A New Communism

[ThisDay]

One Communism

The successful smear campaigns against Socialism, and the left, put forward by the bourgeois controlled media, Have created a state of affairs in which our comrades often face the same discrimination as neo-fascists and the rest of the far right.
People do not want to wait for brief explanations of our morals, when the explanations put forth by the upper classes seem so much more fitting in their description of the past communist states, like the Soviet Union and Cuba.
They see them as demons to rival the Third Reich.
And if they do not see them this way, it is because they are uninformed. Most people my age whom I speak to about politics know little or nothing about Communism. And this, I believe is the major reason communism struggles so in modern times. We need to get ourselves moving again, pick our world from the ashes left by centuries of Imperialism and Capitalism, And begin to once again spread our ideas in an earnest fashion.
We need a united communism, a new communism. One in which we are as fragmented as we are today. We need organization, and after organization we will need money. And the money will come through the our combined efforts, and not the efforts of the numerous groups and parties in existence.
With the money, we need to get ourselves heard, and teach the world about its alternatives, something different from capitalism and endless greed.

I thank you for reading this comrades, and I assure you. I would, and will fight for what I have written here.

ThisDay

[TheCagedLion]

The left has, in most countries, become a conservative, borderlining on the dogmatic, bunch, who think that the best offense is a good defense. The people with a liberalist agenda spew their propaganda every chance they get, whilst most leftist parties only rebuttle when they themselves are attacked.

We need to, be progressive, adapt our ideology to what the world is becoming, instead of what it once was, and most of all bring the battle to the liberalists home turf.

It's not gonna be easy conquering air-time in the media, but it should not be impossible.

[eyedrop]

The left has, in most countries, become a conservative, borderlining on the dogmatic, bunch, who think that the best offense is a good defense. The people with a liberalist agenda spew their propaganda every chance they get, whilst most leftist parties only rebuttle when they themselves are attacked. Don't forget all the people that are paid to spew liberalistics propaganda, through think-tanks for example. The left in the western world has mostly been in retreat for the last generation or so. In my opinion a big part of that is that the strategies of the established left aren't fit to combat outsourching and capital flight as the strategies rarely target the real strength of those treats, capital ownership and control. Their progressive tax brackets doesn't work as capitalists don't earn (I suppose get would be a better word) their money trough income. Just check the incomes of your country's 10 richest persons, most of them have close to 0 in income.

The national politics are undermined by the internationalist tendencies of the borgouise.


We need to, be progressive, adapt our ideology to what the world is becoming, instead of what it once was, and most of all bring the battle to the liberalists home turf. Sounds very nice, but little concrete content.


It's not gonna be easy conquering air-time in the media, but it should not be impossible. The media is hardly neutral institutions, without political guidelines. Though it isn't nearly as bad outside the US, as inside.

[eyedrop]

One Communism

The successful smear campaigns against Socialism, and the left, put forward by the bourgeois controlled media, Have created a state of affairs in which our comrades often face the same discrimination as neo-fascists and the rest of the far right.
People do not want to wait for brief explanations of our morals, when the explanations put forth by the upper classes seem so much more fitting in their description of the past communist states, like the Soviet Union and Cuba.
They see them as demons to rival the Third Reich. I can't really say I recognize myself here, you aren't by chance from the US? Try to explain your ideas and don't use the labels they go by.


And if they do not see them this way, it is because they are uninformed. Most people my age whom I speak to about politics know little or nothing about Communism. And this, I believe is the major reason communism struggles so in modern times. We need to get ourselves moving again, pick our world from the ashes left by centuries of Imperialism and Capitalism, And begin to once again spread our ideas in an earnest fashion. The left outside the western world, Central Amerika for example, still seem to have a lot of initiative left in them. The traditional leftist reformists don't really have a plan to combat capital flight. As I read something along the lines of "They wont leave, they like it here", in a party programme of RV (Red election alliance) a few years ago, on the question of issue of capital flight if their politics got implemented. I wasn't able to find the party programme at first try since they have reformed to the party red and closed down their earlier webpage.



