Do anyone here has been with Cubans or any - Cuban organizat

[JoseM]

I have been with them and it is obvious that the people that claims that the cuban communism is so great, dont know what they are saying or are fooled by the communist propaganda of Fidel Castro. Better known as the bloody dictator of Latin America.

I heard in one of the threads in this forum that the cuban people loves Fidel, which is a big time lie.

Fidel Castro doesnt allow free elections in Cuba because he knows he will lose them.

If Fidel Castro loves so much the cuban people why does he use the money to buy weapons for his guerrillas in latin america and africa and why didnt he used it for the good of the cuban people?

If Fidel Castro loves so much his people then why does he sent so many thousands of cubans to executions just because they didnt agree with Fidel Castro?

If Fidel is so revolutionary then why did he executed his own "comrades" that helped him take down the Fulgencio Bastista dictatorship? yeah, if u didnt know Fidel killed all the commanders that helped him with the "revolution" except for his brother that is still alive living in a mansion in Cuba and el CHE guevara, anyways some say that Fidel indirectly helped the CIA to kill el CHE, in other words did he betray el CHE? that isnt sure, but what it is sure is the betrayal he commited to the other commanders that helped him with the revolution, kind of a Stalin betraying his allies.

Why does Fidel lives in a mansion while the people is starving?

Why doesnt Cuba allow human rights inspectors in Cuba?

Why do all Cubans in Miami and in Venezuela and the rest of latin america hate Fidel? And im talking only about the cubans that escaped with a RAFT from cuba...

Why do people in this forum talk so much crap about the greatness of the cuban communist tyranny without researching first or knowning the madness and stupidity they are talking?

So here goes my main question... Have you been with cubans or cuban organizations?

My answer is: yes i have.

[I LOVE HO CHI MINH]

Discuss that in the Socialism VS Capitalism forum goddam son of a *****

[bleed3r]

if you really need 4 posts saying the same thing, put them in the right section moron

edit -- excuse me, 6... bah, someone ban this guy...

(Edited by bleed3r at 2:19 am on May 2, 2002)

[JoseM]

nice fucking answer... answer the damn questions... thats right u have no fucking idea of the life in Cuba and when u hear something u dont wanna hear u respond with an ignorant answer. good work asshole.
I would bet all my money that you are just a pile of kids claiming something that u dont know from ur computers.
You people remind me of the nazis on www.thephora.com ... hilarious. Kids that talk so much crap, but when u give them actual facts they will just insult. Great defenders of their ideas. Or should i say ignorants.

(Edited by JoseM at 4:46 am on May 2, 2002)

[RedCeltic]

REMINDER:

http://www.che-lives.com/cgi/community/top...um=22&topic=174 (http://www.che-lives.com/cgi/community/topic.pl?forum=22&topic=174)

[JoseM]

i didnt know about that rule, u can move my threads to that forum, or if u wanna ban me, go ahead, i dont feel like i want to keep discussing with ignorant people.

[RedCeltic]

i dont feel like i want to keep discussing with ignorant people

Is someone forcing you to post on Che-Lives?

[CheGuevara]

So, what Cuban group are you a part of? Alpha 16 or whatever the fuck that group is of Cuban exiles who are so bent out of shape over Castro that they try to attack convoys of medical and educational equipment like computers going to Cuba, which is obviously to the detriment of the Cuban people.

[bleed3r]

Don't flatter yourself jose... We get this shit all the time, and you're nothing special. If you want to be taken even remotely seriously, at least follow the rules and post in the right forum otherwise you'll get this type of reply.

[BOZG]

Fidel Castro doesnt allow free elections in Cuba because he knows he will lose them.

Do you mean free as he doesn't allow other parties to run or that he doesn't have any elections?

