China opening "Economic Zones" in DPRK

[Crux]

Changing the subject more and more, of course. First, it's not an empty position, the example you brought up was the PSL denouncing imperialist belligerence in relation to Russia. The first example was a photo of the PSL denouncing the US campaign against China. So that seems to be coming first and foremost after all. Second, China "under Mao" isn't what I would call deformed (ill-advised, sure, but that's different).

Not at all it proves my point about your flawed understanding of political revolution, something which certainly ties in with present day china and why it is ridicolous to have PSL:ers reference The Revolution Betrayed as if it would inform your politics.

[manic expression]

Not at all it proves my point about your flawed understanding of political revolution, something which certainly ties in with present day china and why it is ridicolous to have PSL:ers reference The Revolution Betrayed as if it would inform your politics.

It informs my politics (even if I don't agree with all of it), and that of the PSL. But leave it to the uber-sectarians to deny something like that out of some moral purism. Like I said, that I don't retroactively endorse whatever the 4th International did has no bearing on this issue.

[Queercommie Girl]

I have literally taken the time and explained this to you before. How do you still not understand? We advocate political revolution within the CPC by the rank-and-file working class members. We don't think the capitalists that have joined the CPC will all of a sudden, abandon their class interest and move their private property to collective property. I don't even think anyone believes that to be a realistic possibility. If you still don't understand that, refer to Trotsky's The Revolution Betrayed.

Then the rank-and-file would need to form their own political party outside the current CCP, like the Maoist Communist Party of China which largely consists of ex-CCP members. It's simply strategic necessity.

Do you really think there is a lot of scope to operate politically within the current CCP structure without ending up like Zhao Dongmin?

Also, China today needs more than just a political revolution, since the majority of the economy has already been privatised and is no longer in the state's hands. Some degree of social revolution is also required. China today is hardly a classic "Stalinist" state.

[Chambered Word]

So the attitudes of a movement's leadership don't mean anything when it comes to the movement itself? You just pretend the movement is what you want it to be?

Where have I said or even implied this? Oh right, I actually didn't. Looks like that's the obligatory strawman with your post.

It's called opposing the imperialists of one's country first and foremost. It's kinda what communists have been doing since WWI. Any other basic communist principles you'd like to disparage?

Opposing your own country's imperialism and supporting another country's capitalism are completely different.

CPC cadre publicly protested the treatment of Zhao Dongmin. My point is that the CPC's 78 million members aren't all billionaire capitalists...you honestly don't think there's any potential for progress there?

Not this old argument again. The Australian Labour Party used to be made of of a vast majority of working class people, a lot of them unionists. There's no arbitrary number of workers your party can have that will make it a worker's party. Once again, a completely immaterial analysis cobbled together as a fig leaf over your distortion of Marxism (somehow you're strangely incapable of supporting the liberation of the workers of every country in the cases of countries like China and the DPRK).

[Queercommie Girl]

I suspect a PSL visit to china would be similar to PSL's visit to Iran. Remember to wipe the blood off your hands after you shake hands with the CPC tops.

Just saying: I wouldn't put China into the same category as Iran. Granted, both countries are oppressive politically and economically. But politics and economics aren't everything, unless one subscribes to narrow economic reductionism. Cultural freedom is also an issue. Oppressive as China is today, it is at least still a secular country, not a theocratic one. There are no cultural limitations in China as long as one is not anti-government, whereas in Iran men aren't even allowed to wear necklaces. Culturally China and Iran are light-years apart.

China is oppressive, but it isn't fascist, nor is it the "worst state" in the world at the moment.