I've learned a lot on here.. Thank you.

[tooAlive]

When I first came on here I was expecting to be banned quite quickly. As I had associated communism with oppressive, authoritarian, murderous governments, I couldn't understand how anyone would defend that sort of ideology.

I came here ready to pick a fight with you guys, and start tearing apart your arguments. But the one that actually had much learning to do was myself. You guys were totally not what I was expecting, and what you taught me about communism is pretty much the opposite of the perception I came here with.

I can now understand that the "true communism" most of you on here advocate for has never been implemented. And while I don't consider myself to be a supporter of this ideology, I can absolutely understand why some people would. And I totally respect that.

And also, to be completely honest, you guys were much easier to talk to (and much more educated) than most American Liberals I'm used to debating with. 1

In case you're wondering, I consider myself to be more of a Classical Liberal/Libertarian.

And even though most would probably say that our ways of thinking are polar opposites, I'm actually very thankful I came on here and learned as much as I did about it.

So once again, thank you to everyone that contributed to my threads and helped me better understand your "revolutionary" left way of thinking.

All the best,

Andrew

[AConfusedSocialDemocrat]

Sure we can't draw you to the left side of libertarianism, eh?

[Tim Cornelis]

Sure we can't draw you to the left side of libertarianism, eh?

He will. The seed has been planted and is watered by inner-curiosity. Mwuaha.

[tooAlive]

Sure we can't draw you to the left side of libertarianism, eh?

You know, I've actually been wondering what the difference between left and right libertarianism really is.

Here in the US there's only one flavor of Libertarianism, and it's on the right side of the American political spectrum in regards to the two primary Democrat and Republican parties.

So I'm not quite sure what the left and right flavors would represent in regards to international politics. Although I must say that I do hold firm American Conservative beliefs in regards to how I live my life. But I don't feel the need to impose those beliefs on others, hence why I identify as a libertarian.

[AConfusedSocialDemocrat]

Things like anti capitalist free markets, autogestion, participatory economics/democracy et cetera. Kevin Carson is a good introduction, especially this essay if coming from an Austro-libertarian (as I was) perspective. Chomsky is also pretty good.

[Yet_Another_Boring_Marxist]

Well there are a couple resources.

http://libcom.org/
Supposedly it is really good, and from the few articles I've read I'd say that I agree.

http://www.mainstreamweekly.net/article3646.html
The collected works of Kobad Ghandy, I haven't read much of his stuff but he is supposed to be a Libertarian Maoist

[tooAlive]

Things like anti capitalist free markets, autogestion, participatory economics/democracy et cetera. Kevin Carson is a good introduction, especially this essay if coming from an Austro-libertarian (as I was) perspective. Chomsky is also pretty good.

Okay, I'll definitely have to look into that. As an "anti-capitalist free-market" sounds like an oxymoron to me. Lol

To me, capitalism represents free markets with very little regulations and no government/state intervention. Again, this is based on my understanding of American politics.

I'm sure the word "capitalism" has just a big negative meaning to you guys as the word "communism" has to people here in the states.

[ВАЛТЕР]

Good...good...

Our evil conspiracy is going along just as planned. 1

I'm glad that this forum helped you out in some way. Stick around, I'm sure there is more you can pick up from this site.

[AConfusedSocialDemocrat]

To me, capitalism represents free markets with very little regulations and no government/state intervention. Again, this is based on my understanding of American politics.

Heh, I wont spoil it for you, but that Carson essay I linked you adresses this problem rather well.

[tooAlive]

Heh, I wont spoil it for you, but that Carson essay I linked you adresses this problem rather well.

Thanks for pointing that out; I hadn't noticed there was a link in your last post.

[Paul Pott]

How boring.

[hatzel]

How boring.

It's almost as if you're actively inviting a little tu quoque up in here making posts like this...

[tooAlive]

Heh, I wont spoil it for you, but that Carson essay I linked you adresses this problem rather well.

Just finished going through the essay, and I'm having a bit of a hard time figuring out exactly what system he's trying to promote.

Although I do get the feeling he's associating capitalism with corporatism or cronyism. I suppose that may be how you guys define it, although that's not how we define it here in America.

Under true capitalism for example, there would be no government aid to corporations. In the essay he mentions special treatment given via tax breaks and expenditures. Again, under a true capitalistic economy, that wouldn't be the case.

Of course, it may just be that my definition of capitalism is different that yours or his.

And as a classical liberal/fiscal conservative, I'm a supporter of the Fair Tax (H.R. 25). So with that in place, there would be no way for certain corporations or entities to garner special help from the government/state in the form of favorable tax breaks, as there would eb no tax on any for of income.

He also says that without corporate welfare, many Fortune 500 companies would go bankrupt. As they should; artificially keeping a company afloat with tax dollars (I.E. redistribution) isn't a quality of a true capitalist/free-market economy.

Not sure if these beliefs place me on the right or left side of libertarianism. Here in America there is only "libertarianism."

[Paul Pott]

It's almost as if you're actively inviting a little tu quoque up in here making posts like this...

Then the bouncer will show it the pavement.

[Philosophos]

I really wish there were more people than you

[tooAlive]

I do have another question, however. And please don't take it the wrong way.

In "true communism," would reactionaries like myself be allowed to join the revolutionaries in discussions and activities, or would we be limited in interaction like the Opposing Ideologies sub-section of this forum? Although I do understand that you must get many trolls on here, and it's done to keep things tidy. That's understandable.

1

That's just something I first thought of when I had originally joined.

[Crixus]

Sure we can't draw you to the left side of libertarianism, eh?

There's only one side of libertarianism. The left. Their claim to both libertarianism and anarchism is a joke. Like atheist Christians.

[Crixus]

Heh, I wont spoil it for you, but that Carson essay I linked you adresses this problem rather well.

Too bad Keven Carson is knee deep in a rather large tank of ravenous alligators when it comes to his 'problems' (his problems mostly surround his silly market rhetoric).

[tooAlive]

There's only one side of libertarianism. The left. Their claim to both libertarianism and anarchism is a joke. Like atheist Christians.

What country do you live in, if you don't mind me asking?

Reason is that here in America, libertarians are on the right side of the political spectrum.

I'm curious to know if although I consider myself to be a right-winger by American standards, I'd be considered a leftist by International standards.

[Crixus]

What country do you live in, if you don't mind me asking?

Reason is that here in America, libertarians are on the right side of the political spectrum.

I'm in America, but, you see, I'm not ignorant. Libertarianism was always about left wing/socialist theory until these Orwellian doublespeaking strange alien "anarchists" and "libertarians" started popping up making excuses for property, wage labor, rent and interest.