That worse

[Disciple of Prometheus]

I don't do this, if your black and if I find you stupid and annoying, given the opportunity, I will tell you flat out, "your an ignorant sod, and you should due humanity a favor and stab yourself in the face with the nearest pair of scissors," the same with anyone else that I don't like, regardless of race, stupid is stupid, I feel no reason not to say such things, race shouldn't facilitate ignorance.

However I will tell you why, because black people, and the liberal PC nazis have forced white people into the PC, race card lunacy. If a white guy says anything in jest, that makes fun of another race, he instantly becomes, the imperial wizard of the KKK, and has to apologize for something, that anybody else would have said that wasn't white, everyone would think it's funny.

Black people can label any white person racist, and say "you don't know what it's like being black," because society advocates this behavior, and to them I say "shut up."

America is hardly racist anymore, unless you go down south, or to a neo-nazi trailer park, ehrr,...I mean "headquarters," then your not going to find any racism. If you do find it, it's because YOUR looking for it, YOUR looking for oppression when it is not present, just because someone gives you an odd stare doesn't mean it's a race thing, maybe it's because of the way you dress and act? Every think of that?

Sure there is some isolated cases, and you could find some racist stuff here and there, but doesn't mean you have to generalize it, till you make it seem like a nation wide epidemic. On the whole america is NOT racist at all.

I dress oddly, and people give me odd stares and the like, all the time, and people get nervous around me all the time, because I dress odd, hold hands with my bf, and have a baphomet necklace about my neck, if anyone should complain about nervousness it's me.

Get use to it.

[RedAnarchist]

Political correctness is just as harmful as unveiled rascism and discrimination.

[C_Rasmussen]

Originally posted by dusk@Apr 29 2006, 07:16 AM
I noticed That in the USA a lotta white people are getting nervous around black-folks.
And when they are getting confronted with black-people they suddenly change in to nervous wrecks who don't have the guts to say what they feel.
They gotta act up all the time.
Why can this people just relax and act natural.
If everybody starts to relax and stopscaring about how they gotta tread people from different races.
I think I know exactly what black kids on black college learn.
'How to deal with white-folks'.

But back to the topic.
Am I wrong? or is it in the USA really like this?

Why do I feel that this fucking thread is pretty racist in itself?


<_<

[Colombia]

This is basically because of all the rules that are now into affect thanks to the Civil Rights Movement. I&#39;m not saying having a certain quota isn&#39;t bad, because it is needed, but many minorities abuse the system because of it.

I know in my high school we aren&#39;t allowed to wear hats to school, however, the few black guys we have in our school are allowed to wear du rags. This in itself is racist because they are showing favor towards blacks and no one else. Dumb example but you get the picture.

So basically, white people don&#39;t want to have blacks and other races up in their faces threatening to call the NAACP.

[TC]

Originally posted by dusk@Apr 29 2006, 01:16 PM
I noticed That in the USA a lotta white people are getting nervous around black-folks.
And when they are getting confronted with black-people they suddenly change in to nervous wrecks who don&#39;t have the guts to say what they feel.
They gotta act up all the time.
Why can this people just relax and act natural.
If everybody starts to relax and stopscaring about how they gotta tread people from different races.
I think I know exactly what black kids on black college learn.
&#39;How to deal with white-folks&#39;.

But back to the topic.
Am I wrong? or is it in the USA really like this?

I&#39;m not really positive what this is getting at because there are sort of two scenarios that i think white people are frequently nervous around black people in the US and i&#39;m not sure which one you&#39;re thinking of.

Its not that surprizing that, if a larger black guy is "confrontional" after dark when there aren&#39;t a lot of people around, it would freak a lot of white people out. This might be "racism" of a sort, in that it in part reacts to racist assumptions, but its also just basic self-presevation instincts and if you&#39;re considering the odds of something bad happening if you "just act relaxed and natural", you&#39;d be dumb not to make choices based on sterotypes when you lack any more specific information (and obviously people who are nervous in this context make judgements based on lots of things other than race as well).


The other instance where white people (especially WASPs) can be more nervous when being "confronted" with black people is when they&#39;re in a social context where they&#39;re worried about embarrasement rather than feeling physically intimidated. Sometimes white people are so afraid of being percieved as racist that they show greater deference with black acquaintances than with white acquaintances...and it is in a way racist because it places an excessive focus on race in contexts where its totally inappropriate to do so (like with co-workers, friends of friends at parties, etc.), probably because they were raised in communities that were almost exclusively white and think they need to prove that they&#39;re not racist. http://blackpeopleloveus.com/ somewhat paradies this. You can kindof understand where it comes from though, a superficial, liberal analysis of racism that looks at it as purely cultural rather than class based, and then tries to address it through purely cultural means.

[Hegemonicretribution]

Disciple of Prometheus; if America (apart from in the south as you say) only has racism existing in isolated cases, why is there such a disproportionate amount of black men in prison? Why is there an increased likelyhood of receiving harsher penalties if you are not white? Why does the media perpetuate the view of the black man as the criminal?

