The Things that I like about the US - Just for balance(and t

[canikickit]

There are many great film makers who hail from the good ol' US of A, among them:

Woody Allen
Spike Lee

There are also many musical performers who I respect and love:

Mos Def
Jimi

Then there are great TV programs:

Seinfeld
Larry Sanders
The Simpsons

Comedians:

Bill Hicks
Dennis Leary

There is of course basketball.
Witness Allen Iverson drive to the hoop and do a falling away jumper over Theo Ratliff.
Tracy McGrady giving himself an alley-oop off the backboard in last years all star game (holy fucking shit, that was amazing).
Jason Williams passing the ball off his elbow!
uh lets see....they have a great military! nah fuck that. Anyway there is loads of other stuff.

Come on you commie bastards, don't get to caught up in the hating. There are good things which have come from this "Capitalist Paradise".

Lets not forget American Kid's amazing Cancer! He e-mailed me a copy and boy, its working out just great.

Peace Love Unity
One Heart One Soul One Aim One Destiny One Love, people get ready. Revolution is here.

(Edited by canikickit at 6:27 am on Sep. 5, 2002)

[Anonymous]

omg................

[Pinko]

Fair's fair.

Certain film and television productions.
The American philosophers and writers that specialise in ethics. Carl Sagan is a good example.
The space programme, when it is not being politicised.
Fluff (that marshmallow stuff in a jar). I know it is probably made by third world slaves from their own babies, but it is so nice.

(Edited by Pinko at 7:02 pm on Sep. 5, 2002)

[Capitalist Imperial]

Here are some other small things...

electricity

the television

the radio

the telephone

the airplane

the pc

the railroad

blue jeans

the internet

rock and roll

hip-hop

jazz

the assembly line

nuclear power

the cotton gin

crop rotation

the space shuttle

... oh, and spongebob squarepants

[Anonymous]

Spongebob rocks!

[canikickit]

Crop Rotation was not invented in the US.
I remember reading about Crop Rotation in Ireland pre-Colombus.

Anyway check this (http://www.hort.purdue.edu/newcrop/history/lecture31/lec31.html)out.

Hip Hop was invented by a Jamaican, true he was in America but it was largely inspired by the Jamaican sound systems. Okay, the Jamaican sound systems started out playing largely American music, but if we keep going like this we'll be asking who invented music.

I credit Hip Hop to Jamaica.
I invented the cotton gin, and electricity.

[Pinko]

CI, very few of those things are unique to, or were invented by the USA.

[Nateddi]

CI likes hip-hop?

interesting..

[Capitalist Imperial]

Quote: from Pinko on 9:35 pm on Sep. 5, 2002
CI, very few of those things are unique to, or were invented by the USA.



Yes, pinko, they are. Can you explain yourself? I can.

Why don't you tell me who (non-american) invented some of these things and when?

You will be wrong. I will prove it.

Balls' in your court, dog.

[vox]

CI,

How many of those things were either "invented" by Big Government or implemented by Big Government?

Oh, and has already been pointed out, crop rotation existed before the US was invaded by the Europeans.

vox

[Valkyrie]

I do not think nuclear power was invented by the US either. HAhahahahahhahahahahahahahahha!
Cooked maybe but not invented!

[Sasafrás]

Quote: from vox on 8:24 pm on Sep. 5, 2002
How many of those things were either "invented" by Big Government or implemented by Big Government?I know for a fact that Spongebob was created by the government.

[canikickit]

You will be wrong. I will prove it.

Balls' in your court, dog.

Did you ever hear the expresion can't see the wood for the trees?
Are my responses not good enough for you?
Your response to my wholly positive post strikes me as negative.
I would have expected more of the so-called "Capitalists" to be in here pposting stuff in an effort to get some support behind this.

A lot of people post stuff about how they wish the US would be bombed and so fort, I am trying to prove that it's far from being all bad.
Capitalist Imperial, if that is your real name, you seem very defensive, there's no need to be this way.

[Valkyrie]

Well, I hope someone, the US or somebody else... would invent a new and improved condom.... those things are worth shit.

[Guest]

Electricity: Nobody invented electricity. It is a natural phenomenon. The Ancient Greeks had some idea about it. Benjamin Franklin invented the lightining rod, he did the kite flying thing in 1752 (Before US independence). Alessandro Volta invented the first source of continuous electric current, the battery in 1799 in Italy. The English physicist Stephen Gray discovered electrical conductivity in 1729 and the physicist Otto von Guericke experimented with generating electricity in 1650.

The television: John Logie Baird (Scotish) 1925 Most of the work was carried out in his London Laboratory.

Radio: By the strictest sense of the word it was Marconi. However he was only the last in a long line of contributors toward the development of his famed transatlantic broadcast of December 1901. In reality, though, the earliest known demonstrations to send wireless messages across great distances occurred years before Marconi was born. In January 1896 Popov published a detailed description and design of the world’s first radio receiver in a Society of Physics and Chemistry magazine. In March of the same year, he demonstrated the transmission of signals without the use of wires and sent the first words: "Heinrich Herz." Only in June of that year did Marconi patent an analogous invention, he published a description of it a year later, in January 1897. Popov's work was officially recognized in 1900 at the Fourth World Electro-Technical Congress in Paris.

