16 amercian/britsh soliders died!! - YAY [Archive]

Capitalist Imperial

21st March 2003, 15:12

redstar2000

21st March 2003, 15:19

Are there people here who don't really grasp the reality of professional soldiering?

When you volunteer for military "service", you have essentially renounced your humanity...you have become a "killing machine" with no more individuality or personality than a tank or a bomb. You are pointed in a certain direction and told to kill...and if you're a "good soldier", that's what you do.

You are "beyond good and evil". As a killing machine, you are morally neutral; machines either work or don't work, that's all.

To mourn the death of a professional killing machine makes as much sense as mourning a bomb with a defective fuse or a tank with a burned-out engine.

One can, if one wishes, mourn the death of any human being who volunteers to be a soldier...that's when the death of a human takes place. What happens in combat is a different matter...machines do get destroyed in combat and are replaced by new machines. No one holds a funeral for machines that are destroyed in war.

If that seems unpleasant, the remedy is obvious: retain your humanity and don't volunteer to become a killing machine for U.S. and British imperialism.

Simple enough, I would think.

:cool:

Dhul Fiqar

21st March 2003, 15:27

Very well said RedStar2000.

These people invaded a foreign country with the expressed aim to to kill it's people (for whatever long-term goal is unimportant for this simple mental exercise).

They died in the process.

Good, they asked for it. No amount of unemployment would make me take up arms to kill children for an unjust money-grabbing bunch of murderers. If you join the army of a country like the USA, you are helping them wage their murderous campaigns.

Long live those giving their lives to defend their country, death to the Imperialists invading it for the sake of oil!

--- G.

Dhul Fiqar

21st March 2003, 15:29

Oh, and btw, a lot of people here seem to support violent rebellion but go nuts over every human that dies.

These soldiers are typical of the kind of people we would have to kill in the opening stages of a real revolution. As distasteful as death is, it's impossible to say all human death is something to be against unless you are willing to give up on revolution.

--- G.

Moskitto

21st March 2003, 15:58

so if you're an unarmed field doctor and your paradropped into a village where something has gone terribly wrong and you're meant to be treating people for VX poisoning and someone shoots your helicopter out of the sky you deserved to die, right?

Can I point out that these people died because of mechanical failure, not because they were fighting.

Invader Zim

21st March 2003, 16:11

Quote: from redstar2000 on 3:19 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
Are there people here who don't really grasp the reality of professional soldiering?

When you volunteer for military "service", you have essentially renounced your humanity...you have become a "killing machine" with no more individuality or personality than a tank or a bomb. You are pointed in a certain direction and told to kill...and if you're a "good soldier", that's what you do.

You are "beyond good and evil". As a killing machine, you are morally neutral; machines either work or don't work, that's all.

To mourn the death of a professional killing machine makes as much sense as mourning a bomb with a defective fuse or a tank with a burned-out engine.

One can, if one wishes, mourn the death of any human being who volunteers to be a soldier...that's when the death of a human takes place. What happens in combat is a different matter...machines do get destroyed in combat and are replaced by new machines. No one holds a funeral for machines that are destroyed in war.

If that seems unpleasant, the remedy is obvious: retain your humanity and don't volunteer to become a killing machine for U.S. and British imperialism.

Simple enough, I would think.

:cool:

What a load of complete bull. Its such obvious crap i dont even feel the need to ridicule it. Its been done for me by its own sheer stupidity

Just Joe

21st March 2003, 16:26

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 3:09 pm on Mar. 21, 2003

Quote: from Dhul Fiqar on 2:32 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
Those American and British "soldiers" were not conscripted, they were professional murderers. They signed up to join some of the most disgusting military operations on the face of the earth.

They are hired killers, who have made a career out of killing.

Why on earth is anyone shedding a tear for these worthless fucks? I spit on their graves...

fuck you, you fucking bastard

how old are you? 12? 13?

Tkinter1

21st March 2003, 16:28

"These soldiers are typical of the kind of people we would have to kill in the opening stages of a real revolution. As distasteful as death is, it's impossible to say all human death is something to be against unless you are willing to give up on revolution. "

Oh your such a revolutionary.

Invader Zim

21st March 2003, 16:33

Quote: from Dhul Fiqar on 3:29 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
Oh, and btw, a lot of people here seem to support violent rebellion but go nuts over every human that dies.

These soldiers are typical of the kind of people we would have to kill in the opening stages of a real revolution. As distasteful as death is, it's impossible to say all human death is something to be against unless you are willing to give up on revolution.

--- G.

Death to STUPIDITY

smith196

21st March 2003, 16:59

You people make me feel sick. How can you celebrate the deaths of soliders who are risking their lives every day during this conflict? While i was agaisnt the war, now it's started i am fully behind our troops and hope they all survive and the war is over quickly with minimum casulities on either side.

How is this war Imperialism by the way? It's not for the oil. That argument has been disproved. Saddam presents a danger. He's shown he's willing to use his weapons of mass destructuion and he must be disarmed of them. You should note, that i don't think war is the right way to disarm Saddam.

Invader Zim

21st March 2003, 17:04

Quote: from smith196 on 4:59 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
You people make me feel sick. How can you celebrate the deaths of soliders who are risking their lives every day during this conflict? While i was agaisnt the war, now it's started i am fully behind our troops and hope they all survive and the war is over quickly with minimum casulities on either side.

How is this war Imperialism by the way? It's not for the oil. That argument has been disproved. Saddam presents a danger. He's shown he's willing to use his weapons of mass destructuion and he must be disarmed of them. You should note, that i don't think war is the right way to disarm Saddam.

Thank you!!!

I completely agree. Saddam fired scuds he claimed not to have... So that most certainly makes the war legal now because it proves the USA correct.

Just Joe

21st March 2003, 17:08

scuds are not WMD.

to answer what redstar and dhul are saying, i think youre wrong. a lot of the soldiers in Iraq are victims aswell. a lot don't won't the war. they sign up to defend there country, not fight foreign wars. when youre called, you don't have a choice. either fight, or have your career and employment recored ruined for life. most of the families of the soldiers, many of whom are working class lads, would not look to kindly on left wingers, supposedly supporters of the working class, rejoicing in the deaths of there fathers and sons.

Invader Zim

21st March 2003, 17:14

Quote: from Just Joe on 5:08 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
scuds are not WMD.

to answer what redstar and dhul are saying, i think youre wrong. a lot of the soldiers in Iraq are victims aswell. a lot don't won't the war. they sign up to defend there country, not fight foreign wars. when youre called, you don't have a choice. either fight, or have your career and employment recored ruined for life. most of the families of the soldiers, many of whom are working class lads, would not look to kindly on left wingers, supposedly supporters of the working class, rejoicing in the deaths of there fathers and sons.

Yes but its not just weapons of mass destruction that were banned idiot. It was all missiles which have a certain range. Something like 900 miles.

Ã‘Ã³ẊÃ®Ã¶ŉ

21st March 2003, 17:22

Could someone tell me the difference between a soldier ans an armed revolutionary? The only difference I see is that a revolutionary fights because of their beliefs, while a soldier is ordered to fight.
both are armed, and ready to 'live by the sword and die by the sword' and both are highly motivated
I would mourn the passing of every revolutionary as a brother (or sister) in arms has fallen, while I would mourn the death of every soldier because a soul has been lost to imperialism.

Guardia Bolivariano

21st March 2003, 17:36

This is waste of time focusing on the death of 16 murderes while bombs are falling on iraqi civilians.

LOIC

21st March 2003, 17:40

"Those American and British "soldiers" were not conscripted, they were professional murderers. They signed up to join some of the most disgusting military operations on the face of the earth.

They are hired killers, who have made a career out of killing.

Why on earth is anyone shedding a tear for these worthless fucks? I spit on their graves... "

I agree totally with that.
These soldiers are invading a country and killing its people just because they obey orders of a fucked up government.
They are nothing else but pigs.
15 american/british soldiers died? Good riddance!

chamo

21st March 2003, 17:57

Quote: from lostsoul on 5:31 am on Mar. 21, 2003
I hope Amercian and british solider body count keeps growing!!!!!!

anyone who goes into a country with the intent to murder deserves to be killed.

You are a fucking disgrace and I refuse to recognize you as a leftist. All bloodshed is blood not worth having been shed.
All life lost is human life lost, those men were probably very young in life, they had opportunities to live and were denied that by their own countries faults (again). I hate more the government that sent them to their deaths than them themselves.

Invader Zim

21st March 2003, 18:25

Quote: from LOIC on 5:40 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
"Those American and British "soldiers" were not conscripted, they were professional murderers. They signed up to join some of the most disgusting military operations on the face of the earth.

They are hired killers, who have made a career out of killing.

Why on earth is anyone shedding a tear for these worthless fucks? I spit on their graves... "

I agree totally with that.
These soldiers are invading a country and killing its people just because they obey orders of a fucked up government.
They are nothing else but pigs.
15 american/british soldiers died? Good riddance!

Fuck you arse wipe; i hope you die as well. Did you know some of those sodures were just mechanics. They dont shoot people moron. Why do they diserve to die.

I refuse to even recognise you as a person you are a Nazi!!!

Saint-Just

21st March 2003, 18:49

Quote: from lostsoul on 1:37 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
dropping bombs and sending soliders liberates countries? your seriously fucked up, buddy.

why don't they have the balls to "liberate" north korea? are they scared they will be "liberated" back?

If you believe that America is doing all this because they want to help the iraqi people, and because their extremely generious, then maybe you should open your eyes to the real world.

(Edited by lostsoul at 1:40 pm on Mar. 21, 2003)

This is a very amusing comment.... on the part of your reference to the DPRK.

No one can deny that it is possible that the attack on Iraq could be motivated by the innate desire of all freedom lovers for the liberation of their fellow men.

Saddam Hussein seems to be a leader that has little regard for human life; the country seems to have suffered, although a disproportionate degree of this suffering is the result of American hands. Still, ignoring the implications for nationalism and sovereignty, there is some evidence that the Iraqi people may desire or require liberation for development of their people.

However, history would suggets that liberation is not the key American objective. The American objective is the protection and furthering of the interests on its own nation, and often at any expense for its fraternal brothers of man.

I am talking about the conflicts America, under the same residual beliefs, has previously entered. In the latter half of the 20th century America has entered conflict only under the interests of its protection and the protection of its interests.

The conflict in Vietnam was to curb the spread of socialism - the greatest threat to the American way of life; capitalism. The same for the Korean war. The Gulf war was under the banned of the UN but it could be suggested that it was for the American interest in the security of the region and in particular the oil-producing Kuwait.

Therefore, liberation is a dubious argument as to the U.S. intention in Iraq. I too have little regard for U.S. soldiers following the witness of their acts in Korea. How can you respect the lives of those who have no respect for life?

(Edited by Chairman Mao at 6:50 pm on Mar. 21, 2003)

Atlas Shrugged

21st March 2003, 19:43

Quote: from lostsoul on 11:31 am on Mar. 21, 2003
I hope Amercian and british solider body count keeps growing!!!!!!

anyone who goes into a country with the intent to murder deserves to be killed.

Individuals such as yourself force me to wish a stray bomb would nick your house.

redstar2000

21st March 2003, 20:30

JustJoe, I'm well aware that most of the people who volunteer for the U.S. Armed Forces are working class...and many are trying to rise up to the level of working class.

Back around 1900 or so, there was a plain-spoken capitalist (they existed back then) who dismissed Marxism with contempt, saying "Any time I need to, I can hire half the working class to kill the other half."

So, yes, those who sign up to be professional killers have indeed "taken the King's pence"...what attitude should we have towards them?

In America, we have a word: scab. I believe in your country the word is blackleg.

Workers who deliberately and consciously side with the boss, who cross a union picket-line, etc....scabs.

Workers who become cops, using violence against their own kind to preserve the wealth and privileges of the boss...scabs.

So are those workers who become professional killers for U.S. and British imperialism...scabs.

What is the proper and just fate of a scab?

As to those who mourn the imperialist dead...how much greater your grief when imperialism itself is dead!

:cool:

(Edited by redstar2000 at 3:34 pm on Mar. 21, 2003)

ComradeJunichi

21st March 2003, 20:33

Life is life to me, and I feel whether the corpse is Iraqi or American it is nothign to celebrate about. Death is death. I do not cry myself to sleep because 16 US soldiers and many Iraqi people have died, but I'm pointing out it's nothing to be excited about - or wish for more of.

CruelVerdad

21st March 2003, 20:35

We have to call for PEACE, to stop the killing of more innocent people...
I don´t care if 1000 american - british troops die, but i do care of the poor people.
Of a poor country been attacked by a huge country like is the USA.
How unfair!

Zombie

21st March 2003, 20:42

Of a poor country been attacked by a huge country like is the USA.
How unfair!
well i think that, for some time now, the USA is champion at attacking third world countries!
as for those soldiers, i won't mourn them, but i won't hail (if that's the word) their deaths either. i mourn the (iraqi) civilian who died,or is gonna die, completely shameful and defenseless...

