THIS ISN"T NEW!!!! - civilian casualties

[M1 Abrams]

While I know CNN and such would have you believe otherwise, there has never been a war that didn't include civilian casualties. I'm tired of all the crying. Are we going to intentionally target civilians in Iraq? NO. Will civilians inevitibly end up in the crossfire? YES. It is true that with our current technology, the cost to civilians in a war could be extreme. Yet it is also this technology that alows them to be spared. Regardless of what you may think Bush's motives are, we WILL in fact be liberating Iraq. We will be eliminating a threat to the world. And we will have the gratitude of the Iraqi people. Civilians will always die in war. It sucks. But as long as the just prevail, I for one don't mind at all. And we are the just. Stop using civilian death's as an excuse not to fight. If not for the death's of many civilians and countless service men, you might not be alive to use such an intellectually bankrupt excuse. I assure you that if we were not protected by our waters, our enemies would rain death down upon our civilian population without a second thought.

[Zelena Hracka]

If Saddam is overthrown, another puppet government set by the US will be established in Iraq. The change in the lifes of the Iraqi won't be that big. So, YOU should stop using as an excuse, claims about the liberation of the paople of Iraq, and the like.

And why is Iraq a threat to the world?

Because Saddam is a delusional dictator? Do you know how many like him exist all around the world? The only difference between them and Saddam is that he dares to defy the US. And why shouldn't he?

Because he has nukes, that he doesn't allow to be checked? Israel is doing exactly the same. Why don't you bomb them as well?

Or something else?, maybe

(Edited by Zelena Hracka at 7:46 pm on Mar. 14, 2003)

[M1 Abrams]

Saddam is more than a delusional dictator. In his tenure as "The Butcher of Baghdad" he has killed more than will die in this entire conflict with Iraq. MANY of them innocent civilians. THAT makes him a threat to the world. Ask the Kurds. Ask Israel. Ask his own people. And as far as defying the US hun, he's defying the entire world. Or perhaps you haven't heard of 1441, which calls for his immediate disarmament. It is this defiance that will cost him his country and hopefully his murderous life. The president WILL be vindicated. I'll accept your post war apology.

[Zombie]

"It is true that with our current technology, the cost to civilians in a war could be extreme. Yet it is also this technology that alows them to be spared"

huh?

"we WILL in fact be liberating Iraq"

wakey wakey, Iraq doesn't need u... u already done enough harm to it already so lay off the liberation hypocrisy.

" And we will have the gratitude of the Iraqi people."

like u had their gratitude when u helped saddam get to power 40 years ago?

"Civilians will always die in war. It sucks"

what'd u no bout war sonny boy... i come from a country that went through a 15 year old war and even after 10 years since it ended it's still in shit cos of 'war'. About those civilians dying in war, it sucks? LMAO, it's a freaking tragedy that has to be prevented at all cost, it doesn't just SUCK.


(Edited by Zombie at 3:18 pm on Mar. 14, 2003)

[M1 Abrams]

I'll respond to what i believe to be zombies one valid point. I disregarded everything else.

"It is true that with our current technology, the cost to civilians in a war could be extreme. Yet it is also this technology that alows them to be spared."

I didn't explain this as well as I could have. I meant that although our technology is very precise accidents will happen. IT'S WAR. Our accuracy has vastly improved and will continue to do so. Our technology while powerful and destructive certainly allows us to minimize loss of innocent life. Yet it is war and if all else fails send in the M.O.A.B!!!!!

[Zombie]

Abrams,
please go back to ur quiet safely duct taped suburban home, watch cnn at night under ur bed sheets while jacking off to the sight of the MOAB's mighty power.
If u knew a little more than jackshit about war you wouldn't be here praising it like that.

[M1 Abrams]

I'll save the duct tape for your mouth actually. I don't sit home afraid. This is because I live in an economic and military super power. JEALOUS?

