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what are your thoughts on multiculturalism?
are mixed race relations a good thing as were all human, or should races stick to their own?
i would think the left would support multi culturalism, but alot of people on here seem to like malcolm X who was obviously dead against it and after luthar kings "i have a dream" speech he did said "i have a nightmare that one day black children and white children will play together" or what ever it was.
non-whites living in a majority white country, is multicultaralism the way for us all to be equal, or is it simply white culture being forced onto other cultures?
"There is no other definition of socialism valid for us than that of the abolition of the exploitation of man by man" - Ernesto Che Guevara
'The Great World Power Has Not Yet Found The Weapon To Destroy Dreams' Subcomandante Marcos
'Freedom without Socialism is privilege and injustice, and that Socialism without freedom is slavery and brutality.'
I think we need to fight for equality and then real "multi-culturalism" will develop from and out of that. "Multi-culturalism" will not deliver equality because it is putting the superfical mask over the real problem. It's like saying planting trees and painting a slum will get rid of poverty... it may make things look nice for a little while, but it dosn't create good jobs and affordable homes for people.
Of course, we should support multi-culturalism but we should also look at the bigger picture. It is a part of almost every nation and it isn't going away any time soon.
Yes, sometimes it is suppressed in the US and other areas that encourage assimilation. However, that has failed and due to globalization and better transportation, it is a necessity for maintaining any type of harmony within our society.
However, is it true equality or simply a type of compromise? As leftists, we should always support true equality between different cultures and races.
I agree. Multi-culturalism simply doesn't do much in terms of economical opportunity. Implementing policies such as government support for newspapers, television, and radio in minority languages, support for minority festivals, holidays, and celebrations, acceptance of traditional and religious dress in schools, the military, and society in general, and support for arts from cultures around the world really won't help all that much. Political status doesn't always equal economical status and we need to push for more.
A section of a previous post I made which touched on why the bourgeois introduced "multi-culturalism"....
http://www.revolutionaryleft.com/index.php...st&p=1292020827
The left should reject the unicultural / multicultural dichtomy. While cultures are 'important' and 'theirs' we should actively encourage the reorganization of every culture into rationalistic, anti-racist, and anti-sexist variants of the original culture.
"We are now becoming a mass party all at once, changing abruptly to an open organisation, and it is inevitable that we shall be joined by many who are inconsistent (from the Marxist standpoint), perhaps we shall be joined even by some Christian elements, and even by some mystics. We have sound stomachs and we are rock-like Marxists. We shall digest those inconsistent elements. Freedom of thought and freedom of criticism within the Party will never make us forget about the freedom of organising people into those voluntary associations known as parties."
--Lenin
Socialist Party (Debs Tendency)
Multiculturalism is definitely a good thing, it teaches tolerance and acceptance and whatnot.
I think respect towards different races should go both ways though. I have lived in Latin America almost half of my life and I hate having to take shit from Latin people. Don't call me a fucking gringo.
And "whatnot"??? <_<
The obvious question becomes why we should bother "tolerating" stuff that we don't like? After all, we're all on this board because we don't "tolerate" our economic situation....so why do we need "tolerate" other stuff we fundamentally dislike?
The words "tolerance" and "acceptance", to my ears, sound like bourgeois buzzwords for sit the fuck down and SHUT UP!
That message appeals to me in the same way shit for tea does. <_<
To me they also sound like one culture is dominant over the others. Which is why in multicultural Australia you have the government speaking for "our values," which are actually white (Anglo), male, hetero values.
"Multi-culturalism" just papers over the cracks. While there's systemic inequality (racism and class-oppression- the two often go hand in hand) you can never have equality in peoples lives; and I think thats what Black Power movements around the world have been trying to get at.
Hear the words I sing,
War's a horrid thing,
So I sing, sing, sing,
Ding-a-ling-a-ling.
--Baldrick, Blackadder Goes Forth
Barricade Books
The last time I was sentenced to death, I ordered four hyper-vodkas for my breakfast. All a bit of a blur after that... I woke up in bed with both of my executioners. Lovely couple, they stayed in touch! Can't say that about most executioners. - Captain Jack Harkness
hmmm. i slightly disagree. obviously if your fundamentally against something then you don't tolerate it. but tolerance and compramise to an extent need to be seen.
"There is no other definition of socialism valid for us than that of the abolition of the exploitation of man by man" - Ernesto Che Guevara
'The Great World Power Has Not Yet Found The Weapon To Destroy Dreams' Subcomandante Marcos
'Freedom without Socialism is privilege and injustice, and that Socialism without freedom is slavery and brutality.'
oh come on. why did this get moved to discrimination? it's about multiculturalism not racial discrimination.
"There is no other definition of socialism valid for us than that of the abolition of the exploitation of man by man" - Ernesto Che Guevara
'The Great World Power Has Not Yet Found The Weapon To Destroy Dreams' Subcomandante Marcos
'Freedom without Socialism is privilege and injustice, and that Socialism without freedom is slavery and brutality.'
