"Nick Griffen is right"

[zider]

I was having a look on the BNP site and came across some of their merchandise. Some of the badges on sale really help to enhance their new democratic, moderate image :lol:. What a bunch of bastards they are:cursing:.
http://s5.tinypic.com/infl14.jpghttp://i39.tinypic.com/30ag7qr.jpghttp://i43.tinypic.com/sx101g.jpg

[redSHARP]

WOW! they suck, i feel bad for the comrades in the UK knwing they have to deal with this. i guess it will make your task a lot easier knowing that these pins show that the BNP are "democratic" and "moderate" and the BNP has "changed".:rolleyes:

[Melbourne Lefty]

wonder why they have a black man with an England flag?

[Skin_HeadBanger]

wonder why they have a black man with an England flag?


I was wondering the same thing :confused:

They're a stupid bunch of bastards though... does that explain it?:laugh:

[Dr Mindbender]

wonder why they have a black man with an England flag?

its called a 'gollywog'. There were used as a pejoritive icon against black people during imperial britain.

There was a shitstorm in the media recently of a rubbish truck driving round with a gollywog soft toy tied to the front. I suspect the BNP intended it to be a response to this.

[Sean]

its called a 'gollywog'. There were used as a pejoritive icon against black people during imperial britain.

There was a shitstorm in the media recently of a rubbish truck driving round with a gollywog soft toy tied to the front. I suspect the BNP intended it to be a response to this.
Correct. Selling those pins are also the reason they couldn't have their christmas party at their usual venue.

[JimmyJazz]

Maybe I'll reveal my ignorance of BNP ideology, but why is the England soccer player a caricature of a black person? Is it ironic or something?

[Skin_HeadBanger]

Maybe I'll reveal my ignorance of BNP ideology, but why is the England soccer player a caricature of a black person? Is it ironic or something?


Read a few posts above and the answer will appear.

[JimmyJazz]

Read a few posts above and the answer will appear.

Well I'll be, it worked.

To tell the truth, I still don't get it though...an offensive caricature of a black person is one thing, an offensive caricature of a black person holding a banner representing all that you supposedly cherish is another. Perhaps this fills out the explanation:



They're a stupid bunch of bastards though... does that explain it?:laugh:

[Wanted Man]

Maybe they are trying to imply that the soccer team is full of blacks? :confused:

[Holden Caulfield]

To tell the truth, I still don't get it though...an offensive caricature of a black person is one thing, an offensive caricature of a black person holding a banner representing all that you supposedly cherish is another. Perhaps this fills out the explanation:its is an attempt to spread 'old world/traditional' rascism behind a 'innocent guise'. It is obviously rascist considering the source however if challenged they can claim that there toys have been around for years that many people like them (they do my 'liberal' mum had a few as a kid and likes them) so they can pretend to be victims and the last bastion of Tradition, it would be 'Political Correctness gone mad when you cant have a badge with a childs toy on it'. The flag is probably something along these lines as well, i'ts not rascist because he has an england flag' would be the likely excuse.

Who can say what other meanings are implied, perhaps it shows that England is being taken over, or some other shit but the fact is the 'gollwog' stands for every negative stereotype given to black men (as seen in old episodes of Noddy when gollwogs mugged him) and so this is clearly rascist regardless of the flag he holds. Maybes its just funny to rascists to see such apparent juxaposition

[Forward Union]

Well I'll be, it worked.

To tell the truth, I still don't get it though...an offensive caricature of a black person is one thing, an offensive caricature of a black person holding a banner representing all that you supposedly cherish is another. Perhaps this fills out the explanation:

My opinion of it is that it's t rying to highlight the "asurdity" of a black person being "english". Like, "hey how wierd is it that he thinks he's english just because he was born here"

Come's from the idea that 'if a dog is born in a stable it's still a dog'

[JimmyJazz]

I don't think BNP members really "get" humor tbqh

[RaiseYourVoice]

I think they made a mistake there, the first button should be this:
http://huey.freeman.pochta.ru/infl14.jpg

[Melbourne Lefty]

Maybes its just funny to racists to see such apparent juxaposition


yes that would be my guess.

racists have a twisted sense of humour at times, but to simply say they have a simplisitic sense of humour or no humour at all is to fall into the same trap as dismissing your enemy as being stupid.

