On the death of Saddam, 1 year on.

[Anti29]

Yes I know I'm late.

Saddam was not executed for mass killings, kurds, shias etc.

The plan was to re shape the middle east by starting with Iraq. Divinde Iraq into three. Attack Iran under the false pretext (nuclear) then go on to attack Syria and then eventually overthrow the Egyptian government and get rid of the Jordanian monarchy. Making every country in the middle east if not the same size then smaller than Israel making it the sole super power in the mid east. With the mid east oil and being in control of main pipelines that cut through Afghanistan giving them control of the Asian oil market.....Puts them in control of the world.

I'll make it real simple.........
Invade Iraq, bring in all of these people from the outside whom Iraqis to not like or hate. Bring in the dawa party that is funded by Iran to run the Iraqi government. Keep in mind this same party tried to assassinate Saddam (Dujail) during the Iraq/Iran war. Bring in other from Iran with their militias mahdi army etc. they join the police force and begin with the sectarian killings. Blow up holy sites and blame it on one side or the other. Then kill Saddam. They couldn't just kill him esp since they went in under false pretext and also in the end they spun the story into liberation. So sine they have to be seen as liberators to the world they make up this bullshit court and try him in a "liberated Iraq". After all of this what happens????.....All hell breaks loose starting with revenge from all sides while the US just sits back and watches all of this unfold making it easier on them to divide the country into three parts.

And I don't think that cell phone video of the execution was a mistake. I really believe it was taken and made public on purpose. See a video of your leader (his supporters mostly sunni) being executed while people are yelling Muqtada (al sadr).

Divide and Conquer!

It all started by supporting Iraq and Iran at the same time during the war in the 80s, then getting Kuwait to pull some shady shit in order to bomb the hell out of Iraq weakening the country with sanctions for another 10 years just so that they could invade in 2003 to try and implement this plan. However so far it has backfired because of the resistance. The original plan included the bombing of Iran in July of 2003. And here we are almost 6 years later.

One has to respect the brains behind all of this,It's pretty genius.

[RGacky3]

Of coarse it was'nt for mass murder, ultimately it was because he disobayed, if the west was REALLY against mass murder Pinoche would'nt have died comfortably and old man.

As for all the other stuff I don't know.

[danyboy27]

Of coarse it was'nt for mass murder, ultimately it was because he disobayed, if the west was REALLY against mass murder Pinoche would'nt have died comfortably and old man.

As for all the other stuff I don't know.

saddam got nobody else but himself to blame for the way he managed the defense of his country. he was stubborn, lacked inventivity, was a sucky tactician. he could have got away of all this without having his country invaded, but saddam being sucky at diplomatic relations, he failed.

i mean, come on, he should have moved away after the us came in, make the us get nut chasing him in the middle east like bin laden, heck, Jordan offered protection for him! he could have controlled the insurgency from here if he wanted to.

[Jazzratt]

Killfacer & spetnaz21: I've removed your spam. Stop doing that shit.

[Led Zeppelin]

and get rid of the Jordanian monarchy.

The Jordanian monarchy is an ally (puppet-state) of the US.

You're a conspiracy theorist, and a pretty bad one at that.

[Lord Testicles]

http://www.forumammo.com/cpg/albums/Upload/tinfoilhat.jpg

[synthesis]

We should be careful not to overestimate the intelligence and capabilities of the ruling class. It might seem like they're omnipotent to us, but that's just not the case, and I think at some level we are crippling our efficacy by buying into this stuff.

[dasright60]

"The Jordanian monarchy is an ally (puppet-state) of the US.


Respectfully, that sounds a bit ignorant.

When has the US NOT turned on it's allies when they're done with them for their own "interests"?? Jordan has absolutely no resources to bargain with. They are forced to work with the Americans in order to survive as a country. But that does not mean the US likes them. Jordan is just a tool for the time being.


