Dealing with Thugs

[MarxSchmarx]

I post this as something of a blog post, both because I wonder if it might be cathartic, and because others on here may have shared similar experiences and might have some suggestions.

This past week, myself and a male and female friend went to visit a former Eastern-bloc country. We were walking home to our lodging late at night, so there wasn't much traffic. And no other pedestrians. We heard behind us two guys shouting loudly. We didn't speak the language, so we assumed they were just some drunken kids. I guess a few of you are already seeing where this is going.

The voices came closer and closer. We had no clue what the hell was going on, and we went into single file so they'd just pass us. We kept walking. Soon these two guys, both young men, came up to us and started shouting in our faces. Since we didn't speak the language, we kept walking, pretended not to look at them, but it was clear they weren't drunk. I started worrying, because just looking at us, it is obvious we aren't from this country.

My worst fears were realized when they caught up with my friend, and when suddenly one of them smacked my friend's (the guy friend's) head really hard. My friend fell over, I turned around and glared at them, and they shoved me. I shouted, in English, "What the fuck, assholes?"

I got a look at the jerks. They both had shaved heads, one had suspenders, and the other had a black shirt with the ss scull and crossbones and that said "sieg heil". I turned around and kept walking. They shoved me again, this time from the head, and one guy kicked me with his boot. I turned around, glaring. But we just kept walking, and they were still shouting. They were well built, and fighting them wasn't an option. Eventually a cab came by, we tried to flag it (it didn't stop) and they backed off, still shouting. We just kept walking, pissed and a little scared, but there was no way we could take on these thugs. I really think if the female friend wasn't there we would have been in serious trouble, and I surmise they were only trying to pick a fight, rather than do serious damage, on account of there being a witness and the attitude of not attacking women.

I read about this shit in the news and on revleft and other places. I hadn't realized just how dangerous these people are until this happened to me and my friends, and I experienced it first hand. My friends thought they were trying to mug us. I tried to explain what had really happened, and only today did I manage to convey to them what the whole affair was about.

I'd like to part with some words of advice if comrades ever are unfortunate enough to find themselves in this situation. The first, and most obvious, is try to avoid moving around in small groups at night in not-well-travelled areas in a city you don't know. And always memorize what the local emergency number is. Unfortunately, this is doubly true for non-whites in white people's countries, and unfortunately now I feel this is especially true in the former Eastern-bloc.
The second is, although some may call it cowardly, fighting back when provoked is almost never a good idea.Don't take the bait. Know the difference between a full blown assault and provocation. Don't try to be a hero, especially if you are within a sprint of a thoroughfare or a store or something. Even if in a purely physical fight you think you can win, they could have knives or worse.
The third, and I suppose most difficult, is to extricate yourself from this situation. Unfortunately this is an area you have the least control over. We were lucky they were only trying to pick a fight with us. I'd suggest even guys think about carrying pepper spray if you are a potential target of these jackasses.

Finally, I am curious to hear if (1) other comrades have suggestions for dealing with situations like these, and (2) if anyone else has had similar experiences. Thanks for reading and I now have a renewed respect for my comrades doing antifa activism.

[nuisance]

I've been in situations like this before but it had nothing to do with fascism, as most incidents of this nature aren't.

[Lector Malibu]

Well Mark I have a lot of experience dealing with stuff like this. Sounds like you ran across some obnoxious boneheads (Nazi's ) The good news is you pretty much did the right thing as not provoking it further and getting out with you're neck intact. Not a fail at all. Well done.

One of the biggest things that saved my butt on the streets is just the way I carried myself.

I happen to be a pretty be a big guy but that actually means squat alot of the time.

You wanna know where you are at all times. When you know what you're doing even if you're alone you have a better chance. You develop a confidence. One of the biggest reasons people get harassed is because they make simple errors alot of the time.

Like making eye contact too much

Not knowing where they are makes a person an easier target

Walking too fast it is a sign of fear.

Not paying attention to the vibe of the street (ie how does it look, Is it really dark and less traveled ect.)

Basically you don't wanna come across a "bad ass" more like a cheshire cat (slick, confident )

I was homeless on the streets of New Orleans for a very long time. I've been in many bad neighborhoods all over the United States often alone.

