What you cannot do is convince a class to carry out a revolution. It's only by acting in their own material interests that the workers will overthrow capitalism. Those of us who are class conscious...
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What you cannot do is convince a class to carry...What you cannot do is convince a class to carry out a revolution. It's only by acting in their own material interests that the workers will overthrow capitalism. Those of us who are class conscious...
Replies 87
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Well that's it for me. Enjoy.Well that's it for me. Enjoy.
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Actually Rakunin, Marx and Engels argued...Actually Rakunin, Marx and Engels argued specifically against the kind of thing you are advocating (an organization of the working class and "radical" petty bourgeoisie, which is actually a petty...
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In other words the working class needs the petty...In other words the working class needs the petty bourgeoisie because it can't rule on its on. In other words petty bourgeois socialist wrapped up in a bunch of obscure vocabulary and an endless...
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"Seek first to understand, then to be..."Seek first to understand, then to be understood." - Stephen Covey
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Hey Jimmie, if Obama gets elected to a second...Hey Jimmie, if Obama gets elected to a second term will the ISO hold another celebration in Harlem like they did the first time around?
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Like most else you comment on, it's clear that...Like most else you comment on, it's clear that you don't really know what a workers council is.
The class establishes councils for practical reasons, in struggle, but at the same time they express...
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It helps to pay attention to what you're...It helps to pay attention to what you're commenting on.
The Communist League does indeed have all of those.
The proposed organization does not.
The two are not the same.
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I didn't mention the internet, use the term real...I didn't mention the internet, use the term real world, say this was a waste of time or anything else you put in quotations.
I'm saying these sorts of discussion would be more effective within...
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A most witty retort!
It would have been much...A most witty retort!
It would have been much better if it didn't miss the point entirely, ie. that this sort of debate can take place within the frame work of organized agitation and education.
...
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Marxist-Leninist parties lack internal democracy...Marxist-Leninist parties lack internal democracy and act in ways alien to the working class?
Get the fuck out of here! I can't believe it. :rolleyes:
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Jimmie, keep searching for a rationale for your...Jimmie, keep searching for a rationale for your reformist organization's back-handed support of Obama. You may find something eventually.
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Yeah, Rakunin. That's part of the point. We're...Yeah, Rakunin. That's part of the point. We're facing a different situation. And Marx and Engels were viewing bourgeois politics and parties (which were created as vehicles for participation in the...
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Have you missed the last 3 pages of discussion on...Have you missed the last 3 pages of discussion on parties?
The SPD was as much a party as all the others.
Are you after the self-liberation of the class and communism or a big party capable...
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Marx used the words party, movement, etc.,...Marx used the words party, movement, etc., interchangeably. He meant the general movement of the class.
The formation of the class into a party = a fighting force capable of taking control of the...
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The trade unions are beyond the topic of this...The trade unions are beyond the topic of this discussion though I do have my views on them, and I believe the experience of the class has born those out too (unless you can point me to a communist...
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By all means, let's base our strategy on what a...By all means, let's base our strategy on what a guy from a country with very little history of bourgeois democracy had to say in 1920. After all, following his advice enabled the Communist Party to...
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False.
In the 2008 president election - which...False.
In the 2008 president election - which had the highest turnout of any election since 1964 and the third highest turnout ever - only 56.8 of those of voting age cast ballots.
The...
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False. I was replying to a comrade who cited a...False. I was replying to a comrade who cited a letter from Marx with a larger samplings of the works of Marx and Engels to help put it in perspective.
I've said repeatedly throughout this...
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We are living on the same planet right? "Workers...We are living on the same planet right? "Workers parties" either helped derail or directly lead to the ruination or the workers revolutions in Russia 1917, Germany 1919, China 1927, Hungary 1956,...
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Your perspective is all wrong. You're coming from...Your perspective is all wrong. You're coming from outside of the class like a missionary goes into a country full of non-believers. You await the day that they will convert to the teachings of your...
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That group doesn't exist anymore.
I think...That group doesn't exist anymore.
I think it's more the case that "workers" parties lead by elements alien to the class tend to hijack struggles when they get to a certain point (the point...
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But why do we need a party?
The working class...But why do we need a party?
The working class can liberate itself without a party. The working class expresses its rule through councils, not party states.
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They all were. Service in the army of the...They all were. Service in the army of the Republic of Korea is mandatory for all male citizens.
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Some families also vented anger at the military,...Some families also vented anger at the military, accusing authorities of a cover-up and saying survivors told them the Cheonan was leaky and in need of repair. They shouted "Liars!" and jumped on a...