I think whats problematic about multi-culturalism is that its a liberal attempt to attribute racial inequality to cultural discrimination rather than economic discrimination...multi-culturalism responds to a symptom while ignoring the cause of racism.
It also sometimes builds its own sort of racism because, ultimately its a political program created by the dominant majority groups applied to minority groups, rather than allowing them to indepedently choose to define their own politics (you see WASPs in America talking about multi-culturalism and Martin Luther King but not the Black Panthers); it also discourages intengration into the general, dominant, cultural when its desired, and often that integration is a sign of economic equality.
☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮
Multiculturalism celebrates human "difference" and "diversity" over human commonality. Therefore, it encourages divisions within the working class. Socialists should oppose all multiculturalist policies.
Working class solidarity - not multiculturalism!
That's because not all humans ARE the same. They all have the same value and the same rights but they are not all clones.
And fine, if you want to play the hardcore UNITE THE MASSES Commie role (which I find very annoying at times) then:
Multiculturalism is simply a policy stating respect for the cultural and ethnic differences. If you don't have respect for others, how do you plan to unite with them?
'multiculturalism' in it's current, centre-left liberal form is just an attempt to make Western societies look progressive and diverse without having to achknowledge the racism that's inherent in the system. particularly when said society celebrates food-court multiculturalism while actually endorsing a monocultural worldview, where if you don't suscribe to their (the status quo's) values you'll be stripped of your citizenship, or so politicians warn anyway. (What exactly are the great historical accomplishments of "your" race that make you proud to be white? Capitalism? Slavery? Genocide? Sitcoms? Guns? War? Pollution? Addiction? NAFTA? Thigh-Master? This is your fucking white-history, my "friend"... ahhh propagandhi)
this post was produced on stolen land.
to your tourist mentality, we're still the natives
you're multicultural - but we're anti-racist!
your heart is a muscle the size of your fist.
keep loving. keep fighting.
Multiculturalism is a good concept, but unfortunately in the West, its existance is based on exploitation, not an interest to diversify the cultural spectrum of the developed world. Canada, the United States, and Latin America have been multicultural states for about as long as those names apply to the land, so roughly 4-500 years. From the begining, it was started with cheap labour in mind. The powerful men of Europe did not go to America en masse, but rather sent the lowly elements of their own countries, IE England, France, Spain and Portugal, to repopulate the newly found land (from their perspective of course, as it was inhabbited for 10,000 years prior) with people who would prove more loyal to their greedy imperial ambitions than the indigenous population. This did not provide enough labour, so they exploited the slave trade in Africa and brought millions of Africans as slaves to the America's. Slavery was dying, and impossible to keep up in the cities, so immigrants from other European countries, particularly Ireland and Italy, came over as cheap labour, and were treated with the same racism experianced by the Blacks and Natives, but only for a generation or so, then they just became regular white Americans, by and large ignorant and complaicent about the system they live under. when this happened, they became filled with the idea that this country is theirs, and demanded higher wages, rather than give it to them, it prooved easier to ship their jobs oversea's where the people were more desperate and therefore easier to exploit, but some labour remained in the West, and the best way to exploit this was to bring people from the economic south over to the factories of the north with false promises of American Dreams. Multiculturalism, at least as we know it here, is largely the result of that exploitation, and if the ruling class has its way, they will take away the cultures of the newly arrived immigrants and make them adherents to the new corporate "culture" invented for Americans in the last 50-75 years. This is a pitfall for sure, and multiculturalism is not without its snares, but hope remains still. If the poor exploited people of all races can see eachother as fellow slaves in the same boat, they have the oppurtunity to topple the exploiters. there is a myth going around that class and race are related in the US. it is not allways true, though blacks, hispanics, and other "non-white" peoples are exploited incredibly by the ruling class, the only colour that truly concerns them is green. The poorest parts of america are often the whitest, take a drive around west virginia if you disagree. race and class are not intermingled, and only by realizing that the exploited are exploited regardless of whether they are white, black, yellow, red, brown, olive, or whatever, they are in the same boat, and as long as they continue to look at one another like they are different, they will be divided, much to the boss's delight.
As for intermarriage? whether it is right or wrong depends on the individual couplings, some couples are better than others, but race doesnt come into play on this. People should mix with, and have children with (or abstain from having children if so they wish) with whoever, and race should neither draw them, nor repulse them from relationships. regardless of this, it is inevitable that the races will mix in the united states, and hundreds of years hence, there will be a unique, and hopefully much more enlightened and less capitalistic, American race, looking something like the cross between east asians and Indians. Either that or we will all be extinct in a few hundred years...both are likely.
<span style=\'color:red\'>Liberty without Socialism is privilege, injustice; Socialism without Liberty is Slavery and Brutality.
-Mikhail Bakunin</span>
<span style=\'color:gray\'>The assumption that what currently exists must necessarily exist is the acid that corrodes all visionary thinking.
