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"Libertarians" and "Anarcho-Capitalists"
It seems to me like this is some kind of new "trend" that started in the US but has also spread to other countries. Followers are mostly white, male, middle class teenagers and young adults, who spend lots of time on the Internet.
Would you say that is correct in so far?
And what's the reason for the rise of those ideologies? I'd say they are petty-bourgeois in nature, because they basically advocate going back to pre-Imperialist capitalism, i.e. free competition etc., which is of course impossible.
"The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways; the point is to change it." - Karl Marx
"It is more pleasant and useful to go through the "experience of revolution" than to write about it." - V.I. Lenin
Formerly Random_Girl
Completely ahistorical and downright reactionary in ignoring the fact that late/regulated capitalism is a natural development from lassiez faire capitalism. They're all based in idealist concepts like the non-aggression principle too. Reactionary ideologies often make gains during major crises, and I'd say that its resurgence is a result of the ongoing economic crisis.
Related: Although I don't share his anarchist ideology, Noam Chomsky is cool, and this gives me an excuse to dump a video I recently saw on this thread.
+ YouTube Video
"It is not history which uses men as a means of achieving - as if it were an individual person - its own ends. History is nothing but the activity of men in pursuit of their ends."
- Karl Marx
It's basically hyper classical liberalism couched in radical terminology, the difference being that it (almost) entirely rejects the scientific method... seeing as how that little fact didn't seem to be conducive to the whole Capitalist ideology.
I wouldn't exactly call it petty bourgeois as it's not really in their class interest. In fact, it's in nobody's class interest. The big bourgeois need the state to promote their interests abroad and protect their dominance at home. The petty bourgeois need the state to protect them from monopoly capitalism and from worker agitation. And the proletariat doesn't need capitalism.
... I guess maybe it's in the class interest of drug dealers... idk...
On a related note; comrades might like this gem. It may help in dispelling bourgeois economic nonsense.
http://anarchism.pageabode.com/afaq/secC1.html
Save a species, have ginger babies!
"Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth." ~Albert Einstein
I've wondered about this. "Hardcore" libertarians doesn't seem to exist outside of the Internet. But they're prevalent all over the Internet...most of the political discussion I see (outside of places like Revleft obviously) like Reddit, youtube, 4chan (from what I've heard) are dominated by libertarians. Why is this? I can only guess that socially alienated nerds who spend a lot of time on the Internet might find libertarianism appealing for various reasons, but this isn't a totally adequate explanation.
I think "anarcho"-capitalism actually does provide a benefit for the bourgeoisie. The horde of young spoiled idiots who subscribe to this ideology helps justify attacks on the working class. "Anarcho"-capitalists may in principle also be against the state when it helps the bourgeoisie but they spend all their energy kicking at those at the bottom of the social pyramid.
"What is a thief? - A thief is someone who covets his neighbour's property so much that he doesn't take the time to form a corporation."
"The poor complain - they always do
but that's just idle chatter.
Our system brings rewards to all
- At least to all who matter."
"It is good that things have gotten better but it would be better if things were good."
That's why I'm saying it's an ideology, not a class interest.
Save a species, have ginger babies!
"Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth." ~Albert Einstein
I doubt they're truly in opposition to the state aiding the Bourgeoisie. We've seen "Anarcho"-Capitalists go after Social Security, Medi-Care, gun rights, etc, more so than tax breaks for the rich.
I am an Anarchist not because I believe Anarchism is the final goal, but because there is no such thing as a final goal. - Rudolf RockerEconomic Left/Right: -8.88
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -7.84
[FONT="Franklin Gothic Medium"]Was Known As ProvenSocialist[/FONT]Revolutionary Anarchist Blog
"It will happen to all of us that at some point, you get tapped on the shoulder and told not just that the party's over, but slightly worse: The party's going on, but you have to leave."
I used to be one. I've always held extreme opinions, so, naturally, I was attracted to it. When the ''system'' is in trouble, people, primarily the politically and educationally conscious youth, search for alternatives. Anarcho-Capitalism hasn't been tried before, or at least that's what A-cappies argue, that may be another reason why it's attractive. However, I realised (nice1 Marx) the problem is capitalism itself, and no amount of alteration is going to alleviate the socioeconomic problems it causes. Furthermore, I also realised capitalism without the state is a fairytale. And a capitalism that doesn't eventually bring into existence monopolies and huge concentrated interests is a ridiculous notion that isn't based in reality. I do think it's petty-bourgeois utopianism.
