Thread: Racist Che allegations....

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  1. #21
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    Was he saying that Cuba must be on the offensive and use nukes to bomb millions in the name of liberation?

    Or that they must keep going the course of liberation even if it costs Cuba millions of lives because the US will nuke them?
    Castro has admitted that he told Khrushchev to bomb the US and he didn't care if Cuba was obliterated in response. He was 33 years old and quite a fool. Khrushchev saw he had a novice on his hands and worked quickly to reach a deal to remove the weapons.
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  3. #22
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    I'm not a racist. Lenin wasn't a racist. No real Marxist is a racist.

    Che was a racist. Mao was a racist. But they weren't Marxists (and neither are you for that matter if you think all people are inherently racist) so who cares.
    1. "No true Scotsman" - google it.

    2. I don't think "people" are "inherently" racist - that's a gross simplification. I think that people raised within a white supremacist capitalist world order, especially those who objectively benefit from that order (ie anyone who enjoys access to cheap food and consumer goods due to imperialism, who lives on stolen land, etc.), tend to have internalized significant amounts of racist ideology. This doesn't prevent them from being antiracists; it does mean they have to interrogate their own behaviour and interrogate their ideological positions constantly. Starting from "I'm not racist!" is a really bad way to go about that.
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  5. #23
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    Was he saying that Cuba must be on the offensive and use nukes to bomb millions in the name of liberation?

    Or that they must keep going the course of liberation even if it costs Cuba millions of lives because the US will nuke them?
    "If the rockets had remained, we would have used them all and directed them against the very heart of the United States..."

    He clearly advocated nuking the US.
  6. #24
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    It's very hard for people to be completely devoid of racist, sexist or homophobic notions when our world promotes all three constantly. I think we have a better shot since we've the mechanism behind it and the economic dynamics of racism underneath the surface.

    Race and class are so closely linked that sometimes I think that people conflate the two because a lot of people are more angry at what they perceive to be sloven or uneducated. Remarkably these same people become less a victim of racism once they adopt middle class values and join the ranks of the upper crust.

    That's why I think there are actually less racists than we think and more people not seeing the economic and social conditions that afflict people of color in a cappie society.
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  8. #25
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    I am not 100% positive on many details regarding Che. But I figure considering the time and his obviously hardened nature, that he may have allot of racial prejudices. That being said his revolutionary views, anti capitalism, and never ending struggle for liberation of all types of people clearly took precedent over any personal annoyances he had with any demographic. So it becomes a question of how you consider racism. Let me elaborate in case this is taken out of context.
    You may believe many stereotypes about black people in the united states to either be universally or genrally true. This would be seen as racist by many (and by sheer defintion it is). But if your belief is that regardless of those stereotypes, these people deserve the same liberties and freedoms that all humanity should, than it is not quite the same is it?
    "For the sword outwears the sheath
    just as the soul wears out the breast
    and the heart must stop for breath
    and love itself have rest."
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  10. #26
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    Was he a racist? No, not really.

    But the guy was rather harsh on his men. I don't mean about the part where he shot traitors or deserters, I mean just in general he was kind of an asshole to the men serving under him.
    Every leader is different and sometimes a hard ass is very necessary. This gets confused allot by people who think you have to be pleasant to be great. Not saying you do just saying
    "For the sword outwears the sheath
    just as the soul wears out the breast
    and the heart must stop for breath
    and love itself have rest."
    -----Lord Byron
  11. #27
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    I am not 100% positive on many details regarding Che. But I figure considering the time and his obviously hardened nature, that he may have allot of racial prejudices. That being said his revolutionary views, anti capitalism, and never ending struggle for liberation of all types of people clearly took precedent over any personal annoyances he had with any demographic. So it becomes a question of how you consider racism. Let me elaborate in case this is taken out of context.
    You may believe many stereotypes about black people in the united states to either be universally or genrally true. This would be seen as racist by many (and by sheer defintion it is). But if your belief is that regardless of those stereotypes, these people deserve the same liberties and freedoms that all humanity should, than it is not quite the same is it?
    I think is the case for a lot of Americans who do believe in civil liberties. Liberal or libertarian.
  12. #28
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    Che gets a lot of respect and respect so in contrast he is bound to get criticism from the right. Also, its funny that the right-wing are accusing a revolutionary leftist of racism. Even Marx was accused of racism because there was a mistranslation of his reference to small minorities as "racial trash" while a better translation is "residual nations". Che risked his life fighting for a black country, so if he's simultaneously racist, I guess its not as ridiculous to say Hitler loved Jews and supported the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising.
    “Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”

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  14. #29
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    "If the rockets had remained, we would have used them all and directed them against the very heart of the United States..."
    Do you mind if i request reference to this quote? Because I looked it up and couldn't find anything.

    He clearly advocated nuking the US.
    As the U.S. advocated bombing the Soviet Union and all of Eastern Europe. Just as the USSR advocated bombing the U.S. and all of Western Europe.

    The point is both sides were willing to kill millions for their own selfish reasons.
    Yes, we want to make your wife a radical feminist lesbian, we want to forcibly gay marry you to a leatherclad bear, we want to send your kids into white slavery at the court of a black communist dictator, we want to paint your church red with the blood of christian babies, we want to set fire to your ikea and your SUV, we want to rape your labrador with the broken pieces of your white picketed fence.

    We want to wage nuclear war on the nuclear family.
    why? because we are pinko freedom hating commienazi atheist bastards, its just what we do.
    ~psycho
  15. #30
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    Yes I too would like a link for the bombing quote che said.
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  17. #31
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    I can't post links yet, but the text I got this from was "Saint Che: The Truth Behind the Legend of the Heroic Guerilla, Ernesto Che Guevara". It is from an interview with the Daily Worker.
  18. #32
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    I can't post links yet, but the text I got this from was "Saint Che: The Truth Behind the Legend of the Heroic Guerilla, Ernesto Che Guevara". It is from an interview with the Daily Worker.
    You mean this? http://libcom.org/library/saint-che-...to-che-guevara


    Yeah I couldn't find your quote in there.
    Yes, we want to make your wife a radical feminist lesbian, we want to forcibly gay marry you to a leatherclad bear, we want to send your kids into white slavery at the court of a black communist dictator, we want to paint your church red with the blood of christian babies, we want to set fire to your ikea and your SUV, we want to rape your labrador with the broken pieces of your white picketed fence.

    We want to wage nuclear war on the nuclear family.
    why? because we are pinko freedom hating commienazi atheist bastards, its just what we do.
    ~psycho

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