[Zombie]

jealous of a murderous-capitalist-imperialist-freedom hatin' country whose economy is down the drain , school system as fucked up as it can get and that thinks bout building WMD more than taking care of it's own people? no thx dude have a good one...or not
i'm thru here this thread ain't worth it

[abstractmentality]

liberating Iraq, eh? i will simply copy and paste something i wrote in this forum a while back:

Onto the idea of regime change instituted by the USA. If one is to think that the USA is going to bring about a democratic regime in Iraq, think again. if you look to the numbers of the people in Iraq, you have about 60% of the population as Shi'a Muslims, who are "theocratically alligned with Iran." As many people know, Iran has a lot of anti-american sympathies, and i personally dont think that the US is willing to have two large suppliers of oil in countries with distinct anti-americanism within it. The second largest group is the Kurds, coming in at around 23% of the population. The Turks have been fighting to keep the Kurds from becoming independent, and Ritter and myself think Turkey, being a nice spot for US military to be in, will not allow the kurds to become the rulers. that leaves 17%, which are the Sunni Muslims, of which Saddam is. so, what do we have? a new Sunni muslim that is in a huge minority ruling over Iraq. harldy a democracy.

In addition to the above, the people that have made the list for possible replacements for Saddam are not that impressive. For instance, you have (or had) Gen. Nizar al-Khazraji, who was Husseins chief of staff from 1980-1991. i say had because he has been arrested by Danish police and is going on trial for war crimes for being the field commander of the 1988 chemical weapons usage on Kurdush civilians. an eyewitness also testified to seeing him kick a Kurdish child to death after his forces entered a villiage in 1988.
another person on this list is Gen Najib al-Salhi, who helped to crush the revolt against the government after the Gulf War. Doesnt really seem like somebody i would like to replace Saddam. if these two people are present on the list of possible replacements for Hussein, then i can only imagine who else is on the list.

[Ymir]

M1 Abrams, it is odd you think our weaponry is so precise. Remember the Gulf War?

http://www.journalnow.com/wsj/nationworld/...GBS0N1D2DD.html (http://www.journalnow.com/wsj/nationworld/MGBS0N1D2DD.html)
Army hopes not to repeat 'friendly fire' incidents of 1991

"A total of 35 of the 148 U.S. combat deaths in the Persian Gulf War resulted from what the military calls "fratricide." A further 78 U.S. soldiers were wounded by their brethren, making the phenomenon responsible for 17 percent of American casualties."



(Edited by Ymir at 10:51 pm on Mar. 14, 2003)

[Moskitto]

they should fight wars with computer games instead...

[Saint-Just]

Quote: from M1 Abrams on 9:17 pm on Mar. 14, 2003
I'll save the duct tape for your mouth actually. I don't sit home afraid. This is because I live in an economic and military super power. JEALOUS?


In addition, so do I, but that is nothing to do with what we are talking about. In this comment you sound like an imperialistic racist. there are around 5,700,000,000 people born into countries other than their own, you do not choose which country you are born into, I feel incredibly fortunate as to the country I was born into.

[peaccenicked]

American war mongering idiocy is not new.
Spare me the Anti saddam bufoonery.
The CIA put this man in power and give him military and financial support even after his worst atrocities.

[M1 Abrams]

After spending some time in Iraq you'd be begging America to come save you. And despite my objections, we would do just that. I'm not trying to offend anyone in here. So all you non Americans just thank me for what we know my country must have done for you and all be friends.

[peaccenicked]

Having spent sometime with Iraqi Asylum Seekers, the last thing they want is american bombs on their people,
and as in the last war on their water purification.
Perhaps if you studied the whole situation, instead of parroting the filthy lies about limiting innocent casualities. I might even consider you as someone with a questioning mind.
BTW. Your signiture is sick.

