Results 1 to 20 of 68
In politics we're having a discussion as to why so many right-wingers seem to be pro-life and anti-abortion. I would like to hear what they have to say for themselves, and try to avoid coming up with the religious crap, it's such a cliché!
I'd like to see what the capis have to say for themselves before any lefties say what they think of the capi reasons, just so I know, so if any lefties could restrain themselves until I know what these pro-lifers think, then I'd really appreciate it!
The oppressed are allowed once every few years to decide which particular representatives of the oppressing class are to represent and repress them. ~Karl Marx
Visit http://www.therainforestsite.com everyday to help save the rainforest. While you are there also visit The Hunger Siteand all the others.
You already know my thoughts on the matter, Mentalbunny. The high court has already ruled on a womans liberty to control her ability to reproduce. Therefore, I too am pro-choice. As is always the case in life, there are right choices and there are wrong choices. When you have an abortion, not only are you poisoning yourself, but you are terminating a life. Those are the facts. I suggest anybody caught in a situation where abortion is being considered as an option fully consider the gravity of their decision. Can you live with the fact that you took another human life? If so, then be my guest, utilize the right bestowed upon you by the high court. If not, own up for your responsibilities as the parent of a child. Whatever decision you make, it affects the life of a being not privy to the same luxury of choice as yourself.
Like it or not, right and wrong, black and white are fundamental truths. You can justify your acts by evoking the law of the land, or your own perception that universal truths do not exist. However, perceptions will not change reality. In reality you terminated a life. I can only ask you whether or not that action is wrong. The answer is as plain as day.
When I was faced with such a decision, I would not let the blood be on my hands. I would not acquiesce. I would not allow my soul to be forever scarred by such an important decision. Trying to do what was right, I pleaded for the life of my child. I agreed to commit to the woman I loved enough to plant my seed in. I agreed to the heavy responsibility of raising a child and starting a family. I agreed to face up to reality.
Now I live a much harder life than I would have had I simply paid $250 and destroyed whatever love I had for my significant other. Then again, now I know what I would have been throwing away.
I don't believe life is to be discarded as a bloody heap in a pop-top trash bin. However ridiculous you believe my position on abortion to be, I am confident that I am taking a just stance on the matter. I know this is not contemporary thinking. Quite honestly, I don't care. I don't wish to interfer with your ability to conduct this vile practice, but I can not condone it either.
Like it or not, right and wrong, black and white are fundamental truths.
They are, and always will be, subjective.
Nothing is ever universally correct, and nothing is ever universally incorrect. You will find a supporter for every inept dictator that has existed, from Stalin to Somoza, and you will find a critic of every successful leader as well.
Saying that you are, without a shadow of a doubt, absolutely correct on everything you say proves you to be a moron. Go figure.
"to become a philosopher, start by walking very slowly"
I'm confused by the abortion issue.
Two women become pregnant on the same day. Later on another day the both walk into the same clinic at the same time. Both have an examination using an ultrasound machine.
The first woman takes the image produced by the ultrasound machine home and posts it up with a magnet on the door of her refrigerator. She points to the image on the refrigerator and calls it the baby's first picture.
The second women has an unwanted lump of flesh removed from her womb in an abortion procedure.
What does the ultrasound machine reveal? Does the image show a child or an unwanted lump of flesh?
1. People are smart. They always act in their best interest.
2. Innocent until proven guilty.
3. No person has the right to the fruits of another's labor.
4. Wealth does not just exist. It must be created.
This discussion has been going on for some time, and I think it is right for a pregnant woman to get an abortion. Why do you ask? Well simply because of this. In this (capitalistic) society you have got to make it on your own and will not be helped (or at least not much) by the goverment. This results in a for the pregnant woman very uncomfortable situation. If she decides to keep the child maybe she will not be able to support it, due whatever the reasons.
I think that some people just don't understand what a burden a child can be. Do you think it is fair to destroy that pregnant womans life? Because that is what you are doing. In the one hand you have the unborn childs life and in the other the mothers life.
And when you talk of "murdering" the unborn child, what about throwing bomb on Afghanistan and Iraq? Isn't that also murder?
I agree with the facts that there are no final or fundamental truths, but humans always have to have some rules. Therefore some decisions have to be made.
Heaven forbid, we wouldn't want anyone to be uncomfortable now would we. If that were the case no women would continue their pregnancy and the species would fail to propagate.
I said what I did knowing all to well what a burden a child can be. They are a pain in the ass sometimes, especially when they are 2 years old. They do stress the wallet and it takes a lot of work to raise them.
Basically what you are saying is this. Because we don't have the cradle to grave welfare system that you support, women should kill their youth so they don't actually have to be responsible for them. What is it about being responsible for either your own actions or business transactions that you find deplorable. Tell your boyfriend to get a vasectomy in order to prevent you from taking life. Wouldn't that be more ethical?
We should not claim that a fetus is a human life. Remember, in roman times, one wasnt considered human until he or she could walk. Killing or abandoning children before that time would be acceptable.
Thus we must put things in perspective. Now, we are claiming a fetus is alive.
Now, if we are so worried about this glob of cells, why dont we have rights and priveleges granted to amebas? Are they too not just a glob of cellular mass. In fact, it can be argued they are more alive than a human fertilized egg/zygote.
So if God cares so much about a lifeless mass in a human, i am sure he should be worried about all the poor amebas and paramecium who die.
