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I'm trying to cinvince my friend that sunday school is not what god wanted because its mainly brainwashing class, I know most of you aren't christians, but I need help please
Your friend thinks he knows "what God wants".
You think you know "what God wants".
How would you expect a bunch of damned sinners like us to know "what God really wants"???
If there was such a thing as a "god", why shouldn't "it" want kids to be brainwashed into worshiping "it"?
I think your friend is well within the mainstream of Christian belief and practice...the problem is yours.
If you don't like brainwashing, get out of religion.
Listen to the worm of doubt for it speaks truth.
The Redstar2000 Papers
Also see this NEW SITE:@nti-dialectics
Stop forcing your beliefs on him maybe and give him resources he could study the pros and cons of Sunday School and Church maybe?
"We are now becoming a mass party all at once, changing abruptly to an open organisation, and it is inevitable that we shall be joined by many who are inconsistent (from the Marxist standpoint), perhaps we shall be joined even by some Christian elements, and even by some mystics. We have sound stomachs and we are rock-like Marxists. We shall digest those inconsistent elements. Freedom of thought and freedom of criticism within the Party will never make us forget about the freedom of organising people into those voluntary associations known as parties."
--Lenin
Socialist Party (Debs Tendency)
on the forcing beleifs: isn't trying to get people to be anarchists or socialists forcing beleifs too? you have to try to convert people
redstar: we're all sinners, but no one but god is in a place to judge, as long as we're sorry for our sins we can enter his kingdom, he gave us free will for a reason
rotmutter: thanks for the advice, but I don't think he'll actually study it, I'll try putting htose resources into talking points, thanks again
Sounds like it's too late for you. If you really believe that...you, too, have been brainwashed.
Economic Left/Right: -7.25
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -6.05
=Can't we all just get along?=
"The most heroic word in all languages is <span style=\'color:red\'>revolution.</span>" - Eugene V. Debs
Yeah, waltersm's been brainwashed alright, but don't worry the kid's still in elementary school so there's hope for him left.
He almost acknowledges that there are bad things in the bible, but came up with the brilliant idea that all the "bad stuff" in the bible was secretly introduced by "corrupt church officials".!
Still, he doesn't seem to have adpoted biblical biggotry yet, so maybe in a few years he'll realize just how false "faith" based on a "momment of joy" really is.
I'd love to change the world, but I don't know what to do, so I leave it up to you...
Who's forcing "beliefs" here?
I never asked for his "free will". Besides, following this reasoning, if the state wants to murder people we should let it do so since it's the only one "in a place to judge". A pathetic argument to justify why god sometimes asks people in the bible to kill when he had prohibited that.
Stop applauding, the spectacle is everywhere
No, it's presenting people with new alternatives for the current status quo. "Free will" as you put it.
Then why didn't the make the human nature differently, so that all human free will choices would be inherently "good'? So that nobody had to go to hell or suffer.
And this is interesting, if God is all powerfull, then why doesn't he destroy Satan? Wouldn't such a move safe a lot of people from further suffering?
No, he evaded that one with a rather brilliant move. He suddenly told me that he isn't allowed to judge. Weird enough, he did sound rather judgemental on nazi's.
Walter why don't you continue the "Why is this in opposing ideologies" thread? Our souls need to be saved you know. I am starting to feel the burns of hell. Help me!
Let no one charge that socialists have arrayed class against class in this struggle. That has been done long since in the evolution of capitalist society. One class is small and rich and the other large and poor....One consists of capitalists and the other of workers. These two classes are at war. Every day of peace is at the expense of labor. There can be no peace and good will between these two essentially antagonistic economic classes. - Debs
Following that statement, every statement is "the forcing of beliefs". You telling RS2K not to force his beliefs on Walterism is, in fact, you forcing your beliefs on RS2K. In fact, every statement, by that same standard, is 'forcing your beliefs'. Even this one.
The internets are our Woodstock.
ummm... i know people are gonna argue this but how is sunday school brainwashing kids?
oooooo, teaching them to respect each other and not kill and maim each other
my lord no! how dare they
and really...
you cant single out sunday school, cuz they teach you the same damn thing in kindergarden!
ummm.... dude and/or dudette
a lot of the bad things in the bible were created by corrupt church officials
such as:
the original sin concept during the spanish inquisition to demonize the pagan goddess mother earth, to support witch burnings of free-thinking woman including mid-wives(i dunno), herb-gatherers, gypsies, fortune tellers,etc.
paying to absolve your sins instead of confessing them (cant remeber the official term and i cant remember which pope installed it, think it was in the 1600's though...)
dont these count?
no, it wouldnt because evil itself would still exist. the source of evil is free-will but its also the source of good so he couldnt exactly eliminate it, could he?
i am fully aware that this one post will bring on about 50 pages of arguments
but all i can say is bring it on
stalinism = fascism
<span style=\'color:red\'>staging a revolution is easy, its the threat of becoming something worse than the borgoius we have to worry about - me</span>
Free will is based on the human nature. "God" could have given everyone a good human nature. So that all of our choices would be inherently good and we wouldn't have to suffer in the "hellish fires!!". But he didn't.
And really is "respect" the message of Sunday schools? In the real world, Christian nuts attack gay people, approve Capitalist wars, butkiss priests, popes and whatever that holds power. It shouldn't be suprising that it's often the religious community who are the biggest supporters of dictators. Really is it suprising that par example: Bush's fanbase is largely built of "good Christians"? Or that Christian groups sue Spongebob for beeing tolerant towards gays. :P
Ofcourse the bible is written by "corrupt Church officials". The whole Church and Bible is corrupt. The point of that was to have him admit that the bible is untrustworthy. But he manages to dodge the question everytime, with some fairytallish story.