(Edited by peaccenicked at 1:04 am on Mar. 15, 2003)

[M1 Abrams]

With all do respect, your assesment of my mind won't make me lose any sleep at night. And you must be aware that if it was our goal to kill civilians we could kill them in droves. We could quite easlily eradicate every man woman and child in Iraq if that was our goal. Again, war will always result in innocent deaths. This is in fact a tragedy. And although I know your leftist brain cannot fathom this thought; we are in the right! I'm not claiming president Bush is a genious. I mean lets face it, the guy isn't winning any spelling bees. How ever his biggest crime is being naive. So naive in fact that he has an almost childish "good guys-bad guys" view of the world. Fortunatly for us WE are the good guys and have the means to decimate the bad. SEND IN THE M.O.A.B!!!!!

[Zombie]

[/angry mode]

After spending some time in Iraq you'd be begging America to come save you.

WHAT DO YOU KNOW ABOUT BEING IN IRAQ YOU SICK FUCK??!?!...

and will all do fucking respect, have u ever seen first hand war and its aftermath APART FROM ON YOUR FUCKING CNN ?!?!!
come on answer that.
[/cooling down]
and bush's biggest crime is being born. plain and simple.

[canikickit]

M1 Abrams is saying absolutely nothing. The meaningless rhetoric of politicians has no effect here.

[American Kid]

lol, so M1 Abrams calls me at work tonight. I pick up the phone:

Hello?

(first words out of his mouth):

So all your commie friends are ganging up on me...

lol, ah I've created a monster.

Out of a sense of loyalty to a (no-doubt clearly right-wing- and proud of it) good friend, I will now attempt to fan the flames, and maybe even "translate" what he's trying to say. He'll hate that. Like me, he's a writer too (coming soon to a theatre near you). But I'm going to do it anyway. Before my friend gets....uh, banned. :)

Abrams is a realist. His is a view from the top, absolutely. No, he's never known famine. No he's never known war. From the losing side anyway. It's an ace up the USA's sleave, war. We use it as a (hopefully) last resort every time. We wip it out, throw it down, and usually (unless you're fuckin' with the viet cong and their shovels) win. It's not a big deal to us. It's a ways to a mean. It's a mean to an end. A happy one at that.
Nearly every time.

Why shouldn't we fall back on it?

His is a method of problem-solving. He's rational. He actually sympathizes with the Iraqis (he's no racist...lol, trust me...), but he sees dysfunction. There's a mess to be cleaned up. And he's willing to get knee-deep in and mop it up. Even if the mess is blood.

Personally, I couldn't. He could.

And that's all he's trying to say. Understand he's not for mass murder. Not at all. But he's not for inaction either. Whether that equals the right thing to do is for the history books...

Why is this significant? Well multiply him by tens of millions and that's what the enemies of the USA are up against. A formidable, confident opponent with a willingness to do whatever's necessary to get the job done. Good or bad. Right or wrong. In other words, it's worth studying. Maybe even opening up a dialogue with.

Yes, there's a bit of "Capitalist Imperial" in my bud M1-Abrams here. But just like Capitalist Imperial, beneath the facade, is a good kid. And yeah, I've got his back. I mean, Jesus, we're gonna be famous together...:)

-AK

(Abrams, I'm off to hit the streets of Hyannis with the intensity of a thousand Carl Everetts. I'll probably be back on line tonight and we'll rap. Hope this wasn't too apologetic...lol)

(peace, and fear the Justice Knuckle)

(that should've been your name dude!!!!!!) lmao....

[peaccenicked]

http://www.converge.org.nz/pma/ircont.htm

So wrong, So sick.

[Zombie]

I've created a monster
u haven't created a monster, just another dumbass who repeats CNN shit. nothing more nothing less


A happy one at that.
yep, as long as u get what u want, using whatever means necessary, ure happy.


he sees dysfunction
tell him to look away from his reflection. the only dysfunction here is the American gov. they're the one who made this mess in the first place. point à la ligne.


Whether that equals the right thing to do is for the history books...

now that deserves a big LOL. u make me puke. so according to ur logic, we should not interfere with Iraqi business and we should not go to war and whether that equals the right thing to do will be for the history books.. what's wrong with that perpective then? huh?

[American Kid]

lol...now, now.

Down boy.

