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View Full Version : An example of past treason. - Hanoi Jane



Anonymous
23rd March 2003, 21:15
http://www.1stcavmedic.com/Jane_Fonda/Jane_gun.jpg

Jane Fonda sitting on a seat of an anti-aircraft gun.


http://www.1stcavmedic.com/Jane_Fonda/Jane_admiration2-small.jpg

Jane Fonda looking admiringly at an NVA gun crew.

http://www.1stcavmedic.com/Jane_Fonda/Jangun4.jpg

Jane Fonda applauding an NVA anti-aircraft gun crew. These guns were used to shoot down American planes and contributed to the deaths of American Airmen.

http://www.1stcavmedic.com/Jane_Fonda/Jane-color.jpg

Color photo of Jane Fonda sitting in the gun seat.


Transcription dated August 22, 1972 from the Hotel Especen in Hanoi at 7:11 PM.


[Broadcast]

This is Jane Fonda. During my two week visit in the Democratic Republic of Vietnam, I've had the opportunity to visit a great many places and speak to a large number of people from all walks of life- workers, peasants, students, artists and dancers, historians, journalists, film actresses, soldiers, militia girls, members of the women's union, writers.

I visited the (Dam Xuac) agricultural coop, where the silk worms are also raised and thread is made. I visited a textile factory, a kindergarten in Hanoi. The beautiful Temple of Literature was where I saw traditional dances and heard songs of resistance. I also saw unforgettable ballet about the guerrillas training bees in the south to attack enemy soldiers. The bees were danced by women, and they did their job well.

In the shadow of the Temple of Literature I saw Vietnamese actors and actresses perform the second act of Arthur Miller's play All My Sons, and this was very moving to me- the fact that artists here are translating and performing American plays while US imperialists are bombing their country.

I cherish the memory of the blushing militia girls on the roof of their factory, encouraging one of their sisters as she sang a song praising the blue sky of Vietnam- these women, who are so gentle and poetic, whose voices are so beautiful, but who, when American planes are bombing their city, become such good fighters.

I cherish the way a farmer evacuated from Hanoi, without hesitation, offered me, an American, their best individual bomb shelter while US bombs fell near by. The daughter and I, in fact, shared the shelter wrapped in each others arms, cheek against cheek. It was on the road back from Nam Dinh, where I had witnessed the systematic destruction of civilian targets- schools, hospitals, pagodas, the factories, houses, and the dike system.

As I left the United States two weeks ago, Nixon was again telling the American people that he was winding down the war, but in the rubble- strewn streets of Nam Dinh, his words echoed with sinister (words indistinct) of a true killer. And like the young Vietnamese woman I held in my arms clinging to me tightly- and I pressed my cheek against hers- I thought, this is a war against Vietnam perhaps, but the tragedy is America's.

One thing that I have learned beyond a shadow of a doubt since I've been in this country is that Nixon will never be able to break the spirit of these people; he'll never be able to turn Vietnam, north and south, into a neo- colony of the United States by bombing, by invading, by attacking in any way. One has only to go into the countryside and listen to the peasants describe the lives they led before the revolution to understand why every bomb that is dropped only strengthens their determination to resist. I've spoken to many peasants who talked about the days when their parents had to sell themselves to landlords as virtually slaves, when there were very few schools and much illiteracy, inadequate medical care, when they were not masters of their own lives.

But now, despite the bombs, despite the crimes being created- being committed against them by Richard Nixon, these people own their own land, build their own schools- the children learning, literacy- illiteracy is being wiped out, there is no more prostitution as there was during the time when this was a French colony. In other words, the people have taken power into their own hands, and they are controlling their own lives.

And after 4,000 years of struggling against nature and foreign invaders- and the last 25 years, prior to the revolution, of struggling against French colonialism- I don't think that the people of Vietnam are about to compromise in any way, shape or form about the freedom and independence of their country, and I think Richard Nixon would do well to read Vietnamese history, particularly their poetry, and particularly the poetry written by Ho Chi Minh.

Xvall
23rd March 2003, 21:48
Good. This isn't the best site to post anti-vietnam war stuff. If I was alive during the Vietnam war; I would have probably joined, so I can stab the American Military in the back and join the Vietcong. Call it an 'awful' thing to say if you want; but Diem-Ocracy is no American Dream either.

Chiak47
23rd March 2003, 22:39
Most that were against the war were not men enough to go fight against a ideal that's only killed 20,000,000 people.

Hampton
23rd March 2003, 23:29
As opposed to you being "men enough" and fighting in Iraq now?

