Public nudity and sex

[Schrödinger's Cat]

I've been thinking about the lack of justification for prohibiting women from displaying their breasts in public. It seems like a frivelous action to take against something that does no harm. How about lower body nudity? And public sex? I'm still formulating thoughts on the former, but I have a problem with the latter just because fluids - urine, fecal matter, or sperm - could pose a health risk.

[jake williams]

I'll answer very generally, and this is difficult because sexuality is extraordinarily complicated.

The privacy of sex translates into intimacy, which translates into better sex - or at least I think that's the theory for a lot of people, and the argument isn't without any merit at all. It's very tricky to decide how you'd like the world to be as a consequence, but I think that is a valid element to consider. It's tricky. Keep in mind I say this having very liberal ideas about sex in society, and I think we're too uptight now. But there is something of a balancing act, and I wonder sometimes.

[Decolonize The Left]

Gene,
Rationally speaking, women ought to be allowed the freedom to wear whatever they wish (including nothing), just as men.

Unfortunately, in our society, breasts are viewed as sexual objects. Furthermore, the sexuality of women has been systematically oppressed and we have been conditioned to view the female sex as 'dangerous' in some form or another. Hence it is socially unacceptable for women to go topless in public as this can be constituted as a lewd sexual act.

Lower body nudity is similarly socially unacceptable as it constitutes the display of sexual organs.

- August

[apathy maybe]

Nudity and sex in public? I think there should be more of it!

Nudity and sex in public? It would make my job easier...

Nudity and sex in public? Why not?

Only prudes object to nudity in public, and only prudes object to kissing in public, what's wrong with sex in public?

--------

There is a legitimate reason to object to pissing and shitting in public, namely, that it is dirty and possible could spread disease (for the second anyway). There isn't anything wrong with having toilets in public view, just that, well, there should at least be toilets.

Sex is different for two reasons, one is the fluid is a heck of a lot less, and two, it isn't going everywhere in most cases.

-------

So yeah, fuck the prudes, preferably in public. Of course, I'm not saying that everyone should have sex in public, or that they should feel comfortable doing so, just that it should not be a problem if people do have sex in public. (Just like it shouldn't be a problem to kiss or hold hands in public.)

[Holden Caulfield]

to be the hate figure i wouldnt want people fucking next to me on the bus or anything, i wouldnt mind kissing but not fucking, i like clothes and i think you are all hippies,

i have no reasons to back up anything i have just said

[apathy maybe]

to be the hate figure i wouldnt want people fucking next to me on the bus or anything, i wouldnt mind kissing but not fucking, i like clothes and i think you are all hippies,

i have no reasons to back up anything i have just said

It doesn't automatically make you a hate figure.

Question for you then, would you ban sex in public? What about in parks after dark?

Actually, lots of questions, what about clothes in a hot climate? What about on a nude beach?

:p

[Bilan]

to be the hate figure i wouldnt want people fucking next to me on the bus or anything, i wouldnt mind kissing but not fucking, i like clothes and i think you are all hippies,

i have no reasons to back up anything i have just said

QFT, unless I'm that person next to you on the bus. Aw, hell yeah.

[Holden Caulfield]

It doesn't automatically make you a hate figure.

Question for you then, would you ban sex in public? What about in parks after dark?

Actually, lots of questions, what about clothes in a hot climate? What about on a nude beach?

yeah i think i would, i dont want my kids to see people fucking as i dont want them to think that they have to do the same, and i dont want people to watch me fuck in a park, if you do; go dogging.

i wouldnt ban it but i would keep things as they if you want to fuck outside at dark but not for it to be socially acseptable to go round shagging here, there and everywhere, i dont want to sit and have to avoid watching people fuck while i try to relax in a park,

a nude beach is a nude beach, thats the point! i wouldnt be sitting there exspecting to see people fully clothed, i dont think nudists just want to shag all the time do they? ask them, perhaps make special swingers get aways or something. ive had sex outside but not on a busy beach or anything..

and wear whatever clothes you want, let women go topless if them want when it is hot, i dont really care, i would prefer it if people felt obliged to cover up to a decent degree in public, i wouldnt sit next to a naked old man or brush past him in the super market,

what if somebody gets an erection and children is around (and i has nothing to do with that?) ?!!?

stop being 'liberal' hippies wear clothes, get a hair cut and clean your room

[jake williams]

I should point out something I think I see. When I answered I think I was talking about the decision from the view of the person potentially being nude or sexual in public. All the other replies you've all given seem to be about what rules the public should set. I think these are different questions, and on the second question I'm very much in favour of open rules about what public nudity and maybe even sexuality should be allowed, I just don't know if I think it should happen.

