UNION:To Join or Not to Join?

So I'm going in for job orientation tomorrow at a grocery store that, as it turns out, has been unionized by the UFCW (United Food & Grocery Workers International Union).

I understand that unions provide leverage against exploitation in the workforce and are or can be a basis for which to build worker's power; my fear is that I could unknowingly join an organization littered with beuracracy and corruption that spends more money on politicians than on supporting the membership.

It's not the IWW (if only all unions were) but if it's generally looking out for it's members, I want to be involved; does anyone have any experience with this group [UFCW] or advice as to what I should do?

I'd join and be active in it. A quick Google search shows me they aren't afraid to strike. As an employee, you'll be much better off negotiating with your employer through a union than you would individually. If they turn out to be littered with beauracracy and corruption you can hassle them at meetings and vote against the leadership. And if the union is corrupt you can make sure the membership at your store isn't, anyway.

If you're active you'll have a lot more influence on the union.

Join, its practically god for you (you'll have backup, better wages and benefits nad so on).

Always join a union, if there is corruption and beauracracy fight against it, but even a bad union is better than no union.

The UFCW has been known to be bureaucratic, but you'll get more good in joining the union than not. Better wages, benefits, etc. You can also be a dual-carder and still try to enact direct action and be militant where they won't be. Though there are complaints of bureaucracy as I have mentioned, the UFCW does wage battles occasionally, such as strikes, and trying to organize places like Walmart, whereas some unions simply sit around and defend what they have left.

Even if you don't see unions as a tool of revolutionary change (Left-Com's and some anarchists don't), it never hurts to make a better paycheck. :cool:

Be a Materialist.

If you get more money or a higher position by joining--then please do. If you pay some of you hard eared wages to some fat cat so he can live large--well, that is what you have your Capitalists for.

No sense in spending your money for a redundancy.

I'm in the UFCW. You should join.

Join.

learn what materialism means, its a philisophical term, and its not used in the way you use it.

Yeah because Unoin bosses are the real fat cats :rolleyes:

The UFCW is a well-known shit union but you should still join. There's good things that go on in it and there's good people active in it and they're only going to win if their membership makes them. And yeah, even on a totally selfish level it's probably better than not being in it.

UFCW just authorized strike action in socal.

Always join the union. Always, as in no exceptions. Even if it's weak, corrupt, bureaucratic, or even the one set up by the company itself, YOU NEED A UNION. It's the only way to assert your rights and get yourself heard. You could always join the IWW alongside the UFCW if it turns out poorly, and you could always try to stem the union's corruption and make it less bureaucratic.

Don't be naive, there are some bureaucrats and high union officials who live off hard-earned dues just as much capitalists live off workers profit. It sucks, because unions can be tools of revolutionary change and a base for class-consciousness, but sadly for decades the bureaucracy has grown. The absurdity hit a new high when federations like AFL-CIO started having their presidents be college graduates who never worked a day in their life.
This.

There is no Union boss that makes fortune 500 ceo pay or wall street money, is there corruption? Yes, is there bureaucracy, absolutely, but to compare them to capitalists is a little rediculous.

True, you have a point. A lot of them sit around and don't really do anything, and have vacations and conventions in weak-union states, but yes, I tend to forget they aren't making major capitalist pay. That isn't to say some aren't making some nice-ass bank though.

Just out of curiosity, Google search (unionfacts.com) says Richard Trumka (current president of AFL-CIO) makes $264,000 as his annual salary (along with $18,000 in benefits, etc.)

Up for debate is our union president's "salary." He's the only union member who isn't employed. Full time, he does union activities - going to court, negotiating, translating, etc. Here we're talking about bare substinence wages. The union always operates in the red: dues don't cover expenses and we rely on financial settlements to stay alive. The financial settlements usually come after a successful organizing camapaign. What are we fighting against? Usually multi-national corporations. Companies who are listed on the stock exchange, ones who are part of holding companies. Shit, the building I work in is a department store, owned by a larger department store, owned by a holding company, 7 and iholdings, which owns most of the department stores in Japan, half the convenience stores, all the 7-11's in the US, retail shops all over Asia, and financed by a banking syndicate with government subsisdies. That's what a handful of underfunded and overworked rank-and-file unionists are fighting against in one small shop for basic demands. I decided to eat at the Burger King in the building today for lunch, got pissed at all the advertising and found BK was recently bought by a holding company in Brazil, 3G capital, owned by a few of the richest people in the world and heavily invested in Wall st. Union boss??? Give me a fucking break. Join your union and give it a fight - see what you discover.

And unionfactcs is funded by an infamous right-wing union-buster. Give them a wikipedia search.

People shitting on unions imo is rediculous, your shitting on the one of the only organizations that actively fighting back against class warfare, and your shitting on them because they are not angelic heavenly institutions and sometimes have corruption.

Join the union everytime, a union is a million times more useful to the working class than a political party.

If you're directing that post towards me: No, I'm not shitting on them. I think the only person in this thread who did was Bud.
I'm pretty sure everyone can agree to join a union. Even my neocon father recommends it, union member for 30 years.

Well to being with most people would advise that you always join the union no matter what.

This opinion is wrong.

You must first study the union and do some reading up on them to see what they are all about. No good in throwing your hard-earned wages at a union who is in bed with your employer. Also, it is useful to ask other workers what they think of the union. If you find that the union in your workplace is corrupt, collusive or in some otherway reactionary then do no join them. Join another union.

Im not totally familiar with how trade unions operate in the United States so I can only speak for Ireland on this one but, I would advise anyone who is going to join a Trade Union to just maintain a simple membership status for a good number of months before attempting to get further involved in the Union as I've seen people targeted by employers over here in the past and released from employment while in a probationary period as a result of the noise they have been making in the Union.

One should join a crowd just because other people other people do. Look at every decision and see if it makes sense for you.

Some are and some aren't. Nothing is black and white. Union leaders aren't all good guys in shining armor.