The telephone: Antonio Meucci (Italian) 1871(ish) Started in Cuba, finished in the US

On June 15th, 2002, the US Congress officially recognized that the italian inventor Antonio Meucci is to be credited for the invention of the telephone, and not Alexander G. Bell, as so far claimed.

The Aeroplane: Orville and Wilbur Wright, 1903. USA. They were the first to attain powered, sustained and stable fight, although they were not the first to invent an aeroplane. The first flight was in a mill in England in 1848 by one John Stringfellow, who's steam powered aircraft flew straight and true for 10 yards before crashing into a wall and destroying its fragile frame.

The personal computer: Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak made the first ready-made personal computer in 1977, USA.

The Railway: George Stephenson (England) 1814 whilst working in the Killingworth Colliery. His steam locomotive was based on James Watt's (Scotland) rotary steam engine. In 1819 he was given the task of building a eight mile railroad from Hetton to the River Wear at Sunderland.

Blue Jeans: Levi Strauss , (USA) 1849. Strauss was a Bavarian who moved to the US in 1847.

The Internet: USA (mostly). Paul Baran, Rand Corp. He invented the concept of a computer network that had no central authority, and which distributed data in packets. Put to work on Arpanet which went live in 1969, and got its first public demonstration in 1972. The IP protocol was defined in May, 1974, the Institute of Electrical and Electronic Engineers (IEEE) published a paper entitled "A Protocol for Packet Network Interconnection." The paper's authors (Vinton Cerf and Robert Kahn) described a protocol called "TCP" that incorporated both connection-oriented and datagram services.
It was not until 1989 that Tim Berners-Lee, a scientist at the European Laboratory for Particle Physics in Geneva, proposed the World Wide Web.

Rock & Roll: USA probably.

Hip-Hop: Widely acredited to Clive Campbell (aka Kool Herc) although music is an evolution. USA.

Jazz: Again an evolution from black music. USA

*Note I am not disputing the music scene.

The Assembly Line: Ransom E. Olds (USA) 1901. Although Henry Ford is generally accredited with this, he only refined Olds' idea by installing conveyor belt to improve on efficiency.

Nuclear Power: The first Nuclear power plant to open for comercial purposes was at Calder Hall in England in 1955 (connected to the national drid in 1956).
In 1947, the US Atomic Energy Comission started to look into possibly of using atomic energy for peaceful uses and in December, 1951, the first usable electricity from nuclear energy was produced at the National Reactor Testing Station, later called the Idaho National Engineering Laboratory (enough to light four light bulbs).
On December 2, 1942, the first controlled nuclear chain reaction was initiated in Chicago by Leo Szilard and Enrico Fermi.

The Cotton Gin: Eli Whitney (USA) 1794. I didn't know what this was until today, heheh.

Crop Rotation: There are several people accredited with inventing crop rotation, but any claim that it was invented in the last two or three hundred years is abolutely rediculous. Crop rotation has been practiced for centuries, possibly millenia.
Among those given credit are: Jethrow Tull (UK, 1674-1741), Viscount Townshend (UK, 1674-1738), Thomas Coke, Earl of Leicester (UK, 1752-1842), George Washington (USA, 1732-1799), George Washington Carver (USA, 1860-1943).

The Space Shuttle: Yeah yeah, we all know about that.

Noone in their right mind would argue that Songe Bob and Square Pants is anything other than a concoction of the US.

OK six out of seventeen isn't exactly most (not even half) but I was drunk when I posted that remark. So defend those that I dispute. The ball is returned, your play.

[Pinko]

Ooops. I know it is probably obvious, but that last post was mine.
I don't know, going round displaying my IP to any and sundry, what ever next? Forget my own password?

[Capitalist Imperial]

Electricity: Of course, you are right, nobody invented electricity, but I submit that the US was tthe 1st to practicaly generate it and deliver it to the world for everyday use. Ben Franklin, colonial patriot and American founding father, was the 1st to intentionally manipulate electricity. Volta did invent the 1st battery, but it was americans that created actual generated electricity, both in DC current (American Edison) and Alternating Current (Tesla, American), The 1st Electric generation facility built in San Francisco. The 1st hydroelectric plant was built in the USA also (wisconsin)

So, for all intents and purposes, the US in fact 1st genereated electricity and delivered it to the world.


TV: Actually, it was American Philo Farnsworth:

http://vava.essortment.com/whoinventedfir_rskl.htm

it made its debut at the 1927 New York's world fair. Critics said about it, "commercial use uncertain", LOL

The Radio: Nikola Tesla (1856-1943), born in Croatia (at that time within Austro-Hungary), is well known and need not be particularly introduced. We feel it is necessary to cite his own words that he was equally proud of his Croatian motherland and Serbian descent. He was, however, an American using american resources when he invented the radio and AC. He is the father of alternating electrical current technology and the three phase system. He is equally known by his contribution to the high frequency technology and wireless communications. The impact of Tesla's numerous inventions (more than 700 patents) on the development of modern civilization is immeasurable. The unit for magnetic induction Tesla, was named after him. He refused to receive the Nobel prize which he had to share with T.A. Edison. In 1942 the American Supreme Court decided that Tesla invented the Radio, not Marconi.


Telephone:While Alexander Graham Bell was experimenting with telegraph instruments in the early 1870s, he realized it might be possible to transmit the human voice over a wire by using electricity. By March 1876 he made a transmission, but the sound was very faint.
He improved his results over the next few months, including a critical test with this instrument on November 26, when he transmitted sound clearly between Cambridge and Salem, Massachusetts. It functioned as both a transmitter and a receiver.