Blibblob

21st March 2003, 20:56

Civilian deaths are at a minimmum. The war is actually going as a uh, "nice" war.

Guardia Bolivariano

21st March 2003, 22:33

Quote: from Blibblob on 8:56 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
Civilian deaths are at a minimmum. The war is actually going as a uh, "nice" war.

Is thar sarcasm or just a sick joke?
Nothing could be more far away from the truth taking in mind that this is one of the biggest air campaigns in history.And has the deadliest weapons.

(Edited by Guardia Bolivariano at 10:35 pm on Mar. 21, 2003)

Moskitto

21st March 2003, 23:27

what you may think of their social role aside, from what i've heard, the average army sqaudies are basically thugs, the more special forces type people are more professional, but a bit weird mentally, and airforce and navy men are alright guys on a personal level it's just the job they do.

A lot of people become involved in the armed forces through their junior programs, my brother used to go to one for the airforce but left when the Kosavo bombing started. I remember when i was much smaller i used to think being in the army would be cool, but i'd be pretty useless in the military, i'm colourblind so that rules me out of flying and electronics, they'd kinda notice my heads slightly over to one side of my body, one of my deltoids is nearly twice the size of the other, one of my hamstrings is too tight compared to the other one, and one of my legs is longer than the other, Chemical warfare would be ok for me, but it's on very dodgy moral ground, unless it's prevention work in which case it's fine. but apart from that, the army doesn't really seem, appealing.

oh, and a funny thing I heard a British general say, they were asking him what he thought of disabled people in the army for non-combat roles and female soldiers and he said "oh no no no, everyone in the army has to be in a position to fight, and women simply do not have the stregth to handle combat", he he, what a hipocrit.

Anonymous

21st March 2003, 23:39

I can't join the service because of my nystagmus. :sad:

Moskitto

21st March 2003, 23:57

actually, i could do jungle warfare because colourblind people can supposedly see camoflauge so they get employed to do that.

Tkinter1

22nd March 2003, 00:04

"And has the deadliest weapons."

Yeah deadly accurate.

lostsoul

22nd March 2003, 01:12

the next message is kind of long..

Someone called me a disgrace to the left, if the left acts like cowards and supports murders, then fuck the left. Any group that supports hired killers, is as fucked up as the killers themselves. These soldiers are not people we should support or even feel pity when they die, they have a CHOICE. They CHOOSE to go kill, no one forced them. Again any group that thinks that these invaders don’t need to be punished(by death or other means) can go fuck themselves. If any groups thinks this is cool then fuck them and everything they stand for. Before we are right or left, we are human beings, and the murder of innocents by barbarian is unacceptable on either side. This is not about politics is about common sense. Its easy to praise war when your team is not losing. If you want to delete this or ban me, go ahead.

I don’t hate anyone because of stuff they can’t control. I visit America often, I like many Americans, but I choose to wish death upon soldiers because of their actions(or lack of action..in this case, choosing not to stand up for the Iraqi civilians).

The world has many jobs, you can do other things then go to other countries and kill in the name of your country. So don’t fucken use the excuse that these soliders have no choice.

Some crackhead here, tried to say Iraqi soliders are just as evil..i think there is a Huge difference between defending your country from invaders and being an actual invader.

Some guy here said the people who died could have been field doctors or something. The point is they weren’t. I strongly believe in fate, and I think if you do bad or try to bad you will get punished. Using you logic I could say, how do you know the targets America is hitting is not full of priest.

If saddam presents a danger then he should be removed, who gave America the right to start a war to remove one person. Is he so dangerous that he is worth the death of thousand others? If so, why can’t America prove it to the UN?

If America can have weopens then any other country can have weopens to defend itself. America is the only country that has shown that it cannot handle nuclear weopens, I don’t think any other country has used it against civilians in history.

Although I dislike America’s presence in other people’s affairs I would like to thank everyone who wrote in this post, even those who oppose me.

lostsoul

22nd March 2003, 02:08

hey 2 more americans won't be coming home. Its a shame, they shouldn't have really left in the first place. Maybe if people are so worried about their safetly they shouldn't have cheered for them to leave in the first place.

the ones that support this war but can't bear to see their own die, are the biggest hyporites of all, and have no right to talk.

Pete

22nd March 2003, 02:19

Celebrating any death is sickening.

lostsoul

22nd March 2003, 02:27

Quote: from CrazyPete on 2:19 am on Mar. 22, 2003
Celebrating any death is sickening.

murdering civilians who didn't choose to go to war and can't afford or are not allowed to run away, is more sickening.

the second these soliders picked up their weopens and went to war, they lost their status "innocent".

Anonymous

22nd March 2003, 02:29

not all soldiers choose to go to war...
some have to join the army becuase they need a job and needto survive..
may i remind you that unemployment rate is geting higher and higher?

yet those who in free will joined the army just to fight iraq (and i know some morons here taht wanted to join the army to fight in iraq... and the most funny is taht they cant even point Iraq in a geo-politcal map.. NOT EVEN IF THE FUCKING MAP HAS THE NAMES OF THE COUNTRYS IN IT!!) those deserve to die....
all those nacionalists that respond to any patriotic act and grab theyr guns to kill for theyr country are morons...
iliterate and ignorant beasts that attack whoever dares to challange or attack theyr masters...
such beasts should be anhilated for security reasons...

send soldiers of peace like red cross volunteers (or red crescent the muslim version of the red cross) but not armed fools with a far too dangerous education...
or should i say MISeducation...

Xvall

22nd March 2003, 02:34

You are all idiots. ALL OF YOU. I know you're going to say that I shouldn't complain, and make some huge retaliation to my post saying that I should be 'rude' and make 'obscene and unproductive' comment; Fuck you! Why? Because you all seem to be hypocrites. Hell I'm probably a hypocrite too.

Capitalists:

Shut up! God knows that you love hearing about all the awsome explosions that your airplanes are causing to rain down from the sky over Iraq. If you heard that the entire Iraqi army was destroyed you would be laughing your head off. Never before have I met people who claim that the attacks on 9/11 were cowardly; at the same time believing that launching cruise missiles from thousands of miles away and carpet bombing cities is an honerable way to 'liberate' a country.

Leftists:

Shut up! All of your. Yes, you are right; he shouldn't go around cheering about the deaths of allied soldiers, but you're bing the biggest hypocrites in the world! Months ago you were taking about how you couldn't wait for some awsome revolution so that you can shoot fascists, and round up all the capitalists, and kill the president. You advocate the annihialation of the right-wing and all fascists, at the same time caliming to be peaceful libertarians.

Like I said; no one is going to like anything I said, but I am currently under the impression that you are all a bunch of ranting hypocritical idiots! Both sides claim that they stand for justice, peace, and equality while at the same time advocating the utter liquidation of your opponents. Be whatever you want, but have the decency to stay true to it.

Pete

22nd March 2003, 02:34

You may smile as they die. But do not dance on their graves. The stone at their head will be a somber lessons for others. Do not subtract from that by spitting on the fresh mound in the precense of those who could learn that the man died in vain.

Pete

22nd March 2003, 02:37

Xvall

22nd March 2003, 02:50

We are all hypocrite. I am sure of this because if we were not, we would have most definitely accomplished something by now. We have not.

Pete

22nd March 2003, 03:00

Some are just to a different extent, of course. By admitting it, that somewhats lessins it. (spelling error)

antieverything

22nd March 2003, 04:03

I never thought that I would lose respect for so many of you so fast.

Have you no sympathy for the soldier who has been used by his government? War is always a rich man's war and a poor man's fight...you don't get the poor man to fight by saying, "hey, join us and murder children to increase the profits of my favorite corporations!" These soldiers believe that they are protecting America from terrorism, defending freedom, and liberating the people of Iraq. I have friends in the military. They joined because they were poor and hispanic. They had no prospects for a meaningful life--only a life of menial labor and scraping the bottom of the economic barrel. They joined the Army and Marines because they were promised a chance for an education and to learn job skills so that they could get out of military service and give their families the middle class life that our society holds to be the threshold of worth and humanity.

Some of them don't want to be there right now...some of them do. Those that do are there because they want to "cap some rag-heads". Who taught them to hate these people? Is racism not spread by capitalism?

Some of you are hardcore Marxist-Leninists yet you still hold the individual troops to be responsible. Did Lenin denounce the Russian troops? No, he denounced the capitalists who used the troops to make them money. Soldiers are just another group of workers who are exploited by their masters...and it our job to mourn them and direct our rage against the system that caused their deaths--and the deaths of those they killed.

I am ashamed to be associated with the same movement as you...as socialists we are supposed to throw our lot in with the poor and oppressed...the people that are exploited and used by the capitalist. We are not supposed to differentiate worker from worker. We are a single, unified group--the proletariat--being led to hate and kill one another.

I support our troops but not the war...I support our troops because they are no different than the victims of US Imperialism in South and Central America; in Laos, Cambodia, and Vietnam; in Iraq, Africa, and Oceana. Every civilian and soldier who dies in this war will be a victim of the American government...each one equally innocent. Each one equally exploited. And most importantly, each one dead.

I'll finish off with a big FUCK YOU.

GuErRrIlLa

22nd March 2003, 04:24

But, we half to relize that the US soldiers are only pawns in a chess game. Dont forget who is controlling the pawns.

redstar2000

22nd March 2003, 04:55

"I support our troops..." -- Antieverything

In what sense are they "our troops"? They're not mine. They're not fighting for anything that I'm in favor of.

And what is the meaning of "support"? Does that mean you simply feel sorry for the stupid bastards? Or that you hope they will successfully murder lots of Iraqis while suffering nothing worse than aggravated sunburns themselves?

When people perform criminal acts for foolish reasons, that is regrettable...but it does not change the nature of the act, or excuse it.

I'm sure that every "ordinary" German who directly participated in the holocaust (there were many of them) sincerely believed that he was doing the "right thing". So what?

Every scab feels he is driven by economic necessity to join the boss against his fellow workers. So what?

Do you understand what I'm saying? Your personal motives, whatever they might be, do not excuse criminal acts. Under the best of circumstances, they might mitigate such acts...but these are not even remotely "the best of circumstances".

Anyone with half a brain knows what this war is about and who will benefit...even the capitalist media have boasted of the oil industry's glee at getting their hands on Iraq's oil. I'd be surprised if anyone over the age of 10 is not aware of the ties between George W. Bush & Co. and the oil and energy industry.

This is not 1914...where ignorance could be excused. 50% of the U.S. population is on the internet. I personally know a-political people who understand this war...and not because of anything I've told them.

So, AE, please spare me the sad tales of poor ignorant fools who didn't know what they were getting into...they knew and did it anyway.

History will not absolve them. Why should we?

:cool:

Dhul Fiqar

22nd March 2003, 06:54

Quote: from AK47 on 12:33 am on Mar. 22, 2003

Quote: from Dhul Fiqar on 3:29 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
Oh, and btw, a lot of people here seem to support violent rebellion but go nuts over every human that dies.

These soldiers are typical of the kind of people we would have to kill in the opening stages of a real revolution. As distasteful as death is, it's impossible to say all human death is something to be against unless you are willing to give up on revolution.

--- G.

Death to STUPIDITY

Death to those who cannot put together sentances, and thus use annoying font sizes and childish personal attacks to get their so-called "point" across.

--- G.

Dhul Fiqar

22nd March 2003, 06:57

redstar2000: It feels good to have you on the same side as me for a change, you write convincingly and the bold thing doesn't even bother me any more for some reason :biggrin:

AK47: CNN took back their claims of SCUD launches, they just say it was unknown missiles. They travelled only a couple of hundred miles out of Iraq, nothing illegal about that under any convention or agreement.

--- G.

synthesis

22nd March 2003, 07:09

I don't "support" them, either. I wish the war would just end with NO more casualties.

Neither the Iraqi soldiers nor the American soldiers are fighting for a just cause anyway one slices it; too many Iraqi people will die whether it is Saddam Hussein cracking the whip or yet another American puppet.

In my opinion, both sets of soldiers are simply misguided pawns, believing that they are doing their best for the civilians of Iraq. I don't share these beliefs, and therefore I don't "support" them, but when someone celebrates their deaths, that just fucking pisses me off.

Invader Zim

22nd March 2003, 08:40

Quote: from antieverything on 4:03 am on Mar. 22, 2003
I never thought that I would lose respect for so many of you so fast.

Have you no sympathy for the soldier who has been used by his government? War is always a rich man's war and a poor man's fight...you don't get the poor man to fight by saying, "hey, join us and murder children to increase the profits of my favorite corporations!" These soldiers believe that they are protecting America from terrorism, defending freedom, and liberating the people of Iraq. I have friends in the military. They joined because they were poor and hispanic. They had no prospects for a meaningful life--only a life of menial labor and scraping the bottom of the economic barrel. They joined the Army and Marines because they were promised a chance for an education and to learn job skills so that they could get out of military service and give their families the middle class life that our society holds to be the threshold of worth and humanity.