[honest intellectual]

Fidel Castro doesnt allow free elections in Cuba because he knows he will lose them.
In last year's elections (which the UN ruled to be free and fair) Fidel, won 98 of the votes for president, and Raul Castro won 99% of the votes for vice-president. You should relly check your facts before saying:
Why do people in this forum talk so much crap about the greatness of the cuban communist tyranny without researching first or knowning the madness and stupidity they are talking?


Fidel Castro. Better known as the bloody dictator of Latin America.
Nah, he's better known as Fidel Castro


If Fidel Castro loves so much the cuban people why does he use the money to buy weapons for his guerrillas in latin america and africa and why didnt he used it for the good of the cuban people?
that's a pretty stupid question. If what you're saying is true (and I'd like to see what evidence you have) then he does it for the betterment of the people in those countries


Why does Fidel lives in a mansion while the people is starving?
this is my favourite line in your post. Why does George W. live in a mansion while his people are starving?


So here goes my main question... Have you been with cubans or cuban organizations?

My answer is: yes i have.
Good for you, man. You seem pretty fuckin proud. I worked with the Irish-Cuban solidarity boyos a bit

[Vostok]

There was one very important "election" in Cuba. It occurred in April 1961, when 7 million Cubans elected to kick the sorry azzes of the gusano scum (like JoseM) that landed at Play Giron (Bay of Pigs).

[BOZG]

In last year's elections (which the UN ruled to be free and fair) Fidel, won 98 of the votes for president, and Raul Castro won 99% of the votes for vice-president.

Bastard. That was mine.

[samaniego]

Amigo? eres Cubano? If you are please let me know I have been trying to get in contact with Cubans who are Anti Fidel. Yo soy De California, (Mexicano) I want to do a piece on Cuban exciles and why they feel Fidel is bad for Cuba? Gracias.

[wildflower8]

samaniego....te mande algo...mi papa es Mexicano y mi mama Cubana!
~Xochitl

[Hayduke]

You feel real cool cause you spoke to some cubans dont ya ?
And Ill bet you feel real cool cause you come with these stupid arguments on a leftist site...

Let me tell ya this....
I read your arguments everyday in different topics.....
and everytime we win the debate, but to do a debate over and over, is kinda boring and irritating.

So Mr hotshot to see the answers to your stupid arguments go check the old topics in soc-cap and dont bother us with keep posting the same lame shit everytime.

Cheers

D-Day

[kitty katt]

Jose is right.....I'm married to a cuban and life in Cuba is not all that Fidel Castro would have the world believe. I am there frequently and have seen how they have to live. There are really no free elections in Cuba but there is an election every 4 or 5 years but there is only one party to vote for.....and every adult must vote. Sure some people love Fidel but if he is so loved why do thousands risk their lives every year to escape Cuba??? Even though they have free healthcare have you seen the conditions of their hospitals......they lack medicine and supplies and the hospitals aren't in great shape. Have you noticed in Cuba that doctors work in hotels but not as doctors but they work carrying luggage for tourists?? Beef is illegal in that country and the punishment is severe if a cow is injured or killed. The Cubans food is rationed and anything that isn't rationed is bought on the black market. Even toilet paper is a luxury.....most Cubans use newspaper as toilet paper. The job situation is sad there and the only jobs that a Cuban can make money at, and that is only if they can get the job, is the tourist business. The only people that live in luxury are the communist party and el presidente. Even though Fidel would like the world to believe that his country is socialist it is really communist.

[Sabocat]

Quote: from kitty katt on 2:34 am on May 29, 2003
Jose is right.....I'm married to a cuban and life in Cuba is not all that Fidel Castro would have the world believe. I am there frequently and have seen how they have to live. There are really no free elections in Cuba but there is an election every 4 or 5 years but there is only one party to vote for.....and every adult must vote. Sure some people love Fidel but if he is so loved why do thousands risk their lives every year to escape Cuba??? Even though they have free healthcare have you seen the conditions of their hospitals......they lack medicine and supplies and the hospitals aren't in great shape. Have you noticed in Cuba that doctors work in hotels but not as doctors but they work carrying luggage for tourists?? Beef is illegal in that country and the punishment is severe if a cow is injured or killed. The Cubans food is rationed and anything that isn't rationed is bought on the black market. Even toilet paper is a luxury.....most Cubans use newspaper as toilet paper. The job situation is sad there and the only jobs that a Cuban can make money at, and that is only if they can get the job, is the tourist business. The only people that live in luxury are the communist party and el presidente. Even though Fidel would like the world to believe that his country is socialist it is really communist.

