The key to Class Consciousness?

[cop an Attitude]

As many of you realize, we live in a society based upon consumerism and profit. In this capitalist nation it is vital that the upper class keeps control over the lower class and they built a society around that. Our media, our education, our cultural norms all have similar backbones. whether is be to get a job that pays well, have matching clothes or to listen to your elders, the unwritten laws of the society help people stay in line. They live normal lives and don’t diverge outside of it due to the fear of being an outcast or possibly, they don't even know to question their ways. These people are (for lack of a better term) sheep, society gave them map of how life is and they follow and enjoy it to the best of their abilities. These people are blissfully unaware of the fact that our upper class installed these norms for them and directly shaped them for who they are today.
As for you and I, we separated from this norm. We questioned the way of the world and realized that society set up these ideas and that society is controlled by the higher class bourgeoisie. We are free thinkers and free thinkers have the capacity to see past what the mundane. Now saying all of this I guess I get to my point

IS THE KEY TO FREEING OURSELVES FROM A CAPITALIST WORLD A POPULATION OF FREE THINKERS? PEOPLE QUESTIONING THINGS AND ASKING WHY.

has the higher class discovered this and kept the masses blissfully unaware and naive to aviod any opposition?

I have a small example of this that I have witnessed. I am in a college philosophy club and today we touched upon social norms. Everyone in the room, with no help from anyone else reached the conclusion that the higher class controls the lower class by fear and socially excepted ways. Now 20 free thinkers reached this point by just holding a conversation amongst each other. Imagine if everyone thought about this, would the world be a different place, is this the stepping stone to class consciousness?

please avoid any matrix analogies :lol:

[Rosa Lichtenstein]

I think this should be in Theory.

[Hit The North]

I agree...

[benhur]

Very good topic.

The answer is in the OP. People, especially middle class people, are sheep. They make fun of you, if you think differently (or if you think at all!), they want to follow the rules, suck up to the rich, etc. etc., you get the picture.

That being the case, is it reasonable to expect such people to become class conscious or free thinkers? This is why I believe the revolution should be carried out by a select few (class conscious thinkers). And because the average guy is sheep anyway, it's only a matter of time before he becomes part of the revolution.

[Pogue]

I think our role as revolutionaries should be to educate people so they attain class conciousness and let them do the rest, rather than try and get them to back an elite set of revolutionaries, because in my opinion, a vanguard is a crap idea and is basically asking for a post-revolutionary party class who'll destroy the revolution.

[cop an Attitude]

I think our role as revolutionaries should be to educate people so they attain class conciousness and let them do the rest, rather than try and get them to back an elite set of revolutionaries, because in my opinion, a vanguard is a crap idea and is basically asking for a post-revolutionary party class who'll destroy the revolution.

yes, i think if there was ever a "vanguard" it should be only for awareness. Like spreading flyers in desitute areas, radio broadcasting, web sites, things like that. Its the working classes's revolution so give it to them. plus with a vanguard there is a chance it could become corrupt and end up never giving power back to the people.

oh and thanks for the move Bob

[ernie]

As many of you realize, we live in a society based upon consumerism and profit. In this capitalist nation it is vital that the upper class keeps control over the lower class and they built a society around that. Our media, our education, our cultural norms all have similar backbones. whether is be to get a job that pays well, have matching clothes or to listen to your elders, the unwritten laws of the society help people stay in line.
I agree that there are unwritten laws that dictate what kind of behavior is acceptable and what kind isn't in a society, and they usually come from the ruling class. People like to more or less play by those rules, especially when that society is successful. Also notice that these rules are always changing as society itself advances.

I don't think this will be any different in a classless society, except that these rules won't be imposed from above but agreed upon by the community as a whole.


They live normal lives and don’t diverge outside of it due to the fear of being an outcast or possibly, they don't even know to question their ways. These people are (for lack of a better term) sheep, society gave them map of how life is and they follow and enjoy it to the best of their abilities. These people are blissfully unaware of the fact that our upper class installed these norms for them and directly shaped them for who they are today.
I don't think it's fair to say they are "sheep". Some people are, of course, but not everybody...I would say most are not. If things are going well, then you play by the rules; if they aren't, you break them. Think of the US in the late 19th century and early 20th. The working class was extremely revolutionary and did not play by these rules. Why? Because their living conditions were shitty and getting worse. On the other hand, the 50s were a period of relative class peace, in large part because conditions for workers were much better.