You're best bet is to have people with you at night. Sometimes you can't. remember people smell fear. People can read body language.

Thugs go for easy targets.

Over all I'm sorry that that happened to you. I 'm glad it was not worse than you described.

I would also recommend carrying a collapsible baton and a can of mace. BUT if you carry anything make sure you know how to use it.

Pay attention to the street and see them before the see you always . I can't stress that enough.

[Dr Mindbender]

this thread re-confirms my conviction that the left needs it's members to be in a state of physical readiness and preparedness.

Going from what you said, which was 'both' that implies that you actually outnumbered them and had you had some decent martial arts training you could probably have turned the tables quite easilly.


And no, size isnt everything. Neither are weapons because there are disarming techniques.

Collapsable batons and mace spracy isnt always practical since its often illegal in some countries. Best to have a contingency.

Can we have that self defence forum yet, please?

I think the OP's post more than sells it.

[communard resolution]

What country was that?

If it's only one person, stay calm, perhaps say something random/nonsensical to confuse him, then suddenly kick him in the balls as hard as you can. Unfortunately, they usually only attack when they outnumber you, in which case there's not much you can do.

[Die Neue Zeit]

Deepest comradely sympathies for what you went through :(

[Dr Mindbender]

What country was that?

there's not much you can do.

bollocks.


http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=PETO_aKd5H0

[al8]

Doing dance routines won't help the least bit. I usesd to do alot of those katas when parcticing karate. They are mostly stylized and symbolic moves often with only historical references to actual fighting. It is meant as a learning tool, but is hopelessly based on outdated understanding of how people learn. Better is a hands on approach where people train basic techniques into the muscle memory through a lively but reptative action with a responsive partner. I suggest MMA or some other well rounded and modern methods of fighting that are not based on traditional mumbo-jumbo, if comrades want to get good at actual combat.

[Holden Caulfield]

on my walks home when i was younger and out on the streets drinking, and if i was started on there are a few options,

1. full on confidence, keys in knuckles ran back after the fuckers, if they just shits they wont expect it and will peg it or get beate,

2. just shout fuck off back, keep gan, "who cares about kids", if they chuck summit start on the one who did it,

3. if they are big bastards and your about to get welted fucking peg it, nowt big and hard bout getting welted by a gang of people for the sake of your pride, (if you are with somebody who cant run too good, tell them to peg it first and you hang behind them for a while, turn lots of corners)

this dont belong in this forum really, but i think due to our lovely forums regular posters and our attitude to these things it will be best answered in this forum

[Dr Mindbender]

on my walks home when i was younger and out on the streets drinking, and if i was started on there are a few options,

1. full on confidence, keys in knuckles ran back after the fuckers, if they just shits they wont expect it and will peg it or get beate,

2. just shout fuck off back, keep gan, "who cares about kids", if they chuck summit start on the one who did it,

3. if they are big bastards and your about to get welted fucking peg it, nowt big and hard bout getting welted by a gang of people for the sake of your pride, (if you are with somebody who cant run too good, tell them to peg it first and you hang behind them for a while, turn lots of corners)

this dont belong in this forum really, but i think due to our lovely forums regular posters and our attitude to these things it will be best answered in this forum

maybe if we can knock a few of the fuckers back though it will prove to the fash that the left arent pushovers and they will think twice about attacking us in future though, eh?

Personally i'm sick of them generalising us all as weak undernourished cowardly middle class students. I think its about time we stood up.

[freakazoid]

Carry a firearm, although since you are in another country that is more than likely not possible to do, at least legally.



If it's only one person, stay calm, perhaps say something random/nonsensical to confuse him, then suddenly kick him in the balls as hard as you can. Unfortunately, they usually only attack when they outnumber you, in which case there's not much you can do.

Bobby from King of the Hill - "Let go of my purse!" Then kick him in the nuts. lol :lol:

[communard resolution]

Bobby from King of the Hill - "Let go of my purse!" Then kick him in the nuts. lol :lol:

:) Better still, point at the sky and say "look, there's a bird" - then kick the bonehead.

Seriously though, kicking s.o. in the balls never fails.