A couple of questions.

Don't the elections offer choices for all of the cabinets below Fidel?

Don't you think that the lack of supplies, building materials, medicines, food, is in reality a function of the unethical, immoral embargo placed on Cuba by the U$?

Even with the shortages of medicine and supplies, Cuba has an enviable record in healthcare. One of the lowest, if not the lowest infant mortality rates, and a life expectancy that rivals any in the Western hemisphere.

Cuba also has literacy rates that rival any industrial nation.

Of course people leave. Every country has emigration. They believe that they are running to the land of opportunity. If they only knew the truth eh? I could ask you the same question about George Bush couldn't I? If he is so loved, how come so many people want to leave the U$?

This winter alone, in my states biggest city, 255 homeless people died from either malnourishment or exposure. If I'm not mistaken, Cuba has no homeless, and none are starving to death.

I think most of us here, would agree that Cuba is a revolution/country in progress and evolution. The question is, whether the U$ will allow them to flourish and prosper as a sovereign nation.

[Anonymous]

Don't you think that the lack of supplies, building materials, medicines, food, is in reality a function of the unethical, immoral embargo placed on Cuba by the U$?

They can trade with almost any other country in the world.

[Som]

They can trade with almost any other country in the world.

The U.S. has done alot of stamping that out though, essentially it forces countries to trade with either them or Cuba, which isn't much of a buisness choice.

While other countries can trade with Cuba, they can trade nothing that has any U.S. patents, and if a buisness is involved with Cuban trade, theyre at least restricted from U.S. trade.
Put loads of things like that.

It doesn't help that in the last 10 years or so, Cubas had to completley rehash its trading agreements, since 80% of used to come from eastern europe and the soviet union.

Sure some people love Fidel but if he is so loved why do thousands risk their lives every year to escape Cuba???

Thousands risk their lives to escape mexico as well. There are treks through the desert that are just as dangerous as jumping in a life raft and hoping to get the 90 miles. People have died making that journey. Not too long ago a boatload of haitians managed to make it to florida and desperately ran onshore.

While some are political opponents, mostly its just because Cuba is a third world country, it would be worse under capitalism. people have a tendency to move from poorer countries to richer ones, simple as that.

The Cubans food is rationed and anything that isn't rationed is bought on the black market. Even toilet paper is a luxury.....most Cubans use newspaper as toilet paper.

Have you considered that theres just not enough to go around? do you think that all the toilet paper is sitting in the communist party basement for the members to wallow in it?

Overall theyre a country heavily reliant on trade, and trade isn't going so well with them.

[kitty katt]

Hate to tell you but Canada trades with both Cuba and the U.S. Don't dump all this on the trade embargo, even though that is the main cause.....but Castro also has to pay his bills.....and by the way if you really follow what is going on there is some trade between Cuba and America......food and medicine for cash.....check it out for yourself. I do agree that the infant mortality, life expectancy and literacy rate being as good as North Americas. Not being a yankee, I wouldn't live in the U.S.....they tend to stomp on human rights......and yes I see their products in Cuba......coke, pringles chips......and a number of other products. I have yet to meet a Cuban that actually likes Castro......I don't doubt that some do.......but a greater number don't......just remember you have no freedom there.

[Danton]

FREEDOM!

You have no freedom to buy DVD'S Fashionable clothes sports cars, luxury foods, hell even decent toilet paper!

You have the freedom to let go of all that shit and become a human being, to live & work and dance and love and appreciate what really matters. If those of you who posted anti-Castro sentiments and say you've been to Cuba deny this...

