Nazi gang goes to jail

[Sand Castle]

http://www.russiatoday.com/russian_news/news/34143
Read all about it.

[Killfacer]

Finally some good news from Russia. I hope they rot.

[communard resolution]

Have a nice trip, scumfucks.

[Holden Caulfield]

Skinhead gang on trial: the verdict

http://www.russiatoday.com/media/news/e/49356ab3c94de.jpg
A Moscow city court has pronounced seven members of a skinhead gang guilty of 20 racially motivated murders and 12 counts of attempted murder. The two gang leaders – 17 year old Artur Ryno and Pavel Skachevskiy - were found to be undeserving of lenience. The exact terms that those found guilty will have to serve are to be discussed at a Moscow court on Thursday. Although the gang is on trial for 32 incidents of racial assaults of which 20 were murders, Ryno himself claimed that the gang was responsible for the deaths of at least 37 people.

The legal process took place behind closed doors, since some of the gang members are still minors. The ages of the accused ranged from 15 to 22 at the time of the crimes. The jury had to answer 282 questions in their deliberations on coming to a verdict before coming to a unanimous decision.

The hearing

Over the course of the court proceedings, Ryno and Skachevskiy fully admitted their crimes, claiming that they were on a mission to “cleanse Russian blood”. More specifically, Ryno, who studied at a religious painting school before his arrest, launched into several vehement speeches in front of the jury.

The skinhead leader maintained that he led a struggle against “godless authority” and ended his monologue with the phrase “for faith, the Tsar and the fatherland” – a slogan characteristic of pre-revolutionary Imperial Russia. Another accused explained his crimes by saying that he is a great admirer of Chikatilo – the most famous serial killer in Russian history who was nicknamed “the Butcher of Rostov” and executed for the murder of 52 women. This morbid admiration of murder led the investigation to suspect that some of the gang members were psychiatrically ill. But an examination concluded that all of the accused were fully psychiatrically healthy.

Other gang members justified the killings by saying that they deemed it important to free Moscow from an influx of foreigners who were “poisoning Russian blood”. The defence’s line was to point out that the accused were mostly students of prestigious universities, who were guided by their “heightened feeling of justice”. According to the young people’s lawyers, this was what led them to a desire to ‘cleanse’ Moscow of foreigners.

The jury was presented with 282 questions, which were designed to help them decide whether the young people are to be found guilty or not. According to the defence, all the questions are of the same type and repetitive: “Was a crime committed?”, “Did this accused take part in it?”, “Does he or doesn’t he deserve lenience?” This was applied to all 32 incidents of racist murders and attempted murders.

As a result, seven of the nine accused were found guilty under several paragraphs of the Russian criminal code, including premeditated murder by an organized group with the intention of kindling interracial discord.

However, while the two leaders - Ryno and Skachevskiy – were found undeserving of lenience, the rest were revealed to have had mitigating circumstances. The jury decided that they should be given the minimal possible term to serve. Two of the gang members were let free in court. Svetlana Avvakumova, who filmed the murders and later published them on the internet, and Nikolay Dagaev, who claimed that he was accidentally present on several gang crime occasions, divided the jurors. Six claimed they should be acquitted, while six more insisted that they should be found guilty. Under Russian legislation, if this is the case, the decision is made in favour of the accused.

Potential verdict

Although found guilty without mitigating circumstances and without deserving lenience, Ryno and Skachevskiy might not receive the anticipated long sentences. According to the Russian criminal code, only the age at which the crime was committed is taken into account, not the age at which the accused stand trial. And, throughout the 32 incidents of racist aggression, the two gang leaders were underage. This means that their sentences could potentially not exceed 10 years of imprisonment.

The same applies to the other gang members, with the extra circumstance that their direct involvement in the crimes is difficult to prove. In a gang situation, the most standard sentence distribution is for the leaders of the group and the executors of the crime to receive the longest ones. The executors are difficult to pin-point and the leaders were underage at the time of the crimes.