Check it out, first of all, 17 posts, scope my total. Upwards of 1500, approaching 1600. So...relax. lol, seriously. Take a breather. I'm not out to get you dude. And I'm not a band-booster for my friend out-right. And he already knows this. We constantly debate the subject of this "war." It always comes down to the civillians. I say it's not worth the sacrifice, he does. And I'm cool with that.

We're buds. I wasn't so much defending what he said (which I don't really, and he'd be aware of it, agree with per se), only trying to dampen the...lol, I don't know. Just trying to be cool about it.

So, yeah. There's that to consider before I go enducing vomiting of any kind.

Zombie, brah, methinks we're on the same side...except you were the guy who thought the gov and media work together weren't you...? Mmm. Bad medicine. We have lots to talk about.

Anyway. My first name is Matt. In Lebanese I know that means "he died" because the jeweler who works in the store across from mine charmingly told me that. His name is Sal. He's a good guy. He's Lebanese. I don't know why I'm telling you this. I checked out your profile and it was the first thing that popped in my head. Word.

I like to operate as a sort of neutral "moderate" at this site. People's ideas are interesting to me. I'm not judgemental. When I first came here I blew my top and called names and argued a lot, but then I smartened up and decided to listen once and a while. I didn't have to change myself or my base beliefs. Though I wasn't afraid to. There's a reason why I'm the only quote unquote "cappie" allowed to post anywhere on the site I wish.

Out of respect, I only post elsewhere when particularly compelled. I don't fuck around. I'm courteous to people and only fight when it's called for.

Everybody just fuckin' relax. Give Abrams some time. He's got shit to say. Just like everyone else here does too.

-American Kid

[Zombie]

hear hear, master kid has spoken...lol

u seem like a smart guy and i'll gladly go with rationnal debate with U. hopefully.

Matt does in fact mean 'he died' that's correct yes.

About the gov and the media, y is it bad medicine? meaning?

and dude, about those numbers, geez lol u gotta find something a liiittle bit more impressive... cos well errr i'm not impressed.blah.

i guess that's all, i already stated my beliefs on the topic of the thread, no more to say for now.

cheers

[M1 Abrams]

Matty in the future I'd like the existance of "THE JUSTICE KNUCKLE" to remain classified. It's my M.O.A.B and should not be taken lightly. Thanks for having my back. I'll endear myself to these lefties in time.

[canikickit]

Again, war will always result in innocent deaths. This is in fact a tragedy. And although I know your leftist brain cannot fathom this thought; we are in the right!

Not with comments like this you won't.

Perhaps that comment was supposed to imply that leftists are more caring about others lives, although I doubt it. I am willing to give you the benifit of that doubt seeing as you are friends with Matty (snigger :wink: ).

So tell me, what did you mean? That leftists are stupid? There is no place for such Stormin Norman-esque generalisation in these forums. Save it for drama class.


Regardless of all that, I think all you have done so far is shout rhetoric. Your sig is also offensive.

[peaccenicked]

The signature is the very opposite of love for liberty.

[American Kid]

I'm drunk.

[American Kid]

Also, I wasn't really trying to impress you with my stats. I was just trying to "accentuate" the face that I'm not some douchebag off the boat. I've been around a while. Whatever that's worth.

When you go to a bar, don't get a "hurricane." First of all, it looks like a girl's drink. Second of all, it tastes (this is a direct quote from me at the bar tonight): deceptively good. And it doesn't so much get you in full party-mode, as much as it just kind of makes you want to sit on the couch all night and mumble things to yourself no one else understands.

But if you must drink it, pound it. For seriously.

-Ak

like the muppets....

[suffianr]

The sig is fucking sick. Get a life, tank boy.

[M1 Abrams]

That's Mr. Tank Boy to you, commie! Okay, lets all take a step back and reflect on the situation. I love liberty. I love freedom. I love the M.O.A.B. You love people being oppressed. You love Stalin. And you fear the M.O.A.B. I don't blame you. I would too. But seriously. I'd like to issue a formal apology for caring about the Iraqi people. I apologize for living in an economic and military SUPERPOWER. I'm sorry that your jealousy is so profound. Live with it. And if you can't.............then kiss my M.O.A.B!!!!!!