"You're a conspiracy theorist, and a pretty bad one at that"


Conspiracy? Joe Biden (a Zionist) the next US VP introduced federalizing Iraq almost 2 years ago in which a resolution on it was passed in the US senate. It's not a conspiracy at all. They are trying to implement it under the title of a "Federal Iraq"

[RebelDog]

Of coarse it was'nt for mass murder, ultimately it was because he disobayed, if the west was REALLY against mass murder Pinoche would'nt have died comfortably and old man.

As for all the other stuff I don't know.

The truth spoken. Need anyone say more.

[Killfacer]

Ok we will watch out for the evil zionist Joe Biden. Ever read the protocols of the elders of zion? You would like it.

[Led Zeppelin]

"The Jordanian monarchy is an ally (puppet-state) of the US.


Respectfully, that sounds a bit ignorant.

Oh does it now? It does not sound "ignorant" to say that the US has a secret plan to carve the Middle-East into chunks and to do so would invade Jordan, Egypt, Syria, Iran, all to make sure that Israel would become the sole superpower of the Middle-East... but what I said (which is a fact) does sound ignorant?

In that case you either do not know what the definition of the term ignorant is, or are ignorant yourself.


When has the US NOT turned on it's allies when they're done with them for their own "interests"?? Jordan has absolutely no resources to bargain with. They are forced to work with the Americans in order to survive as a country. But that does not mean the US likes them. Jordan is just a tool for the time being.

Respectfully, that sounds a bit ignorant.

The US has no reason to invade a nation which is already pretty much a puppet-state of it. Only if there was some sort of political turmoil would the US seek to interfere, but then again that's not what the OP said, he said that the US would invade Jordan for the hell of it, basically.


"You're a conspiracy theorist, and a pretty bad one at that"

Conspiracy? Joe Biden (a Zionist) the next US VP introduced federalizing Iraq almost 2 years ago in which a resolution on it was passed in the US senate. It's not a conspiracy at all. They are trying to implement it under the title of a "Federal Iraq"

So not only are you ignorant, but you also cannot read.

Reread the original post in this thread to which my post was a reply to.

Then, after having done that, let it sink in that what you just wrote is irrelevant and has little to do with the OP and my reply to it.

Then, after that, stop wasting my time.

EDIT: I just looked over your previous posts and found these gems:


Like all the Arab countries in the middle east should be one big Arab country untited as one.


I am curious, are you a member of the Ba'ath party?No I'm not, but I do believe in it.

I can't believe I even bothered to reply to your post.

I guess that's what you get when you post in OI; all the nuts are able to reply to you.

[TheCultofAbeLincoln]

The OP is ridiculous.


However so far it has backfired because of the resistance. The original plan included the bombing of Iran in July of 2003. And here we are almost 6 years later.

Were the hell did you come up with this bullshit?

Anyway, first they said we invaded Iraq for oil. They were wrong.
Then they said we were going to divide Iraq. They were wrong.
Then they said Iraq would have never-ending civil war. They were wrong.
Then they said we were going to invade Iran from Iraq. They were wrong.
Then they said "we've already lost in Iraq." They were wrong.
Then they said we'd use Iraq as a colony, and with the new agreement just signed, they've been proven wrong as all US personnel will be gone by 2011.

Now, of course, W said it'd be cheap, easy, and quick, and well...

[dasright60]

Led Zeppllen,

The Jordanian Monarchy is just a TOOL being used for the time being. However they still do not like the monarchy there and wish to dispose of it sooner or later. Your statement seemed to imply the US would never slap the shit out of puppet. So yes it did sound a bit ignorant.

Next time you want to paste my words from another post then do it in context. Leave the taking words out of context up to the US media. Also referring to any of my previous posts mean nothing. I just state what's going on. As far as the baath, believing in it is one thing but believing in it entirely is something else...And that I never said. Also I never stated on here what I truly believe or any of my own personal positions. Just in case the thought of trying to put me on the spot by asking me what it is I truly do believe. Forget about it, I don't bother with those I do not respect.

Now for the other quote from my historical post: "Like all the Arab countries in the middle east should be one big Arab country untited as one."
I was stating a FACT about the baath. They do believe in Arab unity, even an outline of the map of "one big Arab country" is part of their party symbol.

