Thread: Forces of Production

Results 1 to 6 of 6

  1. #1
    Join Date Sep 2010
    Location United States
    Posts 1,869
    Rep Power 16

    Default Forces of Production

    I'm trying to give some structure to the idea of how the productive forces of society come into conflict with the social relations of production (property rights, mostly). But I need to start by listing the modern forces of production.
    I am thinking of robots, computers, international airlines and ocean freighters, satellite communication, nuclear power, green energy. also fossil fuels, etc.

    How do the forces of production begin to expand faster than the relations of production thus leading to a social revolution if the markt forces cannot keep pace with the advance of productive forces.
    in 2008 economic production was able to produce housing and "package" them for sale. The forces of production, home building, mortgage preparation, were all in excess of previous housing bubbles. There were too much home building, too much and too rapid mortgage processing, too much cheap credit. All leading to the crisis.


    can anyone give me three or four examples of what you wouid classify as forces of production.
  2. #2
    Join Date Mar 2008
    Location traveling (U.S.)
    Posts 14,968
    Rep Power 63

    Default

    I'd say you answered your own question already.

    Those who normally couldn't afford housing loans were given credit for subprime loans even though the risk of default on repayments was too great for them. So, economically speaking, there was *overproduction* of housing, compared to the financial means of (subprime) borrowers to *pay* for that housing. (And this doesn't even begin to address actual unmet *human need* for housing whatsoever.)

    So while the 'forces of production' were more than adequate -- the technology and capacity for producing housing use-values -- the *social relations* of production ('private property') (means of repayment) of those borrowers was inevitably *insufficient* to sustain the required economic velocity going-forward.

    This, as far as I'm concerned, shows that the dynamic of capitalism *requires* scarcity for its functioning, even if it has to happen *artificially*, by not-distributing housing to those who need it according to humane standards. By ultimately *excluding* subprime borrowers who need housing, the overall regime of market pricing / exchange-values is maintained by economically *limiting supply* of that empirically-needed housing commodity.
  3. #3
    Join Date Sep 2010
    Location United States
    Posts 1,869
    Rep Power 16

    Default

    I was thinking of the computer as a force of production. It is hardly a stretch to think of humans and global society becoming one giant computer network.
  4. #4
    Join Date Mar 2008
    Location traveling (U.S.)
    Posts 14,968
    Rep Power 63

    Default


    I was thinking of the computer as a force of production. It is hardly a stretch to think of humans and global society becoming one giant computer network.

    Well, the more economically advanced parts of the world are like this already, on the Internet.




    We saw the *historical* aspects of this play out already in the previous decade, as computer technologies were *maturing* -- the contradictions between conventional forms of labor-service (like the physical delivery of messages and documents), and the approaching-ubiquity of Internet-based digital communications technologies.

    I think in the next decade we're going to see how capitalism deals with 'threats' of full-automation, since that's a contradiction, too -- perhaps that's what's behind the recent cultural anxiety regarding so-called 'artificial intelligence' (really just the social acceptance and implementation of further-reaching algorithms), and in what ways full-computerization will take entire industries off-the-map due to mass-available, automatically-individually-customized solutions like driverless cars, personal helicopters ('air taxis'), and better 3D printing for anything imaginable (houses, food, etc.).
  5. The Following User Says Thank You to ckaihatsu For This Useful Post:


  6. #5
    Join Date Sep 2010
    Location United States
    Posts 1,869
    Rep Power 16

    Default

    If you drew a line from one computer to another that picture would be an almost exact replication of the neural networks of the brain, except that large parts have been deprived of oxygen.

    Computers also connect people in ways never before possible. We are instantly aware of the struggles of people in Catalonia. Let's give homage to Catalonia.

    This has to be a further step toward socialism, just as Marx said communication, railroads, telegraph, and newspapers would be. "Just connect" as the capitalist biographer EM Forster said. He didn't realize that connection was what socialism is all about.
  7. #6
    Join Date Mar 2008
    Location traveling (U.S.)
    Posts 14,968
    Rep Power 63

    Default


    If you drew a line from one computer to another that picture would be an almost exact replication of the neural networks of the brain, except that large parts have been deprived of oxygen.

    Computers also connect people in ways never before possible. We are instantly aware of the struggles of people in Catalonia. Let's give homage to Catalonia.

    This has to be a further step toward socialism, just as Marx said communication, railroads, telegraph, and newspapers would be. "Just connect" as the capitalist biographer EM Forster said. He didn't realize that connection was what socialism is all about.

    I agree with your technical point, but 'just connect' really isn't enough, because, by that standard, we could say that the Khmer Rouge was correct because they inter-connected really well.

    What's missing from today's hyper-connected digital medium is *content* -- connections *for* what, connections *to* what, exactly -- ?

    Socialism has to facilitate *discussion* so that we can see the whole thing happening *consciously* -- if someone has 100,000 online connections in a political context ('friending'), should that person benefit politically in proportion to their pool of 'connections' -- ?

    You're sounding like you're starting to get bogged-down in 'community' politics, in the worst sense of the term, which *isn't* socialism.

Similar Threads

  1. Handing the means of production to the state...
    By Neomadmonkey in forum Learning
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 13th April 2015, 03:42
  2. Imagining a communist mode of production
    By The Garbage Disposal Unit in forum Theory
    Replies: 12
    Last Post: 17th November 2012, 01:11
  3. Revolutionary analysis on automation of production
    By Delenda Carthago in forum Theory
    Replies: 28
    Last Post: 18th April 2012, 15:01
  4. On the Mode of Production
    By red_che in forum Theory
    Replies: 44
    Last Post: 3rd February 2006, 23:47
  5. The Means of Production
    By Connolly in forum Theory
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 8th November 2005, 04:50

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Website Security Test