The financial crisis was by government and not because of capitalism or free market.
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The financial crisis was by government and not because of capitalism or free market.
Last edited by Catmatic Leftist; 21st January 2011 at 00:06.
Most of those problems was because of government/the protective controls of those governments, which stopped good trade from going to those countries, and stopped people from getting money.
That's like saying my hangover last week was because of the beer and not the alcohol. Capitalism is built on "government," free market or otherwise.
Tell that to Jamaican and Mexican farmers.
Capatalism is not based on government for it is not a governmental system, but a economic system unlike communism. How many of those farmers problems are because of subsidies and protections of American companies/Farmers, IE we need to see if there was effects by a government which caused their problems.
You can't separate the capitalist class and the capitalist state. We see proof of this every day in modern politics. Historically "statism" and capitalism go hand in hand. Countries like the U.S., western European countries, and Japan and South Korea developed their economies and reduced poverty through interventionism and most importantly imperialism.
And communism is an economic system. I don't know where you get the idea it isn't.
The "effects" on said farmers were because of liberalization.
But things like subsidies are what gives North American capitalism its success (as measured by living standards or however you like) compared to poorer countries.
End subsidies to American farmers, and more money to mexican farmers. Free Trade will help everybody.
What we have now is not capitalism it is a form of fascism which is democratic. That what most countries are in the end Democratic Fascisms. Capitalism should exist outside the halls of government, once it touches government it becomes fascism.
nevermind
"whatever they might make would never be the same as that world of dark streets and bright dreams"
http://youtu.be/g-PwIDYbDqI
Yeah, sorry but it sounds like you're suggesting governments don't care and are not a part of economic decision making processes (as if the economy is a sporting event they occasionally venture to)- as if they don't benefit from and protect various money making entities that share a common vision or direct interest with. The WTO, WB and IMF exist.
A country has a lot of oil companies that want and are capable of expansion. What does the government do?
"whatever they might make would never be the same as that world of dark streets and bright dreams"
http://youtu.be/g-PwIDYbDqI
I just want to make it clear.
Do you think that there would be no economic crises if not for government?
I'm on some sickle-hammer shit
Collective Bruce Banner shit
FKA: #FF0000, AKA Mistake Not My Current State Of Joshing Gentle Peevishness For The Awesome And Terrible Majesty Of The Towering Seas Of Ire That Are Themselves The Milquetoast Shallows Fringing My Vast Oceans Of Wrath
There would be economic crises's but it would mainly happen at the banking level IE the recession of 1912 which was a failure of a bank but it was fixed by a group of bankers headed by JP morgan, and co. It was a slight depression but it was quickly fixed, by internal fixes by private individuals concerning money. Most of the boom and busts happened because of Government IE in the 1890's the train bust was caused by government lending.... And such things.
The problem is that they ARE PART OF THE ECONOMIC DECISIONS, AND NOT JUST TO REFEREE IT IE THE COURTS. Allow them to expand, if they can do stuff cheaper which helps the average consumer so let them expand.
I don't understand. If the problems of capitalism are the result of government, then I imagine the "Gilded Age" and the Great Depression just came out of nowhere right? One needs only to look back at American history (though I imagine it goes for most, if not all, other places as well) to see that prior times of less government regulation and interference were even worse places to live than now. Unless you were a capitalist of course.
BUY THE TICKET, TAKE THE RIDE
The great Depression was caused by Low interest rate which also made the boom of the Glided Age, and that was caused by the Federal government/Mal-investment which crashed. The fact is that the Great Depression was caused by mis management by the fed, mixed with low interest rates.
Actually, that's a pretty narrowly focused and naive way of looking at it. The crisis was caused by the capitalist system, and capitalist governments trying to cover for it. We're talking here about capitalism as it actually exists. Capitalism, unlike socialism, was not made in theory. It was made in practice. As such, it must be judged for what it is, not what it should be.
Socialism, fortunatley for mewas made in theory, later put into practice. Therefore, it must be judged on how closely it matches the theory
Yup... capitalism
All politics are economics. This is what you should realize.I'm with you that the underdeveloped/overexploited world deserves jobs just as much as the rest of us. But by free trade you mean;
Companies move their business into the lands of repressive regimes where they can get away with paying 30c/hr and reap huge profits with which to gold toilets.
Fascism was capitalist, friend. There's no way you can get around that w/o jumping into Rothbardian meta-physical and ahistorical political economics
Ya... capitalism
No .... thats not what happened.
Within this scenario, American farmers will be outcompeted and forced to abandon their position in the process of production. Rural areas would witness a massive destruction - people moving out, agriculture faltering, whole areas becoming "ghost towns".
So free trade - that is, complete government withdrawal from economic affairs - cannot in fact help everybody. It's an illusion, and you fell for it.
FKA LinksRadikal
“The possibility of securing for every member of society, by means of socialized production, an existence not only fully sufficient materially, and becoming day by day more full, but an existence guaranteeing to all the free development and exercise of their physical and mental faculties – this possibility is now for the first time here, but it is here.” Friedrich Engels
"The proletariat is its struggle; and its struggles have to this day not led it beyond class society, but deeper into it." Friends of the Classless Society
"Your life is survived by your deeds" - Steve von Till
Not to mention the government is highly invested in food security. If it weren't for the subsidies some farmers would turn to producing profitable cash crops that aren't edible.
But now we must pick up every piece
Of the life we used to love
Just to keep ourselves
At least enough to carry on