I have not heard about the congressional resolution to change credit. I willresearch that. Even if it was in fact Meucci, apparently he finished it in the US. Was he a US citizen when it was invented?


The locomotive was invented by Ephraim Shay, a Michigan lumberman, and was designed for logging railroads where the tracks are often temporary and always in bad condition, with sharp curves and steep grades. Their small wheels make Shays slow but since every wheel is driven, they are able to pull heavy loads for their size. With the engine mounted up high on the side of the loco, the valve gear and motion are less likely to be damaged if the loco leaves the track runs into a log fallen from a previous train. Many Shays were built to a narrower gauge than our standard gauge which enabled them to negotiate sharper curves and allowed the operator to install lighter rail, a considerable saving when working way out in the bush. Shay locomotives are either two-truck with eight wheels (like the one we use) or three-truck with twelve wheels. Shay locomotives are known as "gear locomotives" because of the gear drive to the wheels.

Nuclear Power: Italian immigrant Enrico Fermi, a refugee in the United States, is given the task of building an experimental nuclear reactor within US research labs and with US resources. The 0.5-Watt "Fermi pile" consists of 400 tons of graphite, 6 tons of uranium metal and 34 tons of uranium oxide. Neutron-absorbing cadmium rods control the reaction. On 2 December 1942, Enrico Fermi triggers the first chain reaction in history. It lasts several minutes.


I concede, I was premature on the crop rotation claim.

As for the railroad, You are in fact correct, George Stephenson. I confused this with the USA's using the railroad to settle the west, and leading to the establishment of time zones.

SO, by my count, I'm at 15 of 17 (maybe 15.5, crop rotation still being diputable)

Oh, can I add the artificial heart, the telegraph, and the light bulb?

[suffianr]

Philo Farnswrth didn't invent television, all by himself. It is almost a tie between Farnsworth, Vladimir Zworykin, John Logie Baird and Charles Francis Jenkins.

He did win the "priority of invention" patent from the US Patent Office in 1935, though. And tested his invention at the New York World's Fair in 1939. So did Zworykin.

But the world's first public demonstration was by John Logie Baird, on January 23, 1926.

You can't bullshit me, CI. I'm studying for an American degree. I took the television course a semester ago. Bollocks.

[Pinko]

[Capitalist Imperial]
"I have not heard about the congressional resolution to change credit. I will research that. Even if it was in fact Meucci, apparently he finished it in the US. Was he a US citizen when it was invented?

Does that matter? Most of the scientists that completed the work on the first nuclear reactor were technically illegal imigrants at the time of their work.
As for the arguement about the invention of comercially viable electricity, hinging on the arguement that the US was the first to build a comercial used generator, the same arguement could be made for nuclear power (the first comercially used reactor was built in the UK).
Ultimately, most of the debatable inventions were were international efforts, with people drawing on each others research. Sometimes the inventor doesn't get the patent for various reasons (the link to the information about Philo Farnsworth for example mentions that he couldn't afford a patent and someone else go there before him by replicating his research).

I don't know how you did it, but you managed to fan a few embers of national pride that I thought were long since extinguished. Shame on me.
Ultimately, the US is responsible for bringing many things to the world and I will not deny them those that they did. But every country contributes something. The music of the western world stems from Africa, in an evolution through slavery, emancipation and good times after.
Technological achievement is also an evolution though, each relying on the invention of the components used. It can all be traced back to the first rock (or stick) throw by man.

Capitalism will have the resources to do more research into inventions, but it will not use them in an egalitarian manner. Communism (until its evolutionary completion negates the need for money or the state) will have less resources to throw at a problem (except manpower), they will typically use existing technologies to solve a problem in a clever fashion (as suppoed to inventing new technologies), but will try to make the results of this research equally avaliable to everyone regardless of class.

The USA has bought to the world many things that have had positive and/or negative impacts. I don't hate everything to do with the US, I am strongly opposed to some of its values and its conduct on the world stage though.
I believe it can change and can be a more socially productive member of the world, but it will take time.
Social growth needs to happen at the same rate as technological growth, otherwise out technology will far outstrip our social development and therfore our capability to handle it responsibly. As technologies become more and more powerful and world shaping we need to be able to handle those technologies responsibly otherwise we will find ourselves sitting in the smoking ruins of our world.

(Edited by Pinko at 9:18 pm on Sep. 7, 2002)

[Anonymous]

Quote: from La Rainbeaux on 8:06 am on Sep. 6, 2002

Quote: from vox on 8:24 pm on Sep. 5, 2002
How many of those things were either "invented" by Big Government or implemented by Big Government?I know for a fact that Spongebob was created by the government.


Please provide evidence to support your claim.

[Storman Normin]

Dark Cappie is the same opne i am humouring. The same user. yes yes.

[Anonymous]

Excuse me?

[Storman Normin]

It says in the bible

THOU SHALT NOT LIE.

[Capitalist Imperial]

Quote: from Pinko on 9:12 pm on Sep. 7, 2002
[Capitalist Imperial]
"I have not heard about the congressional resolution to change credit. I will research that. Even if it was in fact Meucci, apparently he finished it in the US. Was he a US citizen when it was invented?