[spartan]

Maybe they are trying to imply that the soccer team is full of blacks? :confused:

Wouldn't surprise me.

Didn't Nick Griffin's best friend and political ally Le Pen of the Front National say something similar about the French team taking part in World Cup 98 and Euro 2000 (both of which they ironically went on to win:lol:)?

[Holden Caulfield]

^ in an old England vs Denmark match the BNP said they supported Denmark as they had a full white team when England won the game they changed the article on theor website so it said they supported England

[Socialist Scum]

^ in an old England vs Denmark match the BNP said they supported Denmark as they had a full white team when England won the game they changed the article on theor website so it said they supported England

:lol: What a bunch of idiots.

[Pogue]

The badge is of a 'Gollywog', which were dolls used to represent black people by ignorant types years ago. Some see them as innocent and cute but fundamentaly they are racist. The term 'Wog', derived form the end of 'Gollywog' is one of the most racist words you can use in England to refer to a black person.

I assume they used it in the badge to mock the idea of black people also being English. They are trying to imply that it is absurd that a black person would also be English and to generally try and mock the idea of black people in England. Its just meant to be insulting.

As you've probably guessed though the BNP are not the most imaginative of types.

[Melbourne Lefty]

Wog



comes from "warden on Guard" doesnt it?

In Australia is used to describe Italians and Greeks.

[Module]

I'm pretty sure 'wog' means 'Western oriented gentleman'. I'm almost certain that I learnt that in history..
Here it's not used towards black people, though, but is used towards... err... Southern Europeans, I guess? Or, more people than that, probably.. people of a certain aesthetic.

As for that pin, as far as I can tell I think it's supposed to be an 'ironic' joke; black people aren't really English. Or, equally plausible, it could mean that England is now the 'land of the black man'; they're taking over!

I was browsing the BNP website http://www.britishpride.org/ and I noticed that in 'British Giants' and 'British Genius', neither of them mentioned William Shakespeare?! Surely he is as big a "British Giant/Genius" as one can get! Can anybody shed light on this?

Edit: Woops, didn't see Melbourne Lefty's post! Shows how long it took me to write this one.. :p

[Skin_HeadBanger]

comes from "warden on Guard" doesnt it?

In Australia is used to describe Italians and Greeks.

In the U.S., WOP (without papers) is the slur for Italians. It's weird that 2 slurs for the same people are so close to each other when each was derived in different parts of the world.

[Melbourne Lefty]

http://www.britishpride.org/ (http://www.britishpride.org/) (http://www.anonym.to/?http://www.britishpride.org/)


Anyone else notice that Disraeli is pictured in "british giants" but does not have a bio dedicated to him?

How strange...:laugh:

Looks like the BNP is not as anti semite free as it would like to be...:laugh:

[BPSocialist]

Who knows how the twisted, subhuman mind of BNP high command works?

They must be 'pacified'.

[Holden Caulfield]

subhuman
if you are going to talk shit stay away from the key board please

[Dr Mindbender]

comes from "warden on Guard" doesnt it?

In Australia is used to describe Italians and Greeks.

If you watch british movies, the term is used exclusively against black people.

[Invader Zim]

The badge is of a 'Gollywog', which were dolls used to represent black people by ignorant types years ago. Some see them as innocent and cute but fundamentaly they are racist. The term 'Wog', derived form the end of 'Gollywog' is one of the most racist words you can use in England to refer to a black person.



Not 'Worthy Oriental Gentleman' then?

But on a serious note, the term isn't just used to describe black people, but also to describe those from the Indian sub-continent. Indeed the OED lists the first use of the term in that context.

The word has also taken on other meanings, for example it also has come to mean something that is parasitic in nature. Also if something has been 'wogged' it has been stolen.

