So, today was irritating

[Ele'ill]

I heard this woman and her son at a home improvement store talking about hardwood floors. She was saying, 'oh I really like the bamboo, what do you think of it?" (to her son who was about thirteen) He replied with 'Yeah but they cut down the trees and one only grows every so many years...' and his mom interjects with 'bamboo is different than that honey, besides, I'm going green. No i'm serious, its my new motto. And the bamboo is so earthy looking.'

Never mind where the hardwood floors were manufactured and if the conditions were safe for the workers or if the wages were livable. Never mind the scourge that is the free market. I almost said something but they stopped talking before I could add myself to their conversation.

Damn it, its like the general public is ALMOST there but at the same time they're so far away and on the wrong track.

This 'green' thing pisses me off. It seems to be a great scape goat and a tool to stop mass suicide when the shit hits the fan. People will say to themselves, 'Hey, I went green and bought wooden floors, nothing else could have been done!!!111oneone'


I said it years ago to a friend. Things will get out of hand when activism and movements for social change become branded.

Your thoughts?

[pusher robot]

I'm not sure what you are complaining about here. Bamboo isn't a hardwood, it isn't even a tree. It's one of the most rapidly growing and easily renewable woody plants, that's why it's more environmentally than actual hardwood or even pine softwood.

What were you going to say to them? That they should be happy with dirt floors?

[Comrade Rage]

This kind of bourgeosie green crap is not only annoying, but it's turned into an obstacle in organizing leftist stuff (in my experience). Whenever somebody outside the activist milieu is talked to by a leftist, they usually think of us all as dated hippies, imitating the 60's and caring more about plants than workers. Since 90-98% of the average workers reject ARN BS, this results in activists being somewhat confined.

[Kronos]

Damn it, its like the general public is ALMOST there


Your thoughts?

No, the general public is not even close to being "almost" there. They aren't even "somewhat headed in the right direction".

My solution is as simple. I'd execute her.

How did Joseph put it? "No man, no problem"?

She's useless consumer trash. Probably a housewife soccer mom with a subscription to Better Home and Gardens. It doesn't get much more counter-revolutionary than that.

[Qwerty Dvorak]

No, the general public is not even close to being "almost" there. They aren't even "somewhat headed in the right direction".

My solution is as simple. I'd execute her.

How did Joseph put it? "No man, no problem"?

She's useless consumer trash. Probably a housewife soccer mom with a subscription to Better Home and Gardens. It doesn't get much more counter-revolutionary than that.
lolz.

[Jazzratt]

I'm not sure what you are complaining about here. Bamboo isn't a hardwood, it isn't even a tree. It's one of the most rapidly growing and easily renewable woody plants, that's why it's more environmentally than actual hardwood or even pine softwood.

What were you going to say to them? That they should be happy with dirt floors?

From what I read it seems she has a problem with how the green movement ignores worker's struggle and acts, essentially, as a half-arsed cop out on the whole thing. Your floor may be made of bamboo (or even dirt) but if you don't try to change the structure of our society then your efforts are a token gesture.

[pusher robot]

From what I read it seems she has a problem with how the green movement ignores worker's struggle and acts, essentially, as a half-arsed cop out on the whole thing. Your floor may be made of bamboo (or even dirt) but if you don't try to change the structure of our society then your efforts are a token gesture.

Ah, I guess I see what is being said, but it's a bit like blaming a dog for not being a cat. I mean, really, all this woman wants is some decent floors in her house without destroying the planet too much. Is that such a crime against humanity? If I got this worked up over such a thing I have no idea how I'd make it through the day.

[Comrade Rage]

*GROAN* She just wants to make some damn token gesture so she doesn't 'feel bad'. She doesn't give a flying fuck about the exploited people who made the floors, or the virtual slaves made to harvest the bamboo. All she wants to do is soothe her conscience a little by being 'green'.

Crap like this is deterring workers from becoming leftists, since we have been, regrettably, tied somehow (in the minds of a lot of the proletariat) to this green bullshit.

[Demogorgon]

Ah, I guess I see what is being said, but it's a bit like blaming a dog for not being a cat. I mean, really, all this woman wants is some decent floors in her house without destroying the planet too much. Is that such a crime against humanity? If I got this worked up over such a thing I have no idea how I'd make it through the day.

