Stalin/Lenin;betrayer of the left or left wing hero?

[C0YS]

What are your views?

And was Lenin any better then the Tzar in the first place, was he just a glorified revolutionist. Who came from a wealthy (enough) family and did he try to trick people into beliving his "false" communism?

Or is it false?

Im pritty sure that you have got my point of view in this senario now but I feel their is a lot of false belief on this. And I am not sure weather Lenin was all that good!

[Chapter 24]

And was Lenin any better then the Tzar in the first place, was he just a glorified revolutionist.

I would entirely disagree with such a statement. Lenin was not a "glorified revolutionist", on the contrary he led the first proletarian revolution and contributed an enormous deal of theory to Marxism.
Also, comparing Nicholas II and Lenin as two different tyrants with different methods is also false. The czar ruled under an autocratic semi-feudal police state. He made no effort to better the lives of Russians and in fact made this clear through the suppression of revolts (i.e., the 1905 Revolution). Lenin sought to improve the lives of the proletariat through revolutionary activity.


Who came from a wealthy (enough) family and did he try to trick people into beliving his "false" communism?

The class status of a revolutionary has proved to be irrelevant in terms of ideology. Other examples of revolutionaries and theorists that were of a wealthier class include but are not limited to Engels, Trotsky, and Che.

[S&Y]

And was Lenin any better then the Tzar in the first place, was he just a glorified revolutionist. Who came from a wealthy (enough) family and did he try to trick people into beliving his "false" communism?Lenin was not a magician that could just make people believe in false communism.

He has no supernatural skills.

He was just another revolutionary that contributed to Marxist Theory and due to the material conditions of the Soviet Union found himself in the head of the proletarian revolution.

He had certainly the correct tactics and ideas in order to do so.

Also in the title you equate Lenin with Stalin which is something very false.

Leninism and Stalinism with the latter arising out of the material conditions of post-revolutionary Russia , have nothing in common.

Stalinism represents the dictatorship over the proletariat, class conciliation and treason against the world working class.

Leninism on the other hand represents class independence, the revolutionary overthrow of the bourgeoisie and loyalty to the working class and internationalism.

They are completely opposite things.


Also Lenin being from a petit bourgeois backround does not make him less of a revolutionary than you or anyone else.

On the contrary the fact that he went through so much, from exile to being hunted down by Czarist police makes him more loyal to the ideas of socialism than a lot of leftists who sit behind their desktop and pretend to be revolutionaries.

[Revy]

Read about the Workers' Opposition. This is a letter they wrote, called the Appeal of the 22.

Dear comrades!


From our newspapers we have learned that the Executive Committee of the Communist International is discussing the “united workers’ front,” and we consider it our communist duty to inform you that in our country the “united front” is in bad shape not only in the broad sense of this term, but even in its application toward the ranks of our party.


As the forces of the bourgeoisie press on us from all sides, as they even infiltrate our party, the social composition of which (40% worker and 60% non-proletarian) favor this, our leading centers wage a relentless, corrupting struggle against all, especially proletarians, having their own opinions, and they apply all kinds of repressive measures against the expression of these opinions within the party.


The attempt to bring the proletarian masses closer to the government is declared to be “anarcho-syndicalism,” and its advocates are persecuted and discredited.


In the trade union movement, there is the same picture — suppression of worker spontaneity and initiative, struggle using all means against heterodoxy. The unified forces of the party and trade union bureaucracy, taking advantage of their position and authority, ignore our congresses’ decisions about laying the foundations of worker democracy. Our union communist fractions, even the fractions of entire congresses are deprived of the right to manifest their will in the election of their own leaders. Bureaucracy’s tutelage and pressure has gone so far, that party members are threatened with exclusion and other repressive measures if they elect whom they want instead of those whom the higher-ups want. Such methods of work lead to careerism, intrigues, and servility, and workers respond to this by leaving the party.


Sharing the idea of the united workers’ front as it is interpreted in point 23 of the theses, we appeal to you, with the sincere wish to end all these abnormalities, which stand in the way of the unity of this front, first of all within our RCP(b).


The situation within our party is so difficult, that it impels us to turn to you for help and in this way to eliminate the impending threat of a split in our party.

[Tower of Bebel]

The historical distinction between good and a bad is so obsolete! Instead of having a quick look at things how we notice them we should look at things how they historically developed.

"Communist" policy in the USSR suffered from continuous retreats (restrictions on democracy, coexistence with capitalist nations, treaty of Brest-Litovsk, the battle between city and countryside, death penalty, low standards of living...) because of (1) the backwardness of the country (which did not allow a socialist development since a peasant majority society has a tendency towards capitalism) and (2) the defeat of the European Revolution. Also, achieving socialism is not simple. Mistakes were made even when there still was hope for Russia to be saved from its isolation (1917-1919).

Lenin was an outstanding revolutionary, yet he had to take the lead during the retreats of the early twenties. These retreats had a temporary character; but the longer Russia would remain isolated the faster these retreats became permanent.

[Faction2008]

Lenin was more of a hero to the revolutionary left and Stalin in some aspects.

[C0YS]

thankyou this has been a good help.