[Zombie]

Everybody just fuckin' relax. Give Abrams some time. He's got shit to say.

-American Kid

AK, u're absolutely positively right, all this kid's got to say is shit.
And according to him, all the commies in here are stanilists...
seriously, get a life boy

(Edited by Zombie at 11:36 pm on Mar. 17, 2003)

[abstractmentality]

Quote: from M1 Abrams on 7:36 pm on Mar. 17, 2003
That's Mr. Tank Boy to you, commie! Okay, lets all take a step back and reflect on the situation. I love liberty. I love freedom. I love the M.O.A.B.

ok, i can see the love of liberty and freedom (freedom is an ambiguous word in itself and can taken to mean a lot of different things, so to be specific about it, i will not accept the "freedom to exploit"). but, why would you love the MOAB? when used, it will inflict massive deaths to any and every living thing in its range. this type of bomb will kill the insects flying in the air, the people all around, in a horrid fashion. i dont know about you, but i really do not like killing tens of thousands of people, that doesnt exactly excite me.

You love people being oppressed. You love Stalin.

I like being oppressed? hmm, the last time i checked the US is attempting to further the Patriot acts, a huge form of oppression. i am one to fight against oppression, whether it be the oppression of the wage labor market or the overly authoritarian leftist state. your broad generalizations are ridiculous, comparable to the broad generalizations of foundationless racist stereotypes.

And you fear the M.O.A.B. I don't blame you. I would too. But seriously. I'd like to issue a formal apology for caring about the Iraqi people. I apologize for living in an economic and military SUPERPOWER. I'm sorry that your jealousy is so profound. Live with it. And if you can't.............then kiss my M.O.A.B!!!!!!

how do you care about the iraqi people when you "love the M.O.A.B" and support a US invasion that would kill countless innocent iraqi civilians? i really dont see how your logic is working at all, in fact it makes absolutley no sense. you care about them so you are willing to killing them? nice logic.

also, can you say arrogance? jealous of you for living in america? why dont you just tell them that they are part of kiplings "white mans burden," that you are higher then them on the evolutionary ladder, and that you will save them from their savage ways. really, your arrogance is sickening.

i am still wondering if you came to this board to make an statement, or to simply make yourself look and sound like a dick.

(Edited by abstractmentality at 10:54 pm on Mar. 17, 2003)


(Edited by abstractmentality at 12:19 pm on Mar. 18, 2003)

[M1 Abrams]

abstract, I'll pose a question to you? If you could cure cancer by killing an innocent child would you do it? I'm assuming your answer is no and I respect that. However I would. Saddam is a cancer. Certainly you're not trumpeting the current Iraqi regime. Regardless of what you may think our motives are, and how many may die on BOTH sides, it needs to be done. The world will be a better place without Saddam and his like. And I'm well aware that he isn't the only one of his kind in power. If it were up to me we would dedicate our considerable power to giving everyone our level of freedom and quality of life. I feel it's our responsability to due so. I'm not on this site to be a dick. However, intelligent people such as yourself seem few and far between. They bite, I bite back........With M.O.A.B......just kidding.

[Pete]

M1. We consider "Saddam and his like" to include people like Bush, Sahorta (sp), Sharon, Blair, and other warmongering/dictators (one or the other sometimes both).

[Zombie]

and how many may die on BOTH sides

I DON'T SEE ANY AMERICAN CIVILIANS WHO ARE GONNA DIE DIRECTLY FROM THIS WAR, DICKHEAD.
53% OF THE POPULATION IS UNDER 15 YEARS OLD... HOW DO U JUSTIFY THEIR KILLING? IT NEEDS TO BE DONE???