The KKK may not be on every street, but social, institutional and racism is still an issue.

[TC]

thats not mostly a result of cultural/personal racism on an individual basis the way dusk is talking about though, Hegemonicretribution, its a result economic racial inequality on an institutional/societal level...

[Black Dagger]

Originally posted by C_Rasmussen
Why do I feel that this fucking thread is pretty racist in itself?

How so?

This is basically because of all the rules that are now into affect thanks to the Civil Rights Movement. I&#39;m not saying having a certain quota isn&#39;t bad, because it is needed, but many minorities abuse the system because of it.

Yeah, damn pesky civil rights movement&#33;

If oppressed/working class people do abuse the system, can you blame them? Well obviously you are, but so what if they? And beside, not everyone &#39;abuses&#39; the system.

I know in my high school we aren&#39;t allowed to wear hats to school, however, the few black guys we have in our school are allowed to wear du rags. This in itself is racist because they are showing favor towards blacks and no one else. Dumb example but you get the picture.

Yeah that is a pretty dumb example, but it&#39;s not &#39;racist&#39; it&#39;s just stupid. But not being allowed to wear a hat (can you wear a du rag?) to school is not going to materially disadvantage you in life, unfortunately people&#39;s skin colour does.

So basically, white people don&#39;t want to have blacks and other races up in their faces threatening to call the NAACP.

You make it sound like all that &#39;blacks and other races&#39; do is complain unjustifiably about innocent whites

[Hegemonicretribution]

Originally posted by TragicClown@Apr 30 2006, 02:03 AM
thats not mostly a result of cultural/personal racism on an individual basis the way dusk is talking about though, Hegemonicretribution, its a result economic racial inequality on an institutional/societal level...

The impact of this (as in my last post) perpetuate trends that do impact on a personal level. There are areas where institutions differ from social oppinion in their actions, but not completely here.

Do you think that racism doesn&#39;t really exist in the USA?

[TC]

No i think racism exists on both an institutional and a personal level in the USA, i just think that the imprisonment rate is more the result of institutional racism rather than personal racism although they both exist.

[VermontLeft]

If everybody starts to relax and stopscaring about how they gotta tread people from different races.

If everybody does that ...what? Racism will "go away"???

i dont know what "white people" your taking about but if people in your area are becoming more conscious of racism then thats a good thing. racism won&#39;t go away cause people pretend that their "color blind" or whatever...

Tragic is absolutely right theres an economic and institutional issue here not a fucking "cultural" one. prejeduce has a material basis and thats what needs to be changed not making people "layd back" or whatever.

[VermontLeft]

Racism is a disease that often lives among stupid people.

No racism is a prejdeuce based on history and material conditions.

it can be fought, but only by acknoweldging it and combating its socioeconomic roots.

But most people in my environment in Holland are relaxed being with blackpeople as well they are with whitepeople and viceversa.

then wht are you complaining about?

if racism isn&#39;t an isue where you are great&#33; why then start this thread where you complain that "white" people arent comfortable around "blacks"?

because you saw it on TV?

the America you see on American television is a stereotype and no better than a fucking cartoon. its like judging new england based on watching family guy.

there are real problems over here but "plastic social connections" is just nonsense.

like i said, racism is not "culture" or whatever and it can&#39;t be treated like a "disease"&#33;&#33;

[Hegemonicretribution]

Originally posted by TragicClown@Apr 30 2006, 02:47 AM
No i think racism exists on both an institutional and a personal level in the USA, i just think that the imprisonment rate is more the result of institutional racism rather than personal racism although they both exist.

Oh yes, I agree with that, but that is why I included the media in there. As I said in my last post, the actual inprisonment rate may have far more to do with the institution, but what about those that act as witnesses or call the cops? What about cops enforcing policy?

Through the media there is a stereotypical criminal, this is taken on bard by part of the populace, and guess what they manage to find criminals fitting this stereotype further reinforcing it. This means arrest rates and sentences go up, further "justifying" this view.

You can not look at this in isolation, well you can but you often miss the impact that I think Dusk was getting at when they suggested that racism wasn&#39;t that much of an issue any more.

[Disciple of Prometheus]

Originally posted by Hegemonicretribution@Apr 30 2006, 01:54 AM
Disciple of Prometheus; if America (apart from in the south as you say) only has racism existing in isolated cases, why is there such a disproportionate amount of black men in prison? Why is there an increased likelyhood of receiving harsher penalties if you are not white? Why does the media perpetuate the view of the black man as the criminal?

Why you ask? The answer is simple and yet harsh, it is because this rap culture has polluted the minds of a lot of under-privileged, and privileged black people into thinking that selling dope, "pimpin&#39; hos," and be a gangster i.e., criminal is something to be admired, because they are taking lyrics to songs literally, and that if any one "dis respects ya," then you should retaliate with violence, and that if you get good grades, obey the law, talk properly then they are "being forced to act white," and are so called "sell-outs," and I am sorry if proper grammar is to "white," for some people.