It's worth noting that it is totally legal for women to be topless in public in Canada.

[Herman]

"Mommy look! Those people there are fornicating!"

[Psy]

Public sex would have to restricted to certain areas just for safety reason alone, for example to avoid buses running reds because of drivers watching public sex on the side walk instead watching the road, or having bus driver crawl by people having sex causing a rubber necking effect around public sex near roads, streetcar operators might lock their breaks so they could stare at public sex that would cause passengers to be violently thrown to the front of the streetcar or even cause the streetcar to jump the track. (sexual desires makes humans do very very stupid things).

[apathy maybe]

Public sex would have to restricted to certain areas just for safety reason alone, for example to avoid buses running reds because of drivers watching public sex on the side walk instead watching the road, or having bus driver crawl by people having sex causing a rubber necking effect around public sex near roads, streetcar operators might lock their breaks so they could stare at public sex that would cause passengers to be violently thrown to the front of the streetcar or even cause the streetcar to jump the track. (sexual desires makes humans do very very stupid things).

Do we also restrict public nudity for the same reasons? If drivers can't concentrate, perhaps they shouldn't be driving.

[Psy]

Do we also restrict public nudity for the same reasons? If drivers can't concentrate, perhaps they shouldn't be driving.
So we expect workers to suppress their sexual urges when people are having sex in their field of view? When I was in high school one the other students decided to have fun by putting porn down on the floor of the hall and watching the reaction of students and every single one (include the girls) focused on the porn as walking many bumping into others as they were concentrating on the porn rather then were they were going.

[Holden Caulfield]

i like the fact many examples of this are all about busses, i love the bus

[BashTheFash]

"Gene,
Rationally speaking, women ought to be allowed the freedom to wear whatever they wish (including nothing), just as men."

I agree with that statement. If somebody decides for whatever reason they wish to walk around in their "birthday suit" thats cool with me.

[Decolonize The Left]

On the issue of whether or not nudity/sex in public areas would cause "distraction" to others, we have failed to note several key issues.
- In such a society, nudity/sex would not be so socially unacceptable/unknown. It would be commonplace, such as holding hands/kissing. You don't run your car off the road when you catch a glimpse of folks making-out and you just couldn't 'control your urges,' do you?
- I agree with apathy maybe here, if you can't concentrate, I don't want you driving my bus and possibly putting my life (among all others on the bus) in serious danger. It is not society's responsibility to provide you with a shared area whereby you don't have to take note of anything but the road. Not to mention such a society would be terribly boring and monotone.
- Restricting activities only makes them more desirable as they are 'forbidden fruit.' This in turn will cause people to find ways to engage in them that may be dangerous to themselves and others. Open communication is the easiest solution.

- August

[Schrödinger's Cat]

I have no qualms with nudity, but public sex seems to indicate an exchange of fluids (even between lesbians), which can cause health risks, especially in high-danger areas like public restrooms. I'm not saying that people be thrown in jail for it, but perhaps some disruption is in order.

[Black Dagger]

I think most people here will probably agree that none of these things should result in people being prosecuted by the state - so what we're talking about is more social 'law'. Personally i don't have a problem with public nudity or sex in public, but given that there is no universal social attitude towards public sex or nudity it could cause some problems.

Basically, if you're in shared space you need to respect other people - some people might find public sex, and especially nudity - intimidating or unsettling. So if you're having sex in public try to be considerate of others in between orgasms >_> But seriously we must ensure that our shared spaces are safe and non-intimidating for everyone. So there is a balance that must be struck here, maybe classify some areas as clothes optional - but there's def gotta be some kind of organisation to it - so that people who are not comfortable with 'naturalism' can avoid places they won't be comfortable in. And as far as safety is concerned, clothes really are important when you're working in a lot of places - like in hospitals, or construction etc. Also given the amount of sexual harrassment, intimidation and other violence - i'm not sure how feasible public nudity as a social norm (as opposed to niche) is at least in the foreseeable future.

[Sendo]

if I see two people fucking in the library I'll tell them to cut it out. But I'm all for more nudity. For protection I'd wear loincloths when sitting down, but I walk around naked when I'm at home or anywhere that doesn't have women (or even if there is and I forget. I would sometimes walk into my room naked at my frat and a roommate might have a girl friend over). The human body, whatever, man.