For you and whatever you are personally trying to accomplish always remember one thing.......Sometimes, other beliefs although may not be your own do consist of some things that do fall in line with your own belief. It's OK to take a few things from them. Have a question? Then ask, who knows they may actually believe in some of the same "bullshit" you believe in. Don't assume and judge. Assumptions and judgments are two things extremist believe in. If you happen to be an extremist Muslim Sheikh (not trying to insult Islam itself) trying to control part of a particular population, then I take it back. I try hard not to be insulting even though in some cases I know it may not be possible.



"So not only are you ignorant, but you also cannot read."

An insult in itself shows ignorance. Seeing that your a MOD show a little more respect and maybe just a bit more intelligence to your position by avoiding insults. If you disagree or have a different opinion. Then state it, explain it or show me why you disagree. without taking it personal. THAT I WOULD RESPECT. When I read posts on here that's all I see most of the time. "This is bullshit" or "That's a lie" etc. Not that I'm saying you've used those words because I haven't read any of your posts. But if one disagrees or has a different opinion, then one should be able to state and explain why and if possible show it intelligently without being bashed or accused of anything. Ever hear of the word COUNTERPRODUCTIVE speed reader?

By the way......I love the way you eloquently used the words "ignorant", "cannot read, and "definition" in your reply. Go put your reading skills to some good use and look up the "definition of the term ignorant", and then look at yourself. When you have done that come back and talk to me. In the meantime don't bother trying to defend yourself I'll just ignore it.

[dasright60]

The OP is ridiculous.



Were the hell did you come up with this bullshit?

Anyway, first they said we invaded Iraq for oil. They were wrong.
Then they said we were going to divide Iraq. They were wrong.
Then they said Iraq would have never-ending civil war. They were wrong.
Then they said we were going to invade Iran from Iraq. They were wrong.
Then they said "we've already lost in Iraq." They were wrong.
Then they said we'd use Iraq as a colony, and with the new agreement just signed, they've been proven wrong as all US personnel will be gone by 2011.

Now, of course, W said it'd be cheap, easy, and quick, and well...



It's not bullshit. Words passed on to the public through CNN is one thing. But what they are really doing or trying to accomplish is something else. That's what their think tanks are for. They sit around creating plans that take years if not months, think of how they can implement it, and then making it idiot proof. By idiot proof I mean believable to the idiots that exist...nothing towards you.

Yes they were wrong. That's what I was basically saying when I said that it "backfired because of the resistance". They didn't expect a planned guerrilla war.

[Led Zeppelin]

Led Zeppllen, blah blah blah, I love Saddam and the Ba'ath party, blah blah

Look you political Elephant Man, I do not have the time nor the desire to argue with ignorant freaks like yourself. You believe that Saddam was a swell guy and that the Ba'ath Party is "cool". You believe that the US wants to invade nations that it already has under its control. You believe that the US wants to attack nations like Egypt in order to make sure that Israel stays the most powerful country in the region, as if the US is the only imperialist power in the world; in other words, you are a joke.

An unfunny and tired old joke.


THAT I WOULD RESPECT

Only a masochist would seek your respect.

Now, again, stop wasting my time.

[TheCultofAbeLincoln]

It's not bullshit. Words passed on to the public through CNN is one thing. But what they are really doing or trying to accomplish is something else. That's what their think tanks are for. They sit around creating plans that take years if not months, think of how they can implement it, and then making it idiot proof. By idiot proof I mean believable to the idiots that exist...nothing towards you.

I'm not pro-war, and trust me, in 2006, I was out screaming that the war was lost and we were evil and all that.

But then something happened. Things got better. Now it's many Iraqi citiznes who are asking the Americans to stay and win the war. The Iraqi Army seems to be much improved, and the "squashing" of Shia militia by all-Iraqi forces earlier this year was heartwarming.