I also fucking hate Mises, that snakelike piece of shit.
Last edited by Deicide; 28th June 2012 at 14:43.
Anyone heard of Stefan Molyneux?
What makes government intervention in the economy a "natural development" from lassiez-faire? It is a devolution IMO.
Eppur si muove -- Galileo Galilei
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That word is meaningless. Evolution doesn't have a fixed upwards progress. Modern statism proved more conducive to the class interests of the bourgeoisie. It was a natural development from the failures of classical liberalism (which wasn't nonarchist, let's just get that straight).
Save a species, have ginger babies!
"Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth." ~Albert Einstein
I've heard of him. Isn't he like a left-libertarian or something... or am I thinking of Carson...
Save a species, have ginger babies!
"Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth." ~Albert Einstein
Boring people with boring ideas attempting to make themselves sound radical and anti-establishment. White male resentment posing as social rebellion. Nothing more.
"Evolution" and "devolution" aren't mutually exclusive if you think dialectically. It's like a snake, when the old skin dies off and a new one grows underneath it, until finally, the snake shakes off the old skin, and the new one is free to develop its full beauty.
Lenin wrote a whole book about this, btw. Not about snakes, but about why "free market capitalism" is a thing of the past, and how the capitalism we have today is already the transition to something new. It's called "Imperialism - The highest stage of capitalism".
"The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways; the point is to change it." - Karl Marx
"It is more pleasant and useful to go through the "experience of revolution" than to write about it." - V.I. Lenin
Formerly Random_Girl
"Free market capitalism" is not a thing of the past. For it to be so, it would have had to... you know... actually have existed.
Save a species, have ginger babies!
"Unthinking respect for authority is the greatest enemy of truth." ~Albert Einstein
I'm talking about free competition as opposed to monopoly capitalism. Of course the free-market-absolutely-no-government-intervention utopia so-called "libertarians" dream about never existed (since it's impossible), but before the end of the 19th century, we didn't have those huge monopolies that dominate the market and use the state to protect their interests against competitors and foreign capital.
"The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways; the point is to change it." - Karl Marx
"It is more pleasant and useful to go through the "experience of revolution" than to write about it." - V.I. Lenin
Formerly Random_Girl
I like this metaphor. I'm stealing it and will use it to explain some things to some people. No, you can't have it back so don't even ask.
Nice thing about words is that they don't go away if someone "steals" them. Thanks, btw.
"The philosophers have only interpreted the world, in various ways; the point is to change it." - Karl Marx
"It is more pleasant and useful to go through the "experience of revolution" than to write about it." - V.I. Lenin
Formerly Random_Girl
We also need to keep in mind that anarcho-capitalists are not really anarchists in any historical or theoretical sense.
http://www.infoshop.org/AnarchistFAQSectionF
Let's be blunt. They are all quasi-rascist, ultra-nationalistic, ignorant, god-fearin' nutjobs. I used to know a "libertarian" that was a holocaust denier, thought the government was trying to turn people gay through aluminum pop cans, and was a 9/11 "truther". Needless to say I don't talk to that ignorant, homophobic dipshit anymore.
"The exploited are not carriers of any positive project, be it even the classless society (which all too closely resembles the productive set up). Capital is their only community. They can only escape by destroying everything that makes them exploited...Capitalism has not created the conditions of its overcoming in communism-the famous bourgeoisie forging the arms of its own extinction-but of a world of horrors." -At Daggers Drawn
"Our strategy is therefore the following: to establish and maintain a series of centers of desertion, or poles of secession, of rallying points. For runaways. For those who leave. A series of places where we can escape from the influence of a civilization that is headed for the abyss." -Tiqqun, Call
and when you tell them this simple fact they then claim you have no authority to say what is and isn't anarchism, arguing you're authoritarian (lol) and then they get out their little dictionary that says it's "opposition to government" as if dictionaries are politically nuanced and not contradictory.
Classical liberalism with radical chic is the best descriptor of this ideology. Another good descriptor is "batshit insane".