Some of them don't want to be there right now...some of them do. Those that do are there because they want to "cap some rag-heads". Who taught them to hate these people? Is racism not spread by capitalism?

Some of you are hardcore Marxist-Leninists yet you still hold the individual troops to be responsible. Did Lenin denounce the Russian troops? No, he denounced the capitalists who used the troops to make them money. Soldiers are just another group of workers who are exploited by their masters...and it our job to mourn them and direct our rage against the system that caused their deaths--and the deaths of those they killed.

I am ashamed to be associated with the same movement as you...as socialists we are supposed to throw our lot in with the poor and oppressed...the people that are exploited and used by the capitalist. We are not supposed to differentiate worker from worker. We are a single, unified group--the proletariat--being led to hate and kill one another.

I support our troops but not the war...I support our troops because they are no different than the victims of US Imperialism in South and Central America; in Laos, Cambodia, and Vietnam; in Iraq, Africa, and Oceana. Every civilian and soldier who dies in this war will be a victim of the American government...each one equally innocent. Each one equally exploited. And most importantly, each one dead.

I'll finish off with a big FUCK YOU.

I second that right down to the ground.

AK47: CNN took back their claims of SCUD launches, they just say it was unknown missiles. They travelled only a couple of hundred miles out of Iraq, nothing illegal about that under any convention or agreement.

Your probably right i read that in a crappy tabloid news paper.

Capitalist Imperial

22nd March 2003, 10:00

Capitalist Imperial

22nd March 2003, 10:04

Quote: from LOIC on 5:40 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
"Those American and British "soldiers" were not conscripted, they were professional murderers. They signed up to join some of the most disgusting military operations on the face of the earth.

They are hired killers, who have made a career out of killing.

Why on earth is anyone shedding a tear for these worthless fucks? I spit on their graves... "

I agree totally with that.
These soldiers are invading a country and killing its people just because they obey orders of a fucked up government.
They are nothing else but pigs.
15 american/british soldiers died? Good riddance!

citizens of france have no right to even talk about these matters, your nation is one of pussies and non-action

I shit on the eifel tower

Capitalist Imperial

22nd March 2003, 10:06

Quote: from Zombie on 8:42 pm on Mar. 21, 2003

Of a poor country been attacked by a huge country like is the USA.
How unfair!
well i think that, for some time now, the USA is champion at attacking third world countries!
as for those soldiers, i won't mourn them, but i won't hail (if that's the word) their deaths either. i mourn the (iraqi) civilian who died,or is gonna die, completely shameful and defenseless...

double standard galore

Capitalist Imperial

22nd March 2003, 10:10

Quote: from Just Joe on 5:08 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
scuds are not WMD.

you're really not educated on resolution 1441 are you? judging by most of your posts, i would submit that you are not educated at all

actually, you're pretty ignorant

Capitalist Imperial

22nd March 2003, 10:13

Quote: from Guardia Bolivariano on 10:33 pm on Mar. 21, 2003

Quote: from Blibblob on 8:56 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
Civilian deaths are at a minimmum. The war is actually going as a uh, "nice" war.

Is thar sarcasm or just a sick joke?
Nothing could be more far away from the truth taking in mind that this is one of the biggest air campaigns in history.And has the deadliest weapons.

(Edited by Guardia Bolivariano at 10:35 pm on Mar. 21, 2003)

Do you have #'s or are you just talking out of your ass?

The iraqi information minister himself said that about 250 civilians have been injured in these air raids

not killed, injured

collateral damage is being kept to a minimum, even the iraqi opposition is confirming this

so fuck off until you have something solid

Capitalist Imperial

22nd March 2003, 10:16

Quote: from lostsoul on 1:12 am on Mar. 22, 2003
the next message is kind of long..

Someone called me a disgrace to the left, if the left acts like cowards and supports murders, then fuck the left. Any group that supports hired killers, is as fucked up as the killers themselves. These soldiers are not people we should support or even feel pity when they die, they have a CHOICE. They CHOOSE to go kill, no one forced them. Again any group that thinks that these invaders don’t need to be punished(by death or other means) can go fuck themselves. If any groups thinks this is cool then fuck them and everything they stand for. Before we are right or left, we are human beings, and the murder of innocents by barbarian is unacceptable on either side. This is not about politics is about common sense. Its easy to praise war when your team is not losing. If you want to delete this or ban me, go ahead.

I don’t hate anyone because of stuff they can’t control. I visit America often, I like many Americans, but I choose to wish death upon soldiers because of their actions(or lack of action..in this case, choosing not to stand up for the Iraqi civilians).

The world has many jobs, you can do other things then go to other countries and kill in the name of your country. So don’t fucken use the excuse that these soliders have no choice.

Some crackhead here, tried to say Iraqi soliders are just as evil..i think there is a Huge difference between defending your country from invaders and being an actual invader.

Some guy here said the people who died could have been field doctors or something. The point is they weren’t. I strongly believe in fate, and I think if you do bad or try to bad you will get punished. Using you logic I could say, how do you know the targets America is hitting is not full of priest.

If saddam presents a danger then he should be removed, who gave America the right to start a war to remove one person. Is he so dangerous that he is worth the death of thousand others? If so, why can’t America prove it to the UN?

If America can have weopens then any other country can have weopens to defend itself. America is the only country that has shown that it cannot handle nuclear weopens, I don’t think any other country has used it against civilians in history.

Although I dislike America’s presence in other people’s affairs I would like to thank everyone who wrote in this post, even those who oppose me.

so you must have cheered che's death, right? he was a murderer

Capitalist Imperial

22nd March 2003, 10:20

Quote: from lostsoul on 2:27 am on Mar. 22, 2003

Quote: from CrazyPete on 2:19 am on Mar. 22, 2003
Celebrating any death is sickening.

murdering civilians who didn't choose to go to war and can't afford or are not allowed to run away, is more sickening.

the second these soliders picked up their weopens and went to war, they lost their status "innocent".

can you show me what civilians have been murdered? perhaps you should look at the iraqi military, who are purposely digging in next to schools, mosques and hospitals, because they know that the USA is actually one of the only counties that gives a fuck and tries to minimize collateral damage, as opposed to hussein, who would just as well kill his own people

the iraqi military is using schools, hospitals, and churches as human shields, you fucking dick

have you thought of that? because that is what they are doing

why don't you try and think for once in your life

Invader Zim

22nd March 2003, 10:22

Quote: from Drake Dracoli on 2:34 am on Mar. 22, 2003
You are all idiots. ALL OF YOU. I know you're going to say that I shouldn't complain, and make some huge retaliation to my post saying that I should be 'rude' and make 'obscene and unproductive' comment; Fuck you! Why? Because you all seem to be hypocrites. Hell I'm probably a hypocrite too.

Capitalists:

Shut up! God knows that you love hearing about all the awsome explosions that your airplanes are causing to rain down from the sky over Iraq. If you heard that the entire Iraqi army was destroyed you would be laughing your head off. Never before have I met people who claim that the attacks on 9/11 were cowardly; at the same time believing that launching cruise missiles from thousands of miles away and carpet bombing cities is an honerable way to 'liberate' a country.

Leftists:

Shut up! All of your. Yes, you are right; he shouldn't go around cheering about the deaths of allied soldiers, but you're bing the biggest hypocrites in the world! Months ago you were taking about how you couldn't wait for some awsome revolution so that you can shoot fascists, and round up all the capitalists, and kill the president. You advocate the annihialation of the right-wing and all fascists, at the same time caliming to be peaceful libertarians.

Like I said; no one is going to like anything I said, but I am currently under the impression that you are all a bunch of ranting hypocritical idiots! Both sides claim that they stand for justice, peace, and equality while at the same time advocating the utter liquidation of your opponents. Be whatever you want, but have the decency to stay true to it.

I have always been anti revolution thanks.

Dhul Fiqar

22nd March 2003, 11:38

LOL, interesting choice of avatar

Just Joe

22nd March 2003, 12:05

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 10:10 am on Mar. 22, 2003

Quote: from Just Joe on 5:08 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
scuds are not WMD.

you're really not educated on resolution 1441 are you?

the US gripe has been WMD. if we knew Iraq had no WMD, and the invasion was only to remove scud missiles, the operation would have had even less support than it does now.

judging by most of your posts, i would submit that you are not educated at all

actually, you're pretty ignorant

coming from a troll whos sole contributions seem to ranting on about the French even though,

A) you've probobly never been to France
B) you've probobly never met a French person

and when hes not doing that, revelling in the joys of individualism and capitalism at the same time as taking collective credit for just about every US military victory in history.

whats the responce gonna be? fuck you you fucking commie puke!!!!11!1!!!!

i'd get out more if i were you.

Anonymous

22nd March 2003, 12:36

drake: one thing is class war.. wich i suport and every leftist should do the same..
otehr is the countrys/diferent peoples war, wich i strongly disagree and want to prevent...

a class war MUST be fought, only with the anhilation, and i am not speaking of a phisical extermination but a ideological extermination, of the bourgeois you can build socialism, yet a war betwen countrys and peoples is diferent and stupid...
like a comrade of mine uses to say, war betwen classes, peace betwen the peoples..
if taht is being hypocrit then socialism and communist IS hypocritic...

Invader Zim

22nd March 2003, 12:36

Quote: from Just Joe on 12:05 pm on Mar. 22, 2003

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 10:10 am on Mar. 22, 2003

Quote: from Just Joe on 5:08 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
scuds are not WMD.

you're really not educated on resolution 1441 are you?

the US gripe has been WMD. if we knew Iraq had no WMD, and the invasion was only to remove scud missiles, the operation would have had even less support than it does now.

judging by most of your posts, i would submit that you are not educated at all

actually, you're pretty ignorant

coming from a troll whos sole contributions seem to ranting on about the French even though,

A) you've probobly never been to France
B) you've probobly never met a French person

and when hes not doing that, revelling in the joys of individualism and capitalism at the same time as taking collective credit for just about every US military victory in history.

whats the responce gonna be? fuck you you fucking commie puke!!!!11!1!!!!

i'd get out more if i were you.

Yes CI whats with the Commi Puke thing i can think of much better insults. Im rather fond of joes. Capitalist Muppet how does that sound.

lostsoul

22nd March 2003, 14:57

according to this: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/gu...ndix/death.html (http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/gulf/appendix/death.html)

"2,300 civilians died during the air campaign" This was in the 1991 gulf war. This war is alot bigger, and if you turn on the news you can see "accidents" are still happening(like plane crashing, missle hitting iran), so i have no reason to believe that America's state of the art weopens will still not kill innocents. In my opinion thats 2,300 reasons to wish death upon any invading troops. I am sure this time the death toll will be higher, because this time i think the fighting will focus more on cities.

Some idiot tried to link Che to these people. Look at the people he murdered..i never read anything about him shooting civilians, i never heard anything about him bombing people's homes.

your kind of right, maybe these soliders were "good", and they didn't want to be in the war. But the fact of the matter is that they are in the war. Since i am against this war, it puts them in direct conflict with my ideals, therfore i wish them to fail. And if to fail, they must die, then so be it, it'll only cheer me up. Individually death of anything from people to animals is bad, but looking at it politically and militarly it is good for these soliders(and hopefully many more) to die.

Maybe i am just saying this since all my hero's have either been killed by America or attempted to be killed by America(or one of its dogs). Anyone who considers themselfs "left" and feels sorry for these people, there is something wrong with them. Think of it this way, if you ever get a chance to implement you "left" ideals, who do you think is going to come after you? If someone tried to kill or destory your cause, who do you think it will? historical speaking, America has the highest rate for this.

So if you so called "lefts" are serious about the stuff you say on this board, i suggest before you do anything, you figure out who your "real" friends are and who you "real" enemies are.

p.s. Ak47 go fuck yourself, you little kid...If you want to write a message, make sure it makes sense first, not some stupid childest 4 word post.

Xvall

22nd March 2003, 15:05

drake: one thing is class war.. wich i suport and every leftist should do the same..
otehr is the countrys/diferent peoples war, wich i strongly disagree and want to prevent..

I'm not even talking about revolution. If you support it, then that's fine. I'm talking about how people hypocritically say that cheering at the death of soldiers is awful, while at the same ranting on about the great revolution that will be the death of the aristocracy.

Anti-Everything. I understand what you are saying entirely, but I have only one question.

During the Second World War; the German Soldiers and the SS; were they bad? Or were they simply being used the the German government. Would you support them, but not their world war?

Invader Zim

22nd March 2003, 15:10

Quote: from lostsoul on 2:57 pm on Mar. 22, 2003

p.s. Ak47 go fuck yourself, you little kid...If you want to write a message, make sure it makes sense first, not some stupid childest 4 word post.