-Murray Bookchin</span>
<span style=\'color:red\'>When we ask for the abolition of the State and its organs we are always told that we dream of a society composed of men better than they are in reality. But no; a thousand times, no. All we ask is that men should not be made worse than they are, by such institutions!
-Peter Kropotkin</span>
One thing that must allways be remembered is that culture is constantly changing. One great example of this is the language we are speaking right now, its the product of Germanic, Celtic, and Latin languages, and is only about 500 years old. do you think that it will be spoken in the centuries to come? Not in this form, surely enough.
sceaþena þreatum, monegum mægþum, meodosetla ofteah, egsode eorlas.
That WAS english, but it changed, as things often do. Neither my forebearers nor my decendants will speak the same as I do now, and I find comfort in that. That which does not change grows stagnant.
<span style=\'color:red\'>Liberty without Socialism is privilege, injustice; Socialism without Liberty is Slavery and Brutality.
-Mikhail Bakunin</span>
<span style=\'color:gray\'>The assumption that what currently exists must necessarily exist is the acid that corrodes all visionary thinking.
-Murray Bookchin</span>
<span style=\'color:red\'>When we ask for the abolition of the State and its organs we are always told that we dream of a society composed of men better than they are in reality. But no; a thousand times, no. All we ask is that men should not be made worse than they are, by such institutions!
-Peter Kropotkin</span>
I'm all for multiculturalism. I'm of the firm belief that people are people no matter what country they live in, that races make no difference whatsoever, that everyone has common cause. That sorta thing.
"Disobedience, in the eyes of any one who has read history, is man's original virtue. It is through disobedience that progress has been made, through disobedience & through rebellion."
-Oscar Wilde, The Soul of Man Under Socialism.
Rioters, I beg to differ........
I fail to see the inherent racism in the system when most immigrants come from non-white homelands.
It would seem to me that the Cappies only see one colour.....Green$$$$$.
The desperation of those who have suffered with deprivation of lifes essentials
would make them excellent wage slaves, especially when they are out of their element.
I would agree with this, as Marxists I believe we have a responsibility to adapt a "critical multiculturalism" that is critical of the idea of "tolerance".
Tolerance is a begining step, it says "You annoy me by your differences but I will endure it." Well as long as someone's differences annoy you and you don't change your perspective eventually you will lash out against the annoyance.
Someone brought up reverse racism, and being a victim of that. I believe that people should be proud of their culture and heritage and honor that, but racism is still racism and it has to stop.
This form of racism is the same as Nationalism that eats at seeing others and brothers and sisters against the fight for oppression.
I understand the need to pass on a pure cultural lineage to your children so that they are not brainwashed by White Anglo Saxon Protestant Society, but racism against those of Celtic orgin is still racism.
A critical multiculturalism is not a melting pot it honors the deeper parts of culture and allows people to teach their heritage to their children, although those aspects that are harmful such as the oppression of women and other races such as minorities such as Jews and Kurds should be done away with.
The problem with this sort of tolerance, deep acceptance of other cultures while honoring your own culture is that it makes it harder for those who are bi or tri cultural, harder for young people to be open about respecting philosophers of other groups, and it opens up a sense of FEAR by elders as far as assimilation and attack.
Racism at it's base is a cultural fear of armed conflict by another tribe or group on your borders. These events replay themselves in New York and LA between ethnic neighborhoods.
Sometimes people come on here about multiculturalism which makes me laugh when I remember the painful riots of my childhood in and around New York.
The basis of racism is a mob mentality of fear of being infiltrated by the other, property taken women raped, this is a tribal fear of human beings. We tend to isolate by race simply to continue our customs without analysis of what our customs might be or if they are harmful.
Letting go of these cultural fears and adapting to a world where you are not competing with the neighboring tribe for food (a job) but against a group a world away you have no understanding of makes these fears look ridiculous.
I look at the U.S. attitudes against Latinos and Chicanos currently in the same vein as this irrational fear I saw first hand in the former Yugoslavia.
The ridiculousness of people accepting me, a foreigner, while beating, raping, or killing a person that had almost an identical culture to them, language, and looked very similar was not lost on me.
In the former Yugoslavia the world death merchants made a ton of money on ancient racist hatreds that the world had outgrown.
Now these people must compete with me and someone in Pakistan, China, and Africa for a job
Through critical multiculturalism groups can reflect on what truly oppresses them, and what customs are harmful, while retaining the bulk of their cultural heritage, but getting rid of oppressive practices against women and other racial minorities.
<span style=\'color:blue\'> "The necrophilous person can relate to an object--a flower or a person--only if he possesses it; hence a threat to his possession is a threat to himself . . He loves control, and in the act of controlling he kills life." <span style=\'color:red\'>[Erich Fromm, "The Heart of Man"] </span></span>
<span style=\'colorurple\'> It is not the unloved who intitiate disaffection, but those who cannot love because they only love themselves."</span> <span style=\'color:red\'>Paulo Freire, Pedagogy of the Oppressed</span>