Does that matter? Most of the scientists that completed the work on the first nuclear reactor were technically illegal imigrants at the time of their work.
As for the arguement about the invention of comercially viable electricity, hinging on the arguement that the US was the first to build a comercial used generator, the same arguement could be made for nuclear power (the first comercially used reactor was built in the UK).
Ultimately, most of the debatable inventions were were international efforts, with people drawing on each others research. Sometimes the inventor doesn't get the patent for various reasons (the link to the information about Philo Farnsworth for example mentions that he couldn't afford a patent and someone else go there before him by replicating his research).

I don't know how you did it, but you managed to fan a few embers of national pride that I thought were long since extinguished. Shame on me.
Ultimately, the US is responsible for bringing many things to the world and I will not deny them those that they did. But every country contributes something. The music of the western world stems from Africa, in an evolution through slavery, emancipation and good times after.
Technological achievement is also an evolution though, each relying on the invention of the components used. It can all be traced back to the first rock (or stick) throw by man.

Capitalism will have the resources to do more research into inventions, but it will not use them in an egalitarian manner. Communism (until its evolutionary completion negates the need for money or the state) will have less resources to throw at a problem (except manpower), they will typically use existing technologies to solve a problem in a clever fashion (as suppoed to inventing new technologies), but will try to make the results of this research equally avaliable to everyone regardless of class.

The USA has bought to the world many things that have had positive and/or negative impacts. I don't hate everything to do with the US, I am strongly opposed to some of its values and its conduct on the world stage though.
I believe it can change and can be a more socially productive member of the world, but it will take time.
Social growth needs to happen at the same rate as technological growth, otherwise out technology will far outstrip our social development and therfore our capability to handle it responsibly. As technologies become more and more powerful and world shaping we need to be able to handle those technologies responsibly otherwise we will find ourselves sitting in the smoking ruins of our world.

(Edited by Pinko at 9:18 pm on Sep. 7, 2002)


Yes, I agree, pinko, you and I could spilt hairs all day on already debatable technicalities of who 1st invented what when. I also agree than many inventions are actually international efforts or are based on evolutions of previous technologies (i.e. telegraph to telephone).

My point is that, while capitalism is not a perfect system, I think it is the best system in existence right now as it is, when employed correctly, highly utilitarian, and rewards innovation and progress, which yields a net benefit for humanity overall that communism would be hard pressed to match.

[guerrillaradio]

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 8:32 pm on Sep. 5, 2002
crop rotation

LMAO...that was used by Anglo-Saxons in about 100 AD!!!

Anyways, good things about the US:

Some excellent films (although in general, US films are terrible)
Some excellent music (although in general, US music sucks)
Some excellent TV shows (The Simpsons, South Park, Jackass...although in general US comedy is awful)
New York is/was a fascinating city (I haven't been in the last 12 months)

[Frosty]

Games

[Pinko]

[guerrillaradio]
"LMAO...that was used by Anglo-Saxons in about 100 AD!!! "

The Germanic invasion of England didn't start until about 450 AD.

(Edited by Pinko at 10:23 pm on Sep. 7, 2002)

[Capitalist Imperial]

Quote: from guerrillaradio on 9:57 pm on Sep. 7, 2002

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 8:32 pm on Sep. 5, 2002
crop rotation

LMAO...that was used by Anglo-Saxons in about 100 AD!!!

Anyways, good things about the US:

Some excellent films (although in general, US films are terrible)
Some excellent music (although in general, US music sucks)
Some excellent TV shows (The Simpsons, South Park, Jackass...although in general US comedy is awful)
New York is/was a fascinating city (I haven't been in the last 12 months)


Come on, Gueradillo, get serious.

The US is is known to have the world's greatest movies. I hope you're not going to compare the likes of american cinema to the travesty and bastions of drudgery and film-noir catastrophies that are french foreign films and british bore-athons.

We have basically invented all modern music, from jazz to blues, to rock to hip-hop, to house and techno, metal, country, funk, folk. The list goes on and on. America is responsible for the cultural revolution that is modern music and the youth culture that it spawned.

And TV? How can you even claim that American TV sucks? America is the Mecca of television, we invented the thing (see above debate, I stand by my position and any who researches objectively will come to the same conclusion), let alone we by far have the best programming, most technology, and most $$$ and resources invested in our television industry. Its not even a contest. The only thing that comes remotely close are those crazy game shows on japaneze television. The japanese know how to do TV. They are much quicker learners than Europeans.

Granted a lot of it is brainless cheese, but often the best TV is.

[Frosty]

Why are you using the term "we"?

"Granted a lot of it is brainless cheese, but often the best TV is"
which is why i haven't watched TV for months now.

[Capitalist Imperial]

Because I am american, and I identify with my nation.

I pay taxes here, I pledge my alliegance here, so I can say "We".

Why shouldn't I?

Why wouldn't I?

I am part of the phenomeneon, the enigma, the world-political fast-tracker, that is the United States of America, and proud to say so.

"We" is a 100% accurate and legitimate representation of my inclusion.

[canikickit]

the likes of american cinema to the travesty and bastions of drudgery and film-noir catastrophies that are french foreign films and british bore-athons

Are you actually trying to tell the man what his opinion is?
"French foreign films": what great use of English. What about all the French domestic films.
America pumps out far more films than any other country, the majority of them are shit, and aimed towards uneducated people / children
The likes of Spiderman, Rambo, Predator, Die Hard....the list can go on; they have no depth or character development, they have explosions and special effects.