You are even more stupid than i thought because you cant even count. The post you are refering to was only 3 words long. not 4 retard.

While we are on the subject of childishness the celebration of the death of 16 people is childishness bordering on insanity.

I think you should have a very serious word with a Shrink, if you feal the need to celebrate death.

lostsoul

22nd March 2003, 15:14

Quote: from AK47 on 3:10 pm on Mar. 22, 2003

Quote: from lostsoul on 2:57 pm on Mar. 22, 2003

p.s. Ak47 go fuck yourself, you little kid...If you want to write a message, make sure it makes sense first, not some stupid childest 4 word post.

You are even more stupid than i thought because you cant even count. The post you are refering to was only 3 words long. not 4 retard.

While we are on the subject of childishness the celebration of the death of 16 people is childishness bordering on insanity.

I think you should have a very serious word with a Shrink, if you feal the need to celebrate death.

hahaha i didn't even look and count your message. I just guessed and thought with your education you'd use 4 words..but i guess your not up the that level yet. One day you will..one day..just stick with school.

I never said i was "celebrating" death. I only said it made me happy..When your enemies get weaker, who wouln't be happy?

Invader Zim

22nd March 2003, 15:28

Quote: from lostsoul on 3:14 pm on Mar. 22, 2003
[quote]

I never said i was "celebrating" death. I only said it made me happy..When your enemies get weaker, who wouln't be happy?

Saying Yey to the death of 16 people is celebrating. I suggest you break open the champain somewhere else because quite frankly no rational person would even acknolage you as being worthy of senceble debate. But maybe im wrong perhaps i am Thick like you say.

HOWEVER Thick i may be but at least i can count.

PS not even Marxist Lenonists would sink as low as to post a celebration of death.

Are you sure you would not prefer a Nazi forum.

antieverything

22nd March 2003, 16:30

Hey, nice job in ignoring the entirety of my post to only point out one thing...yeah, I fucking support the American troops because I want them to come home alive. I support all victims of imperialism. I would have supported all victims of WWII era German Imperialism including the German soldiers who were misguided by their capitalist masters into perpetrating one of the worst attrocities of the 20th century.

When my friends joined the army did they know that the US military has a long and bloody history of indiscriminate murder of civilians? Who would have told them? The history books? Their teachers? The news? No, they believed that they were joining a force that always did good things and made the world safe for everyone.

War is different than other crimes. While all crime has roots in capitalism only war is created and held to be a positive thing by the capitalist system. War crimes are perpetrated by people trained to commit horrible acts of violence--people who have been brainwashed to think they are doing the right thing. War crimes are not independant acts. They are ordered by the leaders of government and it is they who are responsible.

Xvall

22nd March 2003, 17:26

Just checking. I never said I had a problem with it.

Mazdak

22nd March 2003, 18:29

AK47 says" i have always been anti revolution."

You must be the most stupid person in the world. You are anti violence yet your name is AK47. Thats a type of gun you know. Or maybe you dont because you are so goddamned ignorant.

Iraq has the right to destroy all the troops that step on its land. It is standing up against imperialism and its a shame they dont catch and destroy a huge portion of the US army. The more casualties for the US the better.

Invader Zim

22nd March 2003, 18:34

Quote: from Mazdak on 6:29 pm on Mar. 22, 2003
AK47 says" i have always been anti revolution."

You must be the most stupid person in the world. You are anti violence yet your name is AK47. Thats a type of gun you know. Or maybe you dont because you are so goddamned ignorant.

Iraq has the right to destroy all the troops that step on its land. It is standing up against imperialism and its a shame they dont catch and destroy a huge portion of the US army. The more casualties for the US the better.

So now you support a facist dictator. What are the Marxist Lenonists coming to...

Mazdak

22nd March 2003, 18:38

Hey AK47 GUESS WHAT? NOT ALL NON LEFTISTS ARE FASCISTS. ITS LIKE CALLING ME ANTI SEMITIC FOR HATING ISRAEL AND ZIONISM. Saddam is standing against imperialism. He is a hero and a martyr right now, regardless of his past. He is no Hitler, but he is no Ghandi, so dont portray him as such. The US is a warmonger. An Iraqi politician called the US the "United States of Al Capone." He is damned right.

And as to the kurds in the north of the country, they didnt like saddam? Well lets see how much they enjoy Turkish domination.

Invader Zim

22nd March 2003, 18:53

Quote: from Mazdak on 6:38 pm on Mar. 22, 2003

He is no Hitler,

Umm yes he is...

Its estimated that he's killed over 1,000,000 people since the begining of his dictatorship. Thats Genocide. He also is extream right wing, setting up a feudal system, with ruler living at the top and the peasants at the bottom.

You support him and you claim to be leftist. I think you should rethink your position, because currently its not exactly leftist.

GuErRrIlLa

22nd March 2003, 18:59

Hey look AK, the U.S. gave Saddam money and power.The U.S. thought by controlling Saddam every thing will be all right, wrong,becuase he started to think on his own and not by the U.S. governments strings. So the U.S. is more to blame becuase we that put a dictator in power!

Invader Zim

22nd March 2003, 19:02

Quote: from GuErRrIlLa on 6:59 pm on Mar. 22, 2003
Hey look AK, the U.S. gave Saddam money and power.The U.S. thought by controlling Saddam every thing will be all right, wrong,becuase he started to think on his own and not by the U.S. governments strings. So the U.S. is more to blame becuase we that put a dictator in power!

Thats completely true but now that hes there hes still a tin pot dictator who goes round executing the Kurdish population. If thats not facism then what the fuck is?

GuErRrIlLa

22nd March 2003, 19:06

You have a point there. But then why should innocen people in Iraq suffer becuase of Saddam and U.S. ignorence?

Invader Zim

22nd March 2003, 19:10

Quote: from GuErRrIlLa on 7:06 pm on Mar. 22, 2003
You have a point there. But then why should innocen people in Iraq suffer becuase of Saddam and U.S. ignorence?

They should not have to but the case is they are and there is fuck all we can do about it. All ce can do is hope the USA kicks saddam out quickly before he/and they massacre the locals.

GuErRrIlLa

22nd March 2003, 19:13

But the problem now is that the U.S. will continue to bomb, and the soliders will go in and find nothing. Most likley Sadam is not even in Bagdad any more.

Just Joe

22nd March 2003, 19:14

d'you even know what Fascism is, AK-47?

and link me to the proof that Saddam has killed over 1,000,000 people if you could.

antieverything

22nd March 2003, 19:54

Nobody in their right mind can claim that Saddam doesn't have to be removed from power.

Of course, the gassing of the Kurds and other such Iraqi attrocities aren't really all that bad compared to the US bombing of Laos and Cambodia during 'Nam. I actually just realized that and it is actually bringing tears to my eyes to think about what my country has done in the past...

Shit man, I fucking hate this world.

Xvall

22nd March 2003, 22:38

I hate it a lot too.

FUN FACT:

At some points in the Vietnam War; the United States damaged the country so much that they were unable to feed a significant portion of their population.

Mazdak

23rd March 2003, 01:40

Once again we hear this garbage about saddam gassing "his own" people. Why is it that you still havent realized that the kurds and the CIA both admitted there was no "mass genocide." Saddam is no leftist, but a hero to all anti imperialists, regardless of how you look at it. Supporting the US means betraying the cause.

Hampton

23rd March 2003, 02:05

http://truthout.org/docs_02/020303C.htm

Capitalist Imperial

23rd March 2003, 07:52

Quote: from Mazdak on 6:38 pm on Mar. 22, 2003
Hey AK47 GUESS WHAT? NOT ALL NON LEFTISTS ARE FASCISTS. ITS LIKE CALLING ME ANTI SEMITIC FOR HATING ISRAEL AND ZIONISM. Saddam is standing against imperialism. He is a hero and a martyr right now, regardless of his past. He is no Hitler, but he is no Ghandi, so dont portray him as such. The US is a warmonger. An Iraqi politician called the US the "United States of Al Capone." He is damned right.

And as to the kurds in the north of the country, they didnt like saddam? Well lets see how much they enjoy Turkish domination.

Mazdak, you are marginally better than the liberal lefists here, because at least you understand true communism, but sometimes you are just plain funny

"Saddam is standing against imperialism."

Actually, I would bet that he is not standing at all right now.

"He is a hero and a martyr right now"

we have to save this one for the archives

Capitalist Imperial

23rd March 2003, 07:57

Quote: from Mazdak on 1:40 am on Mar. 23, 2003
Once again we hear this garbage about saddam gassing "his own" people. Why is it that you still havent realized that the kurds and the CIA both admitted there was no "mass genocide." Saddam is no leftist, but a hero to all anti imperialists, regardless of how you look at it. Supporting the US means betraying the cause.

Yeah, and the holocaust never happened, right Mazdak?

Saddam is no leftist, but a hero to all anti imperialists, regardless of how you look at it. Supporting the US means betraying the cause.

LOL, this is great comedy. You are merely a sad stalinist relic, a member of a faction long ago defeated by benevolent american capitalism

Invader Zim

23rd March 2003, 10:16

Quote: from Just Joe on 7:14 pm on Mar. 22, 2003
d'you even know what Fascism is, AK-47?

and link me to the proof that Saddam has killed over 1,000,000 people if you could.

Fascism
A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.
A political philosophy or movement based on or advocating such a system of government.
Oppressive, dictatorial control.

I think thats sums up saddam perfectly.

and link me to the proof that Saddam has killed over 1,000,000 people if you could.

It is not particualrly hard, only a few seconds on a search engine i had found loads of sites.

Of all the sites available these were really good

source (http://www.sciri.btinternet.co.uk/English/Saddam_Crimes/saddam_crimes.html)

ohh and visit the arab marshes, chemical weapons and mash drainage links at the top left of the page.

source2 (http://www.mediamonitors.net/mosaddeq1.html)

source3(not really on topic but it adds flavour so i added it anyway)

[url=http://usinfo.state.gov/regional/nea/iraq/crimes/]wow another source (http://bulletin.ninemsn.com.au/bulletin/EdDesk.nsf/All/A915CE3B5DB4A5A1CA256CC9000A96FB?OpenDocument)

they just go on and on more and more sources (http://www.gendercide.org/case_anfal.html)

another source im affraid (http://www.efreedomnews.com/News%20Archive/Iraq/Saddam%20War%20Crimes.htm)

yet another source (http://www.fas.org/news/iraq/2000/09/iraq-000918.htm)

sorry more (this one is amnesty international so click on one of their links) (http://web.amnesty.org/ai.nsf/countries/iraq?OpenView&Start=1&Count=30&Expandall)

sorry still more (http://web.amnesty.org/ai.nsf/Index/MDE140102001?OpenDocument&of=COUNTRIESIRAQ)

Im sure thats enough sources for you joe. However if your not satisfied then i can easily find more...

To mazdak: you think that they did not fire chemical weapons etc at his own people then argue with the pictures.

http://www.sciri.btinternet.co.uk/English/Saddam_Crimes/Chemical_Weapons/chemhbja.jpg

http://www.sciri.btinternet.co.uk/English/Saddam_Crimes/Chemical_Weapons/chmhbja2.jpg

Just Joe

23rd March 2003, 12:27

Fascism
A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.
A political philosophy or movement based on or advocating such a system of government.
Oppressive, dictatorial control.

what dictionary did you get that out of? this really shows your true intelligence using this as a description.

not that it even absolves you of previous idiocy. you tried to say that because Saddam went round killing people, it made him a Fascist. its not a question of if Saddam is Fascist, but you don't know what Fascism is.

and i don't think you get what i mean when i say i want evidence. i want acknowledged fact, not opinion. the sources you gave don't show Saddam murdering 1,000,000 people.

Invader Zim

23rd March 2003, 13:04

Quote: from Just Joe on 12:27 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
Fascism
A system of government marked by centralization of authority under a dictator, stringent socioeconomic controls, suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship, and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism.
A political philosophy or movement based on or advocating such a system of government.
Oppressive, dictatorial control.

what dictionary did you get that out of? this really shows your true intelligence using this as a description.

not that it even absolves you of previous idiocy. you tried to say that because Saddam went round killing people, it made him a Fascist. its not a question of if Saddam is Fascist, but you don't know what Fascism is.

and i don't think you get what i mean when i say i want evidence. i want acknowledged fact, not opinion. the sources you gave don't show Saddam murdering 1,000,000 people.

No it shows your stupidity at the lack of acceptance. You asked me if i knew what facism was and i told you what it is. If you cannot accept that saddam hussain perfectly fits that description then you have sub standard intelegance. FACT.