As for you and I, we separated from this norm. We questioned the way of the world and realized that society set up these ideas and that society is controlled by the higher class bourgeoisie. We are free thinkers and free thinkers have the capacity to see past what the mundane. Now saying all of this I guess I get to my point
Yes, people here did at some point question the current order in some form or another. We shouldn't think ourselves superior because of this, though; remember that it was a matter of chance. In a way, we were lucky (or unlucky) to live in conditions such that our consciousness allowed us to question all these things.


IS THE KEY TO FREEING OURSELVES FROM A CAPITALIST WORLD A POPULATION OF FREE THINKERS? PEOPLE QUESTIONING THINGS AND ASKING WHY.
To some extent, yes, this is a requirement. As a materialist, I think that this will happen (that is, workers will become "free thinkers"), and it's the material conditions that will dictate when this happens.

[benhur]

Most people in this world are content with the following:

Job (any shitty little job)
Beer
TV
Video Games
Patriotism and all that "us vs them" bull that keeps them divided
Fanatical belief in profits, private ownership etc. etc.

I can go on and on, but you get the idea. Most people in this world are so silly and close-minded, that it'd be naive if leftist feel they can be changed. By the time you change one group, another group pops up (human population isn't static, is it?).

This is why a vanguard party is absolutely essential. If intellectuals can't guide us, who can? Power in the hands of ignorant people is always dangerous, even if those ignorant happen to be self-proclaimed communists.

[cop an Attitude]

Yes, people here did at some point question the current order in some form or another. We shouldn't think ourselves superior because of this, though; remember that it was a matter of chance. In a way, we were lucky (or unlucky) to live in conditions such that our consciousness allowed us to question all these things.


To some extent, yes, this is a requirement. As a materialist, I think that this will happen (that is, workers will become "free thinkers"), and it's the material conditions that will dictate when this happens.

dont get me wrong, i am not saying i am superior in any way, just that we happen to see the world through a diffrent lense. As it come to the sheep, it more of a follower rather than leader mentality.

[SEKT]

The creation of class counciousness is a great challenge:
1st Because socialization of individuals (the capitalist mode based on fetichized relations) has been so deep that it can be shown even in individuals' personalities.
2nd Because there is no certain program of creation of class counciousness
3rd and as some comrades have exposed it is the problem of a vanguard

From a personal point of view the first point is the most difficult but what needs to be taken into consideration is that humans are historical so all I pointed as critical issues can be changed.

The first thing that has to be attacked is the monopoly of idelogy by the capitalist, it still has to be done by the ones that have realized their conditions or the "vanguard" if it is the name nevertheless the so called vanguard also has to be educated in the way that being councious doesn't mean they can take power in the "name"rather once there is a class counciousness created (and the form[values, expectations, ideas] has to be built extremely well because if not it can transform it into a ideological mask as fascism) the workers as a class not a group has to take the power.

The fact that most people think in things like
Job (any shitty little job)
Beer
TV
Video Games
Patriotism and all that "us vs them" bull that keeps them divided
Fanatical belief in profits, private ownership
doesn't mean they are going to think in those things forever rather the revolutionary work begins here by showing how irrational and stupid those things are.

My theory is that class consciousness has not been eliminated but what has been done is a lumpemproletarization of consciousness indeed it means that the form of thought tends to atomize individuals by promoting the bourgeois individual, lonely but happy of consume and working in any shit that give him or her money to continue their alienation. In fact the phenomena refers to the non class consciousness apparently in individuals promoted by the bourgeoid mass media.

Our challenge is bigger than in the past but not imposible

[gla22]

Yes I think it is. If the entire pupulace was comprised of free thinkers the people will revolt the problem is.

People can't be free until they are free thinkers.
People cant be free thinkers unless they are free.