[Holden Caulfield]

I think its about time we stood up.


we already are,

www.antifa.org.uk

[Dr Mindbender]

we already are,

www.antifa.org.uk (http://www.antifa.org.uk)

ganging up on fash in numbers is all well and good but what about when the tables are turned?

We need to prepare for all eventualities.

[Pia Fidelis]

I think that the scariest thugs are the upper-middle-class white kids who, trying to emulate the image of their Capitalist-driven mainstream hip-hop idols, get together in purposeless gangs and swarm/fight just for the thrills. Around here, they account for most of the casualties among young-adults. Two kids (well, 20 year olds) were even stabbed to death for no reason. Scarier than a huge group of Nazi Skinheads, maybe not, but these Capitalist-grown hooligans are in greater numbers.

Generally though, the best advice is travel in large groups, stay in good shape and try not to wander the streets drunk, as it makes you an easy target. I agree with Ulster Socialist that the average leftist should prepare himself for the worst, especially in urban areas.

[Holden Caulfield]

^^ i cant say its the rich kids i have ever feared when im out on me own on a dark night, but if they came to my area they would probs get mugged on the way,

:lol:

[BurnTheOliveTree]

If they're big fuckers just run. They usually won't be able to catch you, and I find if you're running away you a get a ton more adrenalin than if you're chasing, which helps.

If the situation is already happening and running isn't an option, I echo the confidence idea. For example, the other night, about 2-3am I was jogging through town to meet someone, and in the middle of the town centre is a massive group of chavs, all tanked on cider and looking for a fight, clearly. Now, I was pilled+rushing at the time, so I probably could've had a few of them from sheer speed, and I could easily have outran a few, but there were a good fifty of them. Of course, they shout something derogatory at me. I immediately looked up with apparrent confusion and asked "Why are you being horrible?" To which a few of them looked up and started muttering, and one shouts "What??" aggressively. I walked up to them, not fast but not slow either, and said "Come on, I'm just randomly jogging past you. Be nice, yeah? No need for that shit." That seems counter-intuitive, but being in their midst seemed to disarm them a bit, and get them out of confrontation mode. Cut a long story short, they ended up deciding I was "alright" and gave me a hug goodbye.

So, that sort of shit works for me, being confident and talking them down. But if you can, just run and don't even risk it, because there's bound to be some really evil ones that won't listen to a word you say.

-Alex

[AAFCE]

Get a blade, good convo iece

[Holden Caulfield]

Get a blade, good convo iece

not the best of ideas, ild rather get into a fight and lose than kill somebody who is just pissed out their mind

[Dr Mindbender]

Get a blade, good convo iece

no it isnt worth doing 20 years over some bonehead fuck that thinks he's rambo (well maybe 10 years if you plead murder with diminished responsibility)

better to learn how to fight and just give em a good kicking. Saves a lot of aggrivation all round.

[Pia Fidelis]

^^ i cant say its the rich kids i have ever feared when im out on me own on a dark night, but if they came to my area they would probs get mugged on the way,

:lol:

Yes, I am sure you would stand bold and fearless when a group of 15 twenty-somethings accosted you with baseball bats, knives, lead pipes and extendable batons.

[freakazoid]

no it isnt worth doing 20 years over some bonehead fuck that thinks he's rambo (well maybe 10 years if you plead murder with diminished responsibility)

Who says anyone has to find out? ;)

[Holden Caulfield]

Yes, I am sure you would stand bold and fearless when a group of 15 twenty-somethings accosted you with baseball bats, knives, lead pipes and extendable batons.

if that happened a knife is going to help you, a fucking sword would mean you would still get killed probably if you stab one of these chaps,

i would run like the fucking wind if 15 armed fuckers were after me,

[Pia Fidelis]

i would run like the fucking wind if 15 armed fuckers were after me,

My original point.

[Dr Mindbender]

Who says anyone has to find out? ;)

in the modern era of forensics and cctv your chances of evasion are slim to nil.

And with the long arm of the law firmly on the side of the status quo and right wing sentiment in general, they will throw the book at you when they catch you.

[peterpanne]

You should carry pepper spray or another noxious gas in your pocket! If it is allowed in your country a telescope baton, too. I guess even the "click" of a telescope baton pulling out will make them some respect! You can pretty beat up thugs with a baton, if you know how to handle it!