And the reason why i say saddam is a facist is because: -

1. he set up a facist style feudal system. (stringent socioeconomic controls)(Oppressive, dictatorial control.)
2. he tried to ethnically clence the kurds and marsh people. (and typically a policy of belligerent nationalism and racism. )(Oppressive, dictatorial control.)
3. He kills the press which do not print pro regime artical, executes political opposition. (suppression of the opposition through terror and censorship.)(Oppressive, dictatorial control.)

I think that proves he runs a facist government.

and i don't think you get what i mean when i say i want evidence. i want acknowledged fact, not opinion. the sources you gave don't show Saddam murdering 1,000,000 people.

I used amnesty internationan as a source. They back up all their data, many of the sources use eye witnesses. Others also use government statistics. Government War Crime investigations.

To say that is not evidence then you lack the basic intelegence to determin the definition of evidence.

Any way this is from the US department of state, who im sure can back up there data: -

-------------------

President of Iraq since 1979 (Vice President from 1968-79). Dictator who stops at nothing to preserve personal power and regime survival. After the 1968 Ba'athist Coup, began his career as Chief of Iraq's security services.

Executed opponents and suspected potential rivals, including scores of high-level government officials and thousands of political prisoners.

Since the 1970s, escalated and made routine the systematic torture and execution of political prisoners.

Ordered the use of chemical weapons against Iranian forces in the 1980-88 Iran-Iraq war, and against Iraq's Kurdish population in 1988. The 1980-88 Iran-Iraq war left 150,000 to 340,000 Iraqis and 450,000 to 730,000 Iranians dead.

Ordered the invasion and destruction of Kuwait in 1990-91 with 1,000 Kuwaitis killed.

Directed the 1991 bloody suppression of Kurdish and Shi'a insurgencies in northern and southern Iraq with at least 30,000 to 60,000 killed.

Ordered the destruction of southern marshes to extinguish the Shi'a insurgency.

-------------

And if you cant count the total deaths according to that web page = 2,921,000 people dead. But shit your right Saddam is no facist.

:cool:

Just Joe

23rd March 2003, 13:11

Thats completely true but now that hes there hes still a tin pot dictator who goes round executing the Kurdish population. If thats not facism then what the fuck is?

thats what your quote was. what possible connection is there between killing Kurds and a political ideology?

that quote there showed me you didn't know what Fascism was. the description you gave me showed me how way off the mark you are. while i don't have the time to give you a run down on Fascism, i can tell you many Fascists would laugh at what that dictionary said.

Saddam is actually quite close to Fascism, yes. but his treatment of the Kurds is not related to his ideology. Fascism has nothing to do with racism.

and i'd question the US state departments version of things as much as i'd question the pravda version of things.

Invader Zim

23rd March 2003, 13:53

Quote: from Just Joe on 1:11 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
Thats completely true but now that hes there hes still a tin pot dictator who goes round executing the Kurdish population. If thats not facism then what the fuck is?

thats what your quote was. what possible connection is there between killing Kurds and a political ideology?

that quote there showed me you didn't know what Fascism was. the description you gave me showed me how way off the mark you are. while i don't have the time to give you a run down on Fascism, i can tell you many Fascists would laugh at what that dictionary said.

Saddam is actually quite close to Fascism, yes. but his treatment of the Kurds is not related to his ideology. Fascism has nothing to do with racism.

and i'd question the US state departments version of things as much as i'd question the pravda version of things.

No i think it is you who does not understand facism. I will explain in my own words so you cannot bullshit me about dictionary.

Facism is an extream rightwing authoritarian idiology, they use violance and press censorship to achive power. They are popular in times of economic depression/hardship. Believe in extream capitalism where the state is far more important than the individual. An almost monarchist feudal system is created. Opposition are systamatically removed, using any means necessary. Racism is used in their idiology to gain support from the elements of the population, who feal undermined by a certain set of people. Racism is a typical part of a facist socioty, and idiology. A european/north american facist believes that being a "wasp" (white anglosaxon protestant) is a highest level of the master race. In germany this was the case however being Protestant was not necesary.

If you were to put that into a GCSE history paper you would be guarantead an A* for that question.

So saddam killing Kurds is the example of his racism which is interlinked closely with facism.

Saddam is actually quite close to Fascism, yes. but his treatment of the Kurds is not related to his ideology. Fascism has nothing to do with racism.

I would say that you are wrong facim is inseperably linked with racism.

Visit this site. The page is moskitto's he has links on his site to Nazi webpages. Have a look at them and out of all of them not one nonracist one.

http://www.fightcapitalism.net/users/moski...wcotc/index.htm (http://www.fightcapitalism.net/users/moskitto/anti-wcotc/index.htm)

and i'd question the US state departments version of things as much as i'd question the pravda version of things.

True but a doubt that the amnisty international site lies...

(Edited by AK47 at 1:56 pm on Mar. 23, 2003)

Non-Sectarian Bastard!

23rd March 2003, 13:57

Quote: from Dark Capitalist on 5:45 am on Mar. 21, 2003

Quote: from lostsoul on 10:31 am on Mar. 21, 2003
I hope Amercian and british solider body count keeps growing!!!!!!

Extreme anti-americanism coupled with unfathomable stupidity. So typically leftist.

anyone who goes into a country with the intent to murder deserves to be killed.

Our intent, as if we haven't already explained this a million times to you thick headed pinkos, is to liberate L-I-B-E-R-A-T-E the Iraqi people from an oppressive regime and uphold the security of the free world.

Is this the same way like you guys L-I-B-E-R-A-T-E-D half of South America?

With great leaders like Pinochet?

Or is this supporting great freedom rebels like Osama in the 70's?

I just wonder, no offence towards ur believes tough.

Non-Sectarian Bastard!

23rd March 2003, 14:01

BTW: The US's fantastic anti-air defense system: The Patriot, just shot down a Brittish fighter plane. Both pilots are missing.

And a Sergeant of the 101th Airborn division just killed one of his own mates and wounded 12, like I said all of them are nuts

Hahah, the Coalitian bodycounter is razing.

redstar2000

23rd March 2003, 14:04

AK47, I don't want to put words in your mouth.

The "tone" of your posts to this thread suggest to me that you support this war.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

:cool:

Invader Zim

23rd March 2003, 14:38

Quote: from redstar2000 on 2:04 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
AK47, I don't want to put words in your mouth.

The "tone" of your posts to this thread suggest to me that you support this war.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

:cool:

No you are not wrong... But before you judge me let me explain why.

As i am sure you are aware Saddam is an evil dictator. He has a commited genocide killed of over a million people. (2,921,000 if that source is anything to go by) And in my opinion we as a race (not as in black or white, the entire human race) should not allow such a person to continue his butchering of the people of Iraq. I hate the Idea of war but i dislike the alternative even more.

I am willing to debate this with you if you like?

Saint-Just

23rd March 2003, 15:13

Quote: from AK47 on 2:38 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from redstar2000 on 2:04 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
AK47, I don't want to put words in your mouth.

The "tone" of your posts to this thread suggest to me that you support this war.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

:cool:

No you are not wrong... But before you judge me let me explain why.

As i am sure you are aware Saddam is an evil dictator. He has a commited genocide killed of over a million people. (2,921,000 if that source is anything to go by) And in my opinion we as a race (not as in black or white, the entire human race) should not allow such a person to continue his butchering of the people of Iraq. I hate the Idea of war but i dislike the alternative even more.

I am willing to debate this with you if you like?

There are many countries that are aware of the history of Iraq, yet they still do not support the war. This is because they recognise that initiating wars like this is against global conventions that keep peace and avoid suffering. The U.S. has killed 1 million Iraqis since the beginning of its bombing camapign over 10 years ago. It is debatable if Saddam Hussein has killed this many.

革命者

23rd March 2003, 15:13

Quote: from lostsoul on 2:37 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
why don't they have the balls to "liberate" north korea? are they scared they will be "liberated" back?lol.

Invader Zim

23rd March 2003, 15:36

Quote: from Chairman Mao on 3:13 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from AK47 on 2:38 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from redstar2000 on 2:04 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
AK47, I don't want to put words in your mouth.

The "tone" of your posts to this thread suggest to me that you support this war.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

:cool:

No you are not wrong... But before you judge me let me explain why.

As i am sure you are aware Saddam is an evil dictator. He has a commited genocide killed of over a million people. (2,921,000 if that source is anything to go by) And in my opinion we as a race (not as in black or white, the entire human race) should not allow such a person to continue his butchering of the people of Iraq. I hate the Idea of war but i dislike the alternative even more.

I am willing to debate this with you if you like?

There are many countries that are aware of the history of Iraq, yet they still do not support the war. This is because they recognise that initiating wars like this is against global conventions that keep peace and avoid suffering. The U.S. has killed 1 million Iraqis since the beginning of its bombing camapign over 10 years ago. It is debatable if Saddam Hussein has killed this many.

What you say is perfectly true, and a very valid point. However you do not denie that saddam is a facist dictator though, who needs to be removed?

Smoking Frog II

23rd March 2003, 15:40

to AK47. RE 'butchering'

Saddam doesn't cut up and eat the people he kills. He has a cover up thing, I'm sure of it!

Maybe our people being killed will tell people that war doesn't pay.

Pete

23rd March 2003, 15:41

Most people you talk to, AK, will agree with you. taht Saddam should be removed. America is making sure that they are incontrol of the new regime, it is a kind of Imperialism. This is why most nations do not support it. They see more motives then just 'liberation.' Infact most nations oppose the intervention on one side or the other of any nation into anothers affairs. If America wanted the world's support they could have supported to resistance, and be willing to give self determination, which they obviously (look at thier support of israel) are not.

Smoking Frog II

23rd March 2003, 15:47

go in the CC now, CrazyPete!

Saint-Just

23rd March 2003, 15:51

Quote: from Scotty on 3:13 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from lostsoul on 2:37 pm on Mar. 21, 2003
why don't they have the balls to "liberate" north korea? are they scared they will be "liberated" back?lol.

I'll second that

GuErRrIlLa

23rd March 2003, 16:00

The reason why the U.S. is affraid becuase N.K. can stand up to the U.S. instead of doing nothing. N.K. has weapons so does the U.S.

Anonymous

23rd March 2003, 16:29

I`ve been following the recent events of the injustified war that nobody wants and am sad to hear about the deaths on both sides but at the same time I think this might serve as a wake up call to aint-war sentiments. I`ve also been following some threads here recently and really the caliber of right wing trash being spouted here is even more abysmal.

I think the lesson we should take from these allied casualties is a general reflection on the sadness of death and wrongness of war. It seems that, for some people (i.e right wing warmongers) in particular, death has a relative value. If Iraqies die it`s okay, or at least it doesn`t cause much of an impact, but if some of your own people start dying it`s a tragedy worthy of much atention and human warmth. That is the impact I hope these and future allied deaths have on people. Maybe if you experience the pain of losing someone you will be more sensitive to the loss of others. Surprisingly though the exact opposite tends to happen and people become more filled with anger and extreme in thier positions.

I will abstain from commenting on weather or not these people deserved to die except to say that death is always a tragedy, killing is always wrong and emtional reactions aside I`m sure every Leftist, Humanist agrees with the principal.

lostsoul

23rd March 2003, 18:10

Quote: from El_Che on 4:29 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
I`ve been following the recent events of the injustified war that nobody wants and am sad to hear about the deaths on both sides but at the same time I think this might serve as a wake up call to aint-war sentiments. I`ve also been following some threads here recently and really the caliber of right wing trash being spouted here is even more abysmal.

I think the lesson we should take from these allied casualties is a general reflection on the sadness of death and wrongness of war. It seems that, for some people (i.e right wing warmongers) in particular, death has a relative value. If Iraqies die it`s okay, or at least it doesn`t cause much of an impact, but if some of your own people start dying it`s a tragedy worthy of much atention and human warmth. That is the impact I hope these and future allied deaths have on people. Maybe if you experience the pain of losing someone you will be more sensitive to the loss of others. Surprisingly though the exact opposite tends to happen and people become more filled with anger and extreme in thier positions.

I will abstain from commenting on weather or not these people deserved to die except to say that death is always a tragedy, killing is always wrong and emtional reactions aside I`m sure every Leftist, Humanist agrees with the principal.

Your 100% right, but it just seems the allied deaths are not making people for senstive to the war, instead its fueling their anger and making them want continue and get revenge. I don't know if thats most people's views, just with some Amercians i met last night.

Iraqi deaths i am sure we will not be told about, and allied deaths will be broadcasted on T.V...i think this is a tool being used to make people more pro-war.

Check this site out. http://truthout.org/
Its really sickening that while we are here typing, what horrific acts are being commited against people's who only "misfortune" is to be from a certain geographical location.

(Edited by lostsoul at 6:13 pm on Mar. 23, 2003)

Capitalist Imperial

23rd March 2003, 18:52

Capitalist Imperial

23rd March 2003, 18:55

Quote: from CCCP on 2:01 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
BTW: The US's fantastic anti-air defense system: The Patriot, just shot down a Brittish fighter plane. Both pilots are missing.