A double-edged sword

Some of the skinhead’s relatives claimed that since the gang’s arrest they have become the target of numerous threats and assaults from members of ethnic minorities. The story, which was repeated most often during the proceedings was that of Pavel Skachevskiy’s sister.

Ekaterina was walking with her infant child when a group of six ran up to her and started shouting “Let’s kill the Fascist family”. They kicked over the baby’s pram and hit Ekaterina several times. The woman filed a statement against her attackers at the local police station.

The skinheads

The gang's first assault was directed against a Chinese citizen, Zhao Shibo. On the 21st of August 2006, the skinheads knocked Shibo off his feet, gave him several blows and struck him in the chest with a knife six times. However, the victim survived and proceeded to report the attack at the local police station. The investigation reached a dead end on that occasion. It took over a year and 31 more hate crime incidents to locate the gang. Only following the murder of Karen Abramyan, an Armenian businessman, who was stabbed 20 times, were the suspects finally located. They were arrested in a tram shortly after the crime was committed.

Ryno admitted that he committed his first murder straight after the Cherkizovsky market blast (http://www.russiatoday.com/news/news/24160) on August 31, 2006. Then, a group of young people spontaneously attacked men who looked as though they were from the Caucasus region. Ryno told the investigation that he hit one man with a knife. Soon the religious painting student, whose studies were based around drawing Russian Orthodox saints, met Pavel Skachevskiy, a student of the Moscow Sports University. This happened during a football match. The two decided to combine their desire to “cleanse the city of non-Russians”.

The pair went to various parts of the city, locating single men, who mostly appeared to be from the Caucasus region, and attacked them. Sometimes, they committed several assaults in an evening. After a while, a group of followers started accumulating around the two skinheads. Ryno claimed during interrogations that they were mostly fans of CSKA Moscow football club.

The confession wasn’t immediate. At first, all of the gang members denied their crimes. However, they were shown several of the videos that they themselves posted on the internet as well as several recordings from video surveillance cameras. Then, suddenly, Ryno began recounting the way that the gang operated.

The young people would head out to a suburb of Moscow and seek out a victim. Then, as Ryno said, depending on their mood, they would either find a cause to attack, or attack from the back. The skinhead leader said that they would never inflict fewer than 20 knife wounds. He claimed there were witnesses to their crimes, but nobody ever tried to prevent a murder.

“From my school years I have hated people from the Caucasus who come to Moscow, form ties and start to oppress Russians,” Ryno told the investigation in justification of his deeds.

Unlike his fellow skinhead leader, Pavel Skachevskiy kept silent throughout his interrogations and refused to help the investigation.
Anna Bogdanova, RT
Related Links:
Skinhead leaders plead guilty to 20 murders (http://www.russiatoday.com/news/news/31220)

Skinhead gang on trial for racial murders (http://www.russiatoday.com/news/news/27933)

Police end probe into alleged skinhead murder gang (http://www.russiatoday.com/news/news/26825)

Moscow police bust alleged racist gang (http://www.russiatoday.com/news/news/20824)

[Holden Caulfield]

17 years old! its a fucking waste of a life, this reminds we of what Jaffe said a while back that to make the antifa scene, or leftist, scene (i.e. active in the community, gigs, counter culture etc) stronger and cooler than the right-wing 'scene' stops rebellious kids being sucked into bonehead groups and eventually turned into to out and out Nazis and in the worse cases killers,

although he is old 17 I hope he stays away for a long time, the entire group have alot of blood on their hands

[Dr Mindbender]

Good to hear.

No doubt they'll be out prematurely with 'good behaviour'.

[Holden Caulfield]

A Moscow city court has pronounced seven members of a skinhead gang guilty of 20 racially motivated murders and 12 counts of attempted murder.


This means that their sentences could potentially not exceed 10 years of imprisonment.

that is fucked up.
half a year for every murder?!?

[Dr Mindbender]

that is fucked up.
half a year for every murder?!?


