Saint Stalin ? Russian CP wants "Canonization"

[LiberaCHE]

Communist party in Russia wants Stalin to be canonized.

guaRfmY0iWA

:confused:



As a supporter of Stalins legacy, I say hell no ! He was an Athiest.

[Red October]

Yeah, it's not like this wasn't done already (albeit secularly) with Stalin's personality cult. :rolleyes:

[GPDP]

Shouldn't these guys be doing something better with their time rather than trying to get so-called comrade Stalin canonized by the church?

[Chapter 24]

Stalin was leveling Russian Orthodox churches while Nicholas II was killed by Bolsheviks during the October Revolution. The former attempted to dismantle religion while the latter was represented as a martyr for reasons why he was killed and by who - revolutionaries whose government would have acted against the interests of the Church. Now I imagine that on the very off-chance that the canonization of Stalin were to take place, it would be for strictly nationalistic purposes (his efforts during the war), but beside that I am not exactly against the proposed canonization, just confused. :confused:

[LiberaCHE]

Oh yeah ...

However I forget to mention that Stalin would definitely kick Jesus' ass


:thumbup1:

[RedHal]

Is this a small Russian Communist party or the main one? As we all know there are tonnes of communist parties. If this is just some small group of communists with some fucked up ideas then I say this is just a sensationalists report. If this is the main Russian communist party then I say they are sinking lower and lower.

[spartan]

Wow the Russian communists sink to a new low, what next invoking Russian patriotism and nationalism? Oh wait they already did that.

Mind you Stalin did temporarily allow religion to be practiced during the second world war when he was shit scared of losing all control and wanted to appease the various different people's and religions within Russia (instead of persecuting them like he normally did) in the hope that they wouldn't welcome the Nazis as liberators (kind of didn't work that well amongst the Ukrainians, Baltics and Chechens though).

Of course after the war he just went back to his old ways so if there was ever any doubt about his sincerity now you know what he was really thinking at the time:lol:

[Hyacinth]

This is just ridiculous, not that I expect much of the Russian “communist” (sic) party, but seriously, wtf? :confused:

[Die Neue Zeit]

^^^ Logic dictates that "Saint" Ivan be canonized first. ;) :D

[Joe Hill's Ghost]

I hope stalin is canonized. That way he will be completely discredited as a reactionary sack of evil.

[Red_or_Dead]

I hope stalin is canonized. That way he will be completely discredited as a reactionary sack of evil.

This.

Breaking news from Hell: Stalin sits on a throne, Satan emigrated to purgatory.

[Comrade B]

Fuck Stalin, Fuck the church.

[RHIZOMES]

LOL further proof the Russian CP are fucking insane nationalist fucktards.

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

What the hell is with all the polls in Politics?

[Kwisatz Haderach]

Yes. It's a brilliant idea, as it would discredit both Stalin and the Russian Orthodox Church.

[comrade stalin guevara]

Fuck the church,
Besides we all know stalin is already the communist
who has done the most for marxisim.

Dont patrinise Stalins glorious legacy with sainthood.

[OI OI OI]

Those Russian Stalinists remind of the 9/11 conspiracy theorists.
They want to prove that flying cows exist and that stalin was a saint and they are concentrating all their efforts to that leaving aside the class war.
Such "communists" should be marginalized from the rest of the left.
By being a nostalgic you do not help the socialist cause . You just make the rest of us look like idiots due to association with you.

[INDK]

No big deal.

1. It's the indoctrination of a petty glorification that was in existence unofficially long before Stalin's death.

2. And this:


as it would discredit both Stalin and the Russian Orthodox Church.

Not to mention the Russian CP to the rest of the world's Communists.
[quote]

[Red_or_Dead]

Not to mention the Russian CP to the rest of the world's Communists.


Hasnt that happened already?

[INDK]

Hasnt that happened already?

Well, yeah. This'll be a joke to most communist groups around the world.

[Bear MacMillan]

http://www.geocities.com/satanicreds/saint-stalin.jpg

[F9]

make him a god so as anti-theists we will hate him more!:lol:
SCREW stalin.

Fuserg9:star:

[INDK]

The past two posts have forced me to lol quite loudly.

[Mala Tha Testa]

lol, is this a joke? i didn't think the Russian 'Communists' would stoop this low, wow.

[secret invader]

leave the poor man alone
to lie in his grave he hated religion
being trained to be a priest would do that to one

is this a joke...its gotta be right?

