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I've tried to read Bonano, but ive always found him to be unreadable. Whether that's due to bad translation or him being full of shit, I'm not sure.
Any real change implies the breakup of the world as one has always known it, the loss of all that gave one an identity, the end of safety. And at such a moment, unable to see and not daring to imagine what the future will now bring forth, one clings to what one knew, or dreamed that one possessed. Yet, it is only when a man is able, without bitterness or self-pity, to surrender a dream he has long possessed that he is set free - he has set himself free - for higher dreams, for greater privileges.”
-James Baldwin
"We change ideas like neckties."
- E.M. Cioran
Russian nihilism was so much more godamit. Its not nessesry that nihilism is been translated to "mindless hooligans that burn/bomb shit up".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circle_of_Tchaikovsky
Don't know; perhaps both. Perhaps one has to be full of shit to translate a text by someone who is full of shit.
I usually don't think great of intellectual fools pretending that they are anti-intellectual smarties, so I wouldn't waste my time.
Luís Henrique
My comrade, the Russian "Nihilists" (who weren't nihilists) advocated total misery for all classes and humans to further the revolutionary process. They believe in slaughter and sabotage without any reason or thought, only as a means to quicken a state of total chaos or "Revolution" for them. They are, what intelligent people who know what the word means, terrorists.
While their tactics in that historical context could be justifiable, in today's world they are simply outdated. What they are certainly not is some lionised form of defence against oppression, since these people believe in the misery of the poor as much as the rich.
If you adopt such a policy as necessity in your head then I believe you may have the wrong forum.
Bonanno has written quite a bit of good stuff. Like this:
Nothing obscure about that, and it's 100% true.Originally Posted by Alfredo Bonanno
"Win, lose or draw...long as you squabble and you get down, that's gangsta."
Bonano is like Lenin - always better quoted out of context.
The life we have conferred upon these objects confronts us as something hostile and alien.
Formerly Virgin Molotov Cocktail (11/10/2004 - 21/08/2013)
I have always been quite partial to the text "at daggers drawn with the existent" and the replies to that work. Though that is indeed more an call to arms than a piece of political theory.
The mind is its own place, and in itself Can make a Heaven of Hell, a Hell of Heaven. What matter where, if I be still the same, And what I should be, all but less than he Whom thunder hath made greater?
Here at least We shall be free
^another good oneOriginally Posted by Bonanno1
"Win, lose or draw...long as you squabble and you get down, that's gangsta."
vice is nonsense
R.I.P Juan Almeida Bosque
"The true focus of revolutionary change is never merely
the oppressive situations which we seek to escape,
but that piece of the oppressor which is
planted deep within each of us." Audre Lorde
People who completely conflate late 19th century russian nihilism with the nihilist-egoist current don't know what they're talking about. That goes for the people who conflate insurrectionary anarchism and CCF-style nihilism as well.
'Insurrectionary anarchism' is quite a broad 'tendency' and historically included everything from the Galleanist 'propaganda of the deed' anarchists to the positions held by Malatesta and the praxis which held a major sway with the the many grupistas (including, for example, Nosotros and Los Solidarios) orbiting the CNT and FAI in the interbellum. For an overview of this I recommend the book 'Anarchism and the City' by Chris Eelham, while the man is mostly partial to reformist and syndicalist politics he is a good historian and describes the composition of the Spanish proletarian movement in great detail.
As Psycho mentioned, a lot coming from the 'communisation' milieu is often insurrectionist in nature though differing from the 'Bonanno'-style [email protected] The Insurrectionary Anarchism which is mostly associated with Alfredo Bonanno (he has some interesting things to say and makes some decent observations though I find him lacking overall) and such publications (to name a few) as Machete, A corps perdu, Diavolo in Corpo, Killing King Abacus, Guerre au Paradis, Fire to the prisons and A murder of crows differs from the former due to the more voluntarist nature of their arguments. Though I find them lacking on many fronts an i'm not an 'insurrectionary anarchist' proper, accusing them of 'lacking strategy' is ridiculous, especially when coming from leftist cosplayers who's "strategy" consists of either coattailing reformist and soc.dem organisations or shouting the jargon-laden equivalent of "Lets try all this again, but this time HARDER" all day. Most insurrecionist publications feature long an in-depth articles on the specifics and conditions of various uprisings, clashes and the counter-insurgency operations mounted against them all over the world, evaluating what worked and what didn't and what furthered the insurgency and what recuperated/halted it. Despite the fact that what surfaces from that milieu is usually very bombastic prose-poetry and over-the-top communiques, obviously that's not all there is to it and the fossils on this forum who like to pretend it is are just mad that for all their prayers their 'proletarian revolutionary mass movement' hasn't been summoned yet by their endlessly repeated rituals.
Everyone who talks about the 'big revolutionary proletarian mass movements' and how 'connected' their petty sect is to it and how some kids throwing molotovs and setting of firecrackers are 'disconnected' from it either have no experience whatsoever with any actual activity outside of papersales or they mistake labor activism for revolutionary activity, potentially in the form of a gigantic summoning ritual that, once the magical threshold of effort is reached, will open up the gates of historical materialism and communism will pour out.
