The bolivarian communist revolution in Venezuela - reasons w

[JoseM]

-$95.000.000.000 is the total of the money that Venezuela has got from the OIL in these 3 years and the people ask themselves, where is that money? more poors, more misery... where did that money go?

-With the bolivarian pro communist goverment of Chavez the corruption is worst than ever.

-The criminals were liberated from jail to join the Bolivarian Circles to defend the revolution.

-The hospitals and schools and universities now are a disaster.

-There is no money to pay the medics, proffesors, teaches, ect. Instead Chavez use that money to pay the bolivarian circles to create panic.

-Chavez started 3 years ago with 70% of popularity and now he has only 20%... even the poor people hate him.

-The inflation is now at 19% and growing.

-Chavez received the country in february of 1999 with only 11% of unemployment, now the unemployment is in 22% and by the end of this year (if he isnt overthrown before) the unemployment is going to be on 25%.

-The industries and enterprises broke.

-The factories of the most industrialized city of Venezuela (Carabobo) do not work anymore, because the industries and enterprises broke and there is no money to maintain the factories and the employes or workers.

-The crime is now skyrocketing compared to 3 years ago.

-Chavez is trying to disband the venezuela armed forces (FAN) because he knows the FAN dislike him for betraying the country allowing cuban agents to penetrate the country and allowing colombian guerrillas to use the venezuelan territory as a base. His plan is to disband the FAN to use his BOLIVARIAN CIRCLES (criminals and mercenaries) to help him to stay in power.

- 4 snipers that killed people on abril 11 have been identify, 2 of them (Mayor Avilán Díaz, comisario Rodríguez Orta) are from the DISIP (like the KGB or GESTAPO here in venezuela) and the other 2 (mayor Suárez Chourio y teniente coronel Alejandro Maya Silva) are from the military faction that is loyal to chavez.

- The people that were shooting with pistols on abril 11 that were caught on camera, were from the MVR (Movimiento Quinta Republica) the political party of Chavez and one of them confesed that he was obligated to shoot to the people or he would lose his job.

-The people in the goverment before being in the goverment were people of the low and middle class, now in three years they have expensive cars, their childrens study in expensive school, they live in expensive houses. In other words they live like kings. And that is without talking about the clothes that Chavez uses. Chavez uses a $25.000 watch, clothes around $1000 and $20.000. What a great revolutionary this guy, he is living like a king, while venezuela is getting everyday poor. And in the next month he is going to give another economic measure that is going to make more poor the people.

-The economy is about to collapse, the social situation in the same position, and the military too. Chavez the most hated person in Venezuela. Despite what people from outside of venezuela (who dont know anything) say, the reality is that 55% of the Venezuelan people want a COUP and the other 45% support a constitutional end of the chavez regime.

The statistic and information come from www.globovision.com , www.el-nacional.com and the Venezuelan Bank.

(Edited by JoseM at 6:29 pm on May 29, 2002)

[Capitalist Fighter]

Jose M i am impressed with your posts because you provide ample evidence to support your argument. :)

[pastradamus]

Yeah im also impressed,come join my social-democratic faction! we cud use u on the centre left.

[STALINSOLDIERS]

you people are sick.........fucking capitalist

[Guest]

JoseM, great comments and arguments. Agree 100%

Stalinsoldiers: use arguments instead of pointless insults, if you can that is.

[Thine Stalin]

MALTE!

You must bann Jose now, he is a trouble maker and flamer when he doesn't get his way. They were extremely patient with him on thephora but all he is is a liar and spammer.

[concerned]

Thine,
Jose a "trouble maker and a flamer", how come?
Because he doesn't think like you he is not entitled to express his opinion?
Typical of you people to try to ban any ideas that don't match yours.
Why don't you respond with arguments instead?

Isn't that what forums are all about? An exchange of ideas... Isn't this forum as a matter of fact called "Socialism vs. Capitalism"?

Jose is making a point and it is backing his arguments pretty well with facts. Unlike many socialist and commies here, he is not insulting anyone.

So what is your problem Thine?
Do you already feel so threatened by his intelligence that you are desperately trying to get him out of the way with a ban?

