New hope for Argentina in the recovered factory movement

[AConfusedSocialDemocrat]

The chief executive's office at the MacBody textile factory looks normal enough. It has the big desk and faux-leather chair, a large computer screen and prints of successful advertising campaigns across the wall. The only thing that's missing is the chief executive himself. He left … five years ago.
Ramón Díaz, a former salesman for the Argentinian clothing firm, now occupies his seat. The former salesman is there by the popular vote of his fellow workers. MacBody makes business decisions in a similar way, by a show of hands, he adds. "We hold general meetings every Friday. If we're all at the table for lunch, then we do it there rather than lose time later in the day."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sustainabl...ctory-movement

[AConfusedSocialDemocrat]

Fabricas Recuperadas has to be the most fascinating left wing movement happening at the moment.

[Tim Cornelis]

Fabricas Recuperadas has to be the most fascinating left wing movement happening at the moment.

Is it? In its current shape it reproduces capitalism and has neither the intention nor capability of moving beyond it -- it is workerism. It lacks proper revolutionary direction. But it is useful against Randists that advocate an "employers' strike" or "going Galt."

[AConfusedSocialDemocrat]

Is it? In its current shape it reproduces capitalism and has neither the intention nor capability of moving beyond it

All it needs to do is get stronger, then essentially we have a dictatorship of the proletariat, and then gradually it will drift towards a truly socialistic economic model as people start to question the neccesity of the market system.

[Tim Cornelis]

All it needs to do is get stronger, then essentially we have a dictatorship of the proletariat, and then gradually it will drift towards a truly socialistic economic model as people start to question the neccesity of the market system.

Not really. The dictatorship of the proletariat centres around political power, not economic. The base ought to be workers' councils in communities, and workers' councils in workplaces be subservient to it. This is because the dictatorship of the proletariat is to be express the class interest of the class as a whole, not sections thereof. Whereas economic struggles prioritise such sectional interests over class interests. The short-term interest of profit accumulation by worker managed enterprises overrides the long-term interest of communism.

[AConfusedSocialDemocrat]

Not really. The dictatorship of the proletariat centres around political power, not economic.

Economic power is political power, if workers, not rich international business men, own the factories and the farms, they can start use the apparatus of the state for their own ends.

The base ought to be workers' councils in communities, and workers' councils in workplaces be subservient to it.

I feel that worker councils will naturally come about later once the working class have a strong enough presence in economic matters.

Whereas economic struggles prioritise such sectional interests over class interests.

That could be a problem, but I think family ties, friendships, and worker solidarity could prevent this.

[Tim Cornelis]

Economic power is political power, if workers, not rich international business men, own the factories and the farms, they can start use the apparatus of the state for their own ends.

Then the state is political power, and an outgrow of the economical (in this example). Nevertheless, what will happen if workers mostly isolated expropriate factories and workplaces is that they start producing for themselves, their own short-term interests.

I feel that worker councils will naturally come about later once the working class have a strong enough presence in economic matters.

But unless political workers' councils (or soviets) direct the social transformation, again, we have sectional interests overriding class interests, a workerism, and we end up with independent, autonomous worker managed workplaces as opposed to communism.

That could be a problem, but I think family ties, friendships, and worker solidarity could prevent this.

Family and friendship is not a substitute for class, of course.

Some of Bordiga's writings are relevant here:

Seize power or Seize Factories?
The System of Communist Representation