American democracy. Latest sick joke - Pentagon threatens jo

[peaccenicked]

http://www.gulufuture.com/news/kate_adie030310.htm

As they begin to bomb Iraq into a "model" democracy

[Tkinter1]

I have a feeling there's a good reason behind not allowing outbound satellite uplinks, and I don't think it's as sinister as people are making it out to be.

Satellite phones do disrupt satellite guided missiles/communications, and they are probably trying to avoid that.

No one is stopping them from taking pictures or getting things on film.

[Palmares]

I can understand it, but it sounds a little harsh.

It actually scares me, coz they blow independent journos to little pieces...

[peaccenicked]

tkinter. Are you illiterate?

[Palmares]

Quote: from peaccenicked on 9:11 am on Mar. 13, 2003
tkinter. Are you illiterate?

I think his signature says it all.

[Tkinter1]

"tkinter. Are you illiterate?"

How did you come to that conclusion?



(Edited by Tkinter1 at 1:27 am on Mar. 13, 2003)

[peaccenicked]

" I was told by a senior officer in the Pentagon, that if uplinks --that is the television signals out of... Bhagdad, for example-- were detected by any planes ...electronic media... mediums, of the military above Bhagdad... they'd be fired down on. Even if they were journalists ..' Who cares! ' said.. [inaudible] .."

Do you really comprehend what he said?

[Tkinter1]

I do comprehend that, and my comprehension was evident in my first response.

If the media got the message "no outbound satellite uplinks", who else besides an enemy(trying to disrupt satellite communications) would use them?. It's harsh, I realise that.

Tell me you don't see where the US is coming from with this?

[peaccenicked]

Why is this war so different from previous ones. Does not the Penagon coordinate about the frequency of signals. Your remark seem overly defensive and foolish to me.
Harsh? Brutal if you ask me.

[Tkinter1]

"Why is this war so different from previous ones."

New technology, new enemy.

"Does not the Penagon coordinate about the frequency of signals."

What if a reporter accidently breaks into communications and a missile slams into a hospitle? How can they positivley differentiate between who is trying to jam communications, and who is trying to broadcast news? It's not worth trying too, for the safety of everyone.

"Your remark seem overly defensive and foolish to me."

I'm sorry you feel that way. I just finished a show 2 nights ago, and they were talking about the very same thing(GPS disruption). It doesn't take much to disrupt it.

'Harsh? Brutal if you ask me."

Whatever...

[peaccenicked]

http://www.chips.navy.mil/archives/02_spri...2_files/GPS.htm (http://www.chips.navy.mil/archives/02_spring/index2_files/GPS.htm)
There is an interesting article here but to say that the risk of unintentional jamming is worth the death of a journalist is a very incredible. Especially when official journalists will be allowed to uplink.

[Tkinter1]

"to say that the risk of unintentional jamming is worth the death of a journalist is a very incredible."

They were just forewarning the journalists. It's probably an empty threat anyway.

[peaccenicked]

" And this time the Americans are: a) Asking journalists who go with them, whether they are... have feelings against the war. And therefore if you have views that are skeptical, then you are not to be acceptable."

" Secondly, they are intending to take control of the Americans technical equipment ...those uplinks and satellite phones I was talking about. And control access to the airwaves."

" And then on top of everything else, there is now a blackout (which was imposed, during the last war, at the beginning of the war), ...ordered by one Mr. Dick Cheney, who is in charge of this."

" I am enormously pessimistic of the chance of decent on-the-spot reporting, as the war occurs. You will get it later."
Do you comprehend this?

[Tkinter1]

" And this time the Americans are: a) Asking journalists who go with them, whether they are... have feelings against the war. And therefore if you have views that are skeptical, then you are not to be acceptable."

I agree with you here, that really isn't fair. I didn't address that in any of my previous posts, sorry.

"intends to take control of US journalists' satellite equipment in order to control access to the airwaves."

Notice control access, not control content. All I interpret from that is, they are keeping track of who is using what satellite equipment and when. If they start to censor information based in dissenting view points, then we have a problem.

" And then on top of everything else, there is now a blackout (which was imposed, during the last war, at the beginning of the war), ...ordered by one Mr. Dick Cheney, who is in charge of this."

Blackouts aren't new things.

" I am enormously pessimistic of the chance of decent on-the-spot reporting, as the war occurs. You will get it later."

Well thats her opinion


Lets wait until(if) the war starts before we start saying the US is fixing the media. We both know that even if the US tried to, the truth would leak out anyway. It always does.

[peaccenicked]

why wait for the war to begin.
http://www.indexonline.org/indexindex/2003...tedstates.shtml (http://www.indexonline.org/indexindex/20030225_unitedstates.shtml)

[peaccenicked]

No assess, means no content getting through whatso ever.
BTW
In the UK we get taught interpretation in our english classes

[Pete]

Freedom of speach and media is always the first casuality of a war. The link that talkeda bout the bombing of the al-jezzara hq in kabul especially hit home.

[Zombie]

Quote: from Tkinter1 on 10:56 pm on Mar. 13, 2003
"We both know that even if the US tried to, the truth would leak out anyway. It always does.


Truth leaking out? lol if only it was the case. the media is controled by corporations and governments... the only truth thats is gonna leak out will be the one they want you to know... maybe i'm just being a bit paranoid or something, can somebody tell me i'm wrong.
cheers

[Tkinter1]

"the media is controled by corporations and governments..."

Lol. How did that leak out?

[Zombie]

Lol. How did that leak out?

huh?u actually gonna tell me u believe in media free from the corporations and governments' firm grasp?u actually gonna tell me that what they show u on tv or in the newspapers is the whole truth and nothing but the truth?