...and thats assuming they actually serve the full 10.

[communard resolution]

Well, let's hope their jail is the toughest in the world and full of angry Chechenyan seperatists.

[Sankofa]

So these are the fucks that've been posting those Russian Nazi attack videos all over the net?


The skinhead leader maintained that he led a struggle against “godless authority” and ended his monologue with the phrase “for faith, the Tsar and the fatherland” – a slogan characteristic of pre-revolutionary Imperial Russia.

:rolleyes: What a fucking joke these guys are, nothing more than a bunch of dumbass fash punks.

And less than 10 years for 20 fucking murders? I hope they get raped and shanked, and not necessarily in that order, in prison.

[Dr Mindbender]

i wonder if these are same gang responsible for the 'beheading' video?

I hope so, it makes me sick to the stomach thinking of those fuckers walking the streets freely, god knows what their victim's families must be going through.

[hugsandmarxism]

I couldn't read it all; reading about fascists makes my blood boil. I hope these scum have a rough time of it. If it were up to me though... well, let's just say, they wouldn't enjoy it.

[Dóchas]

pity...its probably only the tip of the iceberg but its two less nazis to worry about

[Killfacer]

Hopefully they are gang raped.

[Holden Caulfield]

Hopefully they are gang raped.
try to be constructive please, for fucks sake, we all really hate nazis so lets try to act at a higher intellectual level than them

[Killfacer]

Oh come on, what was this thread meant to do? Hardly a fertile ground for interesting debate is it.

All anyone else has said is "i hope they rot" or "i hope they have a hard time"

[Holden Caulfield]

to give news,
i didnt mean to single you out, that was unfair of me, what i said applies to everybody, but this forum isnt a place for us to throw insults at nazis from behind our key boards

[Killfacer]

Yeah i guess your right. Won't happen again Mr Holden.

[Sam_b]

Hopefully they are gang raped.

Please do not make such rape analogies on here, I think they are deeply upsetting for a lot of our members.

[cop an Attitude]

The'll be treated good in jail though :(. Nazi gangs are all over the prison system in europe and the westeren US, they'll fit right in. I normally am against most incarsaration but with these people, I think they got whats needed.

[Red October]

10 years is a bullshit sentence, but at least it means they'll be off the street for a while. And given the state of the Russian prison system, maybe they'll suffer an unfortunate accident.

[Armand Iskra]

better to have them not to be imprisoned, but end up being executed by our comrades, especially through the victim (like in afghanistan where the taliban have the victim take over the gun to execute the offender) Or if there are chances of being converted to the cause of our struggle, good for them.

well...
that is what we call revolutionary justice.

[Killfacer]

Please do not make such rape analogies on here, I think they are deeply upsetting for a lot of our members.

What you on about? What kind of cretin could be offended by me saying some evil skin head murderers should get gang raped?

Unless there are loads of rape victims on this site, which i doubt, then i see no reason for people being "deeply upset". Of course if there are rape victims then i apologise for deeply upsetting you.

[Holden Caulfield]

although i'm not going to 'repremand' you for saying you hope these guys get raped in prision, using the whole rape analogy thing is a contraversial issue and it is best to avoid using it in future

[Sam_b]

What kind of cretin could be offended by me saying some evil skin head murderers should get gang raped?

Well if i'm a cretin, so be it. And some of my friends, and an ex-girlfriend of mine have actually been through the experience. So I think its pretty damn insensitive to use it as flippantly as you did in that post.

[Killfacer]

Christ, it was a throw away remark about some Nazi's. Whether you know somebody who has been raped is irrelevant, stop being so touchy about people's off hand statements.

Analogy? It was just me saying i hope some murderering racist suffer. People on this site are so fucking touchy. They also take off hand comments, get offended by them, then fly off the handle. Its fucking pathetic.