We need a united communism, a new communism. One in which we are as fragmented as we are today. We need organization, and after organization we will need money. And the money will come through the our combined efforts, and not the efforts of the numerous groups and parties in existence.
With the money, we need to get ourselves heard, and teach the world about its alternatives, something different from capitalism and endless greed. We won't beat the bourgouise at the money game, although we got some labour and state controlled media here, both of which beats borgouise controlled media.


I thank you for reading this comrades, and I assure you. I would, and will fight for what I have written here.

ThisDay Your welcome

[Yoghourt]

I think that one of the problems that the left has to face up to is its inability to admit that it was wrong to support Russian state-capitalism, just as it was wrong to support the Labour Party in Britain. If you want a united left, which might actually be a force to be reckoned with, then it needs, as Marx suggested in Value, Price and Profit, to inscribe upon its banners the revolutionary watchword "The abolition of the wages system!"

Unless we are advocating a classless, stateless, moneyless global system of society based on the common ownership and democratic control of the means of production we are doing nothing but advocate the meaningless and, ultimately, ineffectual reform of capitalism.

[ZeroNowhere]

I think that one of the problems that the left has to face up to is its inability to admit that it was wrong to support Russian state-capitalism, just as it was wrong to support the Labour Party in Britain. If you want a united left, which might actually be a force to be reckoned with, then it needs, as Marx suggested in Value, Price and Profit, to inscribe upon its banners the revolutionary watchword "The abolition of the wages system!"

Unless we are advocating a classless, stateless, moneyless global system of society based on the common ownership and democratic control of the means of production we are doing nothing but advocate the meaningless and, ultimately, ineffectual reform of capitalism.
Of course.
According to some people, the above makes you sectarian. :rolleyes:

[rednordman]

They see them as demons to rival the Third Reich.
And if they do not see them this way, it is because they are uninformed.
Totally agree with you there. In some cases this new and viscious anti-communism seens to take a softer light on the third-reich, like their trying to prove that the real true 'evil' is that of communism. Im not trying to defend some of the attrocites that have been committed, but their has been times (imo) where it has almost seemed 'in fashion' to take a dig at the past and ideals of socialism. What is even more striking for me is how people will even attack very tiny and insignificant progressive ideas (for instance the NHS being public) are seen as 'backwards' even though they are actually pivotal ideas. I blame the so-called 'liberals' who think that they are savers of humanity, when really they are just conservatives hiding behind civic humanitarian ideals. They seem to think that you can be a full blown capitalist, and a progressive, whereas in my opinion the two are simply imcompatible, and there ethics will come unstuck after a short time.
Of course, if we dissagree with them we are simply naive and uneducated.:rolleyes:

[Tatarin]

I think the first and foremost problem to be solved is to stop all those damn splits! We tell the mainstream that humanity needs to unify and to be progressive, while we make new parties on issues no one will ever know. In my own country, we have two Communist Parties - both are Marxist-Leninist! The only difference is that one is bigger, the other one is smaller. No one even seems to know why they don't merge, or what problems they have with each other.

Also, I believe we need to open the doors to all "sides" of the Left. I see myself as a supporter of both Chavez and the Nepali Maoists. The main point here is that they are progressive in one way or another, at least better than the previous right-twisted governments in Venezuela or the king in Nepal.

But neither do I believe that one should be so quick to condemn anarchism, should they be successful in a revolution. After all, we want human progress.

I mean, look at this forum. There are people from all sides, but when the news come in - say, about Putin or Obama - many tend to criticise them and point out that they won't make anything much better. Doesn't this show that a unified left is possible?

[Killfacer]

I think the first and foremost problem to be solved is to stop all those damn splits! We tell the mainstream that humanity needs to unify and to be progressive, while we make new parties on issues no one will ever know. In my own country, we have two Communist Parties - both are Marxist-Leninist! The only difference is that one is bigger, the other one is smaller. No one even seems to know why they don't merge, or what problems they have with each other.