[DancingLarry]

Actually, it makes sense. Stalin was an Orthodox seminarian, and it was under his leadership that the fiery, immediate and revolutionary power of Marxist language and rhetoric was drained of its power and converted into a droning, ritualistic liturgical creed, the insurgency of revolutionism supplanted with the submission to authority of Orthodoxy, and the creation of a vast and complex iconography that did more to make communism Russian than to make Russia communist. He makes a much better Orthodox Saint than revolutionary leftist.

[Comrade Frenky]

Don't insult the great leader with this filth, fuck the church

I am very disappointed that there is an option where it says "screw Stalin".
This is communist forum and a place where we all should stand united and discuss our differences and not insult someones elses views on communism and heros.
And let us not forget who was the one to stop Hitler and help spread communisam on evry part of the world. You can dislike his views on communism but not those facts.

[Trystan]

Don't insult the great leader with this filth, fuck the church

I am very disappointed that there is an option where it says "screw Stalin".
This is communist forum and a place where we all should stand united and discuss our differences and not insult someones elses views on communism and heros.
And let us not forget who was the one to stop Hitler and help spread communisam on evry part of the world. You can dislike his views on communism but not those facts.

Shut up.

http://www.geocities.com/satanicreds/saint-stalin.jpg

:lol:

Screw Stalin!

[Raúl Duke]

The Russian CP thinking of the canonization of Stalin?? WTF :huh:

I think that's a pretty stupid act and that the Russian CP should stop calling themselves marxists (or materialists) or communists in any sense of the word.

This is surely like a whole new low for a CP.

[Cheung Mo]

A summary of the CPRF's platform:

1. We hate Jews and homosexuals.

2. We support bourgeois and mafioso millionaire and billionaires running under our party's banner.

3. Screw theory. Who needs to read the works of Marx, Lenin, Trotsky, and a bunch of other dead revolutionary leaders and philosophers when we can spend our days putting our fingers in our ears and singing "La La La! All hail St. Joe."

4. Russian language and Russian culture must be predominate all else. Any deviation from this position is petty bourgeois nationalism even though we don't fucking know the definition of bourgeois and run more wealthy elites than any other Russian party.

5. If you don't like it, remember that the Socialist International and the National "Bolsheviks" are even worse than we are. :D

If you were to freeze a religious wacko from the USA and then 100 years from now, people who called themselves Southern Baptists (a right-wing sect founded for the purpose of preaching that the world is 6,000 years old, Hebrew mythology is literal truth, Negros are not human beings and ought to be picking cotton in chain gangs, and women belong in the kitchen bending over and taking whatever abuse their husbands give them) were smoking pot, having orgies, and burning bibles, you'd likely get the same reaction from them as you would get from Lenin if he were to witness this profound moral and intellectual bankruptcy of Russian's mainstream "socialist" organisations.

[M-L_Aussie]

The CPRF is not a Marxist-Leninist organization, it is a revisionist Russian chauvinist party which takes more than Brezhnevite conservatism than from the Revolutionary Marxism expressed by Lenin and Stalin.

Of course it's telling to see the anarchokiddies acting like the common opportunist slime they are in this thread.

[INDK]

Don't insult the great leader with this filth, fuck the church

I am very disappointed that there is an option where it says "screw Stalin".
This is communist forum and a place where we all should stand united and discuss our differences and not insult someones elses views on communism and heros.
And let us not forget who was the one to stop Hitler and help spread communisam on evry part of the world. You can dislike his views on communism but not those facts.

Unity between people like me and you is absolutely ridiculous, get off that shit before you start posting here a lot. When revolution comes one of our ideologies is going to fall into utter irrelevance, and I think I know which one :rolleyes:

So yeah, screw stalin.

[Philosophical Materialist]

Yes. It's a brilliant idea, as it would discredit both Stalin and the Russian Orthodox Church.

Most of all, it's the CPRF being discredited.

Like someone said above, further evidence that the CPRF are batshit insane.

[Ismail]

Communist Party of the Russian Federation is not Communist. Its leadership is composed of 80's-era bureaucrats and its main support is among Russian nationalists who associated the USSR with "OMG RUSSIAN GLORY" (forgetting all the other nationalities that were encouraged to develop and even created, like the Turkmen, during the 20's, 30's and 40's while Russian culture was condemned as chauvinist) and old people who got screwed after the USSR disbanded. Stalin, being considered a hero by many Russians (even if they don't agree with his politics) is the best figure the CPRF can get when it comes to ultra-nationalism. The image built up during WWII and the subsequent image presented of him during and even after the Cold War caused this. ("Stalin had total control, he was indestructible, his evilness cannot be matched, he was legendarily brutal, the Party had unfaltering loyalty to him, he could do only pure, concentrated evil and this is a good thing in a practical way because evil is awesome, Stalin was all that and a bag of chips, Stalin raped my mother, etc.")