A vulgar term indeed.

[BPSocialist]

if you are going to talk shit stay away from the key board please

When talking about genocidal fascists, I believe that this language is justified. Those who have displayed base, animal aggression towards innocent people in such a fanatical way (I'm talking about the holocaust here) must be considered, base, animal creatures.

[Holden Caulfield]

When talking about genocidal fascists, I believe that this language is justified. Those who have displayed base, animal aggression towards innocent people in such a fanatical way (I'm talking about the holocaust here) must be considered, base, animal creatures.

find me a 'race' or group of people who have not committed genocides or atrocoties and then you might ave a point, also people are people, they are neither good nor evil.

[BPSocialist]

find me a 'race' or group of people who have not committed genocides or atrocoties and then you might ave a point, also people are people, they are neither good nor evil.

This last point of yours is debatable when refurring to anyone who agrees with the evil, inhuman acts of the holocaust. It would be hard to find an ethnic group who hasn't committed crimes against humanity based on race, but the fascist refuses to leave their, base, subhuman and medievil beliefs behind and embrace people of different ethnicities, and so must be regarded as base, subhuman creatures. You can't make a good omlette without first sorting the good eggs form the bad.

[Melbourne Lefty]

This last point of yours is debatable when refurring to anyone who agrees with the evil, inhuman acts of the holocaust. It would be hard to find an ethnic group who hasn't committed crimes against humanity based on race, but the fascist refuses to leave their, base, subhuman and medievil beliefs behind and embrace people of different ethnicities, and so must be regarded as base, subhuman creatures. You can't make a good omlette without first sorting the good eggs form the bad.


Hate to say it but your posts smell fishy...:confused:

Also I think its fair to not describe anyone as "sub-Human"

Wrong yes, disasterously wrong certainly, needing to be opposed in every way possible sure.

Sub Human no.

[BPSocialist]

All I was saying was that in the past the fascist has displayed charchteristics that are patently animal in there nature, meaning that these are charachteristics that no decent human being would display without just cause (though there is no just cause for genocide). I believe that unbelievable cruelty towards and the killing of perfectly innocent people (18 million at the last count) are not human charachteristics. I'm not saying that all the fascists should be shot, because re-education of the new or unsure members of that sect is always the first priority, but those people who are so committed to the extermination of racial minorities must be pacified for the good of all.

[Melbourne Lefty]

All I was saying was that in the past the fascist has displayed charchteristics that are patently animal in there nature, meaning that these are charachteristics that no decent human being would display without just cause (though there is no just cause for genocide). I believe that unbelievable cruelty towards and the killing of perfectly innocent people (18 million at the last count) are not human charachteristics. I'm not saying that all the fascists should be shot, because re-education of the new or unsure members of that sect is always the first priority, but those people who are so committed to the extermination of racial minorities must be pacified for the good of all.


calling people sub-human is exactly what fash do. I hope we are better than that.

[BPSocialist]

Yes, but when it's directed towards a fash it's excusable, because we're giving them a taste of there own warped medicine.

[Melbourne Lefty]

Yes, but when it's directed towards a fash it's excusable, because we're giving them a taste of there own warped medicine.

two wrongs dont make a right, calling people "sub-human" for their politicl beliefs is one step away from opening up concentration camps ourselves.

[BPSocialist]

Alright, so maybe the're not 'subhuman', but do you agree that they ned to be removed from polite society and pacified?

[Melbourne Lefty]

Alright, so maybe the're not 'subhuman', but do you agree that they ned to be removed from polite society and pacified?

Depends what you mean by "pacified".

The way to remove fascist ideas from society is to fight the economic system that helps them to thrive.

Killing off individual fash leads eventually to indiscriminate killing and only creates martyrs.

Change the system, change the world, the Gulag or the concentration camp does nothing except kill off your own legitimacy. Just look at the US government and Gitmo.

[ComradeG1967]

Depends what you mean by "pacified".

The way to remove fascist ideas from society is to fight the economic system that helps them to thrive.