Now it may be that I am too drunk to grasp this conversation entirely, but it seems to me that the objection is that being green is simply becoming a trend and people go for such products for consumer status before going in and doing in the environment other ways and al the while ignoring workers rights.,

Now granted we need floors to stop us falling downstairs and I would rather we had floord that didn't damage the environment than ones that did, but by the time you have had all those chemicals and stuff they treat them with the environment i fucked anyway.

I will try a more coherant version of this tomorrow

[Kronos]

She was saying, 'oh I really like the bamboo, what do you think of it?" (to her son who was about thirteen) He replied with 'Yeah but they cut down the trees and one only grows every so many years...' and his mom interjects with 'bamboo is different than that honey, besides, I'm going green. No i'm serious, its my new motto. And the bamboo is so earthy looking.'

What is sickening is the casual, pretentious, surety of this woman. This woman, dumb as a fucking rock, out during the day spending the hubby's money on home decor, with her little shopping cart, and her little matching sandals and purse. "I like the bamboo. I would be unique if I had it, unlike the neighbors. And it does cost a little more, which means if I buy it, I'm a higher status than those who can't afford it. I better make sure and ask my son if he likes it, because if he likes it, it means he likes me and thinks I have good tastes....which is really the only reason I buy anything fashionable, so others will be impressed and think highly of me. Wait, my son just said that bamboo trees are becoming scarce. Hmmm. He must have heard that on the Discovery channel. Probably something those damn green peace people produced. Why don't they just go away, gosh. There is nothing wrong with using trees for this reason. There's millions of trees, jeez. I mean, its just bamboo. Why on earth would I buy regular pine wood flooring? That's not stylish. I'm an important American consumer, and I have my right to choose. Yeah, I'm going with the green....it matches the sofa. Those tips I heard on the Martha Stewart show are great. She's my idol. Now where is the guy who is supposed to load this stuff in my mini van for me? Please find him, sir, I'm in a hurry to go get my nails done. I'm a very busy woman, because I'm important...oh, did I already say that. Well, I don't know the first thing about communism, except that bunches and bunches of people died in Russia, or was it China. I dunno, but I do know communism is evil, and I'm a Christian, can't you tell by the low cut skirt I'm wearing, and the tight blouse? Hey, I want to be sexy too, even though I'm married and over fifty. Don't you think I'm pretty? You pervert! I can't believe you said that! God, learn some manners. I'm not wearing these clothes so you can gawk at me.....or wait a minute....I guess I am, actually. Well, there is nothing wrong with that. Everybody wears sexy clothes. Anyway, come on son. I want to go buy some nik-naks that were made by factory workers in nicaragua for thirteen cents a day. Hey, because of people like me, those people have jobs. Let's go son."

I don't know if it is just me, or if you people can actually see through this thing called the "American consumer". I know precisely the type you are talking about, Mari3L. This thing is like a cancer. Never before in the history of mankind has such a monster ever existed. I swear to God I would round up all the children first, take them off the continent, and drop a neutron bomb on it.

The biggest problem with this thing, this woman, is not that she is stupid. Somebody else can be blamed for that. The problem is the arrogance, the vanity, the pompous "I'm the shit" attitude, while many, many other people are suffering so that trash can walk the earth.

[Phalanx]

You guys are some of the most judgmental people on Earth. Honestly, though she sounds hypocritical and pretentious, I think all of us are guilty of it at some level.

[Os Cangaceiros]

Send this foul wench to the gulags!

[Ele'ill]

The problem is that she sees environmental progress (I wouldn't even call this green-brand bullshit progress but ok) as a material fashion statement. The planet only matters when its survival has finally been branded by corporations as 'in this year', and bled out to the public through magazines and jejune soccer mom talk shows with the headlines 'green is cool'. The headlines should read 'how to be a soccer mom in 2008 and be green? Don't.'

[Kronos]

Now granted we need floors to stop us falling downstairs and I would rather we had floord that didn't damage the environment than ones that did, but by the time you have had all those chemicals and stuff they treat them with the environment i fucked anyway.The ideal timber for all construction material is soft wood pine. It grows faster than hard-wood, and produces less oxygen than hard-wood, which makes it less important than hard-wood. It is biodegradable, unlike synthetic materials, and produces minimal pollution to be manufactured.