[Comrade Frenky]

When revolution comes one of our ideologies is going to fall into utter irrelevance, and I think I know which one :rolleyes:

So yeah, screw stalin.

Funny I dont recall there ever being a large anarichist revolution or an anarchist power in the world.
In fact it is you who are irrelevant an marginal. You alike all are a bunch of spoiled brats from some wesetrn country who know nothing of what means to be in a communist country and not to mention to be at war or a crisis. The truth is your are just bored with your life in such ordinary enviroment so you wanna be radical and different so you ***** on the net.

[RedAnarchist]

Funny I dont recall there ever being a large anarichist revolution or an anarchist power in the world.
In fact it is you who are irrelevant an marginal. You alike all are a bunch of spoiled brats from some wesetrn country who know nothing of what means to be in a communist country and not to mention to be at war or a crisis. The truth is your are just bored with your life in such ordinary enviroment so you wanna be radical and different so you ***** on the net.

Could you go and tell that to the anarchists in your region then?

[Comrade Frenky]

There are none, as far as I know of. Maybe a few, as I said irrelevant an marginal.

[RedAnarchist]

There are none, as far as I know of. Maybe a few, as I said irrelevant an marginal.

I assume you haven't visited our West Balkans subforum then?

[Comrade Frenky]

Of sourse I did. Do you think that there are like 10,000 people living on the balkans or maybe there are over 40,000,000 people there. You can hardly find any communists that are not Yugoslavia/Tito nostalgists, and as I said I haven't met any Anarchists in person (not countig forums like this).
So it is correct to say that you are definitely marginal on the balkans and on the rest of the world (when you exclude bored middle class or upper middle class people who will not do anything other then ***** to contribute to this planet).

[RHIZOMES]

Funny I dont recall there ever being a large anarichist revolution or an anarchist power in the world.
In fact it is you who are irrelevant an marginal. You alike all are a bunch of spoiled brats from some wesetrn country who know nothing of what means to be in a communist country and not to mention to be at war or a crisis. The truth is your are just bored with your life in such ordinary enviroment so you wanna be radical and different so you ***** on the net.


Anarchist power.

lol

[Trystan]

Of sourse I did. Do you think that there are like 10,000 people living on the balkans or maybe there are over 40,000,000 people there. You can hardly find any communists that are not Yugoslavia/Tito nostalgists, and as I said I haven't met any Anarchists in person (not countig forums like this).
So it is correct to say that you are definitely marginal on the balkans and on the rest of the world (when you exclude bored middle class or upper middle class people who will not do anything other then ***** to contribute to this planet).

:lol:

This is typical cappie rhetoric. "Upper class"? Oh irony; they rarely come more "upper class" than Stalin. :lol:

[Ismail]

Stalin was a peasant before he got a job in the party. Lenin was an attorney. There is thus more of a reason to think Lenin was "upper-class" (doesn't exist, there is only relation to the means of production) than Stalin. Of course this doesn't mean anything.

As Trotsky said, bureaucrats aren't a class. (Stalin didn't function as a bureaucrat, but since bureaucracy grew under him due to massive expansion of industry, decentralization of administration, etc...) Government however represents a class, does it not? Bureaucracies breed ignorance and isolation from workers, so such a thing is clearly bad. But it isn't a class.

I encourage people to read Restoration of Capitalism in the Soviet Union in my signature. It shows that whatever economic system Stalin had, it was a lot closer to socialism than what came after it in the USSR. Also, why was Stalin condemned by Khrushchev and such if things were going as planned for "the bureaucracy"? Why did an actual Soviet "upper-class" emerge (backed by a growing bourgeoisie) in the 60's and 70's yet not in the 40's under Stalin?

[John Lenin]

Lenin should be canonized first, if anything.

The masses sure do love their 'opium'.

[RHIZOMES]

:lol:

This is typical cappie rhetoric. "Upper class"? Oh irony; they rarely come more "upper class" than Stalin. :lol:

Uhhh Stalin wasn't from an upper class background. Don't know where you got that from.

[communard resolution]

Well, his father was a shoemaker who employed people, which makes Stalin's background petty-bourgeois by definition. He had a relatively comfortable childhood until his parents separated, but upper class he was not.

