European Union

[Orwell Lives]

I today's world, there are two ever-expanding empires; that of the chinese and that of the americans. I think the time has come for the nations of europe to come together and counter-balance the powers-that-be.
Europe had so much potential, but it is being thrown away by petty squabbling among the members.
Imagine the power held by a strongly united europe. We could easily make the world a better place. Is it possible to form a pan-european party focussed on socialistic solidarity?

Please provide feedback, and discuss among yourselves:)

[Niccolò Rossi]

I think the time has come for the nations of europe to come together and counter-balance the powers-that-be.

So you want to fight imperialism, with your own? This is obscene. Why not, instead of relying on your bourgeois masters, act to fight imperialist capitalism by means of working class organization and militarism?


We could easily make the world a better place. Make the world a better place by European imperialism? Your saying the European bourgeoisie can in someway improve the conditions of the international working class by their own imperial expansion?


Is it possible to form a pan-european party focussed on socialistic solidarity?

It's perfectly possible, but accomplishes nothing. Why not drop the European chauvinism and support an international socialist party?

[Awful Reality]

I today's world, there are two ever-expanding empires; that of the chinese and that of the americans. I think the time has come for the nations of europe to come together and counter-balance the powers-that-be.
Europe had so much potential, but it is being thrown away by petty squabbling among the members.
Imagine the power held by a strongly united europe. We could easily make the world a better place. Is it possible to form a pan-european party focussed on socialistic solidarity?

Please provide feedback, and discuss among yourselves:)

Yes. But currently, the EU economy is founded on Neo-Liberal Principles.
However, if we saw the US or The UK go Socialist, chances are we would see a sort of domino theory effect in Europe. See "If America Should Go Communist" by Trotsky.

[An archist]

Imagine the power held by a strongly united europe.
Yeah, that's great, a strong, unified, neo-liberal Europe (because let's face it: Europe isn't even remotely socialist)



We could easily make the world a better place.
Maybe we could, but I doubt the EU leaders have the same idea about a better world then we do.



Is it possible to form a pan-european party focussed on socialistic solidarity?

Yes, but would it do any good?

[Orwell Lives]

An archst: Are you being sarcastic?

Zeitgeist: I mean for uses as a deterrent, not to 'conquer' lands for Europe. I know Australia was at the butt-end of an empire for a long time, so I expected you'd have a strong opinion.

[An archist]

The first line is quite sarcastic, the last two are serious.

[Not entirely illiterate]

What about the ever-growing economic importance of Russia and its vast amounts of natural resources? Would you include Russia in this pan-European socialist union? Many russians are probably not very interested in socialism anymore, unfortunately...

[Orwell Lives]

An archist: Thanks very much:)

[Colonello Buendia]

The creation of 3 massively imperialist groups will result in 1984 becoming real, a permanent war oppression etc. no socialist would actively defend that position

[Chom]

The European Union is horrible. I mean, you won't even be able to convert it onto your side. It's impossible.

The EU was not even founded on principles of solidarity or union of people of some sort (which they were telling us for years) but a commercial union of huge coal and steel industries. Today, it has barely no democratic function (maybe apart from the EU trials). It's composed mainly of hardcore neo-liberal lobbyists like the ERT (probably the biggest one), which basically is under GATT and GATS (which are then again under the WTO [interesting that they didn't want to have a direct influence with the WTO since "it would make people think it [the EU] is undemocratic"]).

It's full of shit. Take the European Constitution (that would assure total economic movement for the neolib. lobbies) for example. France and Holland (I believe) rejected it massively during the democratic referendum, so they couldn't pass it on a continental scale. Nevermind; make the ministers of all EU countries sign the Lisbon Treaty (who doesn't sign a TREATY :rolleyes:) and it's the same thing.

So it IS impossible to even build up the democratic fundaments for it. Much of my discussions with people has to do with the Bologna Process (basically privatization of EU education.... everything!). People protest everywhere. You can't even imagine the huge media campaign that is set up to keep students ignorant. In Greece, students went out and protested, and if it hadn't gone from slogans to blood, the process wouldn't have been paralyzed there. In Spain, directors of uiversities are being pressured by students to at least have talks and discussions about this; we broke in to my university director's office and really put him up to date on student activism. He has promised a one day discussion group with us. Well that "discussion group" will have to remain a dream to us.

But then again, France and Germany didn't go to war with Iraq since they have a different view on European supremacy in the world (creating a U.S. in Europe without cooperating with the U.S.). But that's really the same; democracy for the few.

So unless you tear the Union apart, get on a real democratic change in every European country and then build the EU up again, then you're far from anything.