But anyway up to serious business. Since, proof is not required to explanations for our entire existence. I have made the Religion of N-SB! Now worship me or die!h34r:
Free cool religious hats for the first ten believers!!! Come quik. Idiots needed. Call 0900-NSBISGOD now. Our operators are ready to help you.
Let no one charge that socialists have arrayed class against class in this struggle. That has been done long since in the evolution of capitalist society. One class is small and rich and the other large and poor....One consists of capitalists and the other of workers. These two classes are at war. Every day of peace is at the expense of labor. There can be no peace and good will between these two essentially antagonistic economic classes. - Debs
Hmmm. Taking young kids who don't know any better, fill their heads with lies, then tell them that if the don't believe them, they get to go to hell!
Nope, no brainwashin' there.
Hah. Right. There's absolutely nothing else that gets taught along with that. Nope. Nothin' at all.
EDIT: Further thought-development:
I don't know any kids who would maim and kill each other, regardless of whether or not they have to sit in those damned uncomfortable seats every Sunday. People are capable of acting rationally without, nay, despite, all the fun things they learn in Schister School.
Some of the rules you learn in Kindergarten come with explainations regarding why certain things should or shouldn't be done.
"Don't splash water because it makes a mess and it makes the floor slippery"
As opposed to, "Don't have sex until you're married because god said so".
None of those things were in the bible. Walt claims that those crazy rules ("kill gay people" and the sort) were implanted by church officials. All the shit from the Inquisition or whatever isn't from the bible, it's practice.
It would if god wanted it to. After all, he can do anything. He could eliminate whatever the hell he wanted, if he was all-powerful, as is claimed.
Oops, you can't eliminate anything if you don't exist.
At least one.
The whole "Christian Warrior" thing is childish and silly.
The internets are our Woodstock.
Dont make me go theological on ur ass .
In the bible god comdemns homosexuality . However , he only says this in the iold testament . This is becuase the Hebrew Testemeant is god's to my people ( the hebrews ) ( He tells us this cuz he wants to be plentaful ).
Unless christians Follow the entire Hebrew Testament , i think its disrespectful they bring up this Gay Crap .
Where does it say that i the hebrew testament ?
Sa-ta'an is not a personality , it simply means advaseary in hebrew . There is no satan for g-d to destroy . And why would he crush the enemy of Idol-worshipin' Christ-Suckers anyways ?
Join the CPC !
Communist Party
Join The YCL !
Young Communist League of Canada
</div><table border=\'0\' align=\'center\' width=\'95%\' cellpadding=\'3\' cellspacing=\'1\'><tr><td>QUOTE ("Comrade Om"</td></tr><tr><td id=\'QUOTE\'>People always write off the proletariat. They are the perpetual underdogs. I’m sure there were plenty in the Tsar’s court who believed that the workers were inferior or unfit to rule. The Petrograd proletariat proved them wrong. This is how it will always be. The proletariat may not feel ready or capable to destroy the bourgeoisie but they will and they will do so simply because they have no choice in the matter.</td></tr></table><div class=\'signature\'>
One question... Who held the pen?
"But we can only open the doors— we can't drag people through. I can't free them unless they want to be free— more than anything else....A person has to be willing to give up everything- -not just wealth. All the bullshit he's been taught— all society's brainwashing. You have to let go of all that to get to the other side. Most people aren't willing to do that."
-Jim Morrison
If the doors of perception were cleansed everything would
appear to man as it is, infinite. —William Blake
"Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire." - Jude 1:7
"Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;" - 1 Timothy 1:9
"Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God." -1 Corinthians 6:9
"For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet." - Romans 1:26
Several times, but since you only accept the "new" testament, let's look at where it says it there:
"And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth. - Revelations 19:6
um... if there "is no satan", how does he have a conversation with God in Job 1:7?
"And the LORD said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the LORD, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it."
Clearly it's you who needs to brush up on his theology.
Pizwnz0r3d!!1!!1!1
I'd love to change the world, but I don't know what to do, so I leave it up to you...
I hate the " New " Testemeant. What I said was that Christians should use Old Testament excuses for there morality ( I.E. Anti-homosex ) becuase thoise were not meant for them ( God , for example , Didnt want jewish homosexuals becuase he wants them to plentiful ) . Not to mention Christians pick and choose there old testament morality ( Christ-Suckers , for example , dont keep Kashrut ).
Becuase thats the testament of the Christ Suckers , not a true testament of god , like the Quran ( Gods Testament to Ishmeals Children ) or the Hebrew Testament .
Join the CPC !
Communist Party
Join The YCL !
Young Communist League of Canada
</div><table border=\'0\' align=\'center\' width=\'95%\' cellpadding=\'3\' cellspacing=\'1\'><tr><td>QUOTE ("Comrade Om"
um...the Book of Job is Old Testament.
So he ordered their murder? Seems like a bit of overkill, doesn't it.
But then the Old Testament makes even less sense than the New. God's always commanding someone to kill someone else. Really whacked out sadistic stuff. Parents kill your children, Parents beat your children, Parents EAT your children. That God is one sick motherfucker!
By the way, speaking of the Old Testament, ever read God's "cure" for leprosy?
I'd love to change the world, but I don't know what to do, so I leave it up to you...