[peaccenicked]

Quote: it needs to be done.
.

yes, but the question is by whom. The US/UK/Australian alliance is opposed by most of the people in the world and most of the Iraqi opposition.
So why are you spreading Imperialist lies. THe iraqi people cannot do it for themselves.
The Americans did it for themselves against the Brits.
The east Europeans did against the Stalinists. The ANC did it against Apartheid.
You know nothing about the Iraqi opposition yet you proclaim them dead by denying thier existence.

If there is going to be democracy in Iraq who will the people vote for?
You know nothing.

(Edited by peaccenicked at 6:22 pm on Mar. 18, 2003)

[IPkurd]

ok i'll show M1 Abrams what war really does to people, and the aftermath of it.
Check this site all u pro war "people"
http://www.answering-christianity.com/iraq...aqi_torture.htm (http://www.answering-christianity.com/iraqi_torture.htm)

[abstractmentality]

Quote: from M1 Abrams on 9:01 am on Mar. 18, 2003
abstract, I'll pose a question to you? If you could cure cancer by killing an innocent child would you do it? I'm assuming your answer is no and I respect that. However I would. Saddam is a cancer. Certainly you're not trumpeting the current Iraqi regime. Regardless of what you may think our motives are, and how many may die on BOTH sides, it needs to be done. The world will be a better place without Saddam and his like. And I'm well aware that he isn't the only one of his kind in power. If it were up to me we would dedicate our considerable power to giving everyone our level of freedom and quality of life. I feel it's our responsability to due so. I'm not on this site to be a dick. However, intelligent people such as yourself seem few and far between. They bite, I bite back........With M.O.A.B......just kidding.

I think that peaccenicked answered this well.

I do have an issue with your saying that we should "giv[e] everyone our level of freedom and quality of life." Look to the indigenous Hourani (sp?) of Ecuador, and you will see how much they do NOT want our "freedom and quality of life." i just recently saw a documentary on their situation, and talked to my cultural anthropology professor who worked with them for a few years, and they are very much against the "freedom and quality of life" that america has. they want to live in the same way their ancestors lived. when people speak of increasing anothers quality of life, one must think of whether or not these people want it. if they dont, it is ethnocide, and nothing less, period.

IPkurd: thank you for showing the horros of war in iraq. i posted some pictures of photographer Takashi Morizumi in another thread here as well.

[Socialsmo o Muerte]

I wish all those anti-war protesters would get a fuckin grip.

It's so annoying. It is pure selfishness.

If you allow Saddam's ideology to remain, more people will be killed over a much longer period of torturous time than they will in a quick war to eliminate him.

[Zombie]

Quote: from Socialsmo o Muerte on 3:36 pm on Mar. 18, 2003
I wish all those anti-war protesters would get a fuckin grip.

It's so annoying. It is pure selfishness. .

of course, because the US gov never thinks for itself and is always on the reach to help others. [/sarcasm]
And may i please add that Saddam's ideology, as u call it, was very much IGNORED *until now*.
The only selfishness i'm seeing comes from the very person that's threatening to bomb Iraq back to Kingdome Come.
i'm so sick of this liberation talk.
GET A FUCKIN GRIP.

[Socialsmo o Muerte]

I'm not talking about the liberation. That is meaningless right now.

The first thing is that Saddam has to be ousted. He is the definiation of evil. That's the direct concern. Then we will complain if America forces it's "democracy" onto the people of Iraq.

[M1 Abrams]

God forbid we "force our democracy on someone else" If someone forced freedom on me I'd give them front row seats to the "JUSTICE KNUCKLE" If I was oppressed my entire life, was liberated, and then "FORCED" to be free I would as Zombie might say wanna puke. Fuck freedom! Fuck democracy. Hail Saddam, Hail Hitler, and Praise Stalin. You fucking commies are a joke. A boatload of hypocrits docked at the port of ignorance, fresh from a trip to the seas of idiocy. THE IRAQIS ARE OPPRESSED: FACT. SADDAM IS A CANCER TO THE WORLD: FACT. THE M.A.O.B conqures all: watch and see commies; watch and see.

[Pete]

what does MOAB stand for?

