"communism failed"

**Chief Rebel Angel** · 7th August 2001, 13:20

so i am not a communist, but i find it to be a great system, way much better than capitalism... yes i do disagree with it on some grounds but mostly it holds great priciples for humanity to go by... so anyway my mother and i were discussing communism after lunch.. i was telling her how good of a system it is and that its more degnified than capitalism... and that i would be communist if only communism believed in god ( i tend to call myself a "muslim-communist", ppl laugh at that,,, i know its stupid, but thats what i see myself as)... anyways, she went on saying if communism was so good then why did the ussr collapse all of a sudden... so i answered it was internal corruption, am i right? and then she told me why is it so hard to apply? i told her thats because the ppl rnt well prepared.. i read what che wrote about the stage prior to communism, which focuses on educating the ppl... besides i think that we have to evolve into something more in order to follow communism, for we have been poisoned by capitalist filth for so long... its the ppls fault that communism isnt working... like islam, it isnt working now because ppl rnt applying it right... but do i say islam failed? no, and neither did communism.

**RedCeltic** · 7th August 2001, 13:50

In my point of view... communism failed in the USSR because it was never truly communist. When Marx envisioned a communist countery he envisioned a place like Germany or the United States not Russia or China. This is simply because communism is ment as the next step after industrialisation and capitalism. The Russia had only recently moved out of the fudal age and into industrialization. Workers where just then moving out of the fields and into factories in cities. They where behind the times, without an abundance of production, without the skills needed to make communism work.

The United States in primed and ready for such a system. US workers know industry and workers produce an abundance.... production is far above consumption. This is why, although not a communist myself... I believe it can work in an industrialized countery such as the USA.

**Chief Rebel Angel** · 8th August 2001, 13:19

nice points

scottish socialist · 8th August 2001, 13:58

communism has not failed. before you make points like that then cite stalinism, please make an attempt to see why socialism failed in the USSR. It was a backward country without the material means to create a socialist society in isolation. There was no workers democracy either. with no democracy, there is no socialism in my opinion, as then society is run by a select qlique at the top, just like capitalism is. many people who support capitalism bizarrely have no qualms with big business running huge tracts of society when it is accountable to nobody except its shareholders, whereas they have misgivings about public ownership of industry which is democratically accountable to the people it serves and also the people who work in that industry. one of our biggest challenges a socialists is breaking down the myth that the profit motive works, as it provides the services we need. if that was the case, then why is it that people in the third world die early from curable diseases? because it is unprofitable to do anything about, so nothing is done. capitalist value systems are are an obstacle, not a catalyst, for human progress. of course central to this is the enourmous power that the capitalist north holds over the south, which the capitalist class will not give up willingly, until they are force to by the mass of the people. Only the masses can decide, thats why it is incompatible with stalinism, where the masses had no power.

**pce** · 9th August 2001, 00:20

redceltic, so ideally are we supposed to evolve into communism like we evolved into capitalism? i mean there wasn't a capitalism revolution right?

**RedCeltic** · 9th August 2001, 05:44

The Industrial Revolution is what moved society from serfdom (slavery for the US) into Capitalism and wage slavery.

Also, I have to not the point raised by Scottish Socialist... I did fail to mention the lack of Democracy in a one party system and the lack of aid for resources also added to the fall of the USSR.

**El Che** · 9th August 2001, 21:55

i will start off by saying i totaly agree with scottish on every count

i would just like to ad that the writings of philosopher Karl Marx, with regards to he`s vison of a comunist society, the ideal society had nothin to do with what happened in Russia. It was tirany pure and simple, dicatorship in the name of the ppl.Even if they tryed to put in practice true comunism (and that ended when lenin did) they would have failed because they could not do it alone.
Comunism is a total revolution of the economic system and no one contry can do it alone, dont even the US, for i to work it must be a world wide revolution and they werent ready for it, they jumped the gun and the capitalist system uses this over ower heads saying" see, see what happens when you try and replace us with something you think is better ? you lose your freedom" well its a bloody lie i tell you. Only ignorance of the matter will let you believe it.
I think comunism is hard to understand and even harder to put in pratice. Maybe we should start be reforming this criminal capitalist system, stop its exploitation of man and planet alike. Eliminate corporate grip on power and only then start think of radical global economic system changes, maybe leave it for another genaration, hell we cant have all the fun

**Markxs** · 10th August 2001, 02:25

for me the perfect leftism is total democracy with communist economics a society were everyone can express himself by doing every think he likes without hirting others.

