Well sorry i cant go but theres the atlantic ocenan between me and there. It looks really cool thought. Hope it all goes well.
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http://www.infoshop.org/inews/article.php?...051204104236452
Nearly two months after their failed attempt to march on Toledo, Ohio, the NSM (National Socialist Movement) is going to try again.
On December 10th neo-Nazis and those who oppose them will converge on Toledo from all around the country. Neo-Nazis, White Seperatists, and KKK members will be pulling out all the stops to ensure a large turnout. Anti-fascists, including anarchists, communist groups, ARA, and ISO, as well as members of the community will be ready to stop them once again.
With the international attention surrounding the last attempted march in Toledo and the subsequent uprising, this is expected to be a massive event
with potentially serious consequences.
We need as many people in the streets as we can possibly get to oppose these fascist and the racist police who serve as their protection service.
Anti-Fascist groups will be meeting at various locations at 12 noon on the 10th. Anyone interested in joing us for this uprising should email us at [email protected] for details.
anyone going to this?
Well sorry i cant go but theres the atlantic ocenan between me and there. It looks really cool thought. Hope it all goes well.
In what relations do the Communists stand to the proletarians as a whole? The Communists do not form a separate party opposed to other working class parties. They have no interests separate and apart from those of the proletariat as a whole. They do not set up any sectarian principles of their own, by which to shape and mould the proletarian movement.
-Karl Marx
It is only by strengthening ourselves ideologically, inculcating in ourselves the values and ideals of the struggle and building up the ranks of the revolutionary party that we will make it.
- Ta Power
not trying to be a bastard, because I totally understand the outrage against these pricks, BUT, you guys showing up and repeating what happened last time is exactly what they want. That IS their entire objective. They wish to create conflict, then put it all over their web pages and say "see commies and blacks don't know how to act we were right all along." In fact on the main website from Mr. Whitey from the nazi organizers of the last march said that he believed he could create (AND WANTED to create) a repeat of this shit anywhere in the country. He believes that this will drum up support for his cause. Instead, if you do go, I would suggest everyone turn their backs to them, or all point and laugh, basically show them that you aren't scared, impressed, angered, or worried about their pressence and that you recognize them for the jokes that they are. They thrive on anger and wish to insight as much of it as they can, and they concider that success. Besides, how many nazis showed up at the last one? I think on their page they touted 30 but all the pictures looked like no more than 20. THIS is their supposed largest organizing nazi group! IT IS A JOKE. They have no power and you shouldn't allow them to take any from you. Their power is fear, and when people allow them to insite violence, then we empower them to create more fear. Anyways, just a suggestion, hell, i'd like to take a baseball bat to them all myself, BUT, i think it may be better to show them to be the dying, misserable, laughable wastes of life that they are instead. If anything, they deserve pittied, not empowered. NOW, if you see them start to physically attack people, the war cry changes, but until then, they only have the power we delegate to them in our minds. just my thinking.
I don't want to go to the beach. NO FUN!
It appears a few Rev Left members are going:
http://www.revolutionaryleft.com/ind...howtopic=43434
And this thread should have been posted in Anti-Fascism.
"Getting a job, finding a mate, having a place to live, finding a creative outlet. Life is a war of attrition. You have to stay active on all fronts. It's one thing after another. I've tried to control a chaotic universe. And it's a losing battle. But I can't let go. I've tried, but I can't." - Harvey Pekar
I don't think that anyone going to Toledo this weekend intends to "repeat what happened last time". Besides, you cannot repeat initiating a spontaneous rebellion anyway.
I really don't care what the Nazis or their supporters think. The fact is that they would have spun the Toledo events one way or the other. If they were not confronted, they would have joked about the ineffectiveness of the left and the acceptance of their message in the community. Would you rather it be like that?
Too bad for him that most people in Toledo blame the Nazis for the rebellion.
Personally, I prefer an educational approach: Get a hold of the Nazis and teach them about the density and tensile strength of concrete. Let them thrive on pain.
... only to someone who has no stake in seeing them beaten. I don't think that African Americans, Latinos, gays and lesbians, etc., who are the targets of Nazi attacks, which often (very often!take place after "successful" fascist rallies, take them as a joke.
Psychologizing nonsense. This is not about our "fear" or their "empowerment". This is about our right of self-defense against those who would kill us, given half a chance.
You cannot show them that unless you can hand them a solid defeat.
What liberal crap! Nazis do not deserve "pity"; they deserve to be shown that they will not be tolerated anywhere -- at any size, at any time. Their presence alone is a threat against the exploited and oppressed. Period. Confronting them is an expression of our power, not theirs. Shrinking away from the Nazis and letting them successfully rally and organize is empowering them. I refuse to empower them.
Miles
well, i'm just saying that the reality of the situation is different. Most neo-nazis are weak pathetic scared people who rally around a symbol that has inspired fear for generations because they know they have no power themselves except when there's at least 8 of them at a concert. They have no real influence and are bullshit. Now if a nazi came up to you and tried to hurt you, then fuck his shit up, but these guys aren't anything. The only power they have is that they create fear. Stop fearing them and they have nothing.
You say I'm some liberal appologist, but It's not about appologizing or using psycho-babble, it's about understanding where people come from, what they are made of, and understanding what can deflate the situation and even maybe create a possitive change. Things aren't so blkack and white when you look examine shit closely. No matter what you can't win in a confrontational way. You could fuck the shit out of every nazi in this country and it wouldn't do shit, it would only give them more recognition and more popularity among people who are angry and looking for a place to channel it. I guess we could kill them, but that's probably a tad nazi for me. Other than that you can offer help and show that there are options that don't involve hate. I'm not saying that we shouldn't speak up against racism and tyranny, but this shouldn't be a hudge magnificent symbolic action, but a day to day investment with the people we come into contact with.
Again like I said in my original post, IF people do get violent, then all bets are off, but don't dignify these fucks by giving them any type of authentisity or authority. Frankly I fear nazi's a hell of a lot less than the rest of this country who keep their hatred under the surface and systemic. IT is the person that follows minorities around when we shop and pulls minorities over for harrassment, who allow red-lining, honkey do-gooders who infantalize minorities and think that they can't take care of themselves and educational inequalities, not a bunch of bald headed *****es. I just have the firm belief that working with people and trying to solve the roots of hatred, often a cycle of violence and a way to empower the powerless, is much more affective. That may not sound "revolutionary" to you, but if you think about it, it's a hell of a lot more of a permanant solution.
and btw, how the fuck do you know what my racial or religious identity is? Furthermore, that has nothing to do with a person's personal intrests in fighting hate, it's an intrest to all folk. Saying that I have no investment at rooting out racism and religious persecution is simply a horseshit attempt to illigitamize me. I guarentee that if you knew who I was, there would be little doubt in your mind that I have a personal investment in this situation. I never questioned your intentions only your methods, and that is what intelligent people do to come up with solutions.
I don't want to go to the beach. NO FUN!
well, in my opinion, fighting fascists in the streets is always a good thing, even if they're relatively weak like this organization.
for one, offical fascists are almost universally hated, even in mainstream american politics. so, by fighting them in the streets.. radicals are presenting themselves in a postive light in the public mind. but we do have reason to be concerned with official fascism... to take one example , Stormfront has grown from like 1000 users to 50000 in only a few years..they're gaining power, and its frightining.
check out chicago.indymedia.org to see our efforts at jail support to defend some local antifas that went to toledo to resist the nazis.