Also, I believe we need to open the doors to all "sides" of the Left. I see myself as a supporter of both Chavez and the Nepali Maoists. The main point here is that they are progressive in one way or another, at least better than the previous right-twisted governments in Venezuela or the king in Nepal.

But neither do I believe that one should be so quick to condemn anarchism, should they be successful in a revolution. After all, we want human progress.

The problem is that i could never get along with a Stalinist, they are fucking idiots. What we consider to my justifiable will completely differ.

It's all well and good talking about petty sectarianism but when it comes down to it, i would never work together with a Stalinist. I don't support Chavez because he will stay in power, despot like, for the rest of his life.

[Dust Bunnies]

I believe the post-Soviet generation (births from 1989 and onwards) may be some new steam to push the Communist train onwards. We need to unite, it is foolish to have 50 Marxist parties in one region. I believe when Marx said for workers of all countries to unite, he meant under one banner, not under different banners. As long as we are divided we cannot stand up to take the challenge of a revolution.

[ThisDay]

"I can't really say I recognize myself here, you aren't by chance from the US? Try to explain your ideas and don't use the labels they go by."

I'm from Canada, and the things I say here I have discovered from my own personal experience and research. Propaganda films from the Cold war still seem relevant to a lot of very stupid people. Also, look on the web for Anti Communist pages, I'm sure you have come across many already.


The left outside the western world, Central Amerika for example, still seem to have a lot of initiative left in them. The traditional leftist reformists don't really have a plan to combat capital flight. As I read something along the lines of "They wont leave, they like it here", in a party programme of RV (Red election alliance) a few years ago, on the question of issue of capital flight if their politics got implemented. I wasn't able to find the party programme at first try since they have reformed to the party red and closed down their earlier webpage.

While the left outside of the western world may have a lot of initiative left in them, the western world does no longer.


We won't beat the bourgouise at the money game, although we got some labour and state controlled media here, both of which beats borgouise controlled media.

Im not suggesting beating the bourgeois in a "money game", nor do I feel the need to ever amass as much money as the bourgeois, all we need to do is get the money to fund a successful campaign against them. And this Labour and state controlled media of which you speak, is fine and needed. But we need more, and we need media with strictly Communist content. Something that can become our voice, a voice to be heard. And not a voice to be found by only those who are looking.

ThisDay

[ThisDay]

I think the first and foremost problem to be solved is to stop all those damn splits! We tell the mainstream that humanity needs to unify and to be progressive, while we make new parties on issues no one will ever know. In my own country, we have two Communist Parties - both are Marxist-Leninist! The only difference is that one is bigger, the other one is smaller. No one even seems to know why they don't merge, or what problems they have with each other.

Also, I believe we need to open the doors to all "sides" of the Left. I see myself as a supporter of both Chavez and the Nepali Maoists. The main point here is that they are progressive in one way or another, at least better than the previous right-twisted governments in Venezuela or the king in Nepal.

But neither do I believe that one should be so quick to condemn anarchism, should they be successful in a revolution. After all, we want human progress.

I mean, look at this forum. There are people from all sides, but when the news come in - say, about Putin or Obama - many tend to criticise them and point out that they won't make anything much better. Doesn't this show that a unified left is possible?I am in complete agreement with you here, your last statement being a sound one. A unified left is possible, Though this unified left needs to be purged of those of us who have become conservatives under a leftist banner. All sectarianism must be eliminated. And replaced with a unified communist front.


The problem is that i could never get along with a Stalinist, they are fucking idiots. What we consider to my justifiable will completely differ.
It's all well and good talking about petty sectarianism but when it comes down to it, i would never work together with a Stalinist. I don't support Chavez because he will stay in power, despot like, for the rest of his life. And this is the kind of thing we need to remove.

[ZeroNowhere]

And this is the kind of thing we need to remove.
I predicted this one a mile away. Awesome.