Who says they receive harsher treatment? Naturally if you harass, lie, or try to assault a police officer he is going to throw you to the ground, regardless of race, and since that would usually lead to another, or multiple violations on top of the violation you where originally being arrested for, I guess that would appear as "harser treatment."

Furthermore, justice is non-existant in today&#39;s world, it&#39;s how good your lawyer is, how good he can get the judge and jury under his spell, not whether or not he is innocent, it boils down to money. O. J. was guilty, but he had a good lawyer and got of "scott free," but if it was a poor white man in the same exact situation, he would have been convicted hands down. Money not race, is why they receive harsher punishments, in some cases mind you.

The media does it because that is what some of the black youths feel they have to be in order to be cool and successful, rappers are seen as "artists," and when you rap about killing, drug trafficking, and what have you, and you have the social graces to say if someone says your records are trash, then you can just say they are racist against black culture, then it&#39;s easy to see why. Sense no one in the media wants that label, they let them be, and the "artists," are free to perpetuate this.

Why are white seen as criminals too? Guys with long hair, usually are feared by some people because we got that "serial killer/rapist look," and I personally can&#39;t tell you how many times people have said, that I have that "Charlie Manson look," sometimes, so it&#39;s not just black people, and the white guy is usually depicted asa worse criminal than the black man. What is the general sterotype of a serial killer?

[LSD]

Why you ask? The answer is simple and yet harsh, it is because this rap culture has polluted the minds of a lot of under-privileged, and privileged black people into thinking that selling dope, "pimpin&#39; hos," and be a gangster i.e., criminal is something to be admired

Oh, so racism is actually black people&#39;s fault.

If only they weren&#39;t so "gangsta", all the racist instutions and hateful police officers would just "melt away".

In the United States, African Americans have been disproportionately incarcerated since long before this "culture" you speak off began. If this was all a subjective phenomenon as you claim, it would nescessarilyhave to be a fairly recent one ...and it&#39;s not.

Furthermore, of course, if your "theory" were correct it would mean that Marx was wrong and social forces are motivated not by material conditions but by "rap music".

You&#39;ll forgive me if I side with Marx on this one&#33;

Who says they receive harsher treatment?

They do.

As do all independent studies on the subject and any remotely progressive examination of the criminal justice system.

And, in fact, your own posts in this thread illustrate why. When people believe, as you do, that a group of people are "culturally" violent and rebellious, they tend to think worse of them prima facie.

That means that judges, lawyers, juries, police offers, corrections officers, etc... will automatically expect a black "criminal" to be "worse" than a white one and treat them accordingly.

In this culture, black people just "look more guilt" than white people. After all, what colour faces stare back at us from the nightly news coverage? What colour is the police sketch hanging in your post office?

You&#39;re damn right there&#39;s a culture problem here, but it&#39;s white culture that&#39;s to blame first and foremost; and, while we&#39;re on the subject, "culture" is not an independent factor it&#39;s a direct result of relevent material conditions.

Black artists did not start composing rap music "out of the blue", they did so in reaction to a system of institutionalized discrimination and it is that system that is at the root of this.

It is absolute liberal idealism to believe that "fixing a culture" is a solution to anything, and this is not a liberal board&#33; :angry:

Naturally if you harass, lie, or try to assault a police officer he is going to throw you to the ground, regardless of race, and since that would usually lead to another, or multiple violations on top of the violation you where originally being arrested for, I guess that would appear as "harser treatment."

What is it exactly that you are claiming here?

That blacks are "more violent", that they "assault police" more than white people? Why, because of their "natural inferiority"???

Black people are treated worse by the police and the justice system because of racial stereotypes exactly like the ones that you&#39;re peddling here.

Blacks are all violent, blacks are all "gangsta", might as well just lock &#39;em all up&#33; :angry:

It&#39;s somewhat ironic that in a post in which you claim that American racism "no longer exists" you manage to spew out virulently racist stereotypes. Black people are not "naturally" "violent", but when an entire society believes that to be true ...they are treated accordingly.

And a history of oppression and exclusion tends to lead to cultural resentment and anger. Black people are not treated worse because their culture is disrespectful of the police; their culture is disrespectful of the police because they&#39;re treated worse&#33;

"Culture" is not a tangible entity, it is a result of material conditions of exploitation and poverty.

Why are white seen as criminals too?

They&#39;re not.

Overwhemingly the popular white conception of a criminal is a large dark-skinned black man.

Although, in recent years, the stereotype of the "thieving hispanic" has been on the rise. Who knows, maybe in a few decades they&#39;ll finally knock blacks off the number one spot.

Hmmm, isn&#39;t it interesting that as a new disenfranchised underclass is emerging, it is becoming victim to racial stereotyping and institutional prejeduce? Could it possibly mean that politics determine sociology and materialism is right???

What is the general sterotype of a serial killer?

An arab guy with a turban and long flowing beard.