[Holden Caulfield]

end this discussion here, rape remarks are insensitive, its a contentios issue,
so avoid making them,

if you dont like the forum then don't post here, warnings will be given out if this continues

[Killfacer]

Ended

[communard resolution]

Hopefully they are gang raped.

But if they get gang raped in jail, how do you know they don't end up enjoying it?






Sorry everybody, something in me just couldn't resist to try and top that. I didn't mean it & it won't happen again.

[Sentinel]

Sorry everybody, something in me just couldn't resist to try and top that. I didn't mean it & it won't happen again.

If you realised it was inappropriate, perhaps you should have edited your post?

Consider this a verbal warning.

[communard resolution]

Consider this a verbal warning.

Sure, in a way I was asking for it. But there's something I'd like to know. The Nazis in question have been put in jail because they cold-bloodedly murdered defenseless human beings whose only 'crime' was the colour of their skin. They have been given laughably low sentences. Some posters have expressed their anger about this by wishing the worst things they could imagine upon those fucks: some wished them death, others rape. Now I'm pretty sure we all consider rape to be a terrible crime - perhaps more terrible than murder (which is why no one got too upset about the straightforward death wishes posted in this thread).

Why then is wishing the most terrible thing you can imagine upon a bunch of murderous racist scumbags so controversial if that terrible thing is rape rather than death?

What if one of my friends got killed? Should everybody refrain from wishing death upon these Nazis out of consideration for me?

[Sam_b]

Rape in itself is more than just a deed. Its a psychological and phsyical act of patriarchy and male dominance (regardless of what gender of who is getting raped) which sends a message that he, as the strong masculine type can get whatever he wants and damn the consequences.

I don't like the term being used as flippantly as killfacer used it, and I think that can set a precedent that makes it OK to use haphazardly/jokingly/as a sign of frustration. His response as well showed absolutely no compassion either to what it has done to people: and i'm sure as hell he wouldn't give such a retort to the face of someone who has actually been through it.

So I thought it was out of line. It isn't something to be joked around with, or used in any way that has been in this thread.

[Killfacer]

Rape in itself is more than just a deed. Its a psychological and phsyical act of patriarchy and male dominance (regardless of what gender of who is getting raped) which sends a message that he, as the strong masculine type can get whatever he wants and damn the consequences.

I don't like the term being used as flippantly as killfacer used it, and I think that can set a precedent that makes it OK to use haphazardly/jokingly/as a sign of frustration. His response as well showed absolutely no compassion either to what it has done to people: and i'm sure as hell he wouldn't give such a retort to the face of someone who has actually been through it.

So I thought it was out of line. It isn't something to be joked around with, or used in any way that has been in this thread.

Shut up. Everyone had stopped talking about it. Stop trying to have the last word and grow up. I'm not going to dissect anything you said otherwise it will go on and on. Just leave it at that okay.

[communard resolution]

Rape in itself is more than just a deed. Its a psychological and phsyical act of patriarchy and male dominance (regardless of what gender of who is getting raped)

Is murder not an act of dominance that send a message that he as the strong masculine type can get whatever he wants and damn the consequences?


i'm sure as hell he wouldn't give such a retort to the face of someone who has actually been through it.That's exactly the point. His initial post clearly indicates that rape is in fact the most terrible thing he can imagine, which is the reason he wished it upon them. In no way did he indicate that he thinks of rape as acceptable.


It isn't something to be joked around with, or used in any way that has been in this thread.I'm not trying to defend my own little 'joke', which obviously just grew out of the infantile desire to cross a line that had been drawn one or two posts earlier... and then some.

As for Killfacer's remark, I can see how it might be considered offensive, but I think it's obvious that he doesn't endorse rape or think of it as a cool thing to do. Neither do I, but to be perfectly truthful, if some of those Nazis incidentelly happened to get raped in prison and you asked me for sympathy, you'd be asking me a bit much.

[Sam_b]

[This should probably be a split thread maybe?]