I do not think that all American films are bad, but proportionatly, I believe so called "foreign" films are more intelligent, and for me more enjoyable.

This however is a matter of opinion, and I don't really give a shit. Fuck it.

[Capitalist Imperial]

"French foreign films" is a term we use here in the US. It is redundant, I know, but it is just a term.

Please do not testmy command of english, as I am confident that it is better than yours.

[canikickit]

That term is very stupid. I'm not "testing", you.
I have very little confidence in your confidence, you know nothing about me. My English is very good, and Americans have bastardised the language to suit there own needs.

"winningest" for example, is a word which seems to be in common usage in American sport today. This is not a proper word. It is, in fact, one of the stupidest things I've heard.

Anyway, I see that "French foreign films" is a phrase used.

What makes you so confidant? Why would you assume?

[Pinko]

Most of the good films to come out of Hollywood are written or produced by people foreign to the US. They go there because that is where the money is.
If US TV programming is so good, why is British compedy so popular over there?

At the end of the day, the majority of countries have shite on TV for most of the time. Everywhere has a cream that floats to the top, the US has more channels and therefore has much more shite to produce a layer of cream on.

[Capitalist Imperial]

Quote: from canikickit on 11:11 pm on Sep. 7, 2002


" Americans have bastardised the language to suit there own needs."




The correct word to use is "their". LOL

[Capitalist Imperial]

Quote: from Pinko on 11:28 pm on Sep. 7, 2002
Most of the good films to come out of Hollywood are written or produced by people foreign to the US. They go there because that is where the money is.
If US TV programming is so good, why is British compedy so popular over there?

At the end of the day, the majority of countries have shite on TV for most of the time. Everywhere has a cream that floats to the top, the US has more channels and therefore has much more shite to produce a layer of cream on.


"Most of the good films to come out of Hollywood are written or produced by people foreign to the US."

You may want to change "Most" to:

"a few, but not even close to most".

"If US TV programming is so good, why is British compedy so popular over there?"

To the contrary it is not, it is highly unpopular. Americans make fun at british attempts at comedy as meaningless, foolish, and boring.

Mr.Bean is OK

Ab Fab was ok, but it got cancelled.

Benny Hill was OK, too.

Monty Python was probably your best export, but even they wer hit and miss.

Again, british comedy is not even close to popular here.

You know who is funny? Canadians. Countless popular, star-quality, marquee comedians got their start in Canada.


"At the end of the day, the majority of countries have shite on TV for most of the time. Everywhere has a cream that floats to the top, the US has more channels and therefore has much more shite to produce a layer of cream on."

It is still the best crap out there.

[canikickit]

The correct word to use is "their". LOL

Yeah, good one. Someone call an ambulance to stitch my sides back together.
I like the way you avoided the rest of my post.

[Capitalist Imperial]

why should I? Your error demonstrated my whole point.

As for the rest of your post, language is not a limited absolute. It is evolutionary. It is constantly being ammended, and added to. Who are you to say that "winningist" isn't just a new, emrging form of the root word "win"?

(Edited by Capitalist Imperial at 11:46 pm on Sep. 7, 2002)

[canikickit]

"winningest" just seems like a stupid word to me.
It is more sensible to say the team which won the most. Why make shortcuts? What you say about evolution is true. However I think "winningest" is an unwieldy word.

Everyone makes mistakes typing:

You know who is funny? Canadians.

"are" funny. "Canadians is funny"


why should I?

"Why" should have a capital letter.

You're just being fucking stupid trying to correct my grammer in a typed message. Do you think I should spellcheck all my posts?

Americans say things like "Led Zeppelin rules", "Led Zeppelin rule" would be grammatically correct.
"Portland is ahead by ten"
Portland are ahead by ten.

[Frosty]

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 11:46 pm on Sep. 7, 2002
Because I am american, and I identify with my nation.

I pay taxes here, I pledge my alliegance here, so I can say "We".

Why shouldn't I?

Why wouldn't I?

I am part of the phenomeneon, the enigma, the world-political fast-tracker, that is the United States of America, and proud to say so.

"We" is a 100% accurate and legitimate representation of my inclusion.

Did YOU do anything to "invent" those things and genres?

If i was an american i would be ashamed of being it.

[guerrillaradio]

"The US is is known to have the world's greatest movies. I hope you're not going to compare the likes of american cinema to the travesty and bastions of drudgery and film-noir catastrophies that are french foreign films and british bore-athons."

I suggest you read my post. Most of my favourite films are American, but the proportion of good US films to bad is very low, as with all art. The best films are those that are reactions to American society however. And to dismiss British cinema so easily is typical arrogance. Have you never seen A Clockwork Orange??

"We have basically invented all modern music, from jazz to blues, to rock to hip-hop, to house and techno, metal, country, funk, folk. The list goes on and on. America is responsible for the cultural revolution that is modern music and the youth culture that it spawned."

I know. Again, most of the music I listen to is American. But it's part of the counter-culture that criticises America. I fucking hate Britney Spears and all the other symbols of Americanism.

"And TV? How can you even claim that American TV sucks? America is the Mecca of television, we invented the thing (see above debate, I stand by my position and any who researches objectively will come to the same conclusion), let alone we by far have the best programming, most technology, and most $$$ and resources invested in our television industry. Its not even a contest. The only thing that comes remotely close are those crazy game shows on japaneze television."