[Thine Stalin]

Jose doesn't have intelligence he got that from a website, on thephora he claimed to be a stalinist for a month until the nazi's just drove him out because all he said was stalin was cool! And things like that, he soon decided he hated stalin when he saw how unpopular it was and began spamming the forum about how chavez was evil, usually not backing up a WORD he said, atleast he did here. I was one of the few that said if he matured he should be unblocked, but he didn't, and so he was permenantly banned from the whole site, not just the main forums.

If he's changed good, but I still wouldn't bet on it

[STALINSOLDIERS]

oh come one just cause malte doesnt agree with our ideas he bans us......why the fuck are we banned then huh if jose aint banned then fuck you malte..

[lenin]

josem is a blatant spammer! i sometimes read his posts on russia.com. he tried to start a communist group and the when eveyone told him he didn't have a fucking clue about communism he turned on communsim! he's done this on other forums! he just copys and pastes shit he sees on anti-chavez web-sites. if chavez is so unpopular, how come the people went crazy when there was a coup against him and the coup plotters have now fucked off? josem is a spam artist! if i am restricted, he should be banned malte!

[Nateddi]

Lenin, are you a member on Russia.com?

What is your name??

[lenin]

no, i just used to read it occasionally. i know you are a member on there. i sometimes go on there to look but its quite dead these days and its full of americans!

[Guest]

Hello, as i am only 14, my views of communism are still rather "crude" but i 100% agree that Chavez is a good leader otherwise the people wouldnt have put him back in power.

[Capitalist Fighter]

Freak Stalinits you are a whiners. Ban him ban him! Wahhhh

[concerned]

The people didn't went crazy when the coop happened. And the people didn't put him back in power either, that is not how things happened. A few minority might have been haapy with the failure of the coup. But don't fool yourselves most of the people in Venezuela were celebrating when the coup happened (at least for the little while it lasted).

Chavez uses populism, a tactic used a lot in Latin America by corrupt politicians. It consists in taking advantage of the poverty and low level of education of some of the people to gain political power by promising unrealistic things to them.

Yes, Chavez can talk very beautiful rethoric about how he is going to save the poor and blah blah blah, but in reality poverty has increased and is increasing during his regime. He is unable to put some action to his words. Chavez can only respond with more promises, more empty rethoric, and by putting the blame outside of him on people that have nothing to do with what is happening.

[lenin]

CF, i don't think josem should be banned for hiis views, the truth is, he's got no views. he's just a spammer! he goes on forums and pretends to be the opposite of what the majority of the board is. i've seen him pretned to be a communist and a nazi!

[Capitalist Fighter]

lol well i don't know from experience but from what i've seen on this forum he seems pretty committed to the his anti-communism and his posts contain evidence. I would like him to clear up these conceptions people have about him.

[lenin]

"I Suggest we four Titoman, marxman, ryan and me... be the leaders of this group... I know communism is a classless society, but without a leadership u will only see anarchy... thats why ryan is right about making Ranks and Leaders... ur also right that the communism is a classless society.. but we need leaders to organize the group...

I suggest we four (Me, tito, marxman, and ryan) be the leaders of this group... we can also make our own WebSite... we can invite a lot of people to be members of the "Communist Group" or "Communist Society" which name do u like most?

Well this was just a suggestion... what do u guys think?"

this was posted by josem on 7th March 2002 on russia.com/forums

check for yourself if you want. don't sound like the ramblings of an anti-communist to me.

[Nateddi]

Quote: from lenin on 1:47 am on June 1, 2002
no, i just used to read it occasionally. i know you are a member on there. i sometimes go on there to look but its quite dead these days and its full of americans!


Lenin, I was born in the USSR, I only lived in America for seven years.

[lenin]

Ñêîëüêî âàì ëåò òåïåðü? È êàêîé âîçðàñò áûë Âû, êîãäà Âû óåõàëè? Îò êàêîãî ÷àñòü ÑÑÑÐ ÿâëÿåòñÿ ëè Âû?

[Nateddi]

Ìíå 16 ëåò ñåé÷àñ. *Ìíå áûëî 10 êîãäà ÿ ïåðååõàë. *ß æèë â Óêðàèíå, â Õàðüêîâå.

[lenin]

Èíòåðåñíûé. ß áûë òîò æå ñàìûé âîçðàñò, êîãäà ÿ óåõàë. Âû ãîâîðèòå ñ ðîññèéñêèì àêöåíòîì? Âû ïðåäïî÷èòàåòå ÑÑÑÐ èëè ÑØÀ?