Cubans need for nothing as all essentials are provided by the state. Cuba produces some of the finest doctors, athletes musicians & artists in the world despite consistant aggression from the U.S. Racism is non-existent and crime virtually so, narcotics, sexual disease, corruption, illiteracy, religious fanatisism etc.. these problems are extremley rare. It makes having to wipe your arse with yesterdays Granma tolerable.

OK this is not utopia but in my travels I have never come across a people of such unwavering spirit & zest & appreciation for life as the Cubans I have met. No I'm not some fucking tourist with blinkered idealistic eyes I know the reality of the place, the few who try to leave do so in the false hope of a better life, tempted by all the junk that you seem to think represents freedom - and what a pile of shit they find. The others, family of exiles, decendants of a privellaged class, murderers and rapists and pederasts are welcome to join that foul nest of vipers and gangsters in Miami and gorge themselves on all that capitalism has to offer until they are left souless and defeated..and....homesick.


"!Victoria o muerte!"

[kitty katt]

Actually they can buy some pretty nice clothes but they can't buy much in the way of luxuries which isn't a problem but when some of the necessities of life are so expensive that the average Cuban can't afford it I would draw the line. All essentials are not supplied by the state.....fruit and vegetables must be bought from the black market as well as milk.

What planet are you on.....racism exists everywhere including Cuba as well as crime as the jails are full there. The freedom they are missing there is freedom of speech which every human on this planet is entitled to.

I'm not even talking about the exiles.....they mean nothing to me but if only a few people were leaving it wouldn't be noticed but many people lose their lives trying to leave that country. I do agree with a lot of what you say.....excellent drs, athletes, musicians and artists but there is more there than the world sees and if you were around enough Cubans you'd see that. As a nurse, I make in an hour what a nurse there makes in a month. Have you seen their hospitals, they're not in the best of conditions. I haven't seen the use of glass IV bottles in 20 years until I was at the hospital in Cuba with my husband. Just remember in Cuba everything is for the tourist and then the Cuban.

I'm not anti-Castro.....I admire him......he stands up to that Nazi that the americans call their president but he also avoids the question about freedom of speech whenever asked about it.

[Urban Rubble]

Maybe if our government would lift the travel ban they wouldn't have to kill themselves taking rafts, they could fucking fly.

[Soul Rebel]

Funny how the medical system is mentioned- saying that it is of poor quality when the reality is that the cuban medical system is very advanced. Cuba has been considered many times a World Medical Power. I have seen it first hand and its not bad.

As for saying that cubans are in horrible condition and hate castro- false. I have mentioned it many times- i have been there and found the opposite. So what if they dont have Coke or Pizza Hut or Pringles. They have the essentials- which is what people should have. They enjoy life more than those in the U.S. because they see that joy and value comes from art, relationships, culture, and not from material possessions.

[ComradeRiley]

I am English and todays sociaty is ever so materialistic you are right, it is sick really, I have great respect for the Cuban people

[Danton]

Kitty,

I like you, have had a Cuban partner, Tereza - also a doctor. I wanted to marry her and to gain Cuban citizanship and live there, however it wasn't to be so I now spend my time between London & Sevilla, I dont know where you reside but I can tell you the state of some of the hospitals in these supposed progressive cities are far worse than what I saw in Havana. not in terms of facilities, equipment or sanitation but the quality of staff the waiting lists, general care and proffessionalism. Starved of proper medicines & materials by the blockade is it not a triumph of dedication & sheer will against unjust adversity that Cuba has undeniably one of the premier healthcare systems in Latin america?

I am on planet Earth.... you cannot tell me racism exits in Cuba like it does around the globe.. no Kitty that is wrong... tell me of another nation where men are born equal regardless of color, name, profession, history.

By the way, Companero? with a husband.


"When the great guiding spirit cleaves humanity in two I know I will be with the people"