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View Full Version : the Nature of the BNP (taken off some other guys website)



Holden Caulfield
28th November 2008, 23:01
i know its a lot of text but it is worth a read i think
Is the BNP Nazi? No, it’s Worse: It isn’t

Andrew McKibben

WITH THE increased vote for the British National Party in the last local elections, a chorus of "these Nazis must be stopped" has gone up, along with suggestions concerning what organising tactics might be effective against it. Unfortunately, most such tactics are presently handicapped by a misapprehension about the BNP that leads well-intentioned activists into ineffective tactics. This suspicion is bolstered by the failure of the brave and sincere efforts of Stop the BNP (publisher of Searchlight magazine), Unite Against Fascism, the Anti-Nazi League and others to stop the party’s growth.

The problem? While it is morally satisfying to call the BNP Nazis, and while their ideology is indeed racist, xenophobic and abhorrent, it’s starting to become clear that this rather slippery political beast has in fact shed its old skin, and is no longer plausibly describable as a Nazi, or fascist, party at all. Why is this "worse"? Because, although one must rejoice in the abandonment of this diabolical ideology by anyone, it also increases their chances of success.

The likelihood of real, live, goose-stepping Nazis actually winning much support in Britain is far less than that of some better-packaged and locally-palatable variety of racist extremism. Unfortunately, after 40 years (if you count its National Front predecessor) the BNP seems to have finally figured this out. So the Nazi business has been junked. This is logical: racial hatred is their only political bedrock, and the swastika is just one expendable way of expressing it.

Before I discuss the evidence they really have done this, it’s important to remind ourselves that "Nazi" isn’t just a word to toss around, even at people who richly deserve any insult they get. Nazism is a real, historical, political ideology, like Marxism, with a specific content and specific criteria for who is one. It is National Socialism, the philosophy of the National Socialist German Workers Party. There’s some leeway to include people who don’t literally fit, but not every racist demagogue is a Nazi, not even remotely. Some, especially in foreign countries that fought Hitler in World War II, are even anti-Nazi.

Why care about being so precise? Because attacking the BNP for being Nazis will backfire, if they’re not. It only invites them to prove to the public that they aren’t, and, because this is now probably technically true, they can then just sit back, smile, and say to the public: "See. Our opponents told you we were bad because we were Nazis, and we’ve now proved we’re not Nazis. So we must not be bad. Furthermore, our opponents are liars and you can’t believe anything else they say about us."

This is not good. When the public hears "don’t vote for them, they’re Nazis", and then, partly out of sheer titillation at the naughtiness of somebody daring to be such an evil thing, goes and looks at the BNP website and starts reading their propaganda, they will discover fairly quickly a group that has gotten rid of the old swastika trappings, and adopted the image of nice British patriots. If they are taken in, they may then conclude they’re a legitimate party, merely being attacked by silly and hysterical left-wing cranks who exaggerate things.

I realise some readers will believe the BNP is still Nazi, and maybe they really have taken it deep enough underground that I’m fooled. But I think not, as some signs are just tell-tales. One of them is the reported expulsion of hardcore Nazis from the party, something loudly complained about on openly-Nazi websites, accompanied with howling accusations of betraying their cause directed at BNP chairman Nick Griffin. Another is the BNP’s sudden change in attitude towards Jews, after having vilified them since the earliest days of the National Front. Basically, they now seem to be openly proclaiming they don’t consider them evil anymore, and have even publicly mocked Nazi and other anti-Semitic ideas about Jewish world conspiracies and the like.

Take a look at this article (http://www.bnp.org.uk/columnists/chairman2.php?ngId=30) by their chairman, for example: "If the neo-cons didn’t have the baggage-laden anti-Semites, especially in America, as bogeymen, they’d have to invent them.... The neo-cons are mainly Jewish, but they are not ‘the Jews’. When it comes to Middle Eastern policy, they are a particular faction, an unofficial overseas agitprop department of Israel’s ruling Likud party. To oppose their war is not to oppose ‘the Jews’, but only one group of Jews and their Christian-Zionist and plutocrat allies...." (Nick Griffin, ‘By their fruits (or lack of them) shall you know them’, BNP website, 21 March 2006)
One could read the above words in the Guardian! Something is definitely going on. Or look at this article (http://www.bnp.org.uk/articles/judeo_obsession.htm) by John Bean, one of the longest-lived right-wing cranks in Britain, and a major BNP ideological guru:

" ... there is no factual basis for anti-Semitism, i.e. the belief that Jews are intrinsically our enemy. The worst one can truthfully say of the Jews is that they are intrinsically opportunistic. To survive in other people’s countries for 2,000 years, they obviously have to be. But this doesn’t make them intrinsically bad; only people who will, like anyone else, pursue their self-interest according to the circumstances of the time. We shouldn’t surrender to their pursuit of self-interest. We should, naturally, pursue our own, but in a calm and rational way in the same manner as we deal with other foreign societies, without hatred, mythology, or hostile intent." (John Bean, ‘Why we must reject Judeo-obsessivism’, BNP website, undated)

Unless this is completely invented out of whole cloth, something fundamental has changed. And I suspect it isn’t a complete put-on, as at least one (extreme right-wing) Zionist magazine (http://www.think-israel.org/locke.bnp.html) seems to have picked up on it, and seems to believe it, or most of it:
"... today [the BNP] is, by world standards, a fairly conventional right-wing populist ethno-nationalist party, having abandoned the fascistic trappings, tendency to violence, and weird obsessions that once characterized it. The party’s transformation is not wholly complete as of this writing. Some of the rank-and-file membership is clearly not as far along as its leadership. But, after four years of reform, the BNP seems to have managed a decisive break with its past.... The BNP’s new ideological complexion is generally denied by its opponents, both on the left and on the establishment ‘right’ ... but it seems to be real. The accusations of ‘sell-out’ hurled at the present BNP leadership by devotees of the old ways make this clear, if nothing else does." (Robert Locke, ‘The British National Party goes straight’, Think-Israel, September-October 2005)

Now a change like this doesn’t just happen. I think some kind of deal has been done between the BNP and some extreme-right-wing Zionists. It’s a pity that a people who suffered so much from fascism should produce fascists of their own, but we have all seen enough of Israel’s behaviour in recent years to know that some Jews are not exempt from this.

It’s obvious that the BNP’s foaming-at-the-mouth Islamophobia must have something to do with this unexpected rapprochement. Even they are bright enough to appreciate the logic of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend". They may, in fact, be rather jealous of the treatment Israel routinely hands out to its Muslim population on the West Bank. Or perhaps the anti-Semitic mind just needs someone to hate, and they just find Muslims a juicier target these days.

The BNP still says it’s not pro-Israel – they claim to be isolationists, who don’t want to side with either side – but one has to wonder, if they’re resolutely uninterested in the whole thing, and simply want to ignore Jews entirely, why they’ve gone to the trouble of making sure everyone knows. The giveaway: they’ve made clear statements that they’re against Britain’s funding the Palestinian Authority, which is a de facto pro-Israel position if anything is, given that we currently do fund it, through the EU.
Maybe they’ve been paid to do this, maybe it’s pure ideology, I don’t know. But don’t be surprised if this apparent new alliance lasts. Israel and Zionists have been happy to do business with any number of extreme-right parties, from the Afrikaner Nationalists in apartheid South Africa to the Falangists in Lebanon to the Kuomintang in Taiwan. Historically, actual fascists (as opposed to Nazis) can go either way on the Jewish Question: some have been raving anti-Semites, others blasé about Jews, or sympathetic to fascistic elements in Zionism. Extremes do meet.

So should we simply substitute the word "fascist" for "Nazi" in anti-BNP campaigns? Unfortunately, I don’t think the BNP is really fascist, either. Fascism means espousing a lot of things, like military glory and massive accumulation of state power, that the BNP sniffs at these days. Whether or not it is sincere, it has become so good at playing this tune that it has even managed to con a significant section of libertarian opinion in the UK, like Sean Gabb, into supporting it, at least tacitly. So calling it fascist suffers the same liability as calling it Nazi: it’s too easy for them to convince people they’re not.

In the end, I think our best bet is simply to classify the contemporary BNP as a right-wing populist racist and xenophobic party, of no stable ideological substance beyond that. Don’t try to fit it into a box in which it doesn’t really belong, and will wriggle out of if accused. The truth about it is bad enough, without having to dress it up in an ideological costume drama from 1936.