To quote some bro from somewhere else
"Of Man's first disobedience, and the fruit
Of that forbidden tree..."
- John Milton -
"The place of the worst barbarism is that modern forest that makes use of us, this forest of chimneys and bayonets, machines and weapons, of strange inanimate beasts that feed on human flesh"
- Amadeo Bordiga
Well, I am indeed sorry to say, but this just means your friend is, guess what? disconnected from the working class.Originally Posted by some bro from somewhere else
Oh, and that he doesn't understand what being connected to the working class means.
Luís Henrique
Care to tell me about your connection to that great massified proletarian movement that I must somehow have missed? Oh, and take care not to mistake the crumbling fossil of the 'labor movement' and its handful of unions and parties for it would you?
"Of Man's first disobedience, and the fruit
Of that forbidden tree..."
- John Milton -
"The place of the worst barbarism is that modern forest that makes use of us, this forest of chimneys and bayonets, machines and weapons, of strange inanimate beasts that feed on human flesh"
- Amadeo Bordiga
Haven't been here in a while, so I see this thread and I say to myself "oh, awesome", having read through it, I can safely say I am not ready to post on revleft yet.
I really have respect for those of you who can continue to log in here, day after day, for years, and have the same stupid, pedantic "arguments" with people who will never listen, and who ultimately are on the wrong team.
Put capitalism in a bag of rice.
For me its mostly procrastination and the fact that my work demands sitting behind a PC all day anyway.Haven't been here in a while, so I see this thread and I say to myself "oh, awesome", having read through it, I can safely say I am not ready to post on revleft yet.
I really have respect for those of you who can continue to log in here, day after day, for years, and have the same stupid, pedantic "arguments" with people who will never listen, and who ultimately are on the wrong team.
"Of Man's first disobedience, and the fruit
Of that forbidden tree..."
- John Milton -
"The place of the worst barbarism is that modern forest that makes use of us, this forest of chimneys and bayonets, machines and weapons, of strange inanimate beasts that feed on human flesh"
- Amadeo Bordiga
And since when "working class" = "great massified proletarian movement"?
Perhaps it is you who mistake the "crumbling fossil" for the working class, since you don't mind being disconnected from the class, and you seem to think that since the labour movement is now a crumbling fossil it means the working class doesn't exist anymore...?
Luís Henrique
It isn't. What this has to do with being 'disconnected' from it I don't know. There's no big massified proletarian movement (esp. in the US and North-West Europe) to be connected to or disconnected from. In addition to that, the proletariat is extremely disconnected and alienated itself, not simply segmented in the usual fashion (by trade, race, nationality, gender, religion, political stripe, etc.) but on a thoroughly atomized level. The phrase 'being disconnected from the working class' is just a political ruse attempting to con militants into tailing fragmentary populist politics that, for every worker they win, alienates a thousand others. Being connected to the class and its pulse has meaning, sure, but outside sporadic moments of the intensification of class antagonism, this means nothing anymore in the modern world. The great proletarian movements of the late 19th century and the early 20th century are gone and they have left a void that cannot be filled by either activists banging their heads against brick walls or historical re-enactment societies.
I invite you to point me towards this proletarian mass movement you talk of and how connected you are to it. In the absence of the former, I invite you to talk about how well-connected you or your sect and the working class are.
Yes, this is what I believe. This is indeed the only possible explanation of my words, something that becomes even more evident when you read my countless other posts on this forum. Congrats, good job boy.
"Of Man's first disobedience, and the fruit
Of that forbidden tree..."
- John Milton -
"The place of the worst barbarism is that modern forest that makes use of us, this forest of chimneys and bayonets, machines and weapons, of strange inanimate beasts that feed on human flesh"
- Amadeo Bordiga
But what proletarian mass movement have I said I am connected to?
I am a member of the working class, so really...
In which case you have just made a not quite well thought post, for it is indicative of such kind of position...
Luís Henrique
I don't see what the problem is with direct action.
I think there should be more organizations of the kind, because we all know that the democratic form of protest does not work.
One point of contention - arguably there are massive proletarian movements. They are disproportionately made up of women and children in sweatshops in the third world, and their organizational forms, their rebellions, etc. are often scarcely felt in the imperial centre.
As for workers in the first world, there is undeniably the historical residue of class-movements (various organizations and parties that persist, zombie-like, hardly aware that their 8 hour day and their weekends are fast becoming things of the past as well). The reality is that both kids setting off firecrackers and little Trotskyist sects are connected to this history, are shaped by it; both also continue fail wildly in terms of any project to constitute a party against capital. Whether you prefer rioting or selling papers is actually not nearly so significant as both camps want to pretend, and, ultimately, both are probably necessary, even if, right now, both are only marginally useful in that they keep the flame burning.
And yeah, to try and approach a unitary "insurrectionism" is pretty hopeless. You're as likely to find common ground between a given anarchist and given Marxist, as between the CCF, the kids firing off flares at riot police in Montreal, and the tiqqunistas distributing stolen photocopies on the university campus.
Last edited by The Garbage Disposal Unit; 16th February 2013 at 23:12.
The life we have conferred upon these objects confronts us as something hostile and alien.
Formerly Virgin Molotov Cocktail (11/10/2004 - 21/08/2013)