The best thing about British TV is that it rejects all the worst American TV, allowing only the hugely successful shows, such as The Simpsons, South Park and Friends (which I also hate btw) and a few others through. However, when I have watched American television, it has been diabolical.

[mentalbunny]

There is America and there is America, two sides to every coin.

true there are good things, but there are bad things.

American stuff I like:

pancakes, bacon and maple syrup
various bands, marilyn Manson for example (not really very "American").
hmm, what else...
I know a few nice, intelligent Americans, what a rarity!

I've never been to the ol' US of A, but I will one day.

[guerrillaradio]

Oh and btw, CI, metal was invented by Black Sabbath, and to a degree, Led Zepplelin, who were both British.

(Edited by guerrillaradio at 2:38 pm on Sep. 8, 2002)

[pastradamus]

Spongebob was invented in secreat govt labs,trying to create a Invincible army of supermen.

But it obviously didnt work out like that ...............

[suffianr]

Oi, tosser!

Who says Brit comedy is boring? CI, you've probably never watched Only Fools and Horses, It Ain't Half Hot Mum, Faulty Towers, Mind Your Language and a host of other top-notch comedies...'Fucked if I'm going to educate you, Mr Bob Saget...

[BOZG]

We have basically invented all modern music, from jazz to blues, to rock to hip-hop, to house and techno, metal, country, funk, folk. The list goes on and on. America is responsible for the cultural revolution that is modern music and the youth culture that it spawned.


You'll find that all urban music has its roots in Africa and evolved in America. As for folk music, it has existed in Ireland long before America was even discovered. I'm not saying its Irish in origin, just that it definately isn't American.



As for British comedy, you cannot possibly comment on what is good or bad because American humour is far different to European humour.

I agree that the majority of British cinema is pretty shit but there are some very good British films just as there are many shit American films. As for saying most American films are great, they are, if you like utter propaganda about the greatness of America.

[pastradamus]

Yeah,I'll watch anything with harry enfield in it.

[Pinko]

Peanut Butter. Fantastic stuff. Something George Washington Carver did invent.

[American Kid]

I wonder what it's like to be an intelligent American........?

*drools*
-AK

[Capitalist Imperial]

Quote: from canikickit on 12:17 am on Sep. 8, 2002
You're just being fucking stupid trying to correct my grammer in a typed message. Do you think I should spellcheck all my posts?

Americans say things like "Led Zeppelin rules", "Led Zeppelin rule" would be grammatically correct.
"Portland is ahead by ten"
Portland are ahead by ten.


No, you are right, I don't always take the time to edit mine either.

However, "Led Zepplin Rules" and 'Portland is ahead" are actually the correct way to say these sentences.

When we refer to them (Portland or Led Zepplin), we are refering to them as one entity, not as the group of individuals that make up the entity itself, therefore, we would use "rules" and "are".

[Capitalist Imperial]

Quote: from Frosty on 12:23 am on Sep. 8, 2002


"Did YOU do anything to "invent" those things and genres?"



If i was an american i would be ashamed of being it.


No, but that has nothing to do with my being an inherent part of this nation.

That is what seperates me and you. I am proud to be american, and I make no apologies for my country. We believe in ourselves here, that is why we are so succesful.

What country are you from?

[Anonymous]

Which planet?

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 6:11 pm on Sep. 8, 2002

Quote: from Frosty on 12:23 am on Sep. 8, 2002


"Did YOU do anything to "invent" those things and genres?"



If i was an american i would be ashamed of being it.


No, but that has nothing to do with my being an inherent part of this nation.

That is what seperates me and you. I am proud to be american, and I make no apologies for my country. We believe in ourselves here, that is why we are so succesful.

What country are you from?


I too am proud to be an american but I'm not proud of america.

It has committed horrible atrocities and once again I don't agree with the government.

But this is my home so I feel an obligation to it.

[Capitalist Imperial]

Quote: from guerrillaradio on 12:32 am on Sep. 8, 2002
"The US is is known to have the world's greatest movies. I hope you're not going to compare the likes of american cinema to the travesty and bastions of drudgery and film-noir catastrophies that are french foreign films and british bore-athons."

I suggest you read my post. Most of my favourite films are American, but the proportion of good US films to bad is very low, as with all art. The best films are those that are reactions to American society however. And to dismiss British cinema so easily is typical arrogance. Have you never seen A Clockwork Orange??

"We have basically invented all modern music, from jazz to blues, to rock to hip-hop, to house and techno, metal, country, funk, folk. The list goes on and on. America is responsible for the cultural revolution that is modern music and the youth culture that it spawned."

I know. Again, most of the music I listen to is American. But it's part of the counter-culture that criticises America. I fucking hate Britney Spears and all the other symbols of Americanism.

"And TV? How can you even claim that American TV sucks? America is the Mecca of television, we invented the thing (see above debate, I stand by my position and any who researches objectively will come to the same conclusion), let alone we by far have the best programming, most technology, and most $$$ and resources invested in our television industry. Its not even a contest. The only thing that comes remotely close are those crazy game shows on japaneze television."

The best thing about British TV is that it rejects all the worst American TV, allowing only the hugely successful shows, such as The Simpsons, South Park and Friends (which I also hate btw) and a few others through. However, when I have watched American television, it has been diabolical.