Chiak47
23rd March 2003, 23:35
I would go in a heart beat if I was allowed to.I have tatts and they said no at the physical.
I'm missing out.

Pete
23rd March 2003, 23:39
Most of you guys have a medical disablity of some sort.

But the picture you showed are not of treason, but of an American excerizing a right. Freedom of Press. Is that not sacred to you? She reported on what she wanted to, it also gave a different window into that war.

synthesis
23rd March 2003, 23:46
I agree Pete, I love how these cappies can accuse protesters of treason and suggest execution because they're impeding America's attempt to spread democracy, liberty, and free speech in the same sentence. Such lovely hypocrisy, but what more can you expect of right-wingers?

Chiak47
23rd March 2003, 23:53
Well in our military they are real picky.
I guess cause china accepts anything that is breathing into their forces the rest of the world should.
http://www.gunsnet.net/forums/images/rolleyes.gif

Pete
23rd March 2003, 23:57
What are you talking about Chiak?

Anonymous
23rd March 2003, 23:59
I can't join because of my nystagmus. :sad:

redstar2000
23rd March 2003, 23:59
"Hanoi Jane"? :cheesy: :cheesy: :cheesy:

Last I heard, she'd "found Jesus." If Jesus could forgive her "treason", surely DC could...?

Unlike Jane, DC, I really am a "traitor"...if I had some way to help Iraq inflict a catastrophic military defeat on U.S. imperialism (and not suffer any unpleasant consequences, of course), I'd cheerfully do so.

Take your imperial America, DC, and shove it up your ass!

:cool:

Chiak47
24th March 2003, 00:02
Quote: from redstar2000 on 11:59 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
Take your imperial America, DC, and shove it up your ass!

:cool:

I'll be glad to take America away from you.
Shit About time people start turng away from us instead of too us(for Money)

Xvall
24th March 2003, 00:48
Dark Capitalist:

I can't join because of my nystagmus.

Seriously? That sucks. Yes; a lot of people on this board have medical/psychological problem. I have no clue why. It seems that everyone nowadays has a medical/psychological problem. I am a very weak, brittle, little kid. I have Touretts Syndrom, Obsessive Compulsive Disorder, Neurosis, and used to have symptoms of Hypochondria. (No wonder I am a strange, wierd, communist.)

Chiak47:

Most that were against the war were not men enough to go fight against a ideal that's only killed 20,000,000 people.

Vietnam was in the middle of a revolution. It was more of a war based around national sovergntey than any sort of economic system. As a matter of fact; a significant portion of the Vietcong wasn't even socialistic. A lot of the people just wanted their own state; away from Diem. A lot of the people that were man enough to fight the Vietcong were doing so unwillingly; instead because of a draft.

redstar2000:

Unlike Jane, DC, I really am a "traitor"...if I had some way to help Iraq inflict a catastrophic military defeat on U.S. imperialism (and not suffer any unpleasant consequences, of course), I'd cheerfully do so.

Isn't that going out on a limb there? I don't like imperialism; and seeing as you are a socialist/communist, I could understand if you had these feelings towards the Vietnam War. But I wouldn't exactly be ready to shake Saddam's hand here.

redstar2000
24th March 2003, 01:26
From what I can tell, Drake, Hussein is a rather minor-league asshole...not really in the same league with, for example, the House of Saud or the mullahs of Iran. (Did you see that link that Hampton posted--it was the Iranians that gassed those Kurds, not Hussein.)

But actually, the character of Hussein is of no particular interest to me. Here's why.

Just as Czarist Russia was the "fortress of European reaction" in the 19th century, the United States is the modern "fortress of reaction" for the whole world.

The modern geo-political/military doctrine of U.S. imperialism asserts the right to intervene and crush anyone in any country at any time who may become in the future a credible threat to U.S. imperialism.

It is a "bill of attainder" addressed to the entire world.

Consequently, revolutionaries in every country are marked for death by the U.S. Government...if the U.S. thinks they are about to succeed. The rebels in Colombia are already labelled "terrorists". Cuba is already considered a "terrorist state". And, no doubt, Venezuela has also been added to the list of targets...but the time for making that public has not yet arrived.

Indeed, even American citizens are not safe. If the government labels you a "terrorist" and disappears you...that's it. They can legally do to you whatever they wish and you have no recourse.

What is clearly needed here is global resistance. The boycotts and demonstrations are great first steps...but like the Third Reich, nothing is really going to curb America's imperial ambition until it faces catastrophic military defeat wherever it looks.

The Germans and the Japanese learned, in painful detail, the true cost of empire. Americans have not yet learned.

But they must be taught!

:cool:

Anonymous
24th March 2003, 01:35
FARC is a terrorist organization.

