Withdrawal from Iraq

[BobKKKindle$]

It is now accepted that the arguments made to justify the invasion of Iraq were illegitimate, and the debate has now shifted to the issue of whether the occupation troops should withdraw now, or maintain the occupation of Iraq. The argument put forward in favor or maintaining the occupation is the issue of sectarian violence - if the troops withdraw now, there will be nothing to stop the outbreak of mass violence between the various ethnic/religious groups which comprise Iraq's population, and thus there will be further loss of life and the country will descend into chaos.

What are the main arguments against this position? Is there really mass sectarian violence in Iraq? Against whom are the resistance operations in Iraq directed? How will the situation on Iraq develop if the occupying forces do withdraw immediately?

Statistically, polls have consistently shown that a majority of Iraqis favor immediate withdrawal and support attacks directed against occupying forces, although levels of support are lower for the Shia population. However, media broadcasts suggest that most of the attacks which occur in Iraq are sectarian - is this a reliable indication of what is happening in Iraq?

[Sugar Hill Kevis]

What you said about Iraqi national opinion on the occupation is quite true. As far as I've heard circa. 80% of the population want the removal of the foreign troops and 50% believe they're entitled to resist the occupying forces. Highly understandable given a death toll in excess of 600,000 and millions left as refugees both abroad and in their own country.

The way I see it; if most attacks are being carried out by sectarian groups on each other - then there already exists this perpetual state of civil war. The prevention of civil war is always given as an excuse for the continued placement of US troops in Iraq, but it looks like it's already underway, just goaded by American rhetoric of "sectarian violence".

[Saorsa]

What sectarian violence there is in Iraq comes as a direct result of the US's divide and rule tactics. The US has purposefully put in place policies that bemefit Kurds and Shi'ites and disadvantage Sunni's in order to divide the people of Iraq against each other, and prevent them from uniting against the common enemy, foreign imperialism.

It's very similar to what the British did in Northern Ireland, playing the Protestant workers off against the Catholics through giving them many benefits that were denied to their Catholic counterparts, and in doing so ensuring that sectarian conflicts would undermine the national liberation struggle in the occupied 6 counties.

[ArabRASH]

Not to mention that the really crazy Sunnis(Al Qaeda etc...) were not present in Iraq before the US occupation. THEY MOVED THERE TO FIGHT THE USA!! So it's the USA that brought them there, and when they leave, there definitely going to fight their next enemy the shiites. Do i support withdrawal? I honestly don't know...We're damned if we do and we're damned if we don't.

[KrazyRabidSheep]

All I can say is I'm glad I'm not a politician. There are no good choices for them right now. As a non-politician I can say get out without worrying about the aftermath and my political career.

Many of them brought it upon themselves when they started this war.

Others are new to the arena and inherited this problem.

[Cybersomatix]

I'm going to say two things. One of them is going to be very much less popular here then the other. To preface this, I'll point out that the sectarian tensions in Iraq and throughout the region go back far before the breakup of the Ottomon Empire where exacerbated by the map of Iraq as laid out by the British and further complicated by the rise of the Ba'th party, the instability caused by US involvement in Iran culminating in the 1979 Iranian revolution and the subsequent Iran-Iraq war. The 1990 annaxation of Iraq's 1930 territorial claims in Kuwait, the 12 years of bombing and sanctions and the 2003 invasion and occupation are only the cherry atop the cream for Iraqi tensions.

That said, I believe in so far as the present mess has been caused primarily by American and British neo-imperial actors, that these actors are responsible for cleaning this mess up. I thus believe that the occupation should continue until which point there is a forseeable possibility of a clean withdrawl from Iraq.

Furthermore, I believe that American and British forces are legitimate targets for Iraqi insurgents and should expect to be so until conditions in Iraq reach a more stable point by whatever means such a point were to come about.