"I suggest you read my post. Most of my favourite films are American, but the proportion of good US films to bad is very low, as with all art. The best films are those that are reactions to American society however. And to dismiss British cinema so easily is typical arrogance. Have you never seen A Clockwork Orange??"

Yes, and I'll hand it to you, excellent film. But what I am saying is that overall british films are not as good as american films.


"I know. Again, most of the music I listen to is American. But it's part of the counter-culture that criticises America."

Actually, that was true sometimes, but not always. As a matter of fact, a lot of old folk and rock was counter culture, but at the same time praised america for being a great land that just needed a few changes, like anywhere. Most counter culture music is not anti-american, just against certain issues in america. Country music is usually patriotic. Modern hip-hop is pretty much all about the practivce of capitalism and its rewards. Also, a lot of rock and other modern music forms are apolitical. Maybe you are just talking about your music, but I am refering to all american modern music.

"I fucking hate Britney Spears and all the other symbols of Americanism."

I don't like britany myself, but she is not the only symbol of americanism.


"The best thing about British TV is that it rejects all the worst American TV, allowing only the hugely successful shows, such as The Simpsons, South Park and Friends (which I also hate btw) and a few others through. However, when I have watched American television, it has been diabolical."

Well, american TV does not even show 1 british show (Comedy Central [an american cable channel] showed "Absolutely Fabulous" for a whaile, and that was actually ok, but then comedy central stopped carying it.). Or maybe some local station will play old benny hill shows at like 2 AM or something

Like someone else said, american and european senses of humor are just different, I guess. But, When I've tried to watch british TV, it just came of as boring and dry as hell. I love dry wit, but this wasn't that. It was just dry period.

[Capitalist Imperial]

Quote: from Lardlad95 on 6:18 pm on Sep. 8, 2002
I too am proud to be an american but I'm not proud of america.

It has committed horrible atrocities and once again I don't agree with the government.

But this is my home so I feel an obligation to it.


Goddamn it Lardlad! Strop discussing american atrocities in the past! What happened, happened! It was terrible! I'm sorry! If I could take it back I would! Most of white america feels horrible for what happened to your people andd the native americans! Lets move on!

Here, we'll give Denzel and Hale an oscar, OK? (J/K)

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Capitalist Imperial on 6:31 pm on Sep. 8, 2002

Quote: from Lardlad95 on 6:18 pm on Sep. 8, 2002
I too am proud to be an american but I'm not proud of america.

It has committed horrible atrocities and once again I don't agree with the government.

But this is my home so I feel an obligation to it.


Goddamn it Lardlad! Strop discussing american atrocities in the past! What happened, happened! It was terrible! I'm sorry! If I could take it back I would! Most of white america feels horrible for what happened to your people andd the native americans! Lets move on!

Here, we'll give Denzel and Hale an oscar, OK? (J/K)

that really pisses you off doesn't it?

but no I didn't say that because I wanted to disscuss them.

I said it because I was saying while I was proud to be an american I wasn't proud of America

I was simply stating why I had that position.

[Capitalist Imperial]

oh, ok

[Goldfinger]

Did you know that every great civilization in history has had slaves? Greece, tha Roman Empire, Egypt, Der Dritte Reich, USA.....

[Lardlad95]

Quote: from Apocalypse When on 6:46 pm on Sep. 8, 2002
Did you know that every great civilization in history has had slaves? Greece, tha Roman Empire, Egypt, Der Dritte Reich, USA.....

Is that trying to validate it

or are you just stating facts?

[No Food Allowed]

Quote: from La Rainbeaux on 7:06 pm on Sep. 5, 2002

Quote: from vox on 8:24 pm on Sep. 5, 2002
How many of those things were either "invented" by Big Government or implemented by Big Government?I know for a fact that Spongebob was created by the government.


Sorry, but i just found that funny. Life is much easier here in the US than it is in other countries. I believe it doesn't matter where things were invented but for every place to advance, we must share and improve our findings.

[Red Revolution]

The railroad, Television, crop rotation, the telephone and electricity are all non-american inventions. and rocknroll ever heard of the Beatles or mabye The rolling stones. I can get evidence, want to see it?

[Anonymous]

"The best thing about British TV is that it rejects all the worst American TV, allowing only the hugely successful shows, such as The Simpsons, South Park and Friends (which I also hate btw) and a few others through. However, when I have watched American television, it has been diabolical."

Well, american TV does not even show 1 british show (Comedy Central [an american cable channel] showed "Absolutely Fabulous" for a whaile, and that was actually ok, but then comedy central stopped carying it.). Or maybe some local station will play old benny hill shows at like 2 AM or something

Like someone else said, american and european senses of humor are just different, I guess. But, When I've tried to watch british TV, it just came of as boring and dry as hell. I love dry wit, but this wasn't that. It was just dry period.



Absolutely Fabulous is utter wank! You want to watch Blackadder, Red Dwarf Goodness Gracious Me or particularily Spaced. And any Eddie Izzard that you can get your hands on.

[canikickit]

Life is much easier here in the US than it is in other countries.

Please don't generalise like this, I find it extremely offensive.
The US has a far greater murder rate and a far higher (proportional) prison population than Ireland, and I see few reasons why "life is easier" there. What exactly is it that makes it easier? The fact that you can buy guns? The fact that capital punishment is legal?