[Zombie]

Quote: from M1 Abrams on 11:19 pm on Mar. 18, 2003
God forbid we "force our democracy on someone else" If someone forced freedom on me I'd give them front row seats to the "JUSTICE KNUCKLE" If I was oppressed my entire life, was liberated, and then "FORCED" to be free I would as Zombie might say wanna puke. Fuck freedom! Fuck democracy. Hail Saddam, Hail Hitler, and Praise Stalin. You fucking commies are a joke. A boatload of hypocrits docked at the port of ignorance, fresh from a trip to the seas of idiocy. THE IRAQIS ARE OPPRESSED: FACT. SADDAM IS A CANCER TO THE WORLD: FACT. THE M.A.O.B conqures all: watch and see commies; watch and see.

oh shut up, just shut up. u're always repeating urself boy... really the only joke here is you :FACT.
now go play with bone.

ps: for a M.O.A.B admirer, u can't even spell it right... geez

[Political Suicide]

M.O.A.B. stands for "Massive Ordnance Air Blast" aka "Mother of All Bombs". And M1, i don't believe he was attacking "democracy" itself but the united state's form of democracy, which many believe is closely tied in with corporations.

[Pete]

And someone who supports democracy can support this? It will be dropped on a city.

[Political Suicide]

Democracy says nothing about dropping bombs or not dropping bombs. Seeing as most people support it, it is democracy. That doesn't mean its right though. At one time, most people in the U.S. thought that african-americans were "lesser-beings" and subject to sale, torture, and inhumace treatment. Democracy works, it just doesn't always work on a moral level.

[Pete]

In Democracy power comes from the people. You cannot kill people and hope to maintain power. Anyways I am not up for this debate.

[Zombie]

Quote: from CrazyPete on 11:54 pm on Mar. 18, 2003
It will be dropped on a city.

You bet your arse it will! :(
It has the destructive power of a sub-nuclear weapon and the dickhead who keeps praising it's glory so much believes in freeing the people of Iraq! ha! the irony...
Hey M1!! if u believe in this war so much why didn't u join the army?? u wuss

[Zombie]

Political Suicide, what is it that u see that people are supporting? would u care to tell me cos i thought it wasn't clear in ur post.

[Political Suicide]

The american people support Bush and this war. I don't. But i can't speak for the american community as a whole.

[M1 Abrams]

I support the removal of Saddam. I support the LIBERATION, yes liberation, of the Iraqi people or anyone else that is oppressed. And I mean that with all that I am as a person. I may get a little carried away with talk about M.O.A.B's and democracy but it boils down to this: I could give a shit about 1441 or even Al samoud missles. My biggest concern is the Iraqi people. And while some might argue it's none of our buisiness I think that's far too easy. It is our buisiness. Because we are so powerful. It's more than our buisiness when people are made to suffer. It's our duty to stop it. Haven't you ever seen Spiderman.....lol

[CheGuevara]

Hey Abrams, while we've got the troops over there, how about we liberate those millions of Saudi women who are forced to cover their entire bodies? Speaking of democracy, how about that Saudi monarchy? Where is that legislative branch of theirs? Oh, I see it, there it is. What's that? O, they're all appointed by the monarch. O, sorry, they give good deals to US oil companies, which don't, by the way, pass any of the savings onto us, the consumers, and they've chummed up with the Israelis. Sorry, I guess there's going to be no 'liberation' war in Saudi Arabia, I guess you'll have to wait another 20 years until the next crackpot the US installs in Iraq needs to be overthrown.

[American Kid]

u wuss

I'm just saying, face to face, I have serious doubts you'd be so quick to "draw" there, cowboy.

-Ak

[Zombie]

Quote: from American Kid on 1:22 am on Mar. 19, 2003
u wuss

I'm just saying, face to face, I have serious doubts you'd be so quick to "draw" there, cowboy.

-Ak

shit i thought u'd have some originality this time, guess i was wrong.. oh well better luck next time

[American Kid]

lol, what's really funny here, is when you think I'm being serious, I'm goofing off. And when I'm goofing off, you think I'm serious.

