The nationalist movement is coming back

[BatistaNationalista]

Never had a true nationalist leader been able to get as much influence as he had before. If only there was no cencorship by the socialist media in France, Le Pen would have kicked Chirac and his so-called "conservative" friends out. The right movement is coming back, europe will be saved from the communist and socialist infiltration.

[Communist Dominion]

Ha! look even a quite capitalist nation like britian (even without the labour party) would not stand for such a fascist govt in power, even the people will not stand for it! its just that the horrers of far right have been forgotten and ignored for so long after WW2 that people dont realise what they're getting themselves into! People were just to lazy and apathetic to see what they were doing in the french elections, life was good under socialism in france but the people wanted to throw a spanner in the works, "le-pen"!

[Angie]

It appears that the French polls had something a little different to say in regards to Le Pen's popularity. At least in France the final decision comes down to the people's choice, and they certainly made it.

[Imperial Power]

Batista why do you oppose democracy?

[Thine Stalin]

I oppose democracy, I can't wait to hear all the crap I get because of this..

Democracy is for a weak willed goverment, they're too scared they'll make the wrong decision they put the people in charge. As you anti-capitalists so like to point out, the people rarely do a good job (end days of Soviet Union, and Pol Pot's Cambodia). You cappies should be more supportive of a monarchy in my eyes.. I'd bet you'd love the regieme in saudi arabia. Democracy is for the anarchists, the communists should believe in the strong central goverment, the strong lack of people make stupid decisions, but still we get all this crap from these socialists saying that the soviet goverments didn't have real democracy and were not really socialist states, f*ckers! You say that to attract the main stream idiots who say that democracy is good. Rome fell because of its 'democracy' just as greece was divided during the roman invasion because of its democracy. You idiots just think that saying 'we like voting for leaders' is gonna make main stream, capitalist american join you? Forget it! Remember your routes. If you want a democracy, join the nazi's and their ignorant jeffersonian theories.

[guerrillaradio]

Quote: from Thine Stalin on 8:09 pm on May 6, 2002
Rome fell because of its 'democracy' just as greece was divided during the roman invasion because of its democracy.

And the USSR didn't collapse during Stalin's day?? Only difference was, the opposition was so well crushed that there was no way of overthrowing the leadership...

[Menshevik]

How are the Nazis in anyway Democratic? But it's true that under a real democracy, nothing would ever get done.

[Moskitto]

I agree with some of what Thine Stalin says because in many cases politicians will not do the right thing because they fear that they will lose votes (example: Britain which needs higher taxes and no one will do it.) But I don't think that Democracy is the problem, It's politicians who aren't in touch with the people and can't persuade them with their ideas (write to an MP and you get a really patronising letter saying you don't understand what's going on in most cases.)

[Michael De Panama]

Quote: from Thine Stalin on 8:09 pm on May 6, 2002
Rome fell because of its 'democracy' just as greece was divided during the roman invasion because of its democracy.

No no no, you Stalinist piece of shit. Rome fell while it was an empire. It thrived under the republic. It was the lack of democracy that brought it down. That, and the constant expansion, the economic dependency it had with outside nation's slave exports, and all the wars that it had with all these nations.

Since you support Stalin, it doesn't surprise me that you oppose democracy. However, communism DOES support democracy. It also opposes this "centralized" economy that you speak of. It's an internationalist democratic system without classes. Without democracy, the ruler of a nation is at a class above the rest. This isn't communism. This is class division. This is fascism. So fuck off, idiot.

[Mac OS Revolutionary]

Democracy is crap. Vote on this, vote on that. It basicaly comes down to who is more popular or who can decieve the masses more.

[Michael De Panama]

Communism, however, is a system without class. Without democracy, a ruler of a nation would be in a class above the rest, leading to further inequalities and social division communism strived to abolish. Communism is the most democratic system ever devised. If you don't support democracy, then don't say you support communism.