[Nateddi]

Âîîáùå, ÿ íàñëàæäàþñü ÑØÀ; íî ýòî òðóäíî ðåøèòü, ÷òî ðàññìîòðåíèå ìåíÿ òîëüêî æèëî â ÑÑÑÐ â òå÷åíèå 5-6 ëåò, è âðåìÿ áûëî î÷åíü íåóâåðåííîå ñîìíèòåëüíî.

[lenin]

Äà ÿ ïðåäïîëàãàþ òàê. Âû êîãäà-ëèáî âîçâðàùàåòåñü? ß âîçâðàùàþñü 2 èëè 3 ðàçà â ãîä. ß èäó â ýòîì íîÿáðå äëÿ íîÿáðüñêîãî 7-îãî áîëüøåâèñòñêîãî ïàðàäà. Äîëæåí áûòü ïðåâîñõîäåí.

[Nateddi]

ß íå èìåþ äåíåã, ÷òîáû âîçâðàòèòüñÿ; ìîè ðîäèòåëè æåðòâû êàïèòàëèçìà *

[lenin]

Ýòî çâó÷èò çíàêîìûì. Åñòü ìèëëèîíû Ðîññèÿí, êòî - æåðòâû êàïèòàëèçìà ñåãîäíÿ (õîòÿ Âû ôàêòè÷åñêè íå ìîæåòå íàçûâàòü ýòî êàïèòàëèçìîì).

[Reuben]

Quote: from Nateddi on 7:06 pm on June 1, 2002

Quote: from lenin on 1:47 am on June 1, 2002
no, i just used to read it occasionally. i know you are a member on there. i sometimes go on there to look but its quite dead these days and its full of americans!


Really, how old were yu when you left.

Lenin, I was born in the USSR, I only lived in America for seven years.

[Reuben]

Lenin, I was born in the USSR, I only lived in America for seven years.

Really, how old were yu when you left.

[Reuben]

Quote: from Nateddi on 7:06 pm on June 1, 2002

Quote: from lenin on 1:47 am on June 1, 2002
no, i just used to read it occasionally. i know you are a member on there. i sometimes go on there to look but its quite dead these days and its full of americans!


Really, how old were yu when you left.

Lenin, I was born in the USSR, I only lived in America for seven years.

[Nateddi]

I was 10

[Borincano]

I was once happy with what Chávez wanted to achieve in Venezuela, but as the years go by, I am unhappy with his hardheadedness, but still, he has tried to do more than any other Venezuelan politican have. When he was over thrown, from my views of news, pictures, and people from Venezuela, thousands protested and especially in the Slums, where the Interim gov't shot and killed many. Something they accused Chávez of doing before the coup. This was recorded by Venezuelan hospitals and brought to the USA by NBC news.

Anyway go here for more information: Hugo Chávez and Venezuela (http://www.che-lives.com/cgi/community/topic.pl?forum=11&topic=1410)

[Guest]

its me again ( the 14 year old)
How can you expect Chavez to encat major changes? He has the United states nearby and knows waht happens to peopel who try to change things. He cants simply monopolize us owned industries(like Allende and Castro) because the US no longer has the USSR acting as a shield.

>>>>>Has anyone heard of the Persian anti religious leader Mazdak?? He was probably one of the first "communist" leaders of the world, i guess.

[Guest]

Hey 14 year old, I can't believe you are so young and already brainwashed by all this leftist propaganda.

Do what all these leftists do, and blame all the trouble on the United States and fail to see the reality of things. If you want to continue fooling yourself, yeah keep repeating to yourself that Chavez has absolutely nothing to do with the empoverishment and dissatisfaction of his citizens, the blame should be put on some "evil" American industrials who went there to create jobs and establish companies.

I think you have a lot of studying to do!. Heck, at 14 you shouldn't even be wasting your time with politics.

[Borincano]

Guest 168.122.14.251,

Don't discourage the 14 year old! At least he/she is interesting in the world that we live in instead of doing drugs and wasting his/hers time on senseless acts that many teenagers do.

The right has their share of propoganda as well....

Also, I agree, you can't blame everything on the USA, many European countries are to blame as well. Still, the USA has played a huge rule in Latin American politics, most of it negatively....