This time I was serious.

-ak

[Ghost Writer]

While I know CNN and such would have you believe otherwise, there has never been a war that didn't include civilian casualties. I'm tired of all the crying. Are we going to intentionally target civilians in Iraq? NO. Will civilians inevitibly end up in the crossfire? YES. It is true that with our current technology, the cost to civilians in a war could be extreme. Yet it is also this technology that alows them to be spared. Regardless of what you may think Bush's motives are, we WILL in fact be liberating Iraq. We will be eliminating a threat to the world. And we will have the gratitude of the Iraqi people. Civilians will always die in war. It sucks. But as long as the just prevail, I for one don't mind at all. And we are the just. Stop using civilian death's as an excuse not to fight. If not for the death's of many civilians and countless service men, you might not be alive to use such an intellectually bankrupt excuse. I assure you that if we were not protected by our waters, our enemies would rain death down upon our civilian population without a second thought.

I am in total agreement with the points made here. I think me and M1Abrams are going to get along just fine. Glad to have you on board.

[Zombie]

Quote: from American Kid on 1:40 am on Mar. 19, 2003
lol, what's really funny here, is when you think I'm being serious, I'm goofing off. And when I'm goofing off, you think I'm serious.

This time I was serious.

-ak


SO was i, cowboy

[American Kid]

What was that you were saying about originality....?

-AK

[Zombie]

when did i give u the impression i was trying to show my originality...
i don't recall ever calling myself original or even pretending to be one! stop throwing steam at my face it's useless kid

[IPkurd]

When are you money lovin americans gonna elect a president that can read and write, throuh out history we pnly see stupied americans leading the USA. the only 1 that was okay was jimmy carter but u americans see him as a failure because he was a bit left.

and M1 ur signiture is so degrading to urself would you like it if my sig was: boeing 737, meet my friend the air port, airport meet boeing 737, oh that wasn't the airport that was the twin towers! oh well who cares.

[American Kid]

i don't recall ever calling myself original or even pretending to be one!

I'm just checking out of this one.

-Ak

[M1 Abrams]

Where are you from IP-turd?

[IPkurd]

first of all M1 i hope u choke on the next dick down your throat, and im from turkey but im a kurd.

[Socialsmo o Muerte]

Hostile territory. Must be a bit difficult.

[M1 Abrams]

Look IPturd, I'm sorry you are so opposed to liberty. I'm sorry you have homo-erotic fantasies about me giving oral sex. As far as you being from Turkey...say no more dude. I understand. And again....I'm sorry.

[IPkurd]

M1 you are so sad you think anyone cares about where your from. and so what that im from turkey, at least we are native people americans just took over the land from the indians so you guys are just fake americans no pure blood. and ur the one thats gay and wanks to the sight of cruse missiles

[M1 Abrams]

IPturd, didn't an errant cruise missle recently land in turkey? Hope you were nowhere near that. If you'd like to engage in intelligent conversasion, fine. However if you continue with your ignorant comments and homosexual advances I'll have no choice but to ignore all your posts.

[M1 Abrams]

further more, you should check your facts before calling me a fake American.....asshole

[IPkurd]

Ok ill stop with the dising but you should stop talking about america being the greatist country in the world. Your being a bit racist at times like when you said your sorry that im from turkey, and one more thing i'm an turkish kurd living in London England yes america's greatist allie

[Socialsmo o Muerte]

Quote: from IPkurd on 6:39 pm on Mar. 30, 2003
Ok ill stop with the dising but you should stop talking about america being the greatist country in the world. Your being a bit racist at times like when you said your sorry that im from turkey, and one more thing i'm an turkish kurd living in London England yes america's greatist allie

He wasn't ever "racist". I hate when people use that word so loosely. As some sort of defence mechanism. Everyones a fuckin racist these days. We're beginning to forget what racism is thanks to people jumping to use it as soon as they can.

Completely irrelevant, just something that pisses me off about people today.