Hard-wood fetishes have always been rampant in the construction industry, since because of their exotic nature, capitalists can sell it at higher prices, and consumers will buy it because they think they are special if they have it. The truth is, hard-wood isn't any better than soft-wood....it only "looks" cooler because of its grain and texture. And hard-woods take more than twice as long to grow than soft-woods. They are chopping down rain forests as we speak so Mary J Williams, the house wife soccer mom, can prance around on her nice new floor with her nice new solid varnished walnut furniture.

Other construction materials are becoming more and more popular in the industry. Right now I am building a styrofoam building, which consists of blocks which are filled with concrete for structural integrity. This material is more energy efficient, and can be constructed quicker. But is a lower gas bill worth using a material that takes a gazillion years to biodegrade? I don't think so. It is mainly because of the speed at which the structure can be built, which is the capitalist's wet-dream. So, this horrible new material is being used in the industry so the capitalist can fill his pockets quicker.

Fuck that. I say again, soft-wood materials would suffice for any and all residential construction for the rest of humanity's existence on this earth. And for commercial construction, metal should be used. End of story. No more plastic, or foam, or any synthetic shit like that.

[Kronos]

Honestly, though she sounds hypocritical and pretentious, I think all of us are guilty of it at some level.

There are degrees here that should be ordered properly.

The absolute worst of them all is the capitalist. There are subdivisions of the capitalist as well. There is the capitalist that was once a proletariat, and has turned on his own class. There is the inherited capitalist, who was born a capitalist. This version is not as bad as the former, because the former actually got a taste of the working class struggle...and then turned his back on it. There is what I call the "hippy capitalist", who is worse than the former two, because this capitalist preaches peace and love and all that bullshit, but is the very monster, in principle, that is preventing all the bullshit they preach from happening. There could not be a more perfect contradiction. This version can be either the inherited capitalist, or the defected capitalist. If he/she is the defected hippy capitalist, he/she is the absolute worst that they come.

That aside, the most rude, arrogant, violent revolutionary is still better than the best capitalist.

The problem is the "consumer proletariat", who isn't a capitalist, but not a revolutionary either. These people are like an obstacle....they are neither here nor there....they just get in the way and perpetuate the disaster. They are like cogs, like pets to the capitalist machine. This lady is one such creature. You don't want to hurt her, because "she knows not what she does", but every second she is alive, she is making things worse. What does one do with the backward masses?

[Vanguard1917]

Environmentalism is a kind of secular religion for the contemporary Western middle classes and the super-rich. Whereas in the past privileged people may have justified their actions through references to god, today the wealthy make themselves feel better about their wealth through various eco-rituals and 'consumerist' practices (recycling, eating organic food, 'carbon off-setting', driving 'hybrid' cars, buying 'fair trade' shit, etc).

This is mere moral posturing. I'd prefer that woman to just come out and say that she wants better flooring for her house for the sake of having better flooring for her house. Annoyingly, though, people increasingly feel that they have to excuse their aspirations through references to modern ruling class morality - i.e. environmentalism.

[Bud Struggle]

I have cork flooring in my den. Beautiful color and it has a wonderful memory so furniture sitting on it won't do it any damage.

Well, I have a difficult time agreeing that the woman is pretentious. I honestly wouldn't have said anythiong different than what she said before ever comming to RevLeft. I just wouldn't that thought in terms of the people MAKING the flooring--I would have only thought in terms of the material itself.

The green movement did a lot for environmental consciousness in the last couple of years, something that the Communists because the Cold War and all of that haven't been able to do for worker consciousness in the last 150 years.

Not for me to say, but the Communist movement needs a new focus--on humanity. I have no idea how it should be done, but I think if presented properly it could do a useful job.

TomK--Once a Proletarian now a Hippy Capitalist. :D

[Kronos]

Environmentalism is a kind of secular religion for the contemporary Western middle classes and the super-rich. Whereas in the past privileged people may have justified their actions through references to god, today the wealthy make themselves feel better about their wealth through various eco-rituals and 'consumerist' practices (recycling, eating organic food, 'carbon off-setting', driving 'hybrid' cars, buying 'fair trade' shit, etc).

This is mere moral posturing. I'd prefer that woman to just come out and say that she wants better flooring for her house for the sake of having better flooring for her house. Annoyingly, though, people increasingly feel that they have to excuse their aspirations through references to modern ruling class morality - i.e. environmentalism.Bingo. I've never heard it said better.

It is a sad day when real, critical issues become fads that are practiced for the wrong reasons.

[Robert]

My solution is as simple. I'd execute her.