However, on the other hand, some teenage slut who has sex with 50 people and becomes pregnant 30 times and has abortions each tiome should be sterilized. Similar treatment for the father/s but that is abusing the system.
I am against sterilizationof anybody. Madak why do you believe that anyone who gets pregnant or gets someone pregnant a certain amount of times needs to be sterilized?
Should abortion be legalised? Probably - if nothing else, at least women'll only have abortions in relatively sanitary conditions.
Is abortion right? I don't think it's for any of us to judge that. As a capitalist, I think it's everyone's choice, and if we come to that decision, we can make it for ourselves, but it's not for us to say whether it's right or wrong.
\"It\'s crazy, it seems it\'ll never let up, but please - you gotta keep ya head up\" - 2pac \"keep ya head up\"
Should abortion be legalised? Probably - if nothing else, at least women'll only have abortions in relatively sanitary conditions.
Queen of Diamonds makes an excellent point.
Making abortion illegal would have many of the same risks as the illegalization of heroin. Most of the danger associated directly with heroin use (i.e. not having to do with the lifestyle, or the appetite loss resulting in a state near anorexia) are the direct result of the drug being illegal.
Overdoses do not happen, for the most part, because the user decides to go on a major heroin binge. Overdoses happen because the user has moved to a new area or found a new dealer that sells a different variety of heroin than he or she had used previously. Thusly, the user has no way of telling what the potency of the heroin is, or, for that matter, what other white, powdery substances are contained within their dimebag of smack.
So, the addict proceeds to inject his or her usual amount, and, as a result, may put into his or her system more heroin than the human body can handle, and, as a result, they OD.
For the record, I am not in favor of legalizing heroin; actually, I would like the penalties to be increased. However, it serves to illustrate my point: if abortion is outlawed, the practice will still continue at much the same rate, but posing many more health hazards to the woman having the abortion, and, in some cases, the doctor delivering the abortion.
Feminists of olde, namely those predating the turn of the 20th century, often preached against abortion, because it killed the woman involved in something around 80% of cases.
But you know what? Women will continue to have abortions, even after it is illegal, much the same as addicts will continue to use heroin after it is illegal. Therefore, it is in the woman's best interests, and therefore society's best interests, to keep abortion legal.
If it is illegal, the working class will suffer, because those who opt to abort risk death and those who opt not to are burdened with another expense that enriches the ruling class in the form of doctors charging outrageous prices for their services, since it is now an expensive black market.
Abortion, then, becomes another luxury that only the rich are able to afford in safety and security.
-D'yer Mak'er
(Edited by DyerMaker at 2:02 am on Dec. 30, 2002)
a pro-life isnt necessarly a right winger, the abortion dilema is more for theliberal/authoritarian side...
i used tobe pro-life, but now, after somethinking im coolwith abortion, though i dontadvice unecessary abortions likethe "OMG im only 20!imust abort" but its your body do what you want with it..
yet i believe that abortion should only be legal until the fetus has less than 3 months, after that is alredy a baby and as soo deserves life...
plus i think legalizing is the way, even if abortions arent legal desesperated womenwould still make them, expecially poor familys, those wouldnthaveto resortto "homemade"abortions, that are so dangerous, my grandgrand mother made some, and i think that should stop, legalize is the only way...
but i alsohave the opinion that with a proper education, expecially sexual education, abortion wouldnt be such a problem, since a good education is the key, if preventionis made, drastic actions are unecessary..
I made my earlier post just to see what the reaction would be.
Stormin Norman says what I think better than I can on this issue. Yes, it should be legal but don't kid yourself,
abortion is murder.
1. People are smart. They always act in their best interest.
2. Innocent until proven guilty.
3. No person has the right to the fruits of another's labor.
4. Wealth does not just exist. It must be created.
Isn't there already a thread about this in politics? Anyhow, yes, "pro-life" is a bunch of chauvinistic, fundamentalist bullshit. Most people who are "pro-life" are christian fundamentalists that believe its a "sin" to abort (yet they find it reasonable to allow children, including unwanted births, to die of hunger when they are already conscious).
abortion is NOT murder, fanatism is, and right now you are being fanatic....fanatic and right winger...
OK...if you sleep better at night, anarchist. Talk about a fanatic.
1. People are smart. They always act in their best interest.
2. Innocent until proven guilty.
3. No person has the right to the fruits of another's labor.
4. Wealth does not just exist. It must be created.
In a word yes. In fact, after one child, this should happen. anything to prevent more people on earth. 3 billion is too much. 6 billion is despicable. Humans are like rats. They infest everything. With such a large amount, nothing can survive on earth.
Humans can easily be viewed as another species of pest. We are probably the most destructive pest of all.
Excuse my rant. I must have had to vent.
Overpopulation disgusts me.
In a word yes.
What about pregnancy by rape?
If you say yes to that, I think you should be sterilized.
(Edited by DyerMaker at 3:47 am on Dec. 30, 2002)
"to become a philosopher, start by walking very slowly"
alright thats different. I am not tlaking about that.
what if a child dies? that person is not going to have another child ever in your plan. How many people should be on this planet in your opinion Mazdak?if 3 Billion is too much for you. there is about 2 billion people in China and India! Should they be considered pests? or an infestation?
anything to prevent more people on earth?
what the fuck is that!