Anyway, I'm posting this message twice.

[guerrillaradio]

Quote: from Mac OS Revolutionary on 9:56 am on May 7, 2002
Democracy is crap. Vote on this, vote on that. It basicaly comes down to who is more popular...


Well at least the people have a choice. Why should a nation's destiny be decided only by one person or party?? Surely it is more ethical that the whole nation should have a say?? Notice that I am talking in relative terms, I recognise the many pitfalls of democracy as well, and, as I do whenever I get into this debate, I quote Winston Churchill (not my best bedfellow admittedly, but this is a good quote), "democracy is the worst system of government, apart from all the alternatives".

[Moskitto]

It was the lack of democracy that brought it down.

I would have blamed the brain damage caused by the lead piping which caused the Roman's downfall.

[jimr]

Democracy is a flawed system. In times of peace democracy is fine, but whenever anything needs to be done democracy fails. To advance a government needs to be strong and willing to take hard deciscions, everyone is too obsessed with staying in power to advance and so democracy begets stagnation.

[Michael De Panama]

Jesus, it's just sickening to see the amount of self-proclaimed "communists" with this amount of opposition towards democracy. You know what? Get the fuck out of the board. Get the fuck out of the movement. Read the Communist Manifesto at least once before getting on a place like this and calling yourself a "communist". And if you already have, then go learn how to fucking read. Because this is a movement for democracy, not for little punk fascist kids.

[PunkRawker677]

Michael,
it is sickening indeed. I do not support, and never will, any non-democratic system. I would rather live under democratic capitalism than a communist dictatorship.

[Imperial Power]

Isn't the basis of the communist movement to put the working class beliefs above that of the upper class? How can the beliefs of the "people" be expressed without asking them (democracy)?

[vox]

"Isn't the basis of the communist movement to put the working class beliefs above that of the upper class?"

No, not at all. That's simply replacing one ruling class with another. As Marx and Engels wrote in the Manifesto, "The ruling ideas of each age have ever been the ideas of its ruling class." Therein lies the problem.

The goal is to have a classless society in which "the free development of each is the condition of the free development of all." Which is to say that we don't want to replace one ruling elite, with its ruling ideas, with another, but to allow the free development of each without the constraints of ruling class dogma.

vox

[El Che]

IP we dont want to put those on the bottom of the social ladder on top, but rather we want to burn the social ladder its self. That is the "communist proposal" socialists offer society, and true socialists are ready to put the proposal to suffrage, even against the crushing cultural hegmony that protects the interests of those that are interested in maintaining the social ladder. Namely those at the top, that would fall on their fat behinds if the ladder where to disappear.

(Edited by El Che at 9:53 am on May 8, 2002)

[Mac OS Revolutionary]

Well at least the people have a choice.

Yes, you are correct. The people have a choice of who to be decieved by.

[guerrillaradio]

Quote: from Mac OS Revolutionary on 10:28 am on May 8, 2002
Yes, you are correct. The people have a choice of who to be decieved by.

So instead you suggest that we're deceived by someone we didn't vote for??

[Michael De Panama]

Ah, the cappies just eat this stuff right up and get even more ignorant. Thanks a lot, all you Stalnist assholes.

[MagnusVolk]

Quote: from BatistaNationalista on 4:11 am on May 6, 2002
Never had a true nationalist leader been able to get as much influence as he had before. If only there was no cencorship by the socialist media in France, Le Pen would have kicked Chirac and his so-called "conservative" friends out. The right movement is coming back, europe will be saved from the communist and socialist infiltration.


And why would anyone think the media in Europe would be biased?

Masters of the Media
The Media-Power in Great Britain and Elswhere

http://www.jeffsarchive.com/media%20contro...he%20Media.html (http://www.jeffsarchive.com/media%20control/Masters%20of%20the%20Media.html)

[Nateddi]

Oh, and you quote little Batista.

Thank God he is gone and you should be too.