And there you have it. Communism, in its full and final expression.

[Kronos]

Alright, wait. Maybe I over reacted a bit. Thinking clearly now, why would I waste a perfectly good worker? What I guess I would do is lock her in a labor camp, and then execute her if she did not produce what was agreed upon by my staff as an adequate amount to match what she consumed.

There. Now isn't that better?

[Kronos]

Are you really a hippy, Tommy? I want the full scoop on you, man. Tell me your story....but first, watch this video I made you idiot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7lOPf_C2Bg

[Redmau5]

And there you have it. Communism, in its full and final expression.

Hardly. You know this ass-wipe isn't representative of the majority of socialists.

[Kronos]

You know this ass-wipe isn't representative of the majority of socialists.

No kidding. Don't listen to me, pal. Listen to one of the other 5,973 different versions of appropriate communist measures here at this site.

:laugh:

[Kronos]

You know, I'm actually starting to like being restricted. Everything is nicely organized for me. I don't have to remember where I last posted. I feel safe here. I've made some good friends and enemies. When I want to show off my mad philosophy skills (and believe me, I got em), I can go fuck with ID-Guy.

I still want the ants-beat-the-spiders chick to come in here and work with me to straighten our shit out. Earlier, she threw a KD Lang album at me that nearly took my head off. She thinks I am a sexist, when in fact I am a feminist. I am all about women's liberation. I got much love for my communist sisters, so somebody tell her to meet me here so we can chat, kay?

[Redmau5]

Don't listen to me, pal.

Excellent advice. The best thing you've said.

[pusher robot]

The ideal timber for all construction material is soft wood pine. It grows faster than hard-wood, and produces less oxygen than hard-wood, which makes it less important than hard-wood. It is biodegradable, unlike synthetic materials, and produces minimal pollution to be manufactured.

Kronos, what the hell is wrong with you? Bamboo is not a hardwood! It is the fastest growing woody plant on the planet!


This is mere moral posturing. I'd prefer that woman to just come out and say that she wants better flooring for her house for the sake of having better flooring for her house. Annoyingly, though, people increasingly feel that they have to excuse their aspirations through references to modern ruling class morality - i.e. environmentalism.

I am floored by how prudishly hypocritical the lot of you are being. You are building these fantastic caricatures of a woman off of a few lines of hearsay and condemning her based on them! I guess in the ideal communist society people just won't want floors! Or they'll want them but won't give a shit about the environmental impact! Yeah! How dare she care about forest depletion! Fight the man!

Idiots.

[pusher robot]

She's useless consumer trash. Probably a housewife soccer mom with a subscription to Better Home and Gardens. It doesn't get much more counter-revolutionary than that.

Don't forget to execute her children too, otherwise they might hold some kind of unreasonable grudge against the communists who killed their mom.

[Phalanx]

That was their excuse for killing the Tsar's family.

[Bud Struggle]

Are you really a hippy, Tommy? I want the full scoop on you, man. Tell me your story....but first, watch this video I made you idiot.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7lOPf_C2Bg

No Kronos, I'm not one of those. I was making a bit of a joke--I used to be a prole, though. You can read all about me in the "Inmate Introductions". The nice people here have heard the "TomK story" ad nauseum.

Overall I think this video is more "me": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vr3rr-eLCY&feature=user :D

[Robert]

I am floored by how prudishly hypocritical the lot of you are being.

Anybody besides me think he did that on purpose?

[Bud Struggle]

Anybody besides me think he did that on purpose?

:lol::lol::lol:

[Kronos]

Kronos, what the hell is wrong with you? Bamboo is not a hardwood! It is the fastest growing woody plant on the planet!I wasn't talking about the bamboo, nor did I say it was hardwood....I was talking in general about construction materials because I am the construction king, and I know everything about it. You know that guy Bob Villa? I'd frame circles around that idiot. The Yankee Workshop? Child's play.

Anyway, bamboo is the red dwarf stage of an ad hominem, I think. I better check with NoXion first though.

[Kronos]

Don't forget to execute her children too

Not necessary. Give me the children, and I will make them bolsheviks for life.

[pusher robot]

I wasn't talking about the bamboo, nor did I say it was hardwood....I was talking in general about construction materials because I am the construction king, and I know everything about it. You know that guy Bob Villa? I'd frame circles around that idiot. The Yankee Workshop? Child's play.

