*** Capitalism in BABY-terms ***

[Bronco]

You guys are all just so fucking horrible (besides Manecchio).

This is why we don't get a lot of folliwers.

Afghan i'll explain to you everything later

To be fair, telling someone to read Das Kapital, an incredibly long, complex critique of Capitalism, isn't exactly the best advice to give to someone who's a complete beginner either

[Bronco]

OK , this is in line with what I was thinking as well.

You say that the State will not provide roads, schools and healthcare in a "purely capitalistic" country. Can you confirm this with references to capitalistic books? Where is this mentioned? Where do capitalists say this themselves?

Can you tell me why/how Somalia is "purely capitalistic"?

Those who advocate Libertarianism or Anarcho-Capitalism believe that it would be more efficient if the private sector provided those instead, so it would be run on a for-profit basis. Their basic idea is that competition would lead to these services being supplied at low cost and that they'd be run more productively although this would presumably lead to them no longer being free of charge, and may well make such services inaccessible to a lot of people. Murray Rothbard in his book "For a New Liberty" argues that all state run institutions should be placed in the hands of private individuals or businesses.

Here's the Wikipedia article on Somalia for the time that it could be considered "Anarcho-Capitalist" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History...lia_(1991-2006), although it's worth mentioning that most Libertarians/An-Caps would reject the suggestion that is a Libertarian Paradise or that it exemplifies what a stateless Capitalist society should look like.

I'm not an expert myself though, so someone may correct me on any of that

[Bud Struggle]

The best way to learn about Capitalism--is to get a job. You'll learn the good and bad of it really quickly.

[Ele'ill]

The best way to learn about Capitalism--is to get a job. You'll learn the good and bad of it really quickly.

To take what you said literally- yes. Hands on experience with labor/organizing will give you everything you need to know about capitalism.

[Bud Struggle]

To take what you said literally- yes. Hands on experience with labor/organizing will give you everything you need to know about capitalism.

Take it any way you want it. Organize, work, be a wage slave, be a businessman. all that will teach you a lot more than reading Marx or Keynes or anyone else ever will.

[Thirsty Crow]

Take it any way you want it. Organize, work, be a wage slave, be a businessman. all that will teach you a lot more than reading Marx or Keynes or anyone else ever will.

Bud, you're on to something, and that's why I asked the question of our OP ever being employed as a wage labourer. However, it's wrong to assume that all necessary knowledge may come from immediate personal experience (although precisely this, working and some other stuff, has been a great motor force for the devleopment of my political positions).

[Ele'ill]

Take it any way you want it. Organize, work, be a wage slave, be a businessman. all that will teach you a lot more than reading Marx or Keynes or anyone else ever will.

I would supplement the hands on experience with reading and critical discussion.

[Bud Struggle]

I would supplement the hands on experience with reading and critical discussion.

I agree.

[Bud Struggle]

Bud, you're on to something, and that's why I asked the question of our OP ever being employed as a wage labourer. However, it's wrong to assume that all necessary knowledge may come from immediate personal experience (although precisely this, working and some other stuff, has been a great motor force for the devleopment of my political positions).

Graphs and economics and compairing growth charts are worthless without real life experience. Studying minimum wage in school is nothing compaired to working for an hour and making $7.31. It's shit.

I did it momentarily when I was a kid and decided to become a Capitalist. You certainly can decide to do otherwise and become a Communist, that's fine.

The only fools are those that make their $7.31 and live with it.

[Afghan]

And dont forget that the things you mentioned such as the benifits system and the NHS were fought for by working people for decades, often in direct opposition to the state and capitalists, and thus are not inherent features of the system, Capitalists saw these measures as 'insurance against revolution'- in order to ease the pain of the current economic system without solving the inherent problems.
Interesting little article for ya.

Interesting article , indeed.

Can you provide a source for the bold part?

Thanks.

Read Das Kapital.

Capitalism carries several internal contradictions. It will implode eventually.

LOL , I'm a beginner , don't push me into the deepsea

The best way to learn about Capitalism--is to get a job. You'll learn the good and bad of it really quickly.

True.

I am aware that :

The employer does not pay me because he feels sympathy with me or because he feels sorry for my children!

He wants to benefit and profit from me (my work). There are always strings attached.

In fact , we have a poem in Afghanistan :

------------------------------------------------------
فریب باغبان را مخور ای گل گر آب میدهد گلاب می خواهد
"O Rose, don't be fooled by the farmer's kindness!
The water that you get , is for the roses that he wants!"
-------------------------------------------------------

But I still work , and I can understand why the employer wants profit as well.

I also hate the class-system in the West , where you have the first-class and business-class system in trains, airplanes etc. I believe that a person should be respected for his good deeds , not for his money.

[Bud Struggle]

Afghan, you from Afghanistan? You live there? Well, welcome to RevLeft. Hope you can lear and grow here.

[Revolution starts with U]

Delete because it was about a page too late.

[Afghan]

Afghan, you from Afghanistan? You live there? Well, welcome to RevLeft. Hope you can lear and grow here.

I am from Afghanistan , but I live in the West now , because there is war in my country : (

I've already learned a lot from you guys and I hope to expand my knowledge even more. I don't feel shy of saying: I don't know. There is a lot I can learn from you guys. We Afghans say about the words , "I don't know" , that it's half of all knowledge.

Nobody is a born scholar.

[Bud Struggle]

I am from Afghanistan , but I live in the West now , because there is war in my country : (

I've already learned a lot from you guys and I hope to expand my knowledge even more. I don't feel shy of saying: I don't know. There is a lot I can learn from you guys. We Afghans say about the words , "I don't know" , that it's half of all knowledge.

Nobody is a born scholar.

Welcome brother, welcome.

[Yugo45]

(because he worked for it , he earned it)

Half people who are rich never moved a finger in their lives. They were born rich. (inheritance).

Just putting it out there.

[Afghan]

Half people who are rich never moved a finger in their lives. They were born rich. (inheritance).

Just putting it out there.

I agree - but a rich person in the West pays TAX/VAT , which goes to the poor , so he's helping the poor as well?

And if that rich individual creates factories , warehouses and businesses where employees can work & earn - how would that be unethical?

He is helping himself & economy & employees - isn't he?

[Bud Struggle]

Half people who are rich never moved a finger in their lives. They were born rich. (inheritance).

Just putting it out there.

The other half build and create.

[Revolution starts with U]

But a slave owner builds houses for his slaves, so he's helping the poor as well!

The good nature of individual capitalists, like the proverbial benevolent dictator, does not justify the position of private property holder.

[Bud Struggle]

But a slave owner builds houses for his slaves, so he's helping the poor as well!

The good nature of individual capitalists, like the proverbial benevolent dictator, does not justify the position of private property holder.

And in theory--we all work together and create a wonderful world. I agree that would be best, but that's now how we human being are. I'm looking out for Bud and you are looking out for Rev.

[Revolution starts with U]

I'll look out for Bud whether he likes it or not