"Racist" is good enough for me, adding "xenophobe" when one needs to elaborate. And, of course, there’s always "thuggish" and "criminal". This sheep smells bad enough without having to tell people it’s really a wolf.

Holden Caulfield
29th November 2008, 00:59
thoughts?

Devrim
29th November 2008, 01:19
Of course the BNP aren't Nazis. There aren't any Nazis today except for a few cranks who like to dress up in funny uniforms.

The bit near the end about them being 'paid by the Jews' sounds a bit like conspiracy theory to me. They are anti-Muslim. But then what respectable European nationalist isn't these days, from Jack Straw rightwards?

Devrim

Melbourne Lefty
30th November 2008, 15:33
Historically, actual fascists (as opposed to Nazis) can go either way on the Jewish Question: some have been raving anti-Semites, others blasé about Jews, or sympathetic to fascistic elements in Zionism. Extremes do meet.


very true.

I dont believe the BNP are nazis, and I dont believe that most of the membership has any nazi type thoughts at all.

And I also think that this makes them MORE dangerous, not less.



The bit near the end about them being 'paid by the Jews' sounds a bit like conspiracy theory to me. They are anti-Muslim. But then what respectable European nationalist isn't these days, from Jack Straw rightwards?


Yeah but then again when it comes to 'zionists' some people on the left can go a bit silly too.:rolleyes:

Not that zionism is a good thing, but I have heard and read enough about 'zionist cabals' in more marginal left wing literiture to know it exists.

Melbourne Lefty
30th November 2008, 15:34
Hey if the BNP WAS fash but is now [mostly] not can they be called 'neo-fascist'?

Holden Caulfield
30th November 2008, 15:37
Hey if the BNP WAS fash but is now [mostly] not can they be called 'neo-fascist'?

yes but i wouldn't use that one outside leftist discussion as i think it requires a deeper than average understanding of terms,

the best one, one they cannot refute is that they are
'White Nationalists' they propose segregation (not overtly but they do), and they are ultra nationalists

Sasha
30th November 2008, 16:34
Hey if the BNP WAS fash but is now [mostly] not can they be called 'neo-fascist'?

didn't the italian fascist party NA call it selfs post-fascist now a days :crying:

Oswy
30th November 2008, 22:26
I think the BNP are neo-Nazis, albeit pragmatically dressing up in suits and distancing themselves from the more obvious symbolism of Nazism in order to gain wider popular support. The BNP's policies are centrally racist, they make much of their 'defence' of the 'white working-class' in nationalist terms and they also claim to be socialists. What does a mix of racism, nationalism and socialism remind you of? It reminds me of the Nazis. Not until or unless they were close to power (an unlikely possibility in my view, but we should never be complacent) are they likely to start making noises which make their central agendas more obvious, but that doesn't mean they don't have such agendas.

Melbourne Lefty
1st December 2008, 08:40
didn't the italian fascist party NA call it selfs post-fascist now a days :crying:

Yeah Fini said it I think.

Now THATS a scary man. :blink:



Not until or unless they were close to power (an unlikely possibility in my view, but we should never be complacent) are they likely to start making noises which make their central agendas more obvious, but that doesn't mean they don't have such agendas.


The best news is that the BNP have had more wins the more 'moderate' they have gotten.

Judging by the noises from Richard Barnbrook and some of the other new members and the murmering you hear from moderates like Simon Darby and Martin Wingfield on their blogs [yeah I have done my research!] it seems like the momentum inside the BNP is to move MORE away from its nazi past.

This is good and bad.

Good because it means that people that might have been recruited into a nazi group are now going to be recruited into a group that is trying REALLY hard not to look nazi.

Bad because the moderate they get the more popular they are likely to get. Not to the point of serious power, but certainly to influence debate.

I saw a news report where Trevor phillips [race equality bigwig] who has fought the BNP for years talking about how the interests of the 'white working class' need to be addressed.

Treating the white working class as a discrete entity is as big a mistake as you can get. If people start thinking in those terms on a widespread level the working class will be split horribly.

This is why I roll my eyes everytime someone on the left starts talking about affirmative action for oppressed minorities. If you wanted to set up a plan to help the BNP gain support without helping poor black kids at all, that will be it.