Anyway, bamboo is the red dwarf stage of an ad hominem, I think. I better check with NoXion first though.

Well here's the situation: I'm going to use some leftover steel track and stud, along with some 1/2 inch gypsum board, to frame out the front of the bar, with support walls extending back perpindicular every couple of feet. Now the question is, what should I use to hang the wood panelling over the hung drywall? Finishing nails? Or would I be better off using a liquid-nails-type adhesive? Also, any suggestions for the bar top? I'm thinking a couple of layers of plywood, with maybe birch veneer for the top surface.

[Kronos]

You don't need the gypsum board for the bar, because you are not trying to insulate it, or create a moisture barrier.

If by wood paneling you mean "waynes coating" material, you can simply fasten it with one inch self-tapping drywall screws, directly to the metal studs. It comes in ply sheets as you know.

But you didn't say there was drywall, first. You said you were using gypsum. I'm saying you don't need drywall or gypsum, and can simply install the waynes coating directly to the studs. Maybe, depending on the dimensions of the bar, you might need to drywall it first to give it more strength and stiffen it up a bit. But maybe not, because you are bracing it with the adjacent knee walls. Really though, I'd have to see it to make an accurate assessment.

But no, you can't use finish nails because you can't nail into metal studs. You'll have to use self-tapping screws.

If you use plywood for the bar top, you'll spend countless hours sanding it to get a smooth finish. You could, of course, apply three of four heavy coats of lacquer finish....but that takes a small eternity to do.

I dunno. Take a picture of the situation and post it do I can see.

[mikelepore]

Never mind where the hardwood floors were manufactured and if the conditions were safe for the workers or if the wages were livable. Never mind the scourge that is the free market.

I wonder where the idea came from that people could help the workers by not buying the product. Let's suppose some workers in another country take the best job they can find and it's still deplorable - wages that a person can barely exist on, miserable treatment - and it's the best job they could find. Other people try to help them by not buying the product. The decline in sales causes that industry to diminish. The job becomes unavailable to those workers, so now so they have to take the second-best job, one that they rejected before when they took the deplorable one, one that is even more deplorable than the one they previously had. So the boycott that was intended to help them has lower their wages and worsened their treatment.

[Redmau5]

That was their excuse for killing the Tsar's family.

Um, no it wasn't. The Tsar and his family were executed to prevent them becoming a rallying point for the White forces.

[pusher robot]

You don't need the gypsum board for the bar, because you are not trying to insulate it, or create a moisture barrier.

If by wood paneling you mean "waynes coating" material, you can simply fasten it with one inch self-tapping drywall screws, directly to the metal studs. It comes in ply sheets as you know.

But you didn't say there was drywall, first. You said you were using gypsum. I'm saying you don't need drywall or gypsum, and can simply install the waynes coating directly to the studs. Maybe, depending on the dimensions of the bar, you might need to drywall it first to give it more strength and stiffen it up a bit. But maybe not, because you are bracing it with the adjacent knee walls. Really though, I'd have to see it to make an accurate assessment.

But no, you can't use finish nails because you can't nail into metal studs. You'll have to use self-tapping screws.

If you use plywood for the bar top, you'll spend countless hours sanding it to get a smooth finish. You could, of course, apply three of four heavy coats of lacquer finish....but that takes a small eternity to do.

I dunno. Take a picture of the situation and post it do I can see.

That's interesting; I was under the impression that the drywall was a necessary structural component in metal framing, as the studs have such poor torsional strength as compared to wood. I haven't framed it out yet, though, so maybe you're right and the drywall will not be necessary. In any case, thanks for the tips on the fasteners. I hadn't considered I could just use the screws to fasten both layers to the studs at once, then just cover with a piece of trim or something. But that seems sensible.

As for the top, I had figured I would just put a couple of coats of spar urethane on the top. The other possibility, of course, it to use a piece of custom-cut kitchen countertop. I might even be able to use a nice faux-stone. The only disadvantage is I don't think I could get that indented spill well at any kind of reasonable price, whereas with the plywood I could simple leave a layer off there.