And a Sergeant of the 101th Airborn division just killed one of his own mates and wounded 12, like I said all of them are nuts

Hahah, the Coalitian bodycounter is razing.

the air defense system apparently is fantastic, it worked

how do we know that it was the british plane at fault here? perhaps they were flying through a hot coridor and did not ID themselves

lets get the facts before we point fingers

lostsoul

23rd March 2003, 19:02

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 6:55 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from CCCP on 2:01 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
BTW: The US's fantastic anti-air defense system: The Patriot, just shot down a Brittish fighter plane. Both pilots are missing.

And a Sergeant of the 101th Airborn division just killed one of his own mates and wounded 12, like I said all of them are nuts

Hahah, the Coalitian bodycounter is razing.

the air defense system apparently is fantastic, it worked

how do we know that it was the british plane at fault here? perhaps they were flying through a hot coridor and did not ID themselves

lets get the facts before we point fingers

Missles can't tell the difference between friends and enemies. Civilians and soliders. And until they do, innocent civilians will have to suffer. At least the american/britsh are tasteing their own medician.

Capitalist Imperial

23rd March 2003, 19:05

Quote: from lostsoul on 7:02 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 6:55 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from CCCP on 2:01 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
BTW: The US's fantastic anti-air defense system: The Patriot, just shot down a Brittish fighter plane. Both pilots are missing.

And a Sergeant of the 101th Airborn division just killed one of his own mates and wounded 12, like I said all of them are nuts

Hahah, the Coalitian bodycounter is razing.

the air defense system apparently is fantastic, it worked

how do we know that it was the british plane at fault here? perhaps they were flying through a hot coridor and did not ID themselves

lets get the facts before we point fingers

Missles can't tell the difference between friends and enemies. Civilians and soliders. And until they do, innocent civilians will have to suffer. At least the american/britsh are tasteing their own medician.

tasting our own medicine? yeah, thats what we deserve for trying to liberate an oppressed regime!

Non-Sectarian Bastard!

23rd March 2003, 19:39

Yes, tomorrow I will liberate you, because I think that you don't like me and might use your weapons of mass destruction. So here comes the bullets of peace, liberty, justice and patriotism. :biggrin:

M1 Abrams

23rd March 2003, 19:56

Lostsoul, you truly are just that. How dare you desicrate the memories of men and women who would die for you without a second thought. I'm having having immense difficulties not cursing you out. This isn't about right and left or capitilism and communism; this is about a base morality that you surley lack. I'm sickened by your post. I'm as right wing as they come. Yet I DO NOT cheer the deaths of the Iraqis. In fact I'm genuinly disheartened when i see the fear in the eyes of the prisoners we've taken. Although I feel this war is warrented, that is not even the point. Anyone on this site who cheers the deaths of American and British servicemen or anyone else for that matter is A SICK FUCK! I'm not sure what the stipulations for banishment are but I hope they would apply to this senseless idiot! Lost soul I can only hope you find your way to Baghdad in the next few weeks. And then maybe someone will "spit on your grave" Sicko!

M1 Abrams

23rd March 2003, 21:08

Does anyone have the moral conviction to ban this clown. Lostsoul should be ousted for his sick comments.

lostsoul

23rd March 2003, 21:32

Quote: from M1 Abrams on 7:56 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
Lostsoul, you truly are just that. How dare you desicrate the memories of men and women who would die for you without a second thought. I'm having having immense difficulties not cursing you out. This isn't about right and left or capitilism and communism; this is about a base morality that you surley lack. I'm sickened by your post. I'm as right wing as they come. Yet I DO NOT cheer the deaths of the Iraqis. In fact I'm genuinly disheartened when i see the fear in the eyes of the prisoners we've taken. Although I feel this war is warrented, that is not even the point. Anyone on this site who cheers the deaths of American and British servicemen or anyone else for that matter is A SICK FUCK! I'm not sure what the stipulations for banishment are but I hope they would apply to this senseless idiot! Lost soul I can only hope you find your way to Baghdad in the next few weeks. And then maybe someone will "spit on your grave" Sicko!

first off, most people in the world do not want this war. So when you say i am "desicrate the memories of men and women who would die for you without a second thought." i don't really understand how you linked me with their cause.

Before i see this situtation as left, or right..or anything like that..i look at it from a human point of view. And yes, anyone dying is bad, but if the are there to either kill or support the killers, which makes me not even feel slight pitty for them. I don't see people who murder for their own greed or for someone else's greed as human beings, so their deaths don't really affect me. I was just glad that the invading forces got weaker.

Of course people on the right would feel sorry for America, but people on the left, i personally believe, shouldn't. If the people on this board are going to actually try to do the stuff they talk about, they they should relize anyone who has tried the same thing has had great conflicts with America. so these "socialist" who support Americian troops should understand later on if they try to act on their idea's, it could be those same troops that come for them.

Any human loss is tragic, but when it is the loss of criminals i don't find it tragic at all. I never felt sorry when hitler died, in fact when i studied history and read it, i also said "YAY".

Invader Zim

23rd March 2003, 21:37

Quote: from lostsoul on 7:02 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 6:55 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from CCCP on 2:01 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
BTW: The US's fantastic anti-air defense system: The Patriot, just shot down a Brittish fighter plane. Both pilots are missing.

And a Sergeant of the 101th Airborn division just killed one of his own mates and wounded 12, like I said all of them are nuts

Hahah, the Coalitian bodycounter is razing.

the air defense system apparently is fantastic, it worked

how do we know that it was the british plane at fault here? perhaps they were flying through a hot coridor and did not ID themselves

lets get the facts before we point fingers

Missles can't tell the difference between friends and enemies. Civilians and soliders. And until they do, innocent civilians will have to suffer. At least the american/britsh are tasteing their own medician.

My own cousin is in the Gulf at the moment and i would much rather you getting a taste of the medicen than him, you cheap fucking Jigalo.

lostsoul

23rd March 2003, 21:43

Quote: from AK47 on 9:37 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from lostsoul on 7:02 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 6:55 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from CCCP on 2:01 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
BTW: The US's fantastic anti-air defense system: The Patriot, just shot down a Brittish fighter plane. Both pilots are missing.

And a Sergeant of the 101th Airborn division just killed one of his own mates and wounded 12, like I said all of them are nuts

Hahah, the Coalitian bodycounter is razing.

the air defense system apparently is fantastic, it worked

how do we know that it was the british plane at fault here? perhaps they were flying through a hot coridor and did not ID themselves

lets get the facts before we point fingers

Missles can't tell the difference between friends and enemies. Civilians and soliders. And until they do, innocent civilians will have to suffer. At least the american/britsh are tasteing their own medician.

My own cousin is in the Gulf at the moment and i would much rather you getting a taste of the medicen than him, you cheap fucking Jigalo.

KAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAABBBBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!!

bye bye counsin Ak47. you'v just been "liberated".

redstar2000

23rd March 2003, 22:53

AK47, you are a servile lackey of U.S. imperialism!

:angry:

Chiak47

23rd March 2003, 22:57

Real soldier's do not celebrate the death of other soldier's.
With that logic in hand I must say you girls have no chance of a sucessfull revolution.HAHAHAHAHa

Xvall

24th March 2003, 01:01

Chiak47:

Real soldier's do not celebrate the death of other soldier's. With that logic in hand I must say you girls have no chance of a sucessfull revolution.HAHAHAHAHa

Seriously, Chiak. Insult if you must; but refrain from using stupid chauvanist insults like 'girls'. I know hundreds of women who are far more intelligent and innovative than you will ever be. Thankfully, your initial statement was actually somewhat profound. Of course no one has a chance of sucessful revolution at the moment. We are all mentally unstable teenagers; Just like you! Deal with it.

redstar2000:

AK47, you are a servile lackey of U.S. imperialism!

Be this true or not, there is something that you know just as well as I myself do. That is that attacking the lackeys of any type of imperialism will solve absolutely nothing. If you wish to combat devil you fight him; not the residents of hell.

(Edited by Drake Dracoli at 1:01 am on Mar. 24, 2003)

redstar2000

24th March 2003, 01:37

"If you wish to combat the devil, you fight him; not the residents of hell."

That's quite well said, Drake. I don't know if I can...but I probably should leave AK47 to rot in his own imperial treachery.

I'll give it a try.

:cool:

Anonymous

24th March 2003, 02:53

I love wallowing in my own depravity. :biggrin: :wink:

Capitalist Imperial

24th March 2003, 03:58

Quote: from Drake Dracoli on 1:01 am on Mar. 24, 2003
Chiak47:

Real soldier's do not celebrate the death of other soldier's. With that logic in hand I must say you girls have no chance of a sucessfull revolution.HAHAHAHAHa

Seriously, Chiak. Insult if you must; but refrain from using stupid chauvanist insults like 'girls'. I know hundreds of women who are far more intelligent and innovative than you will ever be. Thankfully, your initial statement was actually somewhat profound. Of course no one has a chance of sucessful revolution at the moment. We are all mentally unstable teenagers; Just like you! Deal with it.

redstar2000:

AK47, you are a servile lackey of U.S. imperialism!

Be this true or not, there is something that you know just as well as I myself do. That is that attacking the lackeys of any type of imperialism will solve absolutely nothing. If you wish to combat devil you fight him; not the residents of hell.

(Edited by Drake Dracoli at 1:01 am on Mar. 24, 2003)

come get some then, son

M1 Abrams

24th March 2003, 05:00

Do not even bother with these disgusting hypocrits. They call us war mongerers yet preach hate death. I say....Fuck em (especially that damn Canadian)

Invader Zim

24th March 2003, 09:17

Quote: from redstar2000 on 10:53 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
AK47, you are a servile lackey of U.S. imperialism!

:angry:

How do you work that out???

http://216.40.249.192/s/contrib/navigator/mindmunch.gif

(Edited by AK47 at 10:41 am on Mar. 24, 2003)

Invader Zim

24th March 2003, 09:21

Quote: from redstar2000 on 1:37 am on Mar. 24, 2003
"If you wish to combat the devil, you fight him; not the residents of hell."

That's quite well said, Drake. I don't know if I can...but I probably should leave AK47 to rot in his own imperial treachery.

I'll give it a try.

:cool:

If i am a lacky of US imperialism, fine so be it. However you are a lacky of Saddam's FACISM!

Invader Zim

24th March 2003, 09:23

Quote: from lostsoul on 9:43 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

KAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAABBBBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!!

bye bye counsin Ak47. you'v just been "liberated".

I new that you were an ass hole but you have now reached a new low. I congratulate you.

(Edited by AK47 at 9:52 am on Mar. 24, 2003)

Xvall

24th March 2003, 22:11

come get some then, son

Pardon? I stated that I would fight against the devil. (Metaphor for imperialism.) Are you admitting that you are an imperialist?

Just Joe

24th March 2003, 22:29

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 3:58 am on Mar. 24, 2003

Quote: from Drake Dracoli on 1:01 am on Mar. 24, 2003
Chiak47:

Real soldier's do not celebrate the death of other soldier's. With that logic in hand I must say you girls have no chance of a sucessfull revolution.HAHAHAHAHa

Seriously, Chiak. Insult if you must; but refrain from using stupid chauvanist insults like 'girls'. I know hundreds of women who are far more intelligent and innovative than you will ever be. Thankfully, your initial statement was actually somewhat profound. Of course no one has a chance of sucessful revolution at the moment. We are all mentally unstable teenagers; Just like you! Deal with it.

redstar2000:

AK47, you are a servile lackey of U.S. imperialism!

Be this true or not, there is something that you know just as well as I myself do. That is that attacking the lackeys of any type of imperialism will solve absolutely nothing. If you wish to combat devil you fight him; not the residents of hell.

(Edited by Drake Dracoli at 1:01 am on Mar. 24, 2003)

come get some then, son

i did actually spit out my drink with laughter when i read this.

lostsoul

24th March 2003, 23:32

Quote: from AK47 on 9:23 am on Mar. 24, 2003

Quote: from lostsoul on 9:43 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

KAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAABBBBOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!!

bye bye counsin Ak47. you'v just been "liberated".

I new that you were an ass hole but you have now reached a new low. I congratulate you.

(Edited by AK47 at 9:52 am on Mar. 24, 2003)

why thank you, your too kind. :biggrin:
i am glad my ph.d i got in asshole school paid off.

Mazdak

25th March 2003, 01:24

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 7:57 am on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from Mazdak on 1:40 am on Mar. 23, 2003
Once again we hear this garbage about saddam gassing "his own" people. Why is it that you still havent realized that the kurds and the CIA both admitted there was no "mass genocide." Saddam is no leftist, but a hero to all anti imperialists, regardless of how you look at it. Supporting the US means betraying the cause.

Yeah, and the holocaust never happened, right Mazdak?