[eyedrop]

I'm from Canada, and the things I say here I have discovered from my own personal experience and research. Propaganda films from the Cold war still seem relevant to a lot of very stupid people. Also, look on the web for Anti Communist pages, I'm sure you have come across many already. Avoid discussing in a way that ends the discussion in the Cold War pit.



While the left outside of the western world may have a lot of initiative left in them, the western world does no longer. True enough, and why is that in your opinion?



Im not suggesting beating the bourgeois in a "money game", nor do I feel the need to ever amass as much money as the bourgeois, all we need to do is get the money to fund a successful campaign against them. And this Labour and state controlled media of which you speak, is fine and needed. But we need more, and we need media with strictly Communist content. Something that can become our voice, a voice to be heard. And not a voice to be found by only those who are looking.

ThisDay

Mainstream media gains most of their budget from ads, to get the lucrative ad-deals you can't critizise the companies who would have ads in your media. That's why main stream-media will always be pro status quo, excluded major support from some financial powerful institution, which the radical left isn't. Besides I have my doubt about any chain stores selling a radical newspaper.

I'm not really disagreeing with you about becoming more visible and launching a major champain, but the left always attempts that.

As media is moving more and more over to the internet it is becoming more viable for the left to compete as internet is a way less capital intense media channel than newspaper and television.

[ThisDay]

Avoid discussing in a way that ends the discussion in the Cold War pit.

What I say is true though, and of course, it is definitely not the only means in which people gain their views on communism, you have seen things like "If so and so doesn't like football, he must be a communist" I'm sure? and where does all this come from? It comes from the "residue" of anti-communist, pro-bourgeois sentiments left over from the cold war. To top it all off, these schemes put forth by the bourgeoisie, their subtle hints that communism is a bad thing (and not so subtle) have been utterly successful.


True enough, and why is that in your opinion?

That is my opinion because I never see communists in the news, I never hear about communists on TV, I never speak to people who know about communism and our communist party here in Canada received only 0.06% of the vote in the 2008 election, roughly 8000 votes out of the 33,449,000 people who live here.



Mainstream media gains most of their budget from ads, to get the lucrative ad-deals you can't critizise the companies who would have ads in your media. That's why main stream-media will always be pro status quo, excluded major support from some financial powerful institution, which the radical left isn't. Besides I have my doubt about any chain stores selling a radical newspaper.

I'm not really disagreeing with you about becoming more visible and launching a major champain, but the left always attempts that.

As media is moving more and more over to the internet it is becoming more viable for the left to compete as internet is a way less capital intense media channel than newspaper and television.


The internet would be a perfect place, if it weren't for the same reasons we cannot spread our ideas in the other media. Seeing as we cannot criticize the sites like Facebook, Yahoo and still run adds on them.

Though perhaps running adds that are anti-bourgeoisie is the wrong thing to do. Perhaps we need to just get our name out there, so that people will visit our sites, learn about our ideals and learn how they will benefit from a communist government. Then we might spread our radical ideas?

[Killfacer]

How can you simply "remove" it? Despite what you say, it still exists and always will.

[ThisDay]

How can you simply "remove" it? Despite what you say, it still exists and always will.

Sectarianism goes against everything that communism is. As the saying goes "Working men of the world, unite!" it does not say "Working men of the world unite!...and then divide again"

Every time I hear someone like you call a fellow communist "a fucking Idiot", I think to myself, does this fool truly know what communism is?

[eyedrop]

What I say is true though, and of course, it is definitely not the only means in which people gain their views on communism, you have seen things like "If so and so doesn't like football, he must be a communist" I'm sure? and where does all this come from? It comes from the "residue" of anti-communist, pro-bourgeois sentiments left over from the cold war. To top it all off, these schemes put forth by the bourgeoisie, their subtle hints that communism is a bad thing (and not so subtle) have been utterly successful. Don't discuss communism then, discuss how to democratize the local community. Discuss how you as the community should have a say in if the park should be made into parking spots. Start with practical issues, abstract theories can be saved for later. Don't start banging your head against a wall of misconseptions.