Ironically (?) I can't stand art that fetishizes the body. As others stated, it's frivolous to have prosecution of this stuff. Just spray some cold water on people. We need more of that. I didn't like being in class and having people get two second base like noisy slobbering dogs. Save that shit for the dimly lit, drunken parties.

[Black Dagger]

Yeah, i think context - i.e. time and place is important, if people are considerate much of the potential awkwardness can be avoided.

[Hiero]

Female nudity in public isn't too far away. In Australia I have noticed (not in a pervy way) that occasional a woman will sun bath topless on public beaches and it is usually not considered a bad thing.

I think there will always be spaces that prohibit all nudity, as is the case now with men going bare chested. In some cases too much exposure is gross.

[Herman]

Female nudity in public isn't too far away. In Australia I have noticed (not in a pervy way) that occasional a woman will sun bath topless on public beaches and it is usually not considered a bad thing.

Almost every woman in Spain sun bathes topless. It's nothing new or recent.

[Psy]

Yeah, i think context - i.e. time and place is important, if people are considerate much of the potential awkwardness can be avoided.
Yhea, I think there would still be some rules of etiquette just so we don't annoy each other.

[Hyacinth]

Yhea, I think there would still be some rules of etiquette just so we don't annoy each other.
This.

Personally I don't have any issue with either public nudity nor public sex in principle; but, given that we've all been raised in a rather prudish society I don't doubt that it would be awkward or even offend our sensibilities. Moreover, nor do I think any good argument can be made for banning it, as I don't count "I wouldn't want to see it" as sufficient reason. If you have problems with people fucking on a bus (to carry on the bus analogy) then get off it.

That having been said, I doubt people would choose to fornicate on public transit on a regular basis anyway, some rules of etiquette would keep that to a minimum.

[counterblast]

So we expect workers to suppress their sexual urges when people are having sex in their field of view? When I was in high school one the other students decided to have fun by putting porn down on the floor of the hall and watching the reaction of students and every single one (include the girls) focused on the porn as walking many bumping into others as they were concentrating on the porn rather then were they were going.


This is a terrible arguement, because sexuality is taboo in most of Western society, and ESPECIALLY taboo among young people. And of course magazines and nudity are both prohibited at most schools.

If these kids had seen sexual acts on their way to school everyday since first grade, do you think they'd have been as intrigued by the pornography magazine in the hall? Probably not.

[communard resolution]

Yin and Yang. Theoretically, I don't object to people having sex or being naked in public. But realistically speaking, there's a LOT of people in the street that I'd rather not see naked, let alone watch them having sex.

If everybody was super-hot, it would be fine by me.

[Hiero]

If you have problems with people fucking on a bus (to carry on the bus analogy) then get off it.

Actually that is unfair. The bus is a public place and so their should be a meduim of behaviour that keeps it public. People shouldn't be allowed to turn public places into their own private space for their own pleasure. This goes for alot of behaviour, loud music, loud talking/arguing, drinking or drugs, and other annoying or offensive behaviour. Naturally these things are cultural determined, loud music can be annoying in one culture, in another it is apart of the daily background of noise, like in Latin America.

Also people can't just get off the bus, people have to use the bus to get to and from places. Public transport is necessity, it isn't a necessity to have sex right that second on the bus.

So it is not just a prudish verses libertarian issue. In the case of nude sun bathing at the beach this is mostly a prudish verses libertarian issue. In other spaces it is a public verses private issue. That line of demarcation between what is public and what is private will always exist, I think even through till communism.



Yin and Yang. Theoretically, I don't object to people having sex or being naked in public. But realistically speaking, there's a LOT of people in the street that I'd rather not see naked, let alone watch them having sex.

If everybody was super-hot, it would be fine by me.

And that is the other thing.

[Psy]

This.

Personally I don't have any issue with either public nudity nor public sex in principle; but, given that we've all been raised in a rather prudish society I don't doubt that it would be awkward or even offend our sensibilities. Moreover, nor do I think any good argument can be made for banning it, as I don't count "I wouldn't want to see it" as sufficient reason. If you have problems with people fucking on a bus (to carry on the bus analogy) then get off it.

That having been said, I doubt people would choose to fornicate on public transit on a regular basis anyway, some rules of etiquette would keep that to a minimum.

Why make transit workers have to clean up spooge because we allow people to have sex and whack off in the transit system? Also think of the other riders before the bus/train can go into be serviced so the insides can be cleaned, think of the inconvenience to others of having the bus/train go into to be serviced early just to clean up the spooge meaning delays thus people waiting because of people having sex in the transit system.

