What is the best way to treat depression?

[RSS News]

New generation anti-depressants have little clinical benefit for the majority of depressed patients, UK research shows. Do you agree?


What is the best way to treat depression?

New generation anti-depressants including Prozac and Seroxat only help a small group of the most severely depressed, according to a study carried out by the University of Hull.

Many individuals believe the drugs do work for them, but researchers claim that this could be a placebo effect - people feel better simply because they are taking a medication which they think will help them.

Prescriptions for anti-depressants hit a record high of more than 31 million in England in 2006. The government has promised more investment in talking therapies, which ministers see as a better alternative to drugs.

Do you agree with the research findings? Have you taken anti-depressants? Did you find them helpful? Are you someone who dealt with depression without using chemical treatments? Should the government invest more money in talking therapies?

(Feed provided by BBC News | Have your Say (http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/rss/-/2/hi/talking_point/default.stm))

[Sentinel]

This is an interesting and important topic. I've been taking anti-depressants, more specifically SSRI, for years myself. I mainly started taking them against panic attacs, but hey did help against depression as well. When I tried to quit them, it worked fine initially but after some months I started to feel like absolute shit. :(

I really highly doubt it could be a placebo effect, especially since these medicines work on such a long term basis, and it takes quite some time before you notice the effect of taking them, or quitting them. I don't even think about them anymore, taking the pill in the morning has become routine..

[apathy maybe]

Discussion at Slashdot, http://science.slashdot.org/science/08/02/26/107234.shtml along with a link to a Journal article http://medicine.plosjournals.org/perlserv/?request=get-document&doi=10.1371/journal.pmed.0050045&ct=1&SESSID=744fceb71a804519e680a28bf26d80d2

I can not give an opinion on this because I not only have no experience with taking such drugs, I don't know enough (anything) about the relevant science.

[Cencus]

This kinda explains it in laymans terms http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/7264486.stm

The drugs companies have not been adverse to hiding negative aspects of research in the past. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/3602934.stm Glaxo covered up an increase in suicidal tendancies in teenagers taking it's ssri Paxil aka Seroxat.

I have one friend who has been on antidepressants of one kind or another for most of the last 30 years, they seem to take the edge of his worst periods, but nothing little else.

[Sentinel]

See these previous discussions on the subject.

Selective Serotonin Reuptake Inhibitors (http://www.revleft.com/vb/selective-serotonin-reuptake-t58697/index.html?t=58697&highlight=SSRI)
Antidepressants and Psychiatry (http://www.revleft.com/vb/antidepressants-and-psychaitry-t63129/index.html?t=63129&highlight=SSRI)
Panic Attacks (http://www.revleft.com/vb/panic-attacks-t63120/index.html?t=63120&highlight=SSRI)

[Dr Mindbender]

I'm not a fan of pills n' potions for depression. The best cure IMHO is occupational therapy. If you're busy you don't have time to be miserable.

[Lector Malibu]

I'm gonna say right of the bat nor am I a fan of pills. The pharmaceutical industry is a sham. Now sure there are such things as depression and such, I'm saying though that you gotta be careful because doctors like to push pills, and often make prescriptions not so much based on your aliment but how much money they get kicked back. Now depression and things like that are serious and I'm not advocating if someone has some serious problems that they not seek help. I will say though alot can be said for state of mind as well, and if your in a rut and chose to stay there, than yes that's where you will stay. Scope it out, find out about the medicines available and the long term side effects. Don't ever think that just because a doctor writes you a presciption that that is the answer though, it often is not and in the case of anti-depresents, they have been proven to cause severe problems in the long run.

[LSD]

I'm gonna say right of the bat nor am I a fan of pills.

That sentence's grammer is all over the map, but I assume you are trying to say that you are not a fan of pills? If so, I can't disagree more. I'm an enormous fan of pills, specifically the psychoactive fan. I loathe the companies that make them and the policies that govern them, but the substances themselves are outstanding.

That may seem like a semantic distinction, but it's actually an essential one. Because too often legitimate anti-capitalist suspicion turns into anti-science mysticism. You see it when leftists "go vegan" to "fight big agra", you see it when IMTers (sorry, Fehr) call the Big Bang a conspiracy, and you see it in psychiatry, a lot.

Too many leftists are quick to condemn psychiatric medication solely because it's mainstream, because it's accepted. They have no problem taking an aspirin when their head hurts, but for some reason when it comes to the brain, suddenly medicine is all an enormous sham.

Well the reality is that the pharmaceutical companies do decieve, they do manipulate their findings, and they are by no means in this business for your bennefit. But then that's equally true of the folks who made your computer, and your hamburger.

Living in capitalism means living in capitalism, there's no way around it. But we still should avail ourselves of every tool at our disposal. So if you're depressed, by all means try an SSRI. It may not work, but then again it may just change your life.

The real problem, as far as I see it, is that many people can't afford to buy prescription medication and that is a fight worth fighting. Opposing the medication itself, however, is pure lunacy.

And remember, talk therapy remains the single most effective psychiatric tool. Twenty years from now that probably won't be the case, but for now it's still the best channel we have to the mind. Therapy combined with medication is the best psychiatric/psychological mechanism for treating mental illness available. And it's our job to ensure that it's available to absolutely everyone, free of charge.

[Lector Malibu]

That sentence's grammar is all over the map, but I assume you are trying to say that you are not a fan of pills? If so, I can't disagree more. I'm an enormous fan of pills, specifically the psychoactive fan. I loathe the companies that make them and the policies that govern them, but the substances themselves are outstanding.

I know my spelling and such is not the best :lol:

It's not that I don't recognize the importance of medicine, traditional or homeopathic. I'm more of the school of thought on this issue ,that because psychiatrist are quick to push medications that one might not actually need for insurance reimbursement, I'm soured to the "not feeling well, take my pill approach."



That may seem like a semantic distinction, but it's actually an essential one. Because too often legitimate anti-capitalist suspicion turns into anti-science mysticism. You see it when leftists "go vegan" to "fight big agra", you see it when IMTers (sorry, Fehr) call the Big Bang a conspiracy, and you see it in psychiatry, a lot.Well I agree with the above and I'm not anti medicine or science one bit to strike at capitalist.


Too many leftists are quick to condemn psychiatric medication solely because it's mainstream, because it's accepted. They have no problem taking an aspirin when their head hurts, but for some reason when it comes to the brain, suddenly medicine is all an enormous sham.I don't condemn psychiatric medicine at all or think it's a conspiracy. What I suggest is that people educate them selfs about the medications and learn about their mental illness and not just take whatever because a psychiatrist says too.


Well the reality is that the pharmaceutical companies do decieve, they do manipulate their findings, and they are by no means in this business for your bennefit. But then that's equally true of the folks who made your computer, and your hamburger.Yes, I agree completely.


Living in capitalism means living in capitalism, there's no way around it. But we still should avail ourselves of every tool at our disposal. So if you're depressed, by all means try an SSRI. It may not work, but then again it may just change your life.Good , solid advice


The real problem, as far as I see it, is that many people can't afford to buy prescription medication and that is a fight worth fighting. Opposing the medication itself, however, is pure lunacy.Yes it is no if's about it. The medication war is where you see some real ugly but realistic sides of capitalism. The people should have access to medication period. I see your from Canada, do you remember when Bush was vilifying senior citizens from America that where trying to go up to Canada to get meds because they where less expensive? That was sickening to the core. I am not opposed to medicine and I think it should never be a class privilege. we stand in agreement on this.


And remember, talk therapy remains the single most effective psychiatric tool. Twenty years from now that probably won't be the case, but for now it's still the best channel we have to the mind. Therapy combined with medication is the best psychiatric/psychological mechanism for treating mental illness available. And it's our job to ensure that it's available to absolutely everyone, free of charge.Well said.

[Jhé]

Depression i think is better treated by highlighting all the wonderful things that you experience and come with existence as a human. The sent of