Yeah, maybe a little. :-)
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am i pessimistic?
Yeah, maybe a little. :-)
Listen to the worm of doubt for it speaks truth.
The Redstar2000 Papers
Also see this NEW SITE:@nti-dialectics
the question is when, but that's waaaaaaaay too pessimistic, the current development of the Imperialist superpowers and their oil wars and other powerexpanding policies will only create more social polarisation... revolutions are still breaking out in countries and i expect a lot more to come in the coming years...
\"Once more I could convince myself how terrible the capitalist octopuses are.
I swore on a picture of our old and bewailed comrade Stalin,
I swore not to rest before these capitalist octopuses are destroyed.\" Che Guevara
The real question is "Can Communism exist". I dont think it can. In communism there is no judges, no governers, no prisons, and all work is done volunarily, and No Government.
The Socialist rule of "From each according to their ability, To each according to their WORK" is replaced by "From each according to their ability, To each according to their NEED".
Under Communism, if someone sits on their ass all day and doesn't do any work, they can sap all the resorces they want. They can steal the products of labor from others. And with no government who is going to prevent crime. Lawlessness breeds chaos. Lets say some deranged Anarchist punk kills my brother for no reason, who is going to stop him from killing more innocent people! No one! Because there is No Government to protect you in Communism. Communism doesn't work. A government must be in place or else everyone will try and kill each other and nothing productive can happen. And who is going to supply food, medicine, and housing. Who is going to support public schools. Who will fund the Library. Without any schools and librarys everyone will become illiterates and be very ignorant. Will anarchy end all exploitation? NO, it is more likely that it will create more of it. Communism would effectively bring us back into the Dark Ages. You Utopians dont seem to have figured it out. Communism (Anarchy) does not work!
You are confusing anarchist theory with communist theory. Communism believes in the destruction of class hierarchies, but that doesn't mean that a government can't exist in a communist society. The government just has to be on the same level as the people. My beliefs are that direct democracy is the only way to go.
Read my sig.
There's not going to be a 3000 AD as the planet would have already been blown to dust. So, yeah, you are a bit pessimistic. I told Marxman, it if it takes 100 years, something is definetely wrong. The tide is turning my friend, don't you feel it?
isn't it peptimistic as opposed to pessimistic?
anyway, cobra, what are you talking about? you are confusing communism with anarchy. anarchy doesn't work. communism does work.
Communism is the last stage of socialism after the state has withered away. Do you even know what "the state" is? It is the government! It is the stage when there IS NO GOVERNMENT. Anarchist believe that they can reach Communism by destroying the government and skipping the socialism phase. If you don't beleive me, ask Marxman.
wedll aren't you just a gemius. yes the state withers away. what does that tell you? it has to be present for it to whither away. If you give it time to whither away as opposed to trying to destroy it immediately after a revolution then it will work. Anarchy does not work because you are destroying the state. in communism you increase the state power before you let it whither away. Understand Marx before you go quoting him.
So you agree with me that communism does not have a government. But, you might be right...about how it can work... I mean, if socialism exist long enough for a communist superstructure to be put in place, then people would beleive in doing voluntary work and cooperating with each other (a government wouldn't be needed). Kind of like how the Church made people beleive that they should be slaves to the Royalty and fight in the Crusades. hmmm... mabye in 5000 AD, but im being optimistic.
meh, can't be arsed reading all that.
Well we could sit around, talk about it, think about it, then go home at the end of the day, and wait for the "people" to bring it around. Or maybe you could do something?
meh
Captain Blackadder: You see, Baldrick, in order to prevent war two great super-armies developed. Us, the Russians and the French on one side, Germany and Austro-Hungary on the other. The idea being that each army would act as the other's deterrent. That way, there could never be a war.
Private Baldrick: Except, this is sort of a war, isn't it?
Captain Blackadder: That's right. There was one tiny flaw in the plan.
Lieutenant George: O, what was that?
Captain Blackadder: It was bollocks.
I have an idea! We can speed up the process by giving children "Mao's Little Red Book" for christmas.
and a rifle
Captain Blackadder: You see, Baldrick, in order to prevent war two great super-armies developed. Us, the Russians and the French on one side, Germany and Austro-Hungary on the other. The idea being that each army would act as the other's deterrent. That way, there could never be a war.
Private Baldrick: Except, this is sort of a war, isn't it?
Captain Blackadder: That's right. There was one tiny flaw in the plan.
Lieutenant George: O, what was that?
Captain Blackadder: It was bollocks.
Ah, the statists.
Saying that without a state, it will be a violent degrading society is quite a bit off. As there are many ways for people to collectively organize themselves, there are many ways for people to collectively keep themselves from crime.
With the destruction of a capitalist system, property ownership, including ownership by the state, and the state itself, crime in general will decrease. With this non-materialistic society with little, if any concept of ownership, as well as no one having unreasonably more than others, there will be little greed, which is a major incentive towards crimes as theft. Also, the society would likely turn into many more tight-knit communities, as well as people in general, getting rid of, or eliminating many of the social problems which come from the isolation of other societies.
"Lets say some deranged Anarchist punk kills my brother for no reason, who is going to stop him from killing more innocent people"
The collective community would generally get together the force to stop such a killer. In any society, statist or otherwise, someones freedoms end wherever others rights begin. Many communities would likely even implement things resembling police forces. Which are not against an anarchist society as long as they are directly accountable to the people they are policing. Point is, there are many ways the people could choose to organize to prevent that sort of thing.
All the public services like schools, health care, librarys would be organized by the trade unions and the people of the collective, community, trade union, would arrange that these people are taken care of. When the anarchists took control of barcelona, that was the first time there was universal health care in the area.
There are a great many ways that people can organize for these things.
oh no, an anarchist parasite. The Anarchists were trying to take power themselves, they divided the movement in Spain.
The population enacted an anarchist revolution on its own, the CNT just helped it along. They fought together against the fascists as much as anyone.
The stalinists though were much more detrimental. They executed anarchists in their private prisons, and purposely weakened the anarchists and by depriving them of weapons and supplies.
Anarchy only works in very small groups. The more people there are, the more conflicts there will be.
Just look at this Forum! We are all leftist, yet we have a hard time getting along with each other. Without a government, how do you think the people of an Entire Nation will cooperate with each other? Your visons of anarchy are Absurd.
There must be a Central Government to Unite the People and lead them to Freedom!
It does work in small groups, thats why the anarchist society seperates and divides into millions of small groups.
Small towns and rural areas generally organize into collectives where they work together. Though i've yet to do too much reading into it, I'd assume urban areas would do the same.
People will cooperate with eachother however they please.
This is far from absurd, its something that has been put into practice, although for only brief periods of time.
A central government will not lead the people to freedom, it will merely inflict the will of a minority on the majority, no matter how democratic.
Basically what you are saying is we all divide and live the way humans did as cavemen. Living in small isolated groups. The thing humans need is unity. We would have such internal warfare if you had your way. Only unity can stop racism and other such divisions. Humans must be united to achieve their greatest potential.
james agrees with mazdak
Captain Blackadder: You see, Baldrick, in order to prevent war two great super-armies developed. Us, the Russians and the French on one side, Germany and Austro-Hungary on the other. The idea being that each army would act as the other's deterrent. That way, there could never be a war.
Private Baldrick: Except, this is sort of a war, isn't it?
Captain Blackadder: That's right. There was one tiny flaw in the plan.
Lieutenant George: O, what was that?
Captain Blackadder: It was bollocks.