[Pirate turtle the 11th]

I think it should be up to the community to vote. I can imagine having communes in which it was aceptable and ones in which there were laws covering it.

[communard resolution]

I think there should be different buses to choose from: nude/sex buses and normal ones. I think I'll pick the one where I won't be sitting in someone's spunk while smelling my neighbours arse odour.

[Hyacinth]

Actually that is unfair. The bus is a public place and so their should be a meduim of behaviour that keeps it public. People shouldn't be allowed to turn public places into their own private space for their own pleasure. This goes for alot of behaviour, loud music, loud talking/arguing, drinking or drugs, and other annoying or offensive behaviour. Naturally these things are cultural determined, loud music can be annoying in one culture, in another it is apart of the daily background of noise, like in Latin America.

Also people can't just get off the bus, people have to use the bus to get to and from places. Public transport is necessity, it isn't a necessity to have sex right that second on the bus.

So it is not just a prudish verses libertarian issue. In the case of nude sun bathing at the beach this is mostly a prudish verses libertarian issue. In other spaces it is a public verses private issue. That line of demarcation between what is public and what is private will always exist, I think even through till communism.

What counts as permissible public behavior is socially defined and will vary depending on which society that we are in, as you correctly point out. For example, I don't think that you would say that we should kick of a homosexual couple for public displays of affection (not sex here, but holdings hands, kissing, etc.) simply because it might offend some homophobes on the bus. Since, after all, in this circumstance we think that the problem isn't with the couple's behavior, but with the behavior of the homophobes. Similarly I think this also applies to prudishness. There is nothing inherently wrong with sex, and while the rules of public etiquette might require the behavior to in some sense be constrained as to be considerate to others, we need to distinguish between legitimate complains against others who are engaging in such behavior in public in an inappropriate manner (say by taking up seats on a bus reserved for passengers with reduced mobility) vs. those who are engaged in such behavior in such a way as to not be affecting others, expect perhaps their prudish sensibilities.


Why make transit workers have to clean up spooge because we allow people to have sex and whack off in the transit system? Also think of the other riders before the bus/train can go into be serviced so the insides can be cleaned, think of the inconvenience to others of having the bus/train go into to be serviced early just to clean up the spooge meaning delays thus people waiting because of people having sex in the transit system.

I still thing that such concerns can be addressed solely by rules of etiquette, and do not require legislation. It isn't as though by making such behavior in public permissible that people will all of a sudden start having sex on buses, or other public places, like crazy. It is still the case that sex in is by-and-large taboo, and that our society is quite puritanical with regards to sex.

Over time, as public nudity and sex become more permissible, people would, on their own, develop rules of etiquette for such behavior.

As for the concerns about "transit workers have[ing] to clean up spooge", well, as I said, I doubt it would be a problem. At least no more of a problem than transit workers having to clean up buses now, they aren't the cleanliest public places. Think of say all the mud and dirt that is carried onto them just by footwear, or all the garbage that people leave on transit. In some ways I don't know why anyone would want to have sex on a bus, but that's besides the point. This behavior can be dealth with similarly as littering can be dealth with, and that is by making it unacceptable socially (not necessarily legal), and in doing so excluding violators from participation in parts of public life. If you put your muddy shoes up on a seat on a bus your fellow commuters and the trasnit workers should have a right to kick you off the bus, as your being incredebly rude and incosiderate of others. Similalry the same goes for sex in public. But not all public spaces are the same; while I admit that it might be imappropriate to have sex on busses as a matter of etiquette, there could be other public places (such as, say, parks) where similar objections as public cleanliness couldn't be raised.

[Black Dagger]

I think there should be different buses to choose from: nude/sex buses and normal ones. I think I'll pick the one where I won't be sitting in someone's spunk while smelling my neighbours arse odour.

I think you're wildly over-estimating the demand for 'sex+' buses :unsure:

[Mecha_Shiva]

It would be nice if women could be topless without any legal or social problems with it. Like in the summer. When playing soccer or something and you get really hot, all the guys take their shirts off and I wish I could also. And not even just sunbathing at the beach, but if you like to lie in the sun in your own yard, you should be able to be topless there too. Cuz my yard offers no privacy from the street. Or even at the park. Or just anywhere.
As for sex in public, I think people would use common sense to decide whether it would be a good time for it. Like if there is a kindergarten class on a field trip and you want to get it on there, you would maybe wait till the kids aren't around. And if you were being an ass and decided you didn't care and started screwing anyway, then I'm sure someone would let you know how they feel about it.
But sex in a public could help a lot of peoples relationships I think. It's way fun and a good way to keep things from getting redundent in the bedroom if your in a mongomous relationship. Sex on the beach sounds like it could be pretty fun. But the sand could be a problem... and jelly fish lol :laugh:
But then again, if sex in public was a common thing that no one cared about, would it lose all it's fun?

