Batteling the "Communism is evil"

[Drace]

You know all those arguments of how communism has killed over a 100 people people, how the USSR was very authoritative....

Some good sources so I can learn to give proper responses?

[Charles Xavier]

First of all the best source is that there wasn't enough population base to kill a hundred million people on top of the 27 million that died during the second world war. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_Soviet_Union

[Drace]

Lol, its of all the "communist" countries, not just the SU

[LOLseph Stalin]

My very own friends give me that "communism is evil" crap all the time. I'm not even sure how to counter it except for the fact that it has had many corrupted leaders.

[Decolonize The Left]

The best way to counter such a blanket, unjustified, statement is to talk about what this person means by "communism" and "evil."

Most likely they don't understand communism, and believe it to be 'evil' due to the authoritarian governments which have ruled using its name.

- August

[Charles Xavier]

My very own friends give me that "communism is evil" crap all the time. I'm not even sure how to counter it except for the fact that it has had many corrupted leaders.

The Soviet Union and many other socialist countries had very good leaders actually.

[Plagueround]

Good article, but, out of curiousity:



In response, we have unveiled a “Victims of Capitalism Monument,” a modest piece, in memory of the millions that have actually been killed, through starvation, imperialist wars, colonial expansionism, genocide, etc., and the billions that continue to be enslaved by the capitalist system.

Any idea if this monument is around and where it's at? :)

[Dóchas]

My very own friends give me that "communism is evil" crap all the time. I'm not even sure how to counter it except for the fact that it has had many corrupted leaders.

ye i sy that and whenever they say that communism is evil i just say thats them believing capitalist or imperialist propaganda...it works 9/10 times

[chegitz guevara]

You know all those arguments of how communism has killed over a 100 people people, how the USSR was very authoritative....

Some good sources so I can learn to give proper responses?

One of the best ways to counter it is to point out how many people die in the capitalist world. Over ten million people a year world wide die because of the conditions of capitalism, simply because there is no profit in saving them. That means, in any given decade, capitalism kills more people than the communists are accused of killing over eighty years.

[Tatarin]

I guess the hardest part with explaining communism to someone is that the explanation itself requires time. No one will accept "no, it's really good" as an answer.

I would start by pointing out the present capitalist system. If capitalism is so good and caring - how come they are ready to fill the banks with billions of dollars (or, whatever the currency of your country) just one or two days after an economical crisis? While millions are starving, and capitalism tells them that they don't have enough money?

How come a lot of people in "ex-communist countries" feel "communism" wasn't as bad as capitalism is now? Shouldn't 20 years of capitalism made them happy by now?

Or what about the capitalist syndromes? Would they, for example, be ready to send their children out on the streets to deal in drugs and prostitution because the state has decided that public schools isn't all that good?

In other words, I think that criticism of the current system is needed before one can explain that there are other options to the hell we're living in now.

[TheDevil'sApprentice]

Make sure you know in detail how private capitalism has been far worse and killed far more etc than the USSR and its ilk, even if you only count the years since the fall of the USSR. Explain this.

Then you can go into the evils of leninism, how the bosheviks destroyed the revolution and workers movement. Make sure you understand why 'state capitalism' is the accurate description of the USSR and explain this. Make sure the people you are talking to know you consider leninism (in practice) a form of capitalism. Talk about the second russian civil war and the real communists who fought lenin to the death (the Makhnovists, the Kronstadt Sailors etc).

Explain that despite their anti-communist nature, the state-capitalist regimes were generally more benign than the private capitalist once they replaced and which replaced them. Usually does the trick.

[RedHal]

this is helpful

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tDg211Z9yPU

[Comrada J]

If someone has classified something as "evil" then you're going to have a hard time. I usually tailor my response depending on the person, telling them how they'd benefit under a socialist system. Talking amount the immense number of crimes that have happened under a capitalist system should be an obvious angle of attack, however don't structure it the same way they argue the 'crimes of communism' or it'll sound to similar, and they may discount it. One last note; when explaining how capitalist propaganda has brainwashed them, try not to tell them that they've actually been brainwashed as they'll find that insulting.

[Melbourne Lefty]

The Soviet Union and many other socialist countries had very good leaders actually.

The SU had more bad than good in the leadership department.

It was a try at a socialist country, it failed, for many many different reasons not all the fault of the people within it but it failed.

Time to move on to a new dynamic.

[Incendiarism]

Make sure you know in detail how private capitalism has been far worse and killed far more etc than the USSR and its ilk, even if you only count the years since the fall of the USSR. Explain this.

Then you can go into the evils of leninism, how the bosheviks destroyed the revolution and workers movement. Make sure you understand why 'state capitalism' is the accurate description of the USSR and explain this. Make sure the people you are talking to know you consider leninism (in practice) a form of capitalism. Talk about the second russian civil war and the real communists who fought lenin to the death (the Makhnovists, the Kronstadt Sailors etc).

Explain that despite their anti-communist nature, the state-capitalist regimes were generally more benign than the private capitalist once they replaced and which replaced them. Usually does the trick.

oh dear

[TheDevil'sApprentice]

oh dear...

Am I going to get more than a one liner?

[Charles Xavier]

The SU had more bad than good in the leadership department.

It was a try at a socialist country, it failed, for many many different reasons not all the fault of the people within it but it failed.

Time to move on to a new dynamic.

Which reasons would this be as to why it failed? Would you care to be specific?

My feeling is that you just don't like socialism, everything is bad unless its your cut and dried worldview magically attached to a nation state.

[nighthawk]

There is something fundamentally wrong with Russians and Serbs. We (I'm Serb) always screw things up, so we screwed up with communism too. It's not that communism is evil, it's just that we (this goes mostly for Serbia, I dunno that much about Russia) still live in basically a feudalistic society. We always let politicians become too powerful, because people feel that rulers must be that powerful. There's no way there could be someone like Stalin in USA, or let's say Sweden.

And it's true that we lived worse before communism, and it's much worse after it ended. Before communism in Yugoslavia 75% of the people lived in villages, often all family (grandparents, parents, kids) in a house with only one or two rooms. Boys didn't wear pants and underwear until they were 7 or 8 because their parents couldn't afford them.
During communism there was work for everyone and enough money to live normally. We could build houses, travel, buy cars, etc. Communists built factories, roads, they brought electricity and phones to villages, healthcare and education (including colleges) were free for all, and whole society was in very good shape. There was no homeless people or beggars on the street. Even the poorest people had roof over their heads.

Now, when Yugoslavia has fallen apart, and we live in "Democratic" society unemployment rate is about 20% and most people work for 10-12 hours a day for money that's not enough even for food (less than 100 euros per month), they can't live independently.