Thread: Socialism is totalitarian; Price control example - Prove me wrong.

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  1. #21
    Join Date Sep 2010
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    Another problem is that the Fed "assets" were mostly junk when they were bought. Instead of pricing them as "mark to market" the assets were purchased at the price the banks set, resulting in a massive cash infusion to the banks. Now, does Yellen or her successor think they can sell $1,000 bonds for $100,000? They will use some creative accounting to balance the books.

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    It is still a market ckhatsu. Labor credits remain another word for 'money.'
    It doesn't matter. What counts is who owns the market, labor credits and money. Capitalists own those now, under socialism the international working class owns them.
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  3. #22
    Join Date Mar 2008
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    It is still a market ckhatsu. Labor credits remain another word for 'money.'

    It doesn't matter. What counts is who owns the market, labor credits and money. Capitalists own those now, under socialism the international working class owns them.

    As I said at post #17, there is *no* market for the proposed labor credits. They can only be implemented in a larger 'communistic gift economy', and not in any capitalist-type market-based political economy, as exists today.

    A communist-type gift economy would not have any commodities or exchange values because all social production would be done by liberated labor, on collectivized implements, to fulfill unmet human need (formalized from cumulative, aggregated mass demands with all mass production pre-planned in advance) -- and the potential inclusion of the labor credits system would not introduce any markets or exchange values because all they would represent is discrete amounts of already-accomplished, varying liberated-labor-efforts, based on liberated labor hours, with a multiplier that accounts for varying hazard / difficulty / distastefulness, per work role, per situation. (Labor credits are initially introduced through locality-or-greater planning, and may or may not be debt-based.)

    If / when a post-revolution international working class finally tipped-the-scales away from existing bourgeois class rule, any kind of conventional money / vouchers / tokens system would be the *wrong* approach to the issue of a post-commodity material-economy, because there would no longer be *scarcity* in tending to human need. The post-capitalist / post-commodity political economy would be dealing with a situation of collective *abundance* and *surplus production* for meeting human need, and would have to *organize* such in a collectively hands-on way, yet the approach would have to be *flexible* enough for minute-by-minute dynamics within it (no static 'blueprint' approaches). This is exactly what the 'labor credits' system addresses directly.

    In brief, one post-capitalism issue that the labor credits framework addresses is the potential for a scarcity of *liberated-labor*, for any given complex item / product, or service. Another issue is the potential problematic of a certain subset of the population always ready to do the voluntary work necessary for the society, while *most* of the overall population *doesn't* volunteer -- such would be de-facto *exploitation* of that always-willing subset.

    Finally, whenever the supply of circulating labor credits may tend towards being too insular and localized, the framework allows for *any* localities to issue *new* labor credits -- possibly debt-based -- as a way to rejuvenate and expand the total pool of circulating labor credits, and thus the overall material-economy as a result, most-likely for the sake of a new large-scale mass project that inherently requires the coordination of large numbers of liberated-laborers.
  4. #23
    Join Date Dec 2017
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    Free market? Six banks control the entire banking system in the US. One retailer, Amazon, is on the verge of controlling all of the retail market. Microsoft, one company, controls 85% of the WORLD COMPUTER OPERATING SYSTEM MARKET.

    The only free market left in the US is the neighborhood garage sale market.
    Dodd-Frank killed community banks - large banks love regulations that insulate them from the winds of competition. Amazon does well because it provides amazing service, low prices, and convenience, and you're probably running a Microsoft because it is 10x better than Linux. Linux is free! Go use it!
  5. #24
    Join Date Apr 2018
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    how is capitalism democratic. i hate the term democracy to describe capitalist countries especially since the root word of Democracy means power to the people how is it democratic when only a rich minority rule. Communism is for the people therefore it is ten times more democratic than any bourgeoisie Republic

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