Anyone who says ""If so and so doesn't like football, he must be a communist" will be laughed at by everyone.



That is my opinion because I never see communists in the news, I never hear about communists on TV, I never speak to people who know about communism and our communist party here in Canada received only 0.06% of the vote in the 2008 election, roughly 8000 votes out of the 33,449,000 people who live here. That is only really a reason for it do be unsuccessfull. Not a reason for it to be uninitiative. Now most of the left are using obsolite tactics as the welfare state can't survive the rise of corporate globalism. As have been shown by the decline in all the welfare states the last 20-30 years.




The internet would be a perfect place, if it weren't for the same reasons we cannot spread our ideas in the other media. Seeing as we cannot criticize the sites like Facebook, Yahoo and still run adds on them.

Though perhaps running adds that are anti-bourgeoisie is the wrong thing to do. Perhaps we need to just get our name out there, so that people will visit our sites, learn about our ideals and learn how they will benefit from a communist government. Then we might spread our radical ideas?

Your still thinking of it as a business brand that need to be marketed, we don't have the resourches to do that. Besides try to ask Google about how much it would cost for an AD for an anti capitalistic site, I can assure you they will decline you as socialists have earlier been declined TV-time for commercials.

Besides people become radical through personal experiences, or atleast suspectible to radical politics.

We need practical results, which will lead to the mainstream attention. Now the western left mostly just has a 20 year long string of losses. The government here has been losing grounds steadily to global and local capital even though we've had a red-green government most of the time, and it's mostly the same all over europe.

[Killfacer]

Its impossible to just to brush sectarianism under the carpet. There are stark differences between different leftists, the sectarianism isn't all just petty crap, alot of it is disagreements on important subjects. It is impossible to work with someone that you disagree with on vital subjects.

[ThisDay]

Your still thinking of it as a business brand that need to be marketed, we don't have the resourches to do that. Besides try to ask Google about how much it would cost for an AD for an anti capitalistic site, I can assure you they will decline you as socialists have earlier been declined TV-time for commercials.

Communism does in a sense need to be marketed. I know your not trying to say this, but thinking like that will never get communism off the ground.
While communism will not get into public media any time soon, we do need to get our name heard, an ad campaign or whatever else is needed is merely a means to an end. And saying that I believe communism needs to be marketed implies that the communists would want money for their "ads" this is not the case, Communism needs people to be informed. Money would not be gathered from the ads, but from fund raising and the like by voluntary donors, and this money would go to the spread of our ideas.

[ThisDay]

Its impossible to just to brush sectarianism under the carpet. There are stark differences between different leftists, the sectarianism isn't all just petty crap, alot of it is disagreements on important subjects. It is impossible to work with someone that you disagree with on vital subjects.

then to abolish sectarianism we must, during the creation of our new communism, unite all the other socialist and communist groups under a sound doctrine that is agreeable to all.

:hammersickle:

[eyedrop]

Communism does in a sense need to be marketed. I know your not trying to say this, but thinking like that will never get communism off the ground.
While communism will not get into public media any time soon, we do need to get our name heard, an ad campaign or whatever else is needed is merely a means to an end. And saying that I believe communism needs to be marketed implies that the communists would want money for their "ads" this is not the case, Communism needs people to be informed. Money would not be gathered from the ads, but from fund raising and the like by voluntary donors, and this money would go to the spread of our ideas. Good luck in your endavours then.


We will be heard when we achieve substancial positive results, people don't need to hear more propaganda (although it couldn't hurt) they need to view the left as a viable option for improvement. Which we honestly don't appear as now after 20 years of defeats.

[Killfacer]

then to abolish sectarianism we must, during the creation of our new communism, unite all the other socialist and communist groups under a sound doctrine that is agreeable to all.

:hammersickle:

Are you not listening to anything i'm saying? You can't abolish sectarianism, it exists for a reason. It is impossible to agree on something when everybody has different ideas and dogmatically sticks to them.

I would love for sectarianism amongst the left to dissapeare, but it's impossible for people to agree on things when they simply have different veiws.