[Kronos]

as the studs have such poor torsional strength as compared to wood.True, but this depends on the gauge of the metal studs. If the studs are scraps from interior framing, then yeah, they are most likely light gauge and can bow very easily. Again though, the stability of the bar wall really depends on the knee-walls. If the bar wall is over eight feet long, you might need something more than just two knee-walls at each end, because the middle of the bar wall would be flimsy. You could do something like this with horizontal bracing:

------------------------
I I I I
I I I I
I I I I
I I I I
I I I I

This is looking down on it. You see the two angled lines. These don't have to be knee-walls, like the two on the ends, but can be basic horizontal bracing. This keeps the span in the middle from wavering. You would still have room to move in front of the bar, as you can see the space. This option would be better if it cost more to drywall the bar to get more strength. It's really a matter of a few bucks, though, as drywall isn't that expensive....but neither are a few studs for bracing.

Also consider that the counter top you use will "lock" the frame structure together, lessening the movement of the bar wall in the middle.

But anything less than eight feet long, I wouldn't worry to much about wobbling in the middle.

[Kronos]

What the fuck. I made a little blue print and when I posted it, it got all fucked up.

Dude, it's very simple, but I can't make a graphic of it apparently. And how long would it take for me to find a picture of what I'm talking about. Prolly a long time. You're on your own. Good luck.

[pusher robot]

Also consider that the counter top you use will also "lock" the frame structure together, lessing the movement of the bar wall in the middle.


Yes, you're right - I hadn't taken that into account. It will likely be 8 foot long with a 90 degree turn going another 3-4 feet to the wall. I'm using up scrap steel framing (from interior walls, as you guessed) and leftover drywall. I have at least one complete 4x8 sheet intact, so I figured I'd just use that whole panel on the front. I'll probably put at least one knee-wall in the middle of the span, if for no other reason, then to put shelf brackets on it.

[Phalanx]

Um, no it wasn't. The Tsar and his family were executed to prevent them becoming a rallying point for the White forces.

Unless you've been completely dehumanized and brainwashed you can't possibly agree with the killing of children.

[Redmau5]

Unless you've been completely dehumanized and brainwashed you can't possibly agree with the killing of children.

Where did I ever say I agreed with the killing of children?

I simply said the Tsar's family were executed to stop them being used for White propaganda purposes.

[Kronos]

Overall I think this video is more "me": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vr3rr-eLCY&feature=user (http://www.anonym.to/?http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-vr3rr-eLCY&feature=user) :DTommy, how could you possibly be impressed by a woman who submits herself to such stupid, humiliating crap as a wet t-shirt contest?

I'll tell you why. Because you are objectifying her as a sex object. You don't care if she is as dumb as rock, as long as she is sexually gratifying for you.

I bet you watch "The Man Show", don't you? Stupid blonds bouncing on a trampoline when they aren't bringing beer to two overweight middle class jewish desk-jockeys sitting in their favorite chair. What's their names....Corolla and Kimmell? You know who I'm talking about. These two guys are the epitome of middle class american consumer trash. How fitting for the show. So many men can identify with that show because they too are despicable.

[Bud Struggle]

Tommy, how could you possibly be impressed by a woman who submits herself to such stupid, humiliating crap as a wet t-shirt contest?

I'll tell you why. Because you are objectifying her as a sex object. You don't care if she is as dumb as rock, as long as she is sexually gratifying for you.

I bet you watch "The Man Show", don't you? Stupid blonds bouncing on a trampoline when they aren't bringing beer to two overweight middle class jewish desk-jockeys sitting in their favorite chair. What's their names....Corolla and Kimmell? You know who I'm talking about. These two guys are the epitome of middle class american consumer trash. How fitting for the show. So many men can identify with that show because they too are despicable.

My post was a joke.

I don't own cable or any such thing. I don't watch it, kids don't watch it--we occasionally watch movies--Saturday night is Family Movie Night, but no TV. Really. The kids 14 and 11 have no video games or any of that--they have horses, dogs, boats, music lessons, chores and homework. Happy kids, if I do say so myself. The oldest will work in my factory (and I mean WORK) this summer.

And the video was in the cue on the site of the video you posted. I'm happily married to the first woman I ever loved--we have two daughters--that in NO WAY would I want to be objectify.

The joke was in bad taste--my apologies.

[Peacekeeper]

My post was a joke.

I don't own cable or any such thing. I don't watch it, kids don't watch it--we occasionally watch movies--Saturday night is Family Movie Night, but no TV. Really. The kids 14 and 11 have no video games or any of that--they have horses, dogs, boats, music lessons, chores and homework. Happy kids, if I do say so myself. The oldest will work in my factory (and I mean WORK) this summer.

