why do socialists support the imperalist nature of the soviet empire?

[Elliot_R]

is imperalism good if it is socialist imperalism? why is the soviet empire better than other empires?

[Demogorgon]

Most of us don't.

[IcarusAngel]

Where have socialists on this forum said that the US imperialism is justified but the imperialism of the USSRwas benevolent? No one has suggested this and has been taken seriously. Furthermore, some of the USSR's harshest critics were leftist dissidents in Russia or leftist dissidents here in America, like Chomsky, whose work was banned in Russia during the Soviet period. Quit being a retard.

Some socialists might have noted that the USSR served to protect third-world nations, and this is true, as even many third world countries anti-USSR were sad to see it go, given the protection it offered them in the international chess game.

[Elliot_R]

theres many socialists who support/defend the soviet union. like those people who seem to think that comrade stalin was a great fellow. i'm asking why soviet imperalism is better than american imperalism. didnt comrade lenin write something about imperalism being the highest stage of capitalism! and then socialists defend it. is that ironic...or is it just me....?

[GPDP]

Take that up with the "anti-revisionists". Most of us hold no love for Soviet imperialism.

[Mindtoaster]

Take that up with the "anti-revisionists". Most of us hold no love for Soviet imperialism.

Even most of the "anti-revisionists" are probably opposed to soviet imperialism.

They're total tankies otherwise

But no. No real leftist supports soviet imperialism

[R_P_A_S]

Most of us don't.

i'll second that.

[Killfacer]

socialists dont, stalinist do.

[pusher robot]

Then may I ask a follow-up question:

Why do you tolerate those people?

[RGacky3]

Why do you tolerate those people?

We don't

[Bud Struggle]

We don't

RevLeft has plenty of Stalinists. They seem to be on an equal footing as any other Communist.

[GPDP]

RevLeft has plenty of Stalinists. They seem to be on an equal footing as any other Communist.

Pfft, I'd say we have more cappies here than apologists for Soviet imperialism.

[Incendiarism]

What instances are we talking about here? Poland?

[Bud Struggle]

What instances are we talking about here? Poland?

I would guess Poland, but also Hungary and Czechoslovakia and even some of the "Soviet Republics" like the Baltic states and the Ukraine.

[Labor Shall Rule]

Revleft is mostly anarchist, to my recollection.

Stalin carried social-imperialism in his womb and gave birth to it at the end of the Second World War with the Yalta Agreement. It started with Soviet forces continuing their occupation of the Kurile Islands, South Sakhalin, and Port Arthur to have access to Manchurian minerals.

[#FF0000]

RevLeft has plenty of Stalinists. They seem to be on an equal footing as any other Communist.

There's a difference between Anti-Revisionists and Tankies.

Anti-Revisionists don't necessarily agree with everything that happened in the USSR, or with everything the leadership of the USSR did. I recall meeting a few who were very critical of "soviet imperialism".

Tankies, on the other hand, don't know anything about politics or history and have a fetish for authority and uniforms, which the USSR had plenty of. Therefore, in the mind of a Tankie, the USSR = 1, where 1 means good and 0 means bad.

They also think in Binary, those Tankies.

[Trystan]

Newsflash: it doesn't exist anymore so nobody really "supports" it any longer. :)

But there are, unfortunately, plenty of people who feel nostalgia for it. Most are into their old age, though.

[S&Y]

There was no USSR imperialism....

[JimmyJazz]

Really, I don't see why anyone would waste their time replying to a thread by someone who comes in here telling us what we believe rather than asking.

[Killfacer]

There was no USSR imperialism....


Yes it just invaded Afghanistan for a laugh.

[pusher robot]

Newsflash: it doesn't exist anymore so nobody really "supports" it any longer. :)

But there are, unfortunately, plenty of people who feel nostalgia for it. Most are into their old age, though.

Really, it doesn't? I know some Georgians might beg to differ.

[Rosa Provokateur]

is imperalism good if it is socialist imperalism? why is the soviet empire better than other empires?
Imperialism is never good. The Soviet empire crumbled under it's own bloated weight, for the better I think.

[Labor Shall Rule]

Really, it doesn't? I know some Georgians might beg to differ.

Georgians would "beg to differ" on what? That the Soviet Union still exists?

[Bud Struggle]

Yes it just invaded Afghanistan for a laugh.

