Feminists... Male?

[BeerShaman]

Can there be male feminists? While talking with a friend, he claimed that there can be no male feminists. Is this true or not? What do you think. Please mention your stance (feminist or not) and sex (male/female...).
Pesronally, I consider myself a male feminist. Let's start...

[meow]

feminist is merely believing in gender equality. surely there can be male feminists...

i think that your friend has an incorrect understanding of what feminism is.

[Tower of Bebel]

The plead and struggle of socialists before the 1900's for the emancipation of women is called "male feminism" because at that time socialist "feminists" were mostly male. They were also the only known men who fought for equal rights for women. After the 1900's more and more men became "feminist" making the concept of feminism universal and male feminism obsolete.

Feminism however is not (necessarily) genuine socialism

[Queercommie Girl]

Women need self-emancipation, not having progressive men acting as their "defenders" or "protectors".

[Meridian]

Women need self-emancipation, not having progressive men acting as their "defenders" or "protectors".

Males wanting to end gender discrimination does not imply wanting to act as protectors or defenders of anyone (except perhaps themselves).

[Queercommie Girl]

Males wanting to end gender discrimination does not imply wanting to act as protectors or defenders of anyone (except perhaps themselves).

I didn't say I disagree with the idea of "male feminism" in general, I disagree with the subset of male feminists who think men should have a leading position in the women's movement.

Since feminism, unlike masculinism, implies gender equality, rather than considering males as inferior to females or masculine virtues as inferiors to feminine virtues, it does not in principle rule out the possibility of having "male feminists".

[counterblast]

The idea that there cannot be "male feminists" is a huge second-wave feminist oversimplification of the gender myth and the patriarchy.

Does your friend really think that some sissy-boy in pink hot pants and glitter eyeliner, benefits from the patriarchy because he happens to have a penis?

[Quail]

Of course you can have male feminists. Anyone who wants gender equality is a feminist. Your question is similar to "can there be white anti-racists?" or "can there be heterosexuals who oppose discrimination against LBGT people?".

That isn't to say that men should "take over" the feminist movement and bring equality from the top down. You can't beat patriarchy with more patriarchy.

[scarletghoul]

your friends chatting shit

[F9]

I didn't say I disagree with the idea of "male feminism" in general, I disagree with the subset of male feminists who think men should have a leading position in the women's movement.

So you disagree with male "feminists", not male feminists.Cause your earlier post made us misunderstood you.Now its clear.
The ones you talk about are just plain idiots!
As for the OP, of course there can be male feminists, but sadly as everything around this world, there is always gonna be some idiots who adopt the label for other reasons, but thats not a reason to disqualify the whole movement.

[Zeus the Moose]

In an Intro to Women's Studies class that I took we read an article that used the term "pro-feminist men" to talk about people I would otherwise consider to be feminists who happened to be men. I don't remember the arguments specifically, but it does show that variations of the idea that "men cannot be feminists" do exist. I wasn't particularly persuaded by the article, and still consider myself a feminist who happens to be male, rather than a "pro-feminist man."

[anticap]

I'm reminded of the following:

The objections which are explicitly urged against women's suffrage are, of course, not those which weigh most with most men. Men fear that their liberty to act in ways that are injurious to women will be curtailed, and that they will lose that pleasing sense of dominion which at present makes "no place like home". --Bertrand Russell, 1910

I believe that any man who opposes the sort of men described by Russell qualifies as a feminist.

[Invincible Summer]

I didn't say I disagree with the idea of "male feminism" in general, I disagree with the subset of male feminists who think men should have a leading position in the women's movement..

I've never heard of this... could you link me to some examples?

[counterblast]

I'm reminded of the following:


I believe that any man who opposes the sort of men described by Russell qualifies as a feminist.

On a side note (at risk of stating the blaringly obvious); I just wantto clarify that not all men (or women for that matter) opposed womens suffrage on sexist grounds. Many Leftists especially, opposed womens suffrage because they opposed the ballot in general.

[F9]

I've never heard of this... could you link me to some examples?

Many idiots exist out there in the streets, and arent linkable

[Queercommie Girl]

I've never heard of this... could you link me to some examples?

It may not be conscious, like a lot of patriarchal attitudes, a lot of it is implicit, even among people who are subjectively genuine progressives.

[Bad Grrrl Agro]

Can there be male feminists? While talking with a friend, he claimed that there can be no male feminists. Is this true or not? What do you think. Please mention your stance (feminist or not) and sex (male/female...).
Pesronally, I consider myself a male feminist. Let's start...

Men can be feminist. The problem is men who bring (even subtle) sexist attitudes. Though it is kind of ironic when they do.

[Invincible Summer]

It may not be conscious, like a lot of patriarchal attitudes, a lot of it is implicit, even among people who are subjectively
genuine progressives.

Please go on.

IMHO, if a male considers himself a feminist, is deemed a "subjectively genuine progressive," yet has some "implicit" patriarchal attitude (how you pick up on this or what it even means I don't know... you need to give examples, Iseul), I don't see how this is at all close to the claim of "males wanting to lead the feminist movement."

Stop being cryptic and just say what you mean.

[Adi Shankara]

Iseul, I know you have some interesting and controversial ideas on patriarchy and sexuality, so I want to ask you: do you think transsexual female-to-males really benefit from the patriarchy? and remember: if you say that they don't because they're transsexual and thus exempt, then you're not treating transsexuals like the males they may have become, as then you are slicing things into "us" vs "them" paradigms.

[#FF0000]

In an Intro to Women's Studies class that I took we read an article that used the term "pro-feminist men" to talk about people I would otherwise consider to be feminists who happened to be men. I don't remember the arguments specifically, but it does show that variations of the idea that "men cannot be feminists" do exist. I wasn't particularly persuaded by the article, and still consider myself a feminist who happens to be male, rather than a "pro-feminist man."

I think the argument would be that men benefit from patriarchy and thus are sexist. Sort of the same as the "all white people are racist because they benefit from white privilege", except the former is way shakier.