-A-

but yes el che its a procces and we might not see the day. in the mean time like you said fight opression and exploratation of the ppl

**drunktank** · 25th August 2001, 20:56

Communism has not only failed in USSR.
It has failed in the half world.
Germany, Bulgaria, Rumania, Vietnam, China etc.

You should be blind
not to see this.

We should see it's faults
and correct them.

**Khanmunist** · 25th August 2001, 22:24

A possible contributing factor to the unsuccessful attempts to implement "true" communism around the world (which has yet to be accomplished) may be primarily due to the cynical and hedonistic nature of man. I believe this was one of Che's primary concerns in his philosophy to revolutionize the human psyche to this "new man" which would foster great growth in a communist society with a new communal, cooperative, and altruistic perspective on life.

**drunktank** · 25th August 2001, 23:30

call this "new man" a christian

scared of cows · 26th August 2001, 23:18

Communism did not fail. The soviet interpretation of communism as a theory failed. Communism is utopianistic, it is idealistic and, yes, it is not realistic or workable. It needs molding, shaping and at times, fundamental theories have to be either altered or removed. Humanity and civilisations are constantly evolving structures and communism is a theorized way of life. Applying communism to real life means we have to alter communism to fit our indivdual lives. To say that communsim failed is like saying that religion failed. Religion didnt fail, people simply re-evaluated their faith and came to new conclusions about their beliefs and the same can be said for communism.
(__/)
(='.'=)
(2) (2)

**Chief Rebel Angel** · 28th August 2001, 13:59

out of all those who posted.. i find myself agreeing with scared of cows the most...

**DarkBrown** · 1st September 2001, 11:45

Son, Communism failed because when Karl Marx wrote the Communist Manifesto, it was only propaganda and theory. After all, it is just a theory. It will never exist in an efficient form as would a capitalist government because people are more apt to make money and keep it, then make more money, as opposed to making themselves satisfied with whats given to them. It is not corruption or sabotage that killed Communism, but the human spirit. It goes against the laws of nature that dictate that all men have to rise and accomplish, and to compete with his fellow man. Remember, it is through competition that things get better. People are the same way, if we were all ugly, one person is going to try to be better looking. Then his friend is going to try to be better looking than him, and so forth. Soon we do not have so many ugly people, which is a good thing.

**Guest** · 25th November 2001, 20:27

You ppl are all bent go capitalism

**Freiheit** · 25th November 2001, 20:43

communism has failed, because the human wasnt ready for it.
from capitalism to communism, thats more than one single step. it needs a long time. maybe in 5000 years we will live in a just society.
communism failed, because THE HUMAN SUCKS! we must change the human (make him good), before we can start the revolution.
for a human, grown up in capitalism, communism is very different.

**psycho chicken** · 26th November 2001, 04:43

u can't reverse the system in just one year. that's what lenin tried to do. and when it wasn't working, stalin brought in the 5 year plans. i thikn on the whole russia's transition into communism was too rushed. they should have taken a bit more time.
a revolution won't change the system now days, we need to start making smaller parts socailist/communist then move onto bigger things. start by educating the youth.
the main problem is getting rid of materialist ideals. after we've done that we're set

**Freiheit** · 26th November 2001, 05:08

you cant expect that everyone reads all this communist
book to know what he is supposed to do in communist
country. and even if he does he will have problem to do
it. he must be teached. and he needs time to learn it,
learn it slowly.

**Chancho** · 26th November 2001, 05:08

My opinion is that humans must ascend to communism from capitalism - this ascension must correspond with and will be brought about by, ascension to a truly moral state. This can be equated with acension from a dependent, religious state of being to a moral, responsible atheistic state of being. Capitalism appeals to the worst in humans and socialism to the best - naturally therefore, socialism requires humans to become educated, principled and genuinely moral before it can work. If the moral state is achieved, it's easy to see why communism and atheism complement one another.

**Guest** · 26th November 2001, 05:43

Quote: from Chancho on 6:08 am on Nov. 26, 2001
Capitalism appeals to the worst in humans and socialism to the best

How neat and simple and beautifully naive!

If the moral state is achieved...

"If" is a good choice of words because, as you know, here on planet Earth, there is no "moral state". But go ahead and make one -- we sure could use some force-fed morality. Bring on the revolution! No problem phasing out religion either. Nice dreams.

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