Killing off individual fash leads eventually to indiscriminate killing and only creates martyrs.

Change the system, change the world, the Gulag or the concentration camp does nothing except kill off your own legitimacy. Just look at the US government and Gitmo.

I see what you're saying right enough, but I would happily drown all BNP members. They are scum that seek to divide the proletariat and keep us all in our place. No mercy.

[BPSocialist]

By pacify I was thinking surgically removing the part of the brain that causes all feelings of hatred and anger.

[ComradeG1967]

By pacify I was thinking surgically removing the part of the brain that causes all feelings of hatred and anger.

You will remove 90% of it, then, and it was very, very small to begin with! :D

[BPSocialist]

Labotomy was done in the Victorian times as a treatment of murderers and rapists, rendering them vegitables that did what they were told, but it often left the patients with severe debilitating seizures. But now we have far more sophisticated techniques and we can pacify fascists and then make them contribute to society.

[ComradeG1967]

Labotomy was done in the Victorian times as a treatment of murderers and rapists, rendering them vegitables that did what they were told, but it often left the patients with severe debilitating seizures. But now we have far more sophisticated techniques and we can pacify fascists and then make them contribute to society.

That's a good idea, though I would like to think the procedure is painful and traumatic as people must be made aware that fascism will not be tolerated. If people cannot be educated into understanding how wicked it is, then they must be persuaded by force and fear.

[BPSocialist]

We must distinguish ourselves from the fascist by making any punishment towards them humane and painless, otherwise what would be the difference between us and them?

I've just had a good look at your avatar, are you Irish By any chance?

[Melbourne Lefty]

We must distinguish ourselves from the fascist by making any punishment towards them humane and painless, otherwise what would be the difference between us and them?


you are talking about removing parts of the brains of people against their will because they disagree with you politically.

Are you serious or having a joke?

I cant think of anything that sounds more fascistic. Its disgusting and if you are not a troll you should be ashamed of yourself.

[BPSocialist]

Just who's side are you on anyway?

[BPSocialist]

you are talking about removing parts of the brains of people against their will because they disagree with you politically.

Are you serious or having a joke?

I cant think of anything that sounds more fascistic. Its disgusting and if you are not a troll you should be ashamed of yourself.


This would be an absolute last resort for those so narrow-minded they find the idea of living on a planet with other races on it repulsive.

[Holden Caulfield]

Just who's side are you on anyway?

the correct side for once...

[BPSocialist]

The fascist murdered 18,000,000 innocent people simply for the reason they were different. The fascist deserves no mercy, but I propose we show some, by letting them live, and not only that, but by freeing them from their ideological slavery and showing them a better life.

[benhur]

The fascist murdered 18,000,000 innocent people simply for the reason they were different. The fascist deserves no mercy, but I propose we show some, by letting them live, and not only that, but by freeing them from their ideological slavery and showing them a better life.

Good point. Why treat them fairly, when they don't treat others with similar respect and courtesy? Why try to be nice to those who wouldn't hesitate to gas us given the opportunity? With technological advances, we must be able to save them from themselves, though.

[benhur]

you are talking about removing parts of the brains of people against their will because they disagree with you politically.


I don't believe anyone ever said we should go around and remove the brain of those who disagree with us.:D Fascists don't merely disagree with us, they're willing to kill innocent people, even millions if they deem necessary, they're willing to indulge in ethnic cleansing, genocide, mass exterminations with absolutely no regard for any ethical consideration.

As you can see, this isn't a mere ideological disagreement:rolleyes:, it's a matter of life and death, at least for those who're easy targets for fascists, namely the large bulk of the non-white populations. Being a white person, you wouldn't understand any of this, evidently.

[ComradeG1967]

We must distinguish ourselves from the fascist by making any punishment towards them humane and painless, otherwise what would be the difference between us and them?

I've just had a good look at your avatar, are you Irish By any chance?

I am a citizen of the world! :) I don't like the idea of nations at all, I believe we are all human beings and should be able to enjoy the planet. Territory is just private property on a tribal basis.