Shut up. Everyone had stopped talking about it. Stop trying to have the last word and grow up. I'm not going to dissect anything you said otherwise it will go on and on. Just leave it at that okay.

Nero asked a legitimate question about it. Stop being so childish or go back to OI and troll there.


Is murder not an act of dominance that send a message that he as the strong masculine type can get whatever he wants and damn the consequences?

Thats a good question, and its often hard to draw some sort of boundary. I would probably point out that women generally can't rape someone, but can commit murder. Gnerally I think it goes down to what people think is and isn't acceptable to say, as an outburst or otherwise. I draw the line there, some others don't.


That's exactly the point. His initial post clearly indicates that rape is in fact the most terrible thing he can imagine, which is the reason he wished it upon them. In no way did he indicate that he thinks of rape as acceptable.

Well I would probably make the point that it wasn't thought out and disregardeded anyone who may have been raped on this board. But again, thats probably up to interpretation.

[communard resolution]

[This should probably be a split thread maybe?]

That would make sense. There was a disagreement about the same issue in an earlier thread, but I seem to remember the issue wasn't resolved to everybody's satisfaction (or understanding). I for one still do not see what the big deal is in the context of this thread, but would be willing to have a listen to everybody else's opinions.

EDIT: I've just opened a poll which will give us the chance to hear what everyone thinks:

http://www.revleft.com/vb/wishing-worst-upon-t96475/index.html?t=96475

[The Douche]

I'm loling at the fact that the stock image the news site used had a skinhead wearing a crass backpatch.

[communard resolution]

[This should probably be a split thread maybe?]

Well Sam, unfortunately the poll was prematurely trashed by a mod because she and some other posters (not you) didn't understand its premise.

As far as I'm concerned, the basic question was very clearly phrased: is someone's uttering a rape wish in anger worse than someone's uttering a death wish in anger and why? Some of the posters, however, took it as "is rape an acceptable form of punishment for Nazis", which is of course another question entirely and no one in their right mind would suggest to discuss.

This led to a sort of domino effect: no one cared to read the original question anymore, and as a final result, a mod decided to stifle the debate before Left Communist got the chance to elaborate on some of her rather interesting points. This way, nothing was gained - which is unfortunate, but maybe we can talk it out via PM some time.

[Sam_b]

Thats unfortunate. I'm sure if someone talks to Des and gets her to remove some of the more ridiculous posts the thread tcan be reinstated.

[Holden Caulfield]

again this is not the place for this discussion, either start a new thread and have a nice word with Des or have this via profile comments

[communard resolution]

again this is not the place for this discussion, either start a new thread

I have, but it was trashed.


and have a nice word with Des or have this via profile commentsI've PMed her about it, but she isn't replying. Haven't seen it logged -let alone backed up- in Admin or Moderator Actions either. Maybe she just enjoys trashing threads. Whatever.

I'm more than happy to continue the discussion on Russian neo-Nazis, towards whose activities I've been trying to direct everyone's attention to at several opportunities. We can rather helplessly wish upon them whatever we want, their reign will continue regardless. I'm saying "reign" because as I mentioned in another recent thread, they hold the power in Russia's streets, murdering two people a week on average and hospitalising many more. This is fascism at work right now, not in a future scenario.

At one point, a Russian comrade felt so desperate about the situation that he wrote to me: "we can use anyone's help now, even the police's". This was a year ago. Since then, the Russian police have unmistakably proved in several cases whose side they are on, once even going as far as forwarding anti-fascists' private adresses to the fash. So that one's out for sure.

What does it matter who nominally holds power in the Duma (and make no mistake, they've good good contacts there too) when outside of it the fash control the towns and can do as they please?

Comrades on revleft often suggest we somehow support the Russian Antifa. But the numbers of the Russian Antifa are ridiculously small compared to the armies of neo-Nazis and can never, ever compete. Is there really nothing we can do other than sending donations to Russian anti-fascist groups (which is still of tremedous importance and I would urge everyone to do) or wait for the revolution? Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.