Xvall
24th March 2003, 03:07
That can be argued, DC. I don't think their intention was origionally to become a cocain dealing gang; unfortunately that is what it has seemed to turn out to though.

In regards to Hussein; I know there are many people who are just as bad, if not worse than him. I don't like him any more than I do the American politicians; but I just can not side with him. Aside from that fact that he is a devout anti-communist; he is just a plain jerk. I do not like the war in Iraq, and I will continue to oppose it. This does not, however, mean that I support Saddam Hussein. Just as I hate what happened in Dresden and Hiroshima; I would never support the militariast Togo or the nazi Adolph Hitler.

The Germans and the Japanese learned, in painful detail, the true cost of empire. Americans have not yet learned.

But they must be taught!

I am hoping that they do not have to be 'taught'; and instead just catch on. The Second World War resulted in nearly half of those countries populations being decimated; consider as well that the weapons we have now are far more advanced and dangerous. I am hoping that 100,000,000 United States citizens do not have to die in order to realize something.

I'm not arguing with you; just throwing in my opinion.

Capitalist Imperial
24th March 2003, 03:46
Quote: from CrazyPete on 11:39 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
Most of you guys have a medical disablity of some sort.

But the picture you showed are not of treason, but of an American excerizing a right. Freedom of Press. Is that not sacred to you? She reported on what she wanted to, it also gave a different window into that war.


No, Pete, she was actually at a VC anti-aircraft battery with enemy forces expressing sentiments of shooting down US assets.

That is not "expressing an opinion". That is treachery.

You and dyermaker can minimize her actions however you wish, but those of us with a lick of sense know that she was, is, and always will be a traitor.

Execute her

Capitalist Imperial
24th March 2003, 03:52
Quote: from redstar2000 on 11:59 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
"Hanoi Jane"? :cheesy: :cheesy: :cheesy:

Last I heard, she'd "found Jesus." If Jesus could forgive her "treason", surely DC could...?

Unlike Jane, DC, I really am a "traitor"...if I had some way to help Iraq inflict a catastrophic military defeat on U.S. imperialism (and not suffer any unpleasant consequences, of course), I'd cheerfully do so.

Take your imperial America, DC, and shove it up your ass!

:cool:


redstar, you are just dumb, full-of shit kid. If you were really that vehemently anti-american, you would not live here, bottom line

"...if I had some way to help Iraq inflict a catastrophic military defeat on U.S. imperialism (and not suffer any unpleasant consequences, of course), I'd cheerfully do so."


TRANSLATION:If I had a way to dish it out but not take it, I would do it!

what a fucking pussy, and a stupid one at that. You are not even a traitor, really, because you are just a mouth, with no action

I consider you a non-factor at best


(Edited by Capitalist Imperial at 3:55 am on Mar. 24, 2003)

synthesis
24th March 2003, 04:05
redstar, you are just dumb, full-of shit kid. He's, like, 61. You should really take this stuff into account before opening your yap like that.

Capitalist Imperial
24th March 2003, 04:14
Quote: from DyerMaker on 4:05 am on Mar. 24, 2003

redstar, you are just dumb, full-of shit kid. He's, like, 61. You should really take this stuff into account before opening your yap like that.

do you know what, DM? That doesn't exactly help his situation. I feel even more pity for him now.

redstar2000
24th March 2003, 13:33
"If I had a way to dish it out but not take it, I would do it."

That's being a "pussy", CI? And stupid?

I suppose you imagine yourself leading the charge of the light brigade down the Baghdad Freeway...you dumb shit!

I thought you right-wing assholes at least understood the minimal basics of warfare: maximum risk for the enemy; minimum risk for your side.

So naturally, if I could, I would inflict maximum damage on your side at minimal risk to mine. Isn't that what war is about, insect?

Perhaps the only real regret in my life is that I didn't leave the United States while in my 20s or 30s...now, given my abject poverty, there's probably no country that would let me in...even if I had the money to get there. (Civilized countries don't like elderly immigrants who are also poor...they think the first thing we'll do when we get there is run up a big bill at the national health service...that we can't pay.)

But, CI, I try to do my part: specifically, I try as hard as I can to encourage young American lefties to get out of this shit-hole while it is still possible.

That should make you feel better, moron.

:cool:

Chiak47
24th March 2003, 13:37
funny how you mention the highway of death.

Most of the planes upon return of bombing runs had light damage from small arms fire.

Sounds to me they did not want the US to take back the stolen goods of Kuwait.

Not that it matters to commies.You people don't believe in "private" ownership.It's there for the world to take instead of earn.