Saddam is no leftist, but a hero to all anti imperialists, regardless of how you look at it. Supporting the US means betraying the cause.

LOL, this is great comedy. You are merely a sad stalinist relic, a member of a faction long ago defeated by benevolent american capitalism

Yes of course. When Iran and N Korea smash US forces or at least go out with a huge "blast," we will be singing to a different tune. Stop complimenting your parasitic system, the Soviets fell from internal and external pressure. However, i have to hand it to you guys, aiding Osama against the reds was a genius maneveur eh?

Tasha

25th March 2003, 04:06

Because you do not agree with what a person's ideas are does not mean they should be graded on a different scale than anyone else. A hardcore capitalist should be regarded on the same scale as a hardcore socialist. All life should be regarded as equal, when looking at casualties there should be no ratios. They should only be seperated by military and civilian losses.

Non-Sectarian Bastard!

25th March 2003, 16:34

Quote: from Chiak47 on 10:57 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
Real soldier's do not celebrate the death of other soldier's.
With that logic in hand I must say you girls have no chance of a sucessfull revolution.HAHAHAHAHa

That's why the US soldiers "cried" when 2 bombs hit in a building full of Iraqi soldiers.

(Edited by CCCP at 4:37 pm on Mar. 25, 2003)

Non-Sectarian Bastard!

25th March 2003, 16:40

Quote: from AK47 on 9:37 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from lostsoul on 7:02 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 6:55 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from CCCP on 2:01 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
BTW: The US's fantastic anti-air defense system: The Patriot, just shot down a Brittish fighter plane. Both pilots are missing.

And a Sergeant of the 101th Airborn division just killed one of his own mates and wounded 12, like I said all of them are nuts

Hahah, the Coalitian bodycounter is razing.

the air defense system apparently is fantastic, it worked

how do we know that it was the british plane at fault here? perhaps they were flying through a hot coridor and did not ID themselves

lets get the facts before we point fingers

Missles can't tell the difference between friends and enemies. Civilians and soliders. And until they do, innocent civilians will have to suffer. At least the american/britsh are tasteing their own medician.

My own cousin is in the Gulf at the moment and i would much rather you getting a taste of the medicen than him, you cheap fucking Jigalo.

Hope he steps on a fuckin mine or gets liberated with chemical weapons provided to Iraq by the US.

My best wishes, I hear the Iraqi troops are liberating a lot of Allied troops.

Invader Zim

25th March 2003, 21:49

Quote: from CCCP on 4:40 pm on Mar. 25, 2003

Quote: from AK47 on 9:37 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from lostsoul on 7:02 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 6:55 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from CCCP on 2:01 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
BTW: The US's fantastic anti-air defense system: The Patriot, just shot down a Brittish fighter plane. Both pilots are missing.

And a Sergeant of the 101th Airborn division just killed one of his own mates and wounded 12, like I said all of them are nuts

Hahah, the Coalitian bodycounter is razing.

the air defense system apparently is fantastic, it worked

how do we know that it was the british plane at fault here? perhaps they were flying through a hot coridor and did not ID themselves

lets get the facts before we point fingers

Missles can't tell the difference between friends and enemies. Civilians and soliders. And until they do, innocent civilians will have to suffer. At least the american/britsh are tasteing their own medician.

My own cousin is in the Gulf at the moment and i would much rather you getting a taste of the medicen than him, you cheap fucking Jigalo.

Hope he steps on a fuckin mine or gets liberated with chemical weapons provided to Iraq by the US.

My best wishes, I hear the Iraqi troops are liberating a lot of Allied troops.

Every one else keep the fuck out its private between me and this ass hole.

Cant take your wrong so fucking say that my family should die well you fucking coward come on then want to test some code then as i cant fucking get you in goddamed reality.

(Edited by AK47 at 9:58 pm on Mar. 25, 2003)

lostsoul

25th March 2003, 22:47

Quote: from AK47 on 9:49 pm on Mar. 25, 2003

Quote: from CCCP on 4:40 pm on Mar. 25, 2003

Quote: from AK47 on 9:37 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from lostsoul on 7:02 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 6:55 pm on Mar. 23, 2003

Quote: from CCCP on 2:01 pm on Mar. 23, 2003
BTW: The US's fantastic anti-air defense system: The Patriot, just shot down a Brittish fighter plane. Both pilots are missing.

And a Sergeant of the 101th Airborn division just killed one of his own mates and wounded 12, like I said all of them are nuts

Hahah, the Coalitian bodycounter is razing.

the air defense system apparently is fantastic, it worked

how do we know that it was the british plane at fault here? perhaps they were flying through a hot coridor and did not ID themselves

lets get the facts before we point fingers

Missles can't tell the difference between friends and enemies. Civilians and soliders. And until they do, innocent civilians will have to suffer. At least the american/britsh are tasteing their own medician.

My own cousin is in the Gulf at the moment and i would much rather you getting a taste of the medicen than him, you cheap fucking Jigalo.

Hope he steps on a fuckin mine or gets liberated with chemical weapons provided to Iraq by the US.

My best wishes, I hear the Iraqi troops are liberating a lot of Allied troops.

Every one else keep the fuck out its private between me and this ass hole.

Cant take your wrong so fucking say that my family should die well you fucking coward come on then want to test some code then as i cant fucking get you in goddamed reality.

(Edited by AK47 at 9:58 pm on Mar. 25, 2003)

Do you suffer from any mental illness's? or perhapes you are upset uncounsiously that your cousin is invading in the name of a country that had killed numourious world leaders, causes the deaths of million and millions of civilians, and treats anyone who is not part of white america like trash?

Or maybe your just upset cause your dad uses a dildo on your ass, you "gaylord focker".

*get a nervous feeling that i'm about to get banned*

(Edited by lostsoul at 10:52 pm on Mar. 25, 2003)

Moskitto

25th March 2003, 22:56

CCCP, I strongly recommend you do not post such sentiments again, attacking forum members personally like that is out of order, this has been reported to the rest of the moderators as well.

Lostsoul, the same thing goes to you

(Edited by Moskitto at 11:28 pm on Mar. 25, 2003)

Chiak47

25th March 2003, 23:05

CCCP advocated direct death to someones loved one.
And he is not banned?Why?

Kalashnikov did the same and he was banned with the quickness..

WTF?Is this about being above the masses?

Purged.

Off to the gulags I go....

Moskitto

25th March 2003, 23:30

I cannot ban Mr CCCP as I have no administrator powers, if an administrator sees this and agrees that this is over the edge, appropriate action will be taken.

lostsoul

25th March 2003, 23:48

it was AK47, capilistic imperials and some other guy that started to attack people directly. Before that we were discussing the soliders.

you can't expect anyone to take insults for too long without fighting back.

some cowards here, think just because their in their little nice homes and behind a computer they can say what ever they want. As soon as someone says something back, they try to get that person banned. I actually find it pretty funny.

Chiak47

25th March 2003, 23:56

lostbong...did you say something?

lostsoul

26th March 2003, 00:02

Quote: from Chiak47 on 11:56 pm on Mar. 25, 2003
lostbong...did you say something?

lostbong

hahhaha hohoh heheheh hhhehehe kekkeke..that is cleaver and witty..all at the same time. Man, you should leave this site and just do stand up comedy.

You could be on HBO or BET comic view. Your a very funny guy..but then again looks aren't everything.

Chiak47

26th March 2003, 00:04

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/afp/20030325/capt.sge.ojy96.250303205112.photo00.default-389x260.jpg

Drake this soldier would do take a bullet for you just cause you are American.

Please think about it man.

Chiak47

26th March 2003, 00:06

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20030324/capt.1048524474.iraq_us_military_war_reb106.jpg

Lostsoul this one has your name on it..

Chiak47

26th March 2003, 00:10

http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/rids/20030325/i/1048610166.3892346962.jpg

The baddest MOTHERFUCKERS IN THE WORLD...

http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/rids/20030325/i/1048551656.4228243561.jpg

Domino

26th March 2003, 00:13

They are killing each other anyway. I thought they wanted to kill Iraqis, LMAO! They are more stupid than I thought! Shooting each other's tanks, crashing helicopters, granades-- boy. They should save some for the war, LOL!

Chiak47

26th March 2003, 00:18

Listen here tits.They are moving fast and the fog of war is nasty thick.It's all part of the play.

So get some real ammo if you want to spue shit towards me.

Thanks,
Asshole

lostsoul

26th March 2003, 00:24

Quote: from Chiak47 on 12:10 am on Mar. 26, 2003
http://us.news1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/rids/20030325/i/1048610166.3892346962.jpg

isn't it a bit funny, that tattoo and he's in another country fighting to put his own country's goverment in power.

I don't like to call Americians stupid, but that guy has seriously got to research and find out what he's really fighting for and either take that tattoo off or get out of the army.

and the guy who got shot in the face wouldn't have been shot if he didn't try shit with other people's livies. He's not exactly in iraq for a vaction or tan, he knows why he's there and he should take that as a warning and back up before something else happens that seriously effects his health forever.

Pete

26th March 2003, 00:26

Live Free or Die. Isn't that the motto of Vermont? It is a bit of hypocrisy isn't it? Or atleast very circular.

Kapitan Andrey

26th March 2003, 00:31

canikickit

26th March 2003, 00:33

That tattoo is chauvinistic bullshit.

Chiak47

26th March 2003, 00:35

yep it should read "live oppressed and die"

WTF...Do the red's spoon feed this shit to you punks?

canikickit

26th March 2003, 00:45

It "should" read whatever the hell that idiot wants to be branded with.

Nobody spoon feeds me anything. I don't watch Fox "news" or CNN or listen to Bush's speeches with anything other than a satirical and cynical smile on my face.

Kapitan Andrey

26th March 2003, 00:47

Fuck by bullet this damn idiot, that made this tatoo to himself!!!

Chiak47

26th March 2003, 01:04

Kaptian Crunch.I think he earned the right to put anything on his arm he wants.I would pay to see you tell him any different.

canikickit

26th March 2003, 01:49

We have, equally, the right to say whatever we want about his ridiculous tattoo.

You're so self righteous, it makes me laugh.

Anonymous

26th March 2003, 01:56

That tatoo kicks ass.

Chiak47

26th March 2003, 02:07

DC you are a man of true taste.

Invader Zim

26th March 2003, 07:53

Do you suffer from any mental illness's? or perhapes you are upset uncounsiously that your cousin is invading in the name of a country that had killed numourious world leaders, causes the deaths of million and millions of civilians, and treats anyone who is not part of white america like trash?

(Edited by lostsoul at 10:52 pm on Mar. 25, 2003)

Or maybee hes under order and joined the RAF long before the war was started shit for brains!!!

million and millions of civilians

Bullshit, pure bullshit. Not even the most hardcore war protestors would make such a stupid claim. At the most it will be thousands, dont even think for a minute that i want this coz i dont. Which is nothing compaired to Saddam Hussain.

Chiak47

26th March 2003, 07:57

Get em AK47...Make M.kalashnikov proud

http://www.gunsnet.net/forums/images/smilies/killemall.gif
http://www.gunsnet.net/forums/images/smilies/ak2.gif

Domino

26th March 2003, 08:54

Quote: from Chiak47 on 6:18 pm on Mar. 25, 2003
Listen here tits.They are moving fast and the fog of war is nasty thick.It's all part of the play.

So get some real ammo if you want to spue shit towards me.

Thanks,
Asshole

LMAO!!! http://mindscraps.com/s/contrib/blackeye/lol.gif You are so pathetic. Pobrecito.

(Edited by tetelives at 2:55 am on Mar. 26, 2003)

Chiak47

26th March 2003, 08:56

Tits,
Son you just fired a dud.Get a 120mm smoothbore and lets rock fuck face.

Thank you,
Greed

Domino

26th March 2003, 08:59

OMG, LOL! Do you really think you sound threatening? You have to be more pathetic than I thought. You are even funny, I'll give you that. Now go play with your toys before you daddy tells you is bed time.

Chiak47

26th March 2003, 09:02

Tits,
Its fucking 3am here.It's past my bedtime.
Thanks for your concern-bloody heart,
Massacre

Domino

26th March 2003, 09:04

Yeah, it's 3 here too. Then go to bed before your parents spank you, go go!

Chiak47

26th March 2003, 09:14

Tits,
Thanks for your concern.My mother passed away and my dad thinks I'm a big boy now even though I am 26.
What can I say tough love.
I have lived in Mesa AZ,Yuma AZ,Lake LA California,Antigo WI,Milwaukee WI,Chicago IL,Racine WI.I have been all over these United States.Including Mexico and Canada
I have 2 kids and a nephew I'm raising cause his leftist mother(my sister in law) is a drug addict and can barely keep herself together.
I have seen the ugly face of laftie bullshit and I would love to sit here and dance with you as I'm sure you would with me.But since It is 3am and I'm talking to you like your serving drinks at a tavern or some shit.
I'm going to retire for the night.
Thank you "Dear Abby",
PURGED

Domino

26th March 2003, 09:23

That's so moving *sniff* go to bed already! Like I care about your life, LOL

Chiak47

26th March 2003, 09:29

Yea I should edit that huh.
Ahh fuck it.
keep it
Bye

Invader Zim

26th March 2003, 12:02

Quote: from Chiak47 on 7:57 am on Mar. 26, 2003
Get em AK47...Make M.kalashnikov proud

http://www.gunsnet.net/forums/images/smilies/killemall.gif
http://www.gunsnet.net/forums/images/smilies/ak2.gif

Shut up, i dont support your cause either.