If the US were to pull out right now it'd be a free for all betweenvarying Shi'i sects (some of them with Iranian backing) and various Sunni sects (some of them the wahabist Sa'udi sects which have capitalized on the American occupation)... Turkey would capitalize in the situation to remove the Kurds as a threat to their southeastern boarder and Iran would likely intevene on behalf of pro-iranian forces near the Shat-Al-Arab waterway in southeast Iraq (Perhaps even Muqtada Al Sadr's Al Mahdi Army). Former Ba'th party teachers, doctors and soldiers would be fucked, forced to fight for their survival and the country as a whole would subsequently be economically fucked. Over time, Sa'udi may even intevene in an effort to gain control over Iraq's southern oil fields.

The long and short of it is, if the west pulls out of Iraq now, there will be no Iraq in 10 years... only decades of genocide.

[Sam_b]

What sectarian violence there is in Iraq comes as a direct result of the US's divide and rule tactics. The US has purposefully put in place policies that bemefit Kurds and Shi'ites and disadvantage Sunni's in order to divide the people of Iraq against each other, and prevent them from uniting against the common enemy, foreign imperialism

Absolutely. It says a lot that the majority of Iraqi marriages were between between Sunni and Shias before the troops went in.

[ckaihatsu]

http://www.ifcongress.com/English/News/2008/0308/basra-fight0308.htm


On The Fierce Fighting Between Badr and Dawa Militias, And Mahdi Army


For two days violent crimes, murder and anarchy have been carried on in the cities of Baghdad, Basra, Kut and Hilla…

Under the guise of National Guard and police forces; Badr militias of (Islamic Supreme Council) and Dawa Party militias played a significant role in these bloody events that are taking place till this very moment. They are justifying their heinous crimes by saying that they are combating the outlaws, in an indication to Mahdi Army.

Mahdi Army in return issued threats to a large number of shop owners warning them of the consequences of opening their shops in Shula, Thawra and Husseinieh districts of Baghdad. They also issued threats to school administrations of facing worst fate if they allowed students going to school. Ironically they call these actions "Civil Disobedience".

Also on the last two days; people have witnessed random shootings and killings in Sadoun, Battaween, Za'faraniya and Palestine Street (districts in Baghdad), Where armed groups attacked cafés, Liquor stores and clinics before the eyes of the police forces who did not move to deter those gangs. Dozens of people were killed as a result, however the media did not broadcast these incidents. At the same time the government decided to entirely cut off the water and power supplies from the cities of Basra and Baghdad to exacerbate the sufferings of millions.

Maliki and preceded Jaafari militia based Governments are fully responsible for the bloody events that are taking place today. Instead of dissolving the militias, they completely put the Ministries of Interior and Defense in the hands of Badr, Dawa and Mahdi militias, which turned into a nightmare looming with its full weight on the Iraqi society. The events of the last two days showed how divided, vicious and irresponsible the police and defense forces are; as oppose to bringing security and stability to society who tasted the bitterness of militias and their crimes during the past years.

The armed conflict that is raging today between these militias, in which a climate of terror imposed, feelings of panic and fear are put out among the people and millions of lives of innocents are jeopardized; is part of the repercussions of the failure of the occupation project. It is part of the authorities efforts in fighting over wealth and power sharing among militias. These gangs are preparing for gaining the biggest share in the provincial authorities which are to be elected in October.

These events on the other hands have confirmed Iraq Freedom Congress speculations on how Bush new strategy would fail. This new strategy has brought nothing but more tragedy, scourge and chaos. Therefore the security and stability are in jeopardy as long as a militia based government in power.

Iraq Freedom Congress instructed its chapters in the cities and towns, to organize the ranks of the masses to protect themselves and their homes, and not to allow any armed group to put their security and safety on the line. Also the members of Iraq Freedom Congress anywhere in Iraq should take the initiative to protect schools and shop owners from those gangs and forming the Safety Force.

Iraq Freedom Congress calls upon all Iraqis to join its ranks and form the Safety Force as soon as possible to deter the gangs from tampering with our fates.



Iraq Freedom Congress

26-3-2008