But, to answer your question, I would be described as Scots-Irish (or a Tim, Fenian bastard, etc) as I am a Glaswegian of Catholic, Irish heritage. ;) :)

[Holden Caulfield]

For fucks sake, if i were still mod i would have given you all warning points, you are fucking way off the mark.

We do not seek vengence, most fascists are mislead members of the working class, yes we must fight them but even militant antifascists who truely do 'bash the fash' don't think that they should be killed, lobotomised, or gassed.

Try to hold a correct marxist and materialist view of things, treating fascists as animals or as a problem we need a final solution to is massively ignorant. Sure there are those who are a danger to society, the violent thugs and the manipulative leaders but these are the only people who should be 'punished' with prision or someother means, but only if they do not change from their wrong ways.

In a post revolutionary society surely we have had our revolution and beaten the fascists, no? Then surely we must show those who views might still cling to their old ideas that we can build a better society, perhaps some have already given up their old ideas and we should not witch hunt people for previous 'thought crimes' and reactionary views if they have embraced our new society. If these people are still fascists and deserving of punishment they will be convicted of whatever crime (violent, rascist, whatever) they commit or plan to commit, not because we know they were fascists in the past.

If anybody wants to argue the point still, a point they are clearly wrong on please put together a coherant argument and don't retort with 'they would do the same to us' or someother shit. I hope that you realise you were wrong and show some humility on this issue.

[BPSocialist]

What punishment would be fitting of mass-murderers other than execution?

[Holden Caulfield]

What punishment would be fitting of mass-murderers other than execution?

Which 'Fascists' are currently mass murderers? if you can think of any then by all means they should be punished, i would prefer by life imprisionment but if the mob wants mass murderers killed i suppose i could let it happen if i were in charge without losing too much sleep.

But supporters for parties that have been mass murderers in their past would mean a lot of people would be killed in your 'utopia', supporters of the Labour, Liberal and Conservative Parties will be killed with their leaders as well will they? And the American Republicans, and Democrats etc etc etc

How about the BNP, and their members? Are those who supported Labour last week but a fascist party this week should also be send to the gulags for being fascists?

[BPSocialist]

Only the most radicall of fascists should receive the ultimate punishment, by which I mean those who's adoration of genocidal despots streches far into the past and does not change in the face of radical re-education

[Holden Caulfield]

Only the most radicall of fascists should receive the ultimate punishment, by which I mean those who's adoration of genocidal despots streches far into the past and does not change in the face of radical re-education

Adoration of genocide means they will be hardcore fascists, and likely to be a threat in other ways. We are not interested in prosecuting for thought crimes, and as we cannot agree on what a fascist is, and you could not hold your origional point under scrutiny your kind of argument is clearly wrong, not materially based and driven by emotion and ignorance.

[BPSocialist]

I understand now. I think. Explain to me more how you would punish genocidal fascists, should there ever be any need to.

[Holden Caulfield]

I understand now. I think. Explain to me more how you would punish genocidal fascists, should there ever be any need to.

I don't know how future legal systems will work, however I would suggest that a life of imprisionment and confinement is more fitting and a better punishment for mass murderers, this is why many nazis tried to kill themselves, as a life time alone with their conscience would be hard for them to take, death is a way to dodge the consequences of their actions face on.

But i do not make the laws,

[BPSocialist]

Thank you, I appreciate your opinion, and I back down in this argument.

[Melbourne Lefty]

We do not seek vengence, most fascists are mislead members of the working class, yes we must fight them but even militant antifascists who truely do 'bash the fash' don't think that they should be killed, lobotomised, or gassed.


Thank God!


I don't believe anyone ever said we should go around and remove the brain of those who disagree with us

BPSocialist did....


the correct side for once...

:rolleyes:

Thank you very fucking much...:rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

[BPSocialist]

I said remove the part of the brain that causes all feelings of hatred and anger. This treatment mellows patients out.

But I believe some posts ago, I said that I will respectfully back down in this argument.