Any way the AK47 is a copy of a german sub machine gun, kalashnikov just modified it slightly.

Xvall

26th March 2003, 23:15

Make M.kalashnikov proud

You are aware that Kalashnikov was a Soviet aren't you? I doubt he would be 'proud' of the war in Iraq.

redstar2000

27th March 2003, 00:36

"I have two kids and a nephew I'm raising..." -- Chiak47

Now there are three really unlucky kids! :o

:cool:

Chiak47

27th March 2003, 00:59

redspot,
your right-My nephew should be with a leftist dopehead.
What was I thinking.

Fuck you,
Dickhead

canikickit

27th March 2003, 01:13

So do you consider her a leftist because she uses drugs, or because of her actual political allignment?

I'd imagine it's the former, you really don't seem to understand our stance at all.

I have been all over these United States.Including Mexico and Canada

"including"...hahaha

I have seen the ugly face of laftie bullshit

Where and when?

lostsoul

27th March 2003, 01:17

Quote: from AK47 on 12:02 pm on Mar. 26, 2003

Quote: from Chiak47 on 7:57 am on Mar. 26, 2003
Get em AK47...Make M.kalashnikov proud

http://www.gunsnet.net/forums/images/smilies/killemall.gif
http://www.gunsnet.net/forums/images/smilies/ak2.gif

Shut up, i dont support your cause either.

Any way the AK47 is a copy of a german sub machine gun, kalashnikov just modified it slightly.

You both are pretty retarded, maybe you two should get together and study, so you don't need to try put down other members just to keep an agrument going.

If you look at socialist(albert einstien, che, fidel, lenin, and all the older socialist i have meet personally), most of them are extremly educated(lawyers, doctors, most of the ones i know are university professors). All i am saying is that if you act so retarded they'll tear you apart and you will probally be like other americians, and have to resort to voilence, which will fuck you up back.

Its just a tip, people respect educated people over little immature children.

Dirty Jersey

27th March 2003, 02:05

you know guys i just dont get some people. some argue childishly and the discussion loses focus of the topic. there are people all over this site saying american soldiers should die in iraq. ive mentioned a couple of times so far that my brother in law is a us marine in iraq right now. i dont wish death on anyone and its fucked up to do so. how could you want anyone to die?

redstar2000

27th March 2003, 02:17

"How could you want anyone to die?"

Put it that way, and it does sound kind of "fucked up." But there are other viewpoints.

Do you want America to succeed in its act of imperialist aggression? If you do, then Iraqi deaths become "nasty but necessary".

If you don't, then American deaths fall into the same category.

That's what war is about, Dirty Jersey.

:cool:

Dirty Jersey

27th March 2003, 03:25

i know that. but i never wanted a war. i dont think we should really venture outside our borders. im not saying become isolationists but we should stop tryingto be the worlds police force.

lostsoul

27th March 2003, 03:33

Quote: from Dirty Jersey on 3:25 am on Mar. 27, 2003
i know that. but i never wanted a war. i dont think we should really venture outside our borders. im not saying become isolationists but we should stop tryingto be the worlds police force.

and anyone who tried to make little mini-me's of its self all over the world and tries to police it should fail. And since using military tactics to succeed, then all i am hoping is that their military tactics fail.

Only way for it to fail, is for them to die, or withdraw. Only way they will withdraw is when their losses outweight their gains.

Invader Zim

27th March 2003, 09:53

Quote: from lostsoul on 1:17 am on Mar. 27, 2003

Quote: from AK47 on 12:02 pm on Mar. 26, 2003

Quote: from Chiak47 on 7:57 am on Mar. 26, 2003
Get em AK47...Make M.kalashnikov proud

http://www.gunsnet.net/forums/images/smilies/killemall.gif
http://www.gunsnet.net/forums/images/smilies/ak2.gif

Shut up, i dont support your cause either.

Any way the AK47 is a copy of a german sub machine gun, kalashnikov just modified it slightly.

You both are pretty retarded, maybe you two should get together and study, so you don't need to try put down other members just to keep an agrument going.

If you look at socialist(albert einstien, che, fidel, lenin, and all the older socialist i have meet personally), most of them are extremly educated(lawyers, doctors, most of the ones i know are university professors). All i am saying is that if you act so retarded they'll tear you apart and you will probally be like other americians, and have to resort to voilence, which will fuck you up back.

Its just a tip, people respect educated people over little immature children.

For a start i am far more educated than you will ever be for a fact, second im not american...

You are such a dumb arse, its so very amuz#sing to see what you come out with next.

Little detail leftists dont support Nazis which is why i am anti Saddam!

kylie

27th March 2003, 10:11

For a start i am far more educated than you will ever be for a fact, second im not american... /

AK47 the more i read from you the more i get the feeling you're just another of the petty bourgeois, only really interested in this because of your own fear that something may happen to threaten your position.

so what if someone comes from america?
do you think that because a person is born in america they are les intelligent by default? thats racism, FYI.

lostsoul

27th March 2003, 13:32

Quote: from AK47 on 9:53 am on Mar. 27, 2003

Quote: from lostsoul on 1:17 am on Mar. 27, 2003

Quote: from AK47 on 12:02 pm on Mar. 26, 2003

Quote: from Chiak47 on 7:57 am on Mar. 26, 2003
Get em AK47...Make M.kalashnikov proud

http://www.gunsnet.net/forums/images/smilies/killemall.gif
http://www.gunsnet.net/forums/images/smilies/ak2.gif

Shut up, i dont support your cause either.

Any way the AK47 is a copy of a german sub machine gun, kalashnikov just modified it slightly.

You both are pretty retarded, maybe you two should get together and study, so you don't need to try put down other members just to keep an agrument going.

If you look at socialist(albert einstien, che, fidel, lenin, and all the older socialist i have meet personally), most of them are extremly educated(lawyers, doctors, most of the ones i know are university professors). All i am saying is that if you act so retarded they'll tear you apart and you will probally be like other americians, and have to resort to voilence, which will fuck you up back.

Its just a tip, people respect educated people over little immature children.

For a start i am far more educated than you will ever be for a fact, second im not american...

You are such a dumb arse, its so very amuz#sing to see what you come out with next.

Little detail leftists dont support Nazis which is why i am anti Saddam!

without knowing anything about me, you assume you are more educated then me. very smart.

I would give you a little respect if you were americian, but your basically an want to be americian, which makes you lower then any americian.

You may not support nazi's but you support Americian terrorist.

Invader Zim

27th March 2003, 18:30

Quote: from feoric on 10:11 am on Mar. 27, 2003

For a start i am far more educated than you will ever be for a fact, second im not american... /

AK47 the more i read from you the more i get the feeling you're just another of the petty bourgeois, only really interested in this because of your own fear that something may happen to threaten your position.

so what if someone comes from america?
do you think that because a person is born in america they are les intelligent by default? thats racism, FYI.

No the thing about America was because Lost Soul was under the immpression that i am American, as you can see: -

you will probally be like other americians

I am not american and I have no disrespect for Americans in general, other than the general dislike that they create 20% of the worlds pollution and a hell of a lot more poverty etc, but thats the Government, i dont dislike most americans in general.

i get the feeling you're just another of the petty bourgeois

You bearly even know me but you assume to make presumptions like that? OK then from what you say i gather that you are a Facist protecting the Regim of another Facist because that's what it looks like from my perspective. I only differ from most of the forum because i choose to consider the Facist in Iraq worse than the Undemocratic/imperialist Moron in the White house.

But every one is assuming i support the USA to the Bitter end, i dont, i just agree that they should get rid of Saddam, is that so bad?

only really interested in this because of your own fear that something may happen to threaten your position.

You dont even know what my position is.

I live in a pretty standard area of The UK in a area of average house prices and go to a an average comprehensive school. I dont own shares, i dont study the economy and i dont run a buisness, I would hardly call my self loaded or Bourgeoisie.

Lost soul i dont want to be American because im quite happy as i am. I hold no respect for the American system of government or policys. I just dont hate it enough to want to stop a war to remove a Facist dictator who has killed over 1,000,000 people. I am intitled to my opinion and i will stick by it as i believe it is the only moral solution to the threat of Saddam Hussain to the people of Iraq and its neighbours.

I also know that America is just as bad but that does not mean i dont want to see them destroy Saddam Hussain.

(Edited by AK47 at 6:42 pm on Mar. 27, 2003)

Grauniad

29th March 2003, 07:48

Seems that CI attended the revisionist history class. His quote "We beat the North Koreans once", is a tad off the mark, at best that little "police action" was a draw. If as CI claims they were beaten, look at them now, is this what a nation "defeated" by the US is, like ? If so then whatever replaces Sadaam is going to be interesting to say the least.
Also his quote "You could never beat the US Military", seems to me that th US had its ass whipped by a bunch of "pajama wearing peasants" back in VietNam, or has that been expunged from the right-wing collective, or maybe translated into a win.
I may be wrong but the last time that the US actually won a "war" was when 5000 of them invaded Grenada to surround 28 Cubans.
Also good to see that not only are the US shooting down allied planes, but now they have taken to sehlling each other while teh Iraqi troops sneak around them..........Way to go guys, keep up the good work

M1 Abrams

29th March 2003, 23:48

This site is almost entirely comprised of uneducated racists. First of all you deem all arguments posed by a rightie invalid regardless of it's content. Yet the same point will be loudly cheered coming from a leftie. Your ideology is closer to islamic extremists than Marx or anyone of your alleged idols. You hate Americans merely because they are capitalists. You don't even try to hide this. If you merely disagreed then I would not make such bold claims. However any cappy or equivilant is immediatly ostersized upon entering the forum. Yes I know this is a left wing website. Yet the name of this forum is OPPOSING IDEOLOGIES. Not racist propaganda. This doesn't apply to everyone. Only the VAST majority. I respect you all. Until you cross the boundries of good taste. For most of you that was a long time ago.

redstar2000

30th March 2003, 02:04

M1Abrams, do I understand that you are now claiming "race" status for right-wingers? That's a new one for me. :cheesy:

"You hate Americans merely because they are capitalists." No. There are no protests against Danish imperialism these days, are there? Or Irish imperialism? Or Malaysian imperialism? All capitalist countries.

It is the United States that has assumed the mantle of empire, the new "fortress of world reaction", the Fourth Reich! That is why the United States is hated. And rightfully so!

One of the reasons that conservative views are held in such contempt here is that you have nothing to offer with regard to the present political and economic realities except..."we support our troops" or "God bless America." Such servility can hardly expect any reaction but contempt and redicule from us.

On those exceedingly rare occasions when righties offer something of substance (I think it's happened twice in the last seven months), I, for one, am willing to respond accordingly. I think that applies to others here as well. Indeed, some here are far more patient than I am...and draft lengthy posts explaining why some right-wing banality is wrong in fact and argument.

So if you want substantive argument, offer it. Otherwise you will be treated exactly as you deserve.

:cool:

lostsoul

30th March 2003, 02:37

Quote: from M1 Abrams on 11:48 pm on Mar. 29, 2003
This site is almost entirely comprised of uneducated racists. First of all you deem all arguments posed by a rightie invalid regardless of it's content. Yet the same point will be loudly cheered coming from a leftie. Your ideology is closer to islamic extremists than Marx or anyone of your alleged idols. You hate Americans merely because they are capitalists. You don't even try to hide this. If you merely disagreed then I would not make such bold claims. However any cappy or equivilant is immediatly ostersized upon entering the forum. Yes I know this is a left wing website. Yet the name of this forum is OPPOSING IDEOLOGIES. Not racist propaganda. This doesn't apply to everyone. Only the VAST majority. I respect you all. Until you cross the boundries of good taste. For most of you that was a long time ago.

most people will study only to prove their own points and disregard any points that would go against theirs. And Capitialists are outnumbered here. If you make a point you'll have maybe 20 people giving you a counter point,(although maybe the 5 of the counter points are bullshit). I think then many of the people who are outnumbered in the argument go to name calling then the topic being discussed is not of concern anymore, its basically who can insult the other better.

Thats just from my observations, i think we need more capitialists here(all sorts, smart ones, stupid ones..etc). But i give you guys nuff respect for having the balls to still stand up for yourselfs. i don't think most people can stand up for themselfs when the majority is against them.