And the video was in the cue on the site of the video you posted. I'm happily married to the first woman I ever loved--we have two daughters--that in NO WAY would I want to be objectify.

The joke was in bad taste--my apologies.

That's unfortunate, because girls in Western bourgeois democracies are the most objectified in the world. I won't extrapolate on what will probably happen to them, that would be extremely rude.

[Bud Struggle]

That's unfortunate, because girls in Western bourgeois democracies are the most objectified in the world. I won't extrapolate on what will probably happen to them, that would be extremely rude.

We are pretty Catholic. It works to make them happy and healthy, we don't get too involved in things of this world.

[Peacekeeper]

We are pretty Catholic. It works to make them happy and healthy, we don't get too involved in things of this world.

An isolated upper class family. :cursing:

But if you are using religion in a way to "promote virtue and eliminate vice," then good work. But you're still going to hell. :(

[eyedrop]

An isolated upper class family. :cursing:

But if you are using religion in a way to "promote virtue and eliminate vice," then good work. But you're still going to hell. :(

Your god would punish him for being born into the wrong culture?

Nice guy! I see why one would worship him.

[Bud Struggle]

An isolated upper class family. :cursing:

But if you are using religion in a way to "promote virtue and eliminate vice," then good work. But you're still going to hell. :(

I would LOVE to be a Moslem, but my wife would make my life HELL in Paradise if I even touched one of those 72 virgins I'm supposed to get.

So you see, I'm damned either way. :lol:

And yes we are isolated, we take what we want from the best of what the world has to offer and dispose of the rest. But there is a really happiness in virtue and religion--maybe not happiness, the word would be JOY. Argue about the existance of God all you want--we as the human race are a religious people, and praise and worship and adoration and suplication fufill our lives.



Enjoy!

[Robert]

Tom, none of my biz, but I take it from your sunny outlook that you are a post-Vatican II Catholic, yes?

[Plagueround]

An isolated upper class family. :cursing:

But if you are using religion in a way to "promote virtue and eliminate vice," then good work. But you're still going to hell. :(

I can't think of many things that irritate me more than one religious person telling the other they are going to hell...well, except hornets. Hornets are jerks.

[Raúl Duke]

But if you are using religion in a way to "promote virtue and eliminate vice," then good work. But you're still going to hell.


I can't think of many things that irritate me more than one religious person telling the other they are going to hell

I find it ridiculously funny...

What irritates me is when one religious person makes fun about some non-mainstream religion like scientology or moonies...it's so ironic. Usually I join them laughing....except I laugh at both the butt of the joke and at the person making the joke for the irony.

[Bud Struggle]

Tom, none of my biz, but I take it from your sunny outlook that you are a post-Vatican II Catholic, yes?

Indeed, my friend. Me, the little woman and the brats are mainstream Catholic, though as I said quite devout. :)

[YoungLeninist]

Unless you've been completely dehumanized and brainwashed you can't possibly agree with the killing of children.

When a people adear to the killing of children, those people are truly lost.

[careyprice31]

she could have been green and sensitive to the poor workers. Then she wouldnt offend anybody.

[Redmau5]

An isolated upper class family. :cursing:

But if you are using religion in a way to "promote virtue and eliminate vice," then good work. But you're still going to hell. :(

He's not going to hell, because the place doesn't exist.

You claim to be a Leninist. But how can you be a Leninist when you hold such immaterial beliefs in God? Leninism, and Marxism in general, is grounded in materialism.

So please, drop the charade.

[pusher robot]

He's not going to hell, because the place doesn't exist.


Oh, but you're wrong. In fact, it's quite quaint. But pack well if you go - it can get really cold there (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hell,_Norway)!

[careyprice31]

I would LOVE to be a Moslem, but my wife would make my life HELL in Paradise if I even touched one of those 72 virgins I'm supposed to get.

So you see, I'm damned either way. :lol:



!

I really hope this post is meant to be a joke. and the post about 'little woman'

[Bud Struggle]

I really hope this post is meant to be a joke. and the post about 'little woman'

It all depends: are you volunteering to be one of my 72 virgins? ;):D

Yes, of course it was a joke. :)

[careyprice31]

It all depends: are you volunteering to be one of my 72 virgins? ;):D

Yes, of course it was a joke. :)

Of course I am. You should convert rather quickly.

ahahahaha just kidding

:lol: