The Superior Morality of Capitalism

[Solzhenitsyn]

http://www.ashbrook.org/publicat/onprin/v1...3/thompson.html (http://www.ashbrook.org/publicat/onprin/v1n3/thompson.html)

The professor states his position with more eloquence than I possibly can. I don't agree with everything he has to say but it's a start.

[vox]

You do realize that Marx emphatically rejected normative collectivism, just as he rejected methodological individualism, right?

vox

[Solzhenitsyn]

I do not agree with everything he said. He seems to be caught in the cult of Ayn Rand and her flawed philosophy of radical egoism (which is hardly as original as some of her lackies claim). But Fires of Hell only asked a defense be provided and this I have delivered.

[libereco]

Under socialism a ruling class of intellectuals, bureaucrats and social planners decide what people want or what is good for society and then use the coercive power of the State to regulate, tax, and redistribute the wealth of those who work for a living. In other words, socialism is a form of legalized theft.

The morality of socialism can be summed-up in two words: envy and self-sacrifice. Envy is the desire to not only possess another's wealth but also the desire to see another's wealth lowered to the level of one's own. Socialism's teaching on self-sacrifice was nicely summarized by two of its greatest defenders, Hermann Goering and Bennito Mussolini. The highest principle of Nazism (National Socialism), said Goering, is: "Common good comes before private good." Fascism, said Mussolini, is " a life in which the individual, through the sacrifice of his own private interests…realizes that completely spiritual existence in which his value as a man lies."


I read up to this point and then stopped, because the author obviously doesn't have any idea what socialism means. What he is talking about is extremly Authorian Socialism, Stalinism, Red-Facism...
However if he wants to make a point against that he should not just include all the Libertarian and moderate forms of Socialism - thats ridiculous. (STRAW MAN STRAW MAN)

Also his summary of the morality of Socialism is total bullshit. Just saying "it's envy and self-sacrifice" is no prove for anything. This article is not worth my time, I have to go study anyway: hooray for qantum physics :(


(Edited by libereco at 5:56 pm on April 15, 2002)

[Moskitto]

Bennito Mussolini

Bennito Mussolini seemed to believe that socialism values the importance of the individual, try reading "What is Fascism."

"...even that the nineteenth century was the century of Socialism, of Liberalism, and of Democracy, it does not necessarily follow that the twentieth century must also be a century of Socialism, Liberalism and Democracy: political doctrines pass, but humanity remains, and it may rather be expected that this will be a century of authority...a century of Fascism. For if the nineteenth century was a century of individualism it may be expected that this will be the century of collectivism and hence the century of the State...."

Sounds like the 19th century was the century of Socialism... and Individualism. That can't be right.

[El Che]

"'We distribute poverty equally'
-Anonymous Viet Cong Political
Commissar, 1965 "

Sounds right to me!

[Fires of History]

This is the best defense you could find!? Jeez...

This article is nothing but a point for what I've been saying all along: That capitali$t theory never really connects with reality. Here are some examples of chitter chatter without realistic examples, of blatantly biased and value-laden commentary without any proof:

He says, "Capitalism is the only moral system because it requires human beings to deal with one another as traders--that is, as free moral agents trading and selling goods and services on the basis of mutual consent."

Who the one's 'trading and selling goods'? Who does this 'trading and selling' benefit?

He says, "Capitalism is the only social system that rewards merit, ability and achievement, regardless of one's birth or station in life."

Wow...he really is living in la la land...

How are the poor supposed to compete with the rich when it comes to opportunity? Access? Resources for advancement?

He says, "The winners are those who are honest, industrious, thoughtful, prudent, frugal, responsible, disciplined, and efficient. The losers are those who are shiftless, lazy, imprudent, extravagant, negligent, impractical, and inefficient."

He's really IS living in la la land...

Oh, I forgot, all the poor are just shiftless lazy people, parasites at best.

Yeah, that's right, all those who made millions at Enron were 'honest, industrious, thoughtful, prudent, frugal, responsible, disciplined, and efficient.' Well, definitely efficient...

He says, "Capitalism is the only social system that rewards virtue and punishes vice."

Wuh? What 'virtue'? What 'vice'? Is he some kind of fucking priest?

Just another instance of him saying something WITHOUT examples, just biased chitter chatter.

"The entrepreneur is the man who is constantly thinking of new ways to improve the material or spiritual lives of the greatest number of people."