Doesn't everybody? :lol:

[S&Y]

Yes it just invaded Afghanistan for a laugh.

Afganistan was invaded in order to support the revolution.

See communists are internationalists and as Lenin said

".Uneven economic and political development is an absolute law of capitalism. Hence, the victory of socialism is possible first in several or even in one capitalist country alone. After expropriating the capitalists and organising their own socialist production, the victorious proletariat of that country will arise against the rest of the world .. "

They were merely protecting the revolutionaries of Afganistan by invading Afganistan. But the Americans had different plans and they started funding the fundamentalists to fight against the will of the people.

That is another reason why the Soviets had to assist Afganistan.

[Bud Struggle]

the Soviets had to assist Afganistan. :laugh:

BOGOVICH, is that you?

[Trystan]

:laugh:

BOGOVICH, is that you?

What is this Bogovitch thing that I keep hearing about?

[Mindtoaster]

What is this Bogovitch thing that I keep hearing about?

http://uncyclopedia.org/wiki/Bogovich

Basically, a RevLeft meme

[S&Y]

BOGOVICH, is that you?

I don't know who is Bogovich.
I read the uncyclopedia article and I found it rather amusing.

The thing is though that you will find a lot of leftists who supported the invasion of Afganistan .

Not too many on revleft I suppose but in real life for sure.

And that is because of the reasons I outlined above.

There is a difference between an imperialistic war and a war for liberation from capitalism, which is a fair war.

[Wake Up]

Really, it doesn't? I know some Georgians might beg to differ.

The georgian government, funded by the US, started the war in South Ossetia.
the russians then stepped in to protect the Ossetians, who incidentally voted almost unanimously for a succession with Georgia and was ignored my most of the western world..

SO yeah I know a few Ossetians that would beg to differ..

[Schrödinger's Cat]

Really, it doesn't? I know some Georgians might beg to differ.

I know some Americans who think the moon landing was fake, too.

[danyboy27]

seriously people need to stop freaking out about imperialism, the soviet was imperialist, russia is and will always be imperialist, same goes for the us and the chinese.

sadly its the way its work, when you have power projections capabilities, whether this is aircraft carrier, the most impressing ground forces or an edge on economy or technology, you use them.

[RGacky3]

sadly its the way its work, when you have power projections capabilities, whether this is aircraft carrier, the most impressing ground forces or an edge on economy or technology, you use them.

Yeah, of coarse, which is why I'm an Anarchist :p, and everyone that opposes imperialism should be. Imperialism is the natural reaction of a State gaining influence and power, its what happens, thus, we should oppose State power and influence as well as Capital.

[Pogue]

Yeah, of coarse, which is why I'm an Anarchist :p, and everyone that opposes imperialism should be. Imperialism is the natural reaction of a State gaining influence and power, its what happens, thus, we should oppose State power and influence as well as Capital.

Good point, why are you restricted?

[Pogue]

People supported its imperialism because they were desperate for the Socialist camp to be genuine in a capitalist world. The hopes of alot of people rested on the USSR. Also, some of their imperialist interventions were in support of 'progressive' governments, right? Like the Afghanistan Communists.

[Killfacer]

yeah, the people of afghanistan were lining the streets cheering, hurling rose petals at the feet of their liberators, were they not? Haven't you seen rambo?

[RGacky3]

Good point, why are you restricted?

Anti-Abortion



People supported its imperialism because they were desperate for the Socialist camp to be genuine in a capitalist world. The hopes of alot of people rested on the USSR. Also, some of their imperialist interventions were in support of 'progressive' governments, right? Like the Afghanistan Communists.



Imperialism is almost NEVER welcome, I cannot think of one example where its welcome (at least by the people, its sometimes welcome by the ruling class of that country), be it thet USSR or the US imperialism.

It does'nt make a difference whether the imperialist interventions support progressive governments or not, its not their place to be imposing governments.

[timbaly]

I don't think many leftists on this site support the USSR and their imperialist wars and domination of of other nations. A lot of leftists do sometimes seem to go out of their way to defend the USSR, and that's probably because it was seen as the hope for the communist movement for so long and it was the face of the ideology, albeit a poor one.


Anti-Abortion

Damn that seems harsh. I remember you being anti-abortion in the old days. In fact I think I had a debate with you about it. I can't really remember, though I believe my first debate on this site was with you. Weren't you openly anti-abortion for a long time? What exactly changed?