white kids with keffiyehs are seriously begging it.
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white kids with keffiyehs are seriously begging it.
I'm bound to stay
Where you sleep all day
Where they hung the jerk
That invented work
In the Big Rock Candy Mountains.
How interesting, a thread where a bunch of people go on about how white people should "act white" (and black people should "act black", presumably). In fairness, that's not even the intention of the OP, but it has developed quickly.
Oh well, as a local former fascist leader once said, "There is only one thing worse than a negro, and that's a white negro". Good to see this kind of healthy racial thinking on Revleft as well.
What's the matter Lagerboy, afraid you might taste something?
Whoa shit, sorry for thinking critically about things.
I'm questioning the intentions of some leftists, is all. I realize it's not really my problem or whatever, but it just seems a bit immature to be like "Man I really feel for those Palestinians and Muslims who get pushed around all the time... I know... I'll be a Muslim too and wear Muslim/Arabic things to show my support!"
Yes, but it seems only specific to Palestinians/Muslims/Arabs. There are plenty of anti-imperialist struggles that take place in other parts of the world, but it seems that Western lefties choose to appropriate the aesthetics of Palestinian/Muslim culture almost exclusively. It just seems like a "counter-culture" (given the political climate against Islam in the West) way of showing one's politics. There is a certain "shock" value to it. Much like people who wear Mao or Stalin shirts.
I meant Muhammad. I edited my post.
I realize you're not directing this at me, but I will reply anyway.
It's not that white people should "just act white" and so on, but rather that some leftists/activists seem to almost take a lifestylist approach to solidarity, conflating political support with emotional/spiritual attachment.
We've got your war!
We're at the gates!
We're at your door!
We've got the guillotine...
I think there is a bit of a difference between wearing a checked scarf and converting to Islam.
I always thought Arabs and Kurds were white anyway.
Devrim
I suppose I meant white English. Also the social position of being white in the UK I see as more than being 'not black', and Arabs and Kurds are probably just as likely to get stopped and searched or dodgy looks on tubes and, says, those with African/Caribbean heritage.I always thought Arabs and Kurds were white anyway.
I think I care less about kids with keffiyahs who just think they look cool, I just get pissed off with the 'yeah I do it because I really feel solidarity with the Palestinians, what you don't? here buy a scarf'. A lot of it seems to come from this romanticised ideal of the mystical Arab, culturally and ethnically inherently prone to 'resistance'. I'd definitely say Orientalist ideals come into a lot of left policies towards the 'middle east'.
I'm bound to stay
Where you sleep all day
Where they hung the jerk
That invented work
In the Big Rock Candy Mountains.
what makes you say all that,lol?keffiyahs arent a muslim thing.i guess they were more of a leftist thing of the 70s,than of today
i guess it says more about western ignorance ,especially over the past 15 years or so,than about the arabs,or arabic language.as for westerners conversion to islam/christianity et cetera, how rebellious must that be!
Well, one good thing that has come out of the shemagh being worn in popular culture is that it is known as a "Palestinian scarf". . . not an "Israeli scarf". People now know who Palestinians are now, people who otherwise would not.
But who is to say that wearing a scarf is only to be attributed to certain populations? Surely it is merely an item and therefore doesn't belong to specific cultures or even religions.
The people of Palestine are of different religions, Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Bahai, pagan and atheist. The shemagh has nothing to do with religion.
I wear a shemagh because it keeps my neck warm, hides my face, or keeps me cool in the sun. The symbolic value it has is of little importance because few people will know its significance.
Personally, I do not like Islam and the only aspect of Arab culture I like is the mint tea, fig cakes and hooka-pipe cafe culture. I do however support the Palestinian peoples fight against such blatant oppression. There's not much I can do about it except make others aware of the injustices.
let people wear what they want for whatever reasons they want, the same with religion.
I think there's a point that's been made before, about the misdirection of some of the pro-Palestinian movements. Or criticism that these movements aren't specific to the issues that can easily be argued for the Palestinians (ie. the World Court, the human rights organisations, International Law, American funding, Jimmy Carter..). Emphasising that we cannot afford to alienate people about the facts, the facts that support the Palestinians.
On that point, I agree, because currently where I live, I don't feel like I believe in the tactics that the for Palestine movement in my city argues for. They seem to be about getting rid of Israel altogether, which isn't realistic, and never ever focus on the World Court, International Law or the human rights organisations. It encourages me to set up my own little group, that can actually talk to people on a logical and rational level about the facts, the facts that demonstrate the illegality of many of Israel's actions.
So in regard to your post, maybe I can relate a little, as long as your talking about non-muslim white people wearing the Islamic scarfs..
Last edited by progressive_lefty; 17th August 2010 at 15:17.
If people only 'know who the Palestinians are' from a scarf, and not from the fact that it is constantly in the news, then they can't be very interested in the world around them.
Devrim
I'm an atheist and I wear the scarf, and have worn it before it became 'fashionable'. It is NOT a religious symbol at all. Palestinian Muslims, Christians, secularists(including yes Marxists like the PFLP) wear it.
It's totally legit, in my view.
Just to be clear, I realize that the keffiyah is not a religious symbol and has nothing to do with Islam, but I'm (perhaps foolishly) just lumping pro-Palestinian and Islamic sympathizers together for simplicity of argument.
We've got your war!
We're at the gates!
We're at your door!
We've got the guillotine...
Most people who dont have some kind of link to it through their cultural background, seem to wear it to be fashionable.
If you want an example of pro israeli groups' people wearing it, look no further than the "fascist" EDL and a young white girl in stoke ontrent (think its a keffiyeh, my visions a bit blurry without my reading glasses):
I am really getting sick of People saying how whites and blacks are suppose to behave. Just shut the fuck up, if you have nothing good to say.
Last edited by The Red Next Door; 17th August 2010 at 21:05.
Whoops, I meant in the west, as in fashion trends in the west. My point wasnt about white people, people of all colours wear them obviously. Its a fashion trend in the UK and America at the moment and that was the point of the post.
on a serious note-it's better to get a kaffiyeh made in palestine.solidarity groups sell them.rather than buying the cheaply made chinese kafiyehs that seem tobe everywhere these days
I am going to mine from a Muslim center.
Slow down a bit comrade, its not a Muslim head scarf, it's worn by Christians too, it's simply a multi-use head wear, you can wear it on your head, wrap it around your neck in cold days, or to protect your head when working in a field on a hot day, and it was used by the Palestinian resistance to hide their faces, thus it has the symbolic solidarity with Palestinian resistance.
We have on this earth what makes life worth living:
On this earth, the Lady of Earth
Mother of all beginnings and ends
She was called Palestine.
Her name later became Palestine
My Lady, because you are my Lady, I deserve life
ok.although a solidarity group will sell them cheaper,and the money is used for palestine solidarity.and their kaffiyehs etc,will be made in palestine.available in black&white or red and white
Last edited by freepalestine; 18th August 2010 at 15:35.
Does it matter if they are from Palestine? Does it look any different depending on where it was made?
Devrim
Hell Ya the Quality is totally different what you get from Palestine will be thicker
We have on this earth what makes life worth living:
On this earth, the Lady of Earth
Mother of all beginnings and ends
She was called Palestine.
Her name later became Palestine
My Lady, because you are my Lady, I deserve life
