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School Uniforms?
I've always been against school uniforms because I thought that they hinder expression and individuality but many socialist country's have had school uniforms, for example the Soviet Union, Cuba, DPRK for example. I was wondering what the pro's of school uniforms are, and what other people think about school uniforms in a socialist/communist education system?
Some of this might just be cultural preference - I've heard people in the US argue that public school uniforms would be better because then kids wouldn't clique-up along income-levels and compete over who has the latest expensive fasions. I'm pretty skeptical personally.
I think both in the west and in so called socialist countries uniforms probably had a similar function of diciplining the next generation of labor.
I say mandatory uniforms have no place in a really free society - not in jobs (aside from speciaty protective gear of some kind of course) etc. Clothing in the past was how caste-systems identified people, their rank, etc.
I can almost understand how people would want to avoid hierarchies in school based on the socio-economics of fashion and clothing, but at the same time, I'd rather solve the root of the problem, which is capitalism, than worry about whether or not kids feel equal at school because of their clothing (as if there aren't other things that would create a fissure between the "popular" and "unpopular" other than clothes).
As someone who went to a middle school at a place where we had to wear uniforms -- it's bullshit. The place had no fewer cliques than at my current school. People were not made fun of less. People did not learn better because they all had to dress the same.
All it does is goes along with and exacerbates public school mantra of "conform intellectually and socially to avoid punishment and gain acceptance". I hated it and enjoy the school I am at now much more largely in part because we don't have to wear uniforms.
Uniform clothes, uniform tests, and uniform social standards are all structured to build one thing: uniform people.
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Both my schools had a uniform (shirt, ugly tie, black trousers / skirt and shoes) and it does not make it any less awful than if we could have worn whatever we liked...I always got the piss ripped out of me on non-uniform days anyway because my clothes weren't considered cool enough or the right label.
its usually about discipline, and in some countries they have a culture where you dress nicely when you go outside, E.x The DPRK.
I wore a uniform for about five years as a postman, and another couple of years as a hospital porter. It never bothered me, and it is good to have suitable clothes to wear. Also in certain situations its good to be able to see who knows what is going on for example in a busy train station you ask see who you can ask for help by the fact that they have uniforms on.
Devrim
We have school uniforms in Scotland and, as you would expect, you never cease to hear complaints about it. I, for one, think that they are a good thing as they do make us look professional and equal.
I think there's a place for them in certain professions, but uniforms in schools are bullshit. When I was little it was fine, but at high school, if you deviated just a little from the fucking dresscode, every person in the place would be on your ass about it. And I'm not even talking about a leather jacket or jeans - I'm talking about wearing a singlet under your shirt because it's cold, or not wearing a tie. A TIE.
It's stupid at best, restrictive at worst.
Also ties are pointless strips of material that people tighten around their necks so that it looks like a giant tongue is hanging out of their throat. They are the pinnacle of bourgeois fetishism and must be purged with napalm. Hell, professionalism itself needs to be skewered with pikes.
Fixed that for you.
Last edited by Flying Purple People Eater; 3rd September 2013 at 10:35.
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I don't think there's a problem with a uniform, as long as it's a guide.
For example, at my school, in the sixth form we had to wear a suit, and we could ONLY wear the school tie, and ONLY wear plain white, or plain light blue shirts. And we could only have uniform length hair - no shaved heads and no long hear -, no piercings, and no beards.
That was taking it too far. But I don't see why uniform - loosely based, on the idea of smart trousers, smart shoes, a shirt, a school tie and a school blazer - cannot feed positively into a sense of community and inclusiveness in a school, as long as it's done for that purpose, and not just for the purpose of making kids looks uniform, which is what my school - and no doubt countless other schools - does.
My secondary school didn't have a uniform, but my sixth form did (well it was actually a "dress code" but a pretty strict one). I preferred wearing a uniform for school because it meant I didn't have to bother putting any thought into what I was going to wear, and the clothes were practical, etc. I think uniforms can be used for discipline too though, like for some reason at my sixth form you weren't allowed to walk around with no blazer until the school had officially declared we could walk around without blazers. It just seemed really arbitrary, especially when there was a freakish hot day and we were forced to slowly bake to death in our blazers. I also got told off for wearing a vest under my blouse in winter because it was visible, which was bullshit because I was cold! I like the idea of a dress code to encourage a sense of community, but I've only ever seen it used for discipline. The school I went to where I didn't wear a uniform, I don't think it really made any difference in the way of bullying; although cliques were more visible to the naked eye, it's not like making groups of people all dress the same would suddenly make them start including each other more.
Last edited by Quail; 3rd September 2013 at 12:35. Reason: grammar
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At my school we wear uniforms but there is still disscrimination. I can't see the point of uniform. The first six months at my school uniforms were optional then they became compulsory. It dosent really do much, it dosent stop discrimination and it certainly dosent make people better learners. If anything my grades have lowered since uniform became compulsory(not saying it makes people worse but I don't think it helps anyway). I suppose it could create a sense of commodity but I doubt many schools do it for that reason.
Catholic HS for me. Uniforms v Dress code. I liked wearing a uniform because my mornings were made easier. Our blouses were our own purchase/color so the girls with more money had Polo ones; my shirts were from Kohls or Sears but I didn't really care. There really wasn't any noticeable classism (but we had some racist events between our Detroit girls & some of the suburban girls). One workplace we had poly cotton shirts & worked outside where on hot days we had to wait for the folks in the air conditioned tower to tell us it was ok to unbutton the first 2 buttons. That was bullshit & I let them know (glass shops are hot).
I hate dress codes for work (black or khaki bottoms & white or black tops) because they usually require me to buy more clothes. I hate shopping.
Overall, I'm fairly indifferent about them. But hair, hair color, jewelry, etc. would be a big problem if I had to follow guidelines, which I have, & the results were me being reprimanded.
I support the concept of a relaxed school dress code for safety purposes; that is, clothes that make it more difficult to conceal weapons or drugs.
I also think the idea of using them to eliminate class differences has some merit. Most of the counter-evidence here is anecdotal.We can't eliminate cliques entirely, nor should we want to (barracks communism, anybody?), but you cannot tell me that the stories of working-class being ostracized for wearing the same outfit all year will happen with a uniform code.
I know there's the argument of it stifling self-expression, but to me that all stinks of bourgeois subjectivism and individualism anyway. We should approach these questions from a practical standpoint.