I believe it doesn't matter where things were invented but for every place to advance, we must share and improve our findings.

I agree with this, however.
All this argument over inventions is pissing me off. I wish I hadn't started this thread.
Who gives a fuck where the train was invented? I give credit to the people, not the country.

[Valkyrie]

It's interesting we never see a British Capitalist here? Are there any? And then who is more arrogant - an American or a Brit? With the percentage of Capitalists -- that speaks for itself.

[Anonymous]

Should i convert to Capitalism?

[Capitalist Imperial]

Quote: from Red Revolution on 10:04 pm on Sep. 8, 2002
The railroad, Television, crop rotation, the telephone and electricity are all non-american inventions. and rocknroll ever heard of the Beatles or mabye The rolling stones. I can get evidence, want to see it?



You obviously did not read my whole post, I gave the dates and facts, educate yourself. To say that the US did not invent TV is just stupid

[John Difool]

Come on, Gueradillo, get serious.

The US is is known to have the world's greatest movies.

I thought you wrote "Get Serious" ??

[suffianr]

To say that the US invented television is a little far-fetched, methinks.

Look, the television, like most other modern inventions, was invented by several scientists throughout the world, at different stages of development, at the same time during the early 20th century. Read my previous post. It lists people such as JL Baird, Zworykin, Jenkins and that nice American chap, too.

The scientists, or pioneers, if you will, were all rushing to acquire patents from their various governments, and although Baird did in fact secure the first recorded & certified demonstration of his television, Farnsworth was the first to receive a US Patent.

You can't say the US invented television, because it sounds, er, stupid.

One does not merely slap a cathode-ray tube on the inside of a box, bang a screen on the front and call it a national invention. J. Robert Oppenheimer may have invented the atom bomb, but the Russians were working on one at the same time. So, who invented it? US or the Russkies? Who invented the wheel?

Most inventions and scientific discoveries were made simultaneously by many scientists and inventors almost at the same time. Some inventions worked, some didn't.

See, you cannot tie inventions to nation-states, but to individuals. By saying that the US invented TV, you merely trivialize the inventors and their creations.

[mentalbunny]

The best comedy comes from Britain, no one can beat Mony Python!!!! I have to admit there are some great American books out there, but I don't think that's anything to do with America, it's to do with the authors.

[Guest]

Quote: from mentalbunny on 3:38 pm on Sep. 10, 2002
The best comedy comes from Britain, no one can beat Mony Python!!!! I have to admit there are some great American books out there, but I don't think that's anything to do with America, it's to do with the authors.

This is CI...

Monty python is better than eddie murphy, richard prior,or saturday night live? Better than george carlin? Better than seinfeld? Better than cheers or friends? Better than jim carey or mike myers (canadian but developed in the US)?

Not even close.

[Red Revolution]

On this site is says a russian also invented the television

http://vava.essortment.com/whoinventedfir_rskl.htm

[suffianr]

Well, I hate nitpicking but CI, your apparent lack of response to my posts on television means that you are:

a. keeping quiet because you're wrong
b. still looking for facts to support your ideas
c. convinced that you are right, won't budge and
most certainly won't reply because that is not the
American Way.
d. Discovery Channel isn't helping at all
e. really can't be bothered

If so, then I am:

a. pleased with myself
b. looking for more facts to throw at you when you reply
c. convinced that you are right, and America is right, and
I am just a Third World citizen from a banana republic
so what in God's name am I doing here anyway when
I should be outside your embassy queueing up for a
visa
d. I don't have Satellite TV
e. really can't be bothered either

No hard feelings, mate. :)

[peaccenicked]

America is 96% beautiful. The 4% brainwashed think they own the planet.

If a dog was republican people would vote for him. It is a great tradition.

I got that statistic from Bush himself. Mind you, I had to corner him on a dark night and squeeze it out of him.

[I Will Deny You]

Quote: from peaccenicked on 12:22 am on Sep. 12, 2002
If a dog was republican people would vote for him.It depends what country club the dog belongs to.

Lindsay

[Capitalist Imperial]

I find it funny that when people want to blame an entity for the world's suffering and exploitation, then the point at "America".

However, when we are talking about who gave the world the vast majority of revolutionary inventions and innovations in the last 100 years, then it has nothing to do with the nation itself, it is the individuals that are important, and the nation's ideals, resources, and environment conducive to innovation and free thinking are moot.

The fact that the US has been the leader in industry, technology, invention and innovation in the last 100 years, and has yielded the vast majority of revolutionary inventions and developments, must just be a grand coincedence.

Hypocrites

[Xvall]

America is the only country where a dead man has won an election.

*Rolls eyes*

[RedCeltic]

Yea, that is funny that you say that CI because I would have said something simmilar.

Most people who are Anti-Americans fail to realize that the common American actually has very little voice in their Government. We have elections every now and then, but most people had lost faith in them anyway... if by chance they guy you bet on gets in, changes are he's going to ignore everything he promised you anyway.

And as for all the mess that America causes, the fact that the nation is run by a handful of people, doesn't make the American people innocent, it makes them FUCKED!

[RedCeltic]

Quote: from Drake Dracoli on 7:49 pm on Sep. 12, 2002
America is the only country where a dead man has won an election.

*Rolls eyes*


If the choice was between Ashcroft and an Italian Sausage I'd vote for the Sausage.