the west launches new crusade against osama bin blair

[gooddoctor]

we had a spontaneous anti-war protest in glasgow on the day after the terrorist attacks started in afghanistan, and all the previously scheduled meetings too of the scottish coalition for justice not war. but tomorrow is the biggy and i've spent all day promoting it at my university. what's everyone else doing? is there anyone on these boards who actually supports the attacks?
the us says that the war in afghanistan could last until next summer, i don't think that there will be any afghan civilians to save from the taliban by that time as winter sets in.
oh, and by the way , i don't know if this has already been discussed, but did anyone remember that it was the 34th anniversary of che's murder a few days ago, the 11th i think. hasta la victoria siempre!

(Edited by gooddoctor at 7:31 pm on Oct. 12, 2001)

[Just Red]

I have never supported the war in Afghanistan but I think that the Taliban is an threat to everyone, they are oppressing the poor afghanistan people and they say that every white man should be killed. They say that they're the "real" muslims but they are acting against al the rules in the holy koran.
However I don't think Usa should bomb Afghanistan down. They would only blast innocent peole and children to pieces.
I think the taliban threat should be ended bus not by mass-murder from the air.

Bush called it a war of good against bad, well I say it's a war of pure evil against pure evil. And while the neo-imperialist fleet is bombing "the greatist evil of the world" maybe they should fire one of them cruise missles on the white House. Only than all evil wil be eridicatet.

Death to the oppressing, and freedom for the oppressed!!!

[Just Red]

Oh yeah, I almost forgot, here in Holland there aren't any great mass-protests, but I feel responsible to explain everybody that bombing Afghanistan isn't the sollution, how f*cking hypocrite the rest of the world is and that USA is the greatest legal terrorist on earth!

[Chief Rebel Angel]

"legal terrorist" is a very funny term...
sadly, there is such thing as a "legal terrorist"...

[gooddoctor]

we all hate the taliban here, but most of us support persecuted peoples of all types. that includes the four afghan un aid workers who were killed in a direct hit on their house by a us cruise missile, the farmer near jalalabad (i think) who was travelling home from a friend's house only to be hit in the neck by shrapnel from a missile aimed at the airport and is now recovering in a hospital in peshawar because the taliban are the only people with healthcare in afghanistan, as well as the faceless hundreds of civilians and villagers who the taliban are claiming have been wiped out already by us aggression and indiscriminate missiles.
that's not to mention the millions of afghan refugees who will die if hostility is not called off so that aid supply routes can be re-opened. i don't know how many more innocent lives must be lost before this crazy venture is called off.
what will it achieve anyway? loss of innocent life? even more devastating and widespread terrorist retaliation? the driving further underground of terrorist networks? a million new bin ladens? complete discrediting of the effectiveness of international law? mass destabalisation of the middle-east? and all of this before bin laden, nevermind his terrorist organisation, has been brought to justice. there is another lawful and peaceful way, but who is the one country in the world that has consistently vetoed establishment of an international court of justice? the fucking yankee administration in the first place!

(Edited by gooddoctor at 9:09 pm on Oct. 12, 2001)

[Chancho]

I have just (about 2 hours ago) come home from a mass rally and march in Sydney city today - thousands of socialists, muslims, commies and other anti-war folks. It was great - and I chatted to some fellow socialists about getting more organised. What do you guys think about getting into a socialist party for the purposes of parliamentary representation? Is that just reform - is it completely unsatisfactory? I am organised and affiliated but I want to know about whether you think operating as a political party within the system is futile or not...

[gooddoctor]

solidarity chancho. i'm press liasons officer for the glasgow university justice not war coalition and i've just got back from our main anti-war rally since hostilities began in the centre of glasgow. what a wonderful sight to see an asortment of over 2000 people gathered in the main square, all opposed to western sponsored terrorism and listening to what people with really objective views have to say on the us' new war. we marched through the city centre and people were pulled in from the side of the road until our ranks were swelled to what must have been over 5000 protesters. the streets were lined with shoppers, shop-keepers and capitalists with their mouths hanging open, questioning their beliefs. we had scottish drum bands at each end of the 500m long procession, while our police escort cleared the path for us as we chanted "1-2-3-4 we don't want your fucking war! 5-6-7-8 we don't want your racist hate!". it was a beautiful day in the battle for democracy against the imperialist state.
at university i am head of paper distribution for the scottish socialist students (i like to think of myself as propaganda minister) a youth affiliation of the ssp, which currently is running at 7% in the latest opinion polls just behind the tories. not bad for a three year old party based solely on continuous protest with no major propaganda machine. there was a massive ssp presence in town today. we have a socialist member of the scottish parliament tommy sheridan who spoke at the rally (he's kind of a national icon), and i'd recommend his book "imagine" which lays down our vision of a social democratic future for scotland. you can find it in your local dsp resistance office. it is relevant to all peoples, internationalist in outlook and the closest thing we have to a manifesto and my own personal bible. the ssp is very similar to your socialist alliance (i was fortunate enough to be present at the founding in may) in that it consolidates all the existing socialist parties under one banner. it is an exciting time for social democracy.
i explained my views on social democracy in q&a only yesterday, but once again, i am a firm advocate of social democracy because i see socialism as the only solution for the future of humanity (we are all familiar with the arguements for that). also, the only way to achieve that is through parliamentary democracy and the gradual phasing in of a socialist society by dismantling the organs of capitalism from the inside. the days of violent revolution in the west are decidedly over. any attempt to impose socialism instantaneously in the west would be too much of a shock to the workers, industry, family and friends that we are all fighting for and would herald the end of socialism for good. we would never recover from the propaganda backlash. also, social democracy is less radical than communism etcetera, and therefore not as intimidating to people less well versed in revolutionary theory or simply not as militant. we welcome all moral people. furthermore, western social democrats, unlike their eastern counterparts, will not tolerate corruption or oppression.
oof - i hope that wasn't too longwinded.

(Edited by gooddoctor at 6:44 pm on Oct. 13, 2001)

[Michael]

Well,now the US are going to send their "rambos".I think we're about to see a new Vietnam.
Look at the map,Afghanistan is the center of the eastern world,you may imagine what the US may earn by controlling this area.And not to mention about heroin.
Shit!The war rages on in Latin America and the 3rd world countries.It's nearly the same.
One enemy is enough to start the war.It doesn't need two.But we definately are not going to fall for them pigs..

[Chief Rebel Angel]

yes, by controling afghanistan the us can keep an eye on China.. and also Iran and Pakistan (tho i doubt something from them)...

[M cin]

Nobody is able to control Afghanistan other than afghans themself. In order to erradiate them from the face of earth US needs to seal every cave in the mountains.
Afghans are like fremens from Dune. Even if they fight with older weapons they will make a full scale occupation impossible by "hit and run" assaults. Ask russians and learn, yanks!

[DaNatural]

just red, i agree the taliban is a threat to its people, however ive never heard them say, all whites should be killed. i think it would go over well with many afghans who have white skin or are mixed. many afghans, are of the pushtun tribe, the taliban is of this tribe, and they are of aryan descent, indo-aryan. peace

[ViktorPravda]

The problem with living in BFE is that the only thing you can get anyone to do around here is wave the "old red, white and blue" and chant incoherrent whiticisms about freedom while driving around in their lexus. Being a student is really difficult right now. There are so many more important things I feel I could be doing. At the same time though, at my age, I can't afford to quit school and hope to go back and finish later. I'm glad that some of you are in an area where you can get your voices heard. Thanks to all of you. Or as the say around here, "y'all".