[spice756]

topless ,kissing ,holding hands,getting close to one other is one think .Well Sex is other thing :eek:

If I'm on a bus or subway going to work I don't want to see people having sex.Same if I'm walking down a side-walk to go to store or in the store.Take that to the park or bathroom or community that allows it every where.

Has for jobs well some jobs require clothing for safety reasons.

LA people are more open more skin showing.In Canada this still a taboo.Even in Amsterdam it is more open so it is more a culture thing.

[Hyacinth]

It would be nice if women could be topless without any legal or social problems with it. Like in the summer. When playing soccer or something and you get really hot, all the guys take their shirts off and I wish I could also. And not even just sunbathing at the beach, but if you like to lie in the sun in your own yard, you should be able to be topless there too. Cuz my yard offers no privacy from the street. Or even at the park. Or just anywhere.
As for sex in public, I think people would use common sense to decide whether it would be a good time for it. Like if there is a kindergarten class on a field trip and you want to get it on there, you would maybe wait till the kids aren't around. And if you were being an ass and decided you didn't care and started screwing anyway, then I'm sure someone would let you know how they feel about it.
But sex in a public could help a lot of peoples relationships I think. It's way fun and a good way to keep things from getting redundent in the bedroom if your in a mongomous relationship. Sex on the beach sounds like it could be pretty fun. But the sand could be a problem... and jelly fish lol :laugh:
But then again, if sex in public was a common thing that no one cared about, would it lose all it's fun?
I think you have a very good point. In a society where sex in public is not taboo it might well loose much of its appeal.

[Decolonize The Left]

But then again, if sex in public was a common thing that no one cared about, would it lose all it's fun?

I highly doubt it. What it would lose would be the negative stigma which it carries today - that 'dirty' thing people do. This all stems from the notion that women are sexual creatures and seek to corrupt men with their sexual devices thereby drawing men away from the divine work of [insert term] (pun intended).

Sex is pleasurable when consensual. That's pretty much the bottom line. It's going to stay fun for a long time... (pun not intended, but damn I'm on a roll).

- August

[Mecha_Shiva]

I highly doubt it. What it would lose would be the negative stigma which it carries today - that 'dirty' thing people do. This all stems from the notion that women are sexual creatures and seek to corrupt men with their sexual devices thereby drawing men away from the divine work of [insert term] (pun intended).

Sex is pleasurable when consensual. That's pretty much the bottom line. It's going to stay fun for a long time... (pun not intended, but damn I'm on a roll).

- August

Nooooooo nooo I didn't mean sex itself would lose all it's fun No way lol

I meant if it was all fine and legal and socially acceptable to have sex in public, then having sex specifically in public would lose all it's fun.

Not just sex in general.

Bacause personally I only think sex in public is fun because it's not allowed.

and lol at your puns :laugh:

[Black Dagger]

I disagree. Even if public sex is legal and less stigmatised it'll still be 'fun' - because making it more acceptable doesn't mean that it will become banal. Coz it'll probably never be fully accepted - in the sense that, i doubt it will ever be commonplace to work down the street and just see people fucking left and right - at least every day there should be exceptions for special holidays and celebrations of course! So i think even socially and 'legally' public sex would be fun in and of itself - because it's spontaneous, can be physically challenging, humourous and there's still the pleasure of exhibitionism; though in part this does relate to the kind of sexual inhibitions we're talking about dispensing with here.

[Decolonize The Left]

Nooooooo nooo I didn't mean sex itself would lose all it's fun No way lol

I meant if it was all fine and legal and socially acceptable to have sex in public, then having sex specifically in public would lose all it's fun.

Not just sex in general.

Bacause personally I only think sex in public is fun because it's not allowed.

and lol at your puns :laugh:

Well, as I mentioned, the negative stigma would be gone. But there is still the excitement of being seen by others nude/engaging in sexual activity. This 'voyeur' aspect of public sex would still be in effect, if not heightened as the negative stigma has been relieved (pun not intended).

- August

[Red Phalanx]

Fuck whereever you want, walk around naked and take a shit where ever you want too. I'm all for freedom.