[Pia Fidelis]

Stalin should be remembered as a great leader, not with a false title given by a false institution!

It would be very disgraceful, to say the least.

[Red Tsar]

Under his tenure, the Soviet State become all-powerful and all-conquering.. "there is no citadel which bolsheviks cannot take by storm" to use Stalin's phrase. He was the only soviet leader who seriously try to "build socialism" in Soviet Union and transformed Russia from backwards shithole into one of the world's two superpowers in lessthe thirty years or something like that.

In Russia historically there is no distinction between religious fidelity and political loyalty. Therefor S talin clearly belongs nextto to other cherished icons of Russian culture (i know this is irony he is georgian :D) By canonising the tsar and his family, the Church is rewarding mediocrity and failure. NicholasII was the worst Russian leader in history.

[INDK]

Funny I dont recall there ever being a large anarichist revolution or an anarchist power in the world.

So you equate success and longevity to credibility? Don't be stupid.


In fact it is you who are irrelevant an marginal. You alike all are a bunch of spoiled brats from some wesetrn country who know nothing of what means to be in a communist country and not to mention to be at war or a crisis.

You don't know what it means to live in a Communist country either, since there haven't been any.


The truth is your are just bored with your life in such ordinary enviroment so you wanna be radical and different so you ***** on the net.

Firstly, you don't know me so don't pretend you do, second your attempt at belittling me has severely failed, as a matter of fact your Stalini- excuse me, "Anti-Revisionist", bullshit is quite comical.

Anarchism isn't the product of boredom or living in an ordinary Western country, it is, like all Communism, a reaction to Capitalist and State oppression. Duh. And either way, Anarchism was created in France by Pierre Joseph Proudhon, and the main large Anarchist movements were in Ukraine, Russia, and Lithuania, in movement at the same time as the Bolsheviks, and in some cases (namely the Makhnovist Ukraine) the Anarchists bested the Bolsheviks and lead successful Anarchist society, until outside intervention from Bolshevik forces. Never heard of Makhnoschyna, have you?

It didn't reach the west until very recently, if you put into perspective. It is a serious proletarian movement, so again, get off that bullshit before you post here more.

[PigmerikanMao]

I think its a stupid idea, but if the Russian Orthodox Church and communist party agree on it, I don't really give a damn. If you ask me, it seems like nothing more than a bad joke.
~PMao :rolleyes:

[Bear MacMillan]

The only "canonization" Stalin should get is one with a howitzer.

[Red Tsar]

The only "canonization" Stalin should get is one with a howitzer.

What is this methods?

[spartan]

What is this methods?
Well this is a howitzer (I am sure you will put the rest together).
http://powrightbetweentheeyes.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2007/03/29/howitzer.jpg

[Pia Fidelis]

Removed.

[Ismail]

Anarchism was created in France by Pierre Joseph ProudhonA libertarian and pacifist? You should focus on Bakunin or something. At least they had similarities with Marx.

Also Makhno was peasant-centric and apparently wasn't a big fan of the proletariat. (As peasants usually aren't) This is a reactionary view that puts you more in line with Maoism than traditional (Marxist-Leninist) Communism.

[INDK]

A libertarian and pacifist? You should focus on Bakunin or something. At least they had similarities with Marx

I understand he was a Minarchist in terms of modern Anarchism but without him the ideas that people like Bakunin put forward would never have basis to originate. Don't arguie with things I didn't say.

[rosa-rl]

Is this serious? It would be a shame to canonize any communist leader in any way... no matter how bad their mistakes and errors were.

[Red Tsar]

Well this is a howitzer (I am sure you will put the rest together).

I know what are this yankee weapons. Your questioning of Comrade Stalin's motives is unacceptable.

[Colonello Buendia]

an anarchist power in the world.



oxymorons make me lol

[rednordman]

flippin heck, was hoping that this post had died down by now:D(half hoping it was a joke). I mean the CPRF cannot be serious in this assumption. If they are i dont know whether to laugth or cry (probably the latter if they are:crying:) This isn't even worth getting slightly bothered about because like a few have said already 1) Marxism and religion do not mix very well and 2) Stalin wasnt very religious. I only say that i am sad to hear this news because the CPRF are absolutly out their minds in doing this. If someone from the western media was to see that article they would rejoice and have a field day. Expect to see it in a number of national newspapers in uk soon if the news is actually genuine.:(.

[Trystan]

Uhhh Stalin wasn't from an upper class background. Don't know where you got that from.

It was the fact that he was at the head of a Red aristocracy. :)