[Pete]

Zombie, he was being sarcastic.

[Zombie]

yeah i think i got it, sorry my bad

[American Kid]

the media is controled by corporations and governments

No offense, but you hit it on the head. You're paranoid.

Or something.

-aK

[peaccenicked]

http://www.che-lives.com/cgi/community/top...m=11&topic=3084 (http://www.che-lives.com/cgi/community/topic.pl?forum=11&topic=3084)

[American Kid]

I just wanna say, I'm gonna read that, Peacce, but it better be goddamn good and/or interesting because, basically, it damn near qualifies as a novel.

But I'm goin' in .

Fuck the queen.
-ak

[Zombie]

Quote: from American Kid on 1:04 pm on Mar. 14, 2003

No offense, but you hit it on the head. You're paranoid.


the media isn't as objective as one might think... i always regarded it as the perfect tool for propaganda and Jexster's post (which was reminded by peacceniked - thx man) pretty much elaborated on that topic.. i think jexster's post was very informative... the media is far from being objective most of the time, as it always takes the side of the ones funding it... hasn't it always been bout money and power?:confused:

[American Kid]

I feel like I'm in school again. :)

Okay, here we go.

......."en guarde".

The American government relies on a mutually beneficial understanding with the media to create a culture of fear.

Circumstantially. This is probably the one I would've wanted to see documentation of the most. But anyway, as an American, I honestly don't live in a culture (or climate) of fear. None of the peeps I associate with do either.

This fear gains popular support from the American population to justify using force to propagate an economic and imperialistic system that benefits the privileged elite in America.

Care to take a gander at my checking account? lol...a blip on the radar screen dude..Also, the war is relatively unpopular from what I can determine over here. And those who are for it are entitled to their opinion

Threats to the country, such as Communism or Terrorism, are blown out of proportion by the media who serve the American government in justifying military action in the Middle East and other areas important to maintaining the US economy and international hegemony over global politics, while attempting to maintain that they promote only liberty and equality.

I stated above that I don't live in daily fear. And I don't. If I did, then they already have won. But if I board a plane, I get nervous. And that's not unwarranted. "They" like planes. Paricularly diverting them. Into skyscrapers. As for communism, I didn't even know what it was until I joined this site last summer. The last time I saw an anti-communist propaganda poster, it was in a bar in Cambridge and it was a joke. The gov doesn't combat communism through the media. They don't have to. In practical terms, it's as dead (and as much of a threat) as polio.

There has been a long history of co-operation between the government and the media

I'm sorry dude but you've got to provide sources for a statement like that. Because I can go and say it's not the government, but the jews who work in cahoots with the media- and who are you to say they're not?

the media compete for "information scoops" and are dependant on government personnel to provide them; in turn the government officials competing for electoral support depend on the media for publicity

Again- SOURCES. That basically wreaketh of lehman's verse. A journalist's relationship between himself and his contacts is very complicated. Just ask Woodward and Bernstien. And a journalist with integrity is deaf to the word "electoral." You have to believe that.

The media is not judged based on how fair and objective their reporting is but rather on ratings and commercial value.

The alternative is any better?

Propaganda is "an integral part of technological society" and infuses every part of our lives in a "secretive" and "totalitarian" way that we are generally unconscious of. (Larson, 270) "Everything is infused with some element of a propagandistic message designed to promote uniformity of action and behaviour"

Can't argue with Webster. Nice to see a reference though.

In America ten years ago, there were about 30 independent news-reporting sources. Today due to amalgamations and mergers of the largest media conglomerates (for example AOL/Time? Warner) there are only ten.

I'm with you on this. I hate it. It's obscene. There's nothing more disgusting than corporate mentality. Fuck em.

As George Orwell put it........

Orwell was brilliant but the bottom line is- he was a fiction writer. though being a writer myself, I don't usually agree with extracting absolute opinions about the world and how it's run- from fiction- because, basically, you're basing everything on a bunch of stuff that never really happened to begin with. 2001: a space oddesy is a great book, but I'm not going to go killing my calculator before it has a chance to kill me.

For example, the media was free to report on atrocities carried out by the Khmer Rouge in Cambodia because their interests (ideological hatred of "Western Consumerism" directly opposed those of America. However, the atrocities carried out by General Suharto’s Indonesian government against the people of East Timor, that rivaled the Holocaust in terms of the scale of violence in comparison to the population, were barely acknowledged in the American Press because of extensive trade treaties and oil interests the U.S. enjoyed out of the rich oil fields of the East Timor gap (Chomsky, Perspectives...63).

I agree, there's much to be desired in how the mainstream media covers events. But there's always alternatives to seek out if you choose to. For the record, I read about East Timor in the papers while it happened a few years ago. It was fucked up.

Since September 11th media mogul Sony has developed video games that involve the players taking the role of U.S. soldiers carrying out covert operations against Iraq...

There's also video games where I can play basketball as good as Michael Jordan, or become a blue haired hedge hog zipping around at light speed. Unfortunatly, when I turn the consul off, neither remains the case.

The media attempts to make Americans believe that its "enemies" hate their very way of life to instill them with a greater sense that Americans are fundamentally different from those America wishes to carry out military action against.

I agree, that's idiotic and rediculous.

That's all I got. Hope we're all still friends. :)

-aK

[peaccenicked]

AK as they say up my end of the street. "Fair dink 'ems"

[American Kid]

lol. Good. Up my street they say:

Hey, uh? Hey how you do uh?

Seriously though, you know I'm no frothing at the mouth right-wing extremist, it's just a blanket statement like "the media is in bed with the gov", or a swiss-cheese, source-less essay like the one dude wrote, that gets my panties in a bunch. I'm not trying to be a dick. I just don't buy it.

-Ak