Oswy
1st December 2008, 11:06
I appreciate the argument that the BNP's drive for increased popular appeal takes them into more moderate language, and contingently ties them to moderation in order to maintain wider support - but I don't know that the central agenda, or central interests of the leadership, thus genuinely become more moderate. If the BNP dropped their references to 'ethnic Britons' and recognised that being British is not a matter of race or skin-colour, for example, then I'd accept that they'd genuinely made a shift, but I don't see any evidence of this happening.

Melbourne Lefty
1st December 2008, 14:04
If the BNP dropped their references to 'ethnic Britons' and recognised that being British is not a matter of race or skin-colour, for example, then I'd accept that they'd genuinely made a shift, but I don't see any evidence of this happening.


No they wont do that.

But a racist party can be racist without being fascist.

And from where I look im conflicted over whether its a good thing or not.

A racist party with a wider appeal like Lega Nord in northern Italy?

Or a tiny bunch of 'pure' fascist/nazi thugs who sometimes resort to terrorism? [the 1990s BNP in a nutshell]

which is better?

And whats the best way to fight the former?

Oswy
1st December 2008, 21:49
No they wont do that.

But a racist party can be racist without being fascist.

And from where I look im conflicted over whether its a good thing or not.

A racist party with a wider appeal like Lega Nord in northern Italy?

Or a tiny bunch of 'pure' fascist/nazi thugs who sometimes resort to terrorism? [the 1990s BNP in a nutshell]

which is better?

And whats the best way to fight the former?

Interesting questions. There's probably a tension right now within the BNP over its direction, between the very options you suggest; staying true to their neo-Nazi/fascist ambitions or abandoning the swastikarish image and radical ideas in order to grow as a far-right 'suits and ties' party (and they might be pinning themselves in a corner here by maintaining their 'socialist' rhetoric - not usually that popular with real far-right types). Also, the far-right has a history of splits and in-fighting I think, and maybe we'll see more of this as their current leadership push for popularism over plain-speaking racism/fascism.

Melbourne Lefty
3rd December 2008, 03:15
There's probably a tension right now within the BNP over its direction


oh ya.

Take a look on scumfront, most of the nazis now HATE the BNP.



and they might be pinning themselves in a corner here by maintaining their 'socialist' rhetoric - not usually that popular with real far-right types


With the current economic crisis they will probably push the socialist line more.



Also, the far-right has a history of splits and in-fighting I think, and maybe we'll see more of this as their current leadership push for popularism over plain-speaking racism/fascism.


The far right is like any other minor party, as long as things remain stable or growing they will stick with the leadership.

Personally I think that when they suffer their first dip in support after Cameron replaces Brown [its gonna happen] the internal problem will not be from the hardliners, they have mostly left the party.

Rather it will come from those that wish to be MORE moderate and ditch Griffin as leader for a more photogenic version with a less troubled past.

Holden Caulfield
3rd December 2008, 11:11
most of the nazis now HATE the BNP.

i would say they hate Griffin tbh, they support their fellow W/Ns,

I'm not yet sure in my own mind what the effect on the BNP will be of one or the other party winning yet, if the Tories win they could come from a Labour hasnt worked angle, if Labour win then those who were already disillusioned might vote BNP,

Melbourne Lefty
7th December 2008, 02:42
i would say they hate Griffin tbh, they support their fellow W/Ns,

Yeah the anti-griffin stuff on there is insane. They hate him more than we do.

Also when the LeedsBNP site came out and said that the holocaust happened and that anyone who denies it is an idiot [or words to that effect] the scumfronters went nuts and cursed the BNP from its tip to its toes.

Im pretty sure that overall the nazis feel nostalgia for the 'old' BNP and hate the new one.

Sorta like when a football club gets promoted from the depths and the rusted on fans whine in pubs about how things were better when the club were shite.



I'm not yet sure in my own mind what the effect on the BNP will be of one or the other party winning yet, if the Tories win they could come from a Labour has worked angle, if Labour win then those who were already disillusioned might vote BNP,


BNP want a labour win, the far right always does shite under the centre right because the protest vote goes to the centre left.

Another term of labour and the BNP might actually be getting somewhere. A term of the Tories and they will be crushed just like 79.