[eyedrop]

Are you not listening to anything i'm saying? You can't abolish sectarianism, it exists for a reason. It is impossible to agree on something when everybody has different ideas and dogmatically sticks to them.

I would love for sectarianism amongst the left to dissapeare, but it's impossible for people to agree on things when they simply have different veiws.

You can work with people with different views on many issues, but secterianism will still exists as as there are many diametrically opposed views in practise.

I can't really work with someone to organise a workplace who has a vastly different opinions on how the workplace should be organised than me. The only way to do that would be by either my, or his opinions, bowing to the other.

[#FF0000]

then to abolish sectarianism we must, during the creation of our new communism, unite all the other socialist and communist groups under a sound doctrine that is agreeable to all.

:hammersickle:

Sit a left communist and a Hoxhaist down together and you'll figure out what's wrong with your idea real quick.

[Invincible Summer]

Communism does in a sense need to be marketed. I know your not trying to say this, but thinking like that will never get communism off the ground.
While communism will not get into public media any time soon, we do need to get our name heard, an ad campaign or whatever else is needed is merely a means to an end. And saying that I believe communism needs to be marketed implies that the communists would want money for their "ads" this is not the case, Communism needs people to be informed. Money would not be gathered from the ads, but from fund raising and the like by voluntary donors, and this money would go to the spread of our ideas.

You should know how negatively the terms "socialist" and "communist" are used nowadays - you alluded to it in an earlier post. What do you think the majority of people are going to think if there's just an ad on a bus stop with a Hammer & Sickle and the words "Workers of the world, unite!" or some other slogan on it? Most likely, it'll bring up the failures within the USSR, N Korea, etc. (Not saying that the revolutions themselves were failures, nor that there were no gains, but the eventual degradation of true communism in these societies).

What's more, socialist/communist slogans, motifs, etc are being appropriated by the mainstream as "kitschy." It's not taken seriously anymore.

As eyedrop said, we need to prove to the world that Communism is a way forward, and not with meaningless advertisements.


then to abolish sectarianism we must, during the creation of our new communism, unite all the other socialist and communist groups under a sound doctrine that is agreeable to all.

:hammersickle:

How would you go about "abolishing sectarianism?" I do agree that it is poisonous to the overthrowing of capitalism, but at the same time, it seems inevitable for groups to oppose each other on the means and ends of revolution.


Sit a left communist and a Hoxhaist down together and you'll figure out what's wrong with your idea real quick.

Or a Trotskyist and ANYONE ELSE for that matter :rolleyes:

[ThisDay]

You should know how negatively the terms "socialist" and "communist" are used nowadays - you alluded to it in an earlier post. What do you think the majority of people are going to think if there's just an ad on a bus stop with a Hammer & Sickle and the words "Workers of the world, unite!" or some other slogan on it? Most likely, it'll bring up the failures within the USSR, N Korea, etc. (Not saying that the revolutions themselves were failures, nor that there were no gains, but the eventual degradation of true communism in these societies).

What's more, socialist/communist slogans, motifs, etc are being appropriated by the mainstream as "kitschy." It's not taken seriously anymore.

As eyedrop said, we need to prove to the world that Communism is a way forward, and not with meaningless advertisements.


And your missing what im saying, we do not need cliche advertisements, nor do we need to use communist symbology. We need to get our name out. all we need is just a blank page with a parties symbol and some lines of text detailing where to gather information about us. It'd work.

[Oneironaut]

And your missing what im saying, we do not need cliche advertisements, nor do we need to use communist symbology. We need to get our name out. all we need is just a blank page with a parties symbol and some lines of text detailing where to gather information about us. It'd work.

I sincerely doubt that. The majority of people in my country barely even give enough of a shit to vote. You think they are going to excited about a blank piece of paper with some shitty social-democratic parties that have very little relation to the working class? What eyedrop has been trying to say tell you is that we have to prove how communism improves people's lives.

On another note, I really do like your enthusiasm! :)