It's also clear that Sunni's have accepted co-existence over Islamic terrorism. The Sons of Iraq movement seems to be a huge step. Despite being of Hussein's tribe, from what I've read they make up much of the voice wanting America to stay. They fear The SOI will not be paid by the largely Shiite-controlled central government, and this could create major tension after an American withdrawal.

I disagree. We spent tens of billions in Iraq last year while Iraq had an $80 billion surplus. We leaving in 2011, if they can't figue it out tough. I feel for their civilians if Iraq dos go off the precipice and turns into a massive Lebanon. That would be horrible.


Yes they were wrong. That's what I was basically saying when I said that it "backfired because of the resistance". They didn't expect a planned guerrilla war.

All right, he's what I'll concede:

If there had been no opposition, and Iraq had simply agreed the "puppet" government within 15 minutes, and there were no attacks anywere...It's entirely possible that we'd be at war with both Iran and Syria. Who knows what the administration would have done without the 'quagmire'

So in that sense, I suppose you could argue that the Iraqi "resistance" has performed a positive role.

[TheCultofAbeLincoln]

Oh, and one other thing, I agree with Zepplin on Israel.

They have 200-something nukes. Territorial expansion is not necessary for them to have security on a geo-political level (but does nothing to ensure it on a domestic level).

And Baathism does accomplish basic security in societies based along ancient ethnic lines. Otherwise, these countries may have had massive unrest, and nobody likes that. At least the people who advocate a brutal dictator over a fight for freedom.

No society received political freedom without the struggle.

[dasright60]

Oh, and one other thing, I agree with Zepplin on Israel.

They have 200-something nukes. Territorial expansion is not necessary for them to have security on a geo-political level (but does nothing to ensure it on a domestic level).

Israel can't use their nukes.

I never said Iran,Syria,Jordan or Egypt would be invaded for Israel. When I spoke of Egypt and Jordan I only said overthrowing their governments. You should ask him why he as revolutionary would not think of a revolution from within, and Why overthrowing a particular government only requires an invasion. Not that overthrowing the governments of Jordan or egypt would be a true revolution but same damn concept.

Only invasion that needed to happen is Iraq. Iran is just a bombing. Syria is another bombing and overthrowing the gov. Egypt is overthrowing the gov from the outside. Jordan is another overthrow. Only territorial expansion for Israel other than occupation is expelling all of the Palestinians to Jordan. And to do that the US needs a new puppet in Jordan.

The rest of it has to do with oil. Ivading Iraq into three parts also splits it's oil reserves into three parts. Makes it easier to control the market etc. Overthrowing the gov of Egypt and Syria and installing puppets give the US access to three things. One the Suez canal, a huge oil pipeline that runs from Iraq into Syria to ending at it's border with the Mediterranean which Egypt also border, and easy access to Sudan's untapped reserves from Egypt.

That's when Israel becomes a superpower. By superpower I don't mean weapons as in "200 nukes". By superpower I mean a huge oil pipeline running from Iraq to Israel. That gives them not only nukes, but also control of some of the worlds second most precious resource(humans being the first most precious). It would make them a major player in the world. But none of this is going to happen now.

[RGacky3]

That gives them not only nukes, but also control of some of the worlds second most precious resource(humans being the first most precious).

Its funny you say that, because the people that decide the values (the elite power players of the world) don't see it that way it seams, it seams like people aren't that high on their list.


Otherwise, these countries may have had massive unrest, and nobody likes that. At least the people who advocate a brutal dictator over a fight for freedom.


Iraq would'nt have had that much ethnic unrest had Saddam not been put in power with the US' support.

[PostAnarchy]

good riddance!

[PostAnarchy]

But then something happened. Things got better. Now it's many Iraqi citiznes who are asking the Americans to stay and win the war. The Iraqi Army seems to be much improved, and the "squashing" of Shia militia by all-Iraqi forces earlier this year was heartwarming.


yes something happened bourgeois propaganda went in full gear as they realized that the American people were becoming militantly anti-war. Funny thing is and this is indeed often unreported, the American public remains largely anti-war despite the propaganda about the surge and the near-universal support of it in the bourgeios press, bourgeois politicians and commentators.