I'm sure he was a well-mannered and kind-hearted man.
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Was Lenin a monster?
I've heard some people saying this, and I was just wondering how. And please, no Stalinist flamewars.
I'm sure he was a well-mannered and kind-hearted man.
Why was he called a monster?
Yes, I do have a sailors mouth. Did it offend you? Then toughen up you pussy penis!
Do to Iseuls claims I am a Sexist, I added penis!
I dont like being a wage slave =
"Using negative rep as a weapon against other people just reveals your cowardly and reactionary nature."
--Iseul
"And once again, the old dictum is confirmed that the worst product of fascism was 'anti-fascism'."
-- Zanthorus
Well, he did some monstrous things-- like actually organizing a state to expropriate private property; like mercilessly pursuing a civil war against reactionary, restorationist forces; like executing the Romanoffs.
I mean with depriving the bourgeoisie of property, military power, and a royalty isn't monstrous, I don't know what is.
Yes, he was a monster. I heard he had a tail, which he kept hidden all the time, even from his wife, and he even had little horns he managed to make invisible by means of his evil black magic. Also, i think he had a second stomach, which can account for all the horrid murders and atrocities he committed.
FKA LinksRadikal
“The possibility of securing for every member of society, by means of socialized production, an existence not only fully sufficient materially, and becoming day by day more full, but an existence guaranteeing to all the free development and exercise of their physical and mental faculties – this possibility is now for the first time here, but it is here.” Friedrich Engels
"The proletariat is its struggle; and its struggles have to this day not led it beyond class society, but deeper into it." Friends of the Classless Society
"Your life is survived by your deeds" - Steve von Till
He ate babies. oh wait wasnt that Stalin?
i VIVA LA REVOLUCION !
i MUERTE AL FASCISMO !
lol
I'm not a fan of Lenin but his contribution is extremely valuable. Calling him a monster is being extremely dramatic.
The court system (the Cheka) he set up by modern standards was pretty horrendous but it was no worse than the Czarist one that proceeded it. Many like me don't agree with the vanguard party theory and believe it to be a major re-writing of Marxism. Couple of other minor things like his political ruthlessness in his rise to power and the fact he was a hereditary nobleman and if he had followed Marx's example when it comes to taking positions of power he would have stepped aside for a proletarian to take charge and stayed in an advisory position. None of this makes him a monster. He's an important addition to communist theory just some people disagree with his methods.
'Monster' is a rather emotive term. I'd say he was an authoritarian, a staunch opponant of socialism, etc., which is more than sufficient. Had he lived longer he probably would've earned the term, as Stalin did. It's perfectly justifiable to say Stalin was absolutely a 'monster,' but that is hardly a revelation.
[FONT=Verdana]Economic Left/Right: -7.25
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -7.13[/FONT]
"Kick over the wall 'cause government's to fall,
How can you refuse it?,
Let fury have the hour, anger can be power,
D'you know that you can use it?"-The Clash, "Clampdown"
Say what you will about "authoritarianism" etc. but saying he was a staunch opponent of socialism is absurd.
Not if you believe that democracy, and workers control over the means of production is a core principle of socialism, which was the majority view at the time, and to which many still subscribe.
[FONT=Verdana]Economic Left/Right: -7.25
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -7.13[/FONT]
"Kick over the wall 'cause government's to fall,
How can you refuse it?,
Let fury have the hour, anger can be power,
D'you know that you can use it?"-The Clash, "Clampdown"
No, Lenin was not a monster.
I'm tempted to ask if Makhno and Bakunin were monsters now.
Seriously, "evil" and "monster" are subjective terms, and stalinism isnt really a theory.
Why was Lenin a monster? Is it because he kicked out the Kerensky government which was 'democratic'?
FKA Vacant
"snook up behind him and took his koran, he said sumthin about burnin the koran. i was like DUDE YOU HAVE NO KORAN and ran off." - Jacob Isom, Amarillo Resident.
typical anarchis....I mean Liberal Democrat Lifestylist dribble.
The idea was to not let the Russian revolution make the mistakes the French Commune did and in that regard it didn't, the Bolsheviks was not snuffed out by a capitalist military force.
Even without the problem of running a war, the Bolsheviks had a much bigger problem the proletariat made up a minority in Russia and Russia not being industrialized enough to naturally support a workers state. And Lenin's basic long term strategy was basically to keep Russia in a holding pattern till workers in West Euroe came to their rescue, for example if Germany had a workers revolution naturally Germany would have became the vanguard of the world revolution and taken a lot of pressure off Russia.
Last edited by Psy; 3rd October 2010 at 04:05.
Yeh, you Typical Reactionary Capitalist Authoritarian Imperialist Fascist Nationalist Cappie Bourgeios Reformist Scum.
Your pleas fall on deaf ears, comrade.
"Look at me, I'm so fucking stupid I'm labelling anarchists as Democrats despite their fierce opposition to all social hierarchy and property rights."
Eat a baby, Stalinist.
Yes... A flying spaghetti monster.
he was calling NGNM a liberal and not an anarchist. lol.
FKA Vacant
"snook up behind him and took his koran, he said sumthin about burnin the koran. i was like DUDE YOU HAVE NO KORAN and ran off." - Jacob Isom, Amarillo Resident.
I have explained the workings of a socialist (worker-owned) business to certain conservatives, they actually seem to be keen to the idea! I am not kidding. I simply explain to them that (A) a successful business does not need to have a wealthy owner, and (B) because of this, the wages of the workers can easily double, even triple (through profit-sharing.) Who needs a ten-million dollar owner, when that ten million can be distributed among 100 to 1,000 workers... do the math... socialism is a vastly superior business model than capitalism.
Another possibility is that, since there is no $10 million windbag, prices can be lowered to the point that a socialist business can outsell a capitalist one. It's all fair competition: Laisse-Faire Socialism, rip the bleeding heart out of this archaic thing called capitalism...
money is to politics as fertilizer is to garden weeds.