Another example. Entrepreneurs improve the lives of great numbers of people? Doesn't this contradict his nice little theory of individualism? (Which, by the way, is an inherent denial of the fact that we ALL a part of a community).

Also, notice he said 'spiritual.' He's definitely a fundamentalist chri$tian of some sort if he believes the entrepreneurial spirit has ANYTHING to do with spirituality. But he is at Ashland after all...

He says, "The free-enterprise system is not possible without the sanctity of private property."

I've heard that before somewhere. Oh yes, that's right: "We stand for the maintenance of private property. We shall protect free enterprise as the most expedient, or rather the sole possible economic order." -Adolf Hitler

He says, "Welfare, regulations, taxes, tariffs, minimum-wage laws are all immoral because they use the coercive power of the state to organize human choice and action."

Minimum wage is immoral!? Taxes are immoral!? Welfare is immoral!? What in the fuck is he talking about!? What a fucking lunatic! Damn...is he really a professor? Were in the hell did he get his degree? And, who the fuck hired him!? Oh, Ashland, that's right...

Why should I listen to a man defending capitali$m as 'moral' when he sees minimum wage, taxes, and welfare as 'immoral'? What a bullshit slant and perspective he has!

He says, "Under socialism, most of life's decisions are made for you."

Wow, he really has never studied Socialism. Wow, what amazing bias he shows...

He says, "Simply put: socialism rewards sloth and penalizes hard work while capitalism rewards hard work and penalizes sloth."

Are the examples/proof on another page?

He says, with regard to living under Socialism, that "The forgotten man and woman in all of this is the quiet, hardworking, lawabiding, taxpaying citizen who minds his or her own business but is forced to work for the government and their serfs."

Oh, so now taxpaying is a good thing as long as it's done by quiet, lawabiding people? Does he truly believe that the poor and underpriviledged are not hard workers? Once again, are his examples/proof on another page?


Mr. Professor works for Ashland University, a private school tied to Ashland Theological Seminary. The Ashbrook Center finds it's home in the mix as well, and boasts such proud graduates as Ronald Reagan, Margaret Thatcher, and even William Bennett.

It's easy to say whatever you want to say. To make the ideals of capitali$m sound like they benefit everyone. His strict adherence to individualism is his main flaw, as "No man is an island." -John Donne.

And his theory of 'envy and self-sacrifice' is laughable at best. Is the U$ so conceited that they truly believe that most of the world hates them just because they are envious of their money!? Does Mr. Professor really believe that people like Gandhi, Martin Luther King, or Che fought for a better system for ALL people because they were envious!? Give me a fucking break...

I appreciate the heads up on this article. I have printed it, and will use it with all the groups and organizations I'm in as a shining example of capitali$tic selfishness, self-righteousness, and self-dillusion. In a nutshell, the capitiali$t deification of self-interest over the common good.

Oh, I guess it's called 'individualism' to polish all that up.

Thanks again :) Great example :)

[El Che]

Hey Solz, is the glass half empty or half full?

[Solzhenitsyn]

El Che:

That depends entirely on whether I'm buying it or selling it. If I'm buying it, it's half empty. If I'm selling it, it's half full.

[El Che]

Actualy it depends on how thirsty you are. If ur thirsty you will value the glass of water, even if it is only half full. But if on the other hand you have all the water you can drink and more, you will look at it with contempt. Equal distribution of wealth is the future. Because if there must exist poverty then we shall all share that burden, and if there is to be rivers of wealth then we should all share equaly that fortune.

You need to experience privation to be able to apreciate the little things. Just like some need to experience near death experiences to look upon their lives with renewed eyes.

The millions of miserables of this world cry out to the wealthy "share in our pain, so that it might be lessened". Criminals the lot of you. Venceremos!

[poncho]

"The millions of miserables of this world cry out to the wealthy "share in our pain, so that it might be lessened". Criminals the lot of you. Venceremos!"--El Che

My local paper had a story that fits nicely in this topic. A man died not due to lack of funds, nor beds, medications, hospital closures or any of the usual things you here wrong with Canada's social medicine. The reason the hospitals emergency was closed because the doctors stopped working when they reach the imposed income cap they are allowed to bill medicare for there services....

You want world peace than follow Fidels Castro's example and give the world and humanity what it wants dignity, respect for humanity! Take the profit and greed out of government....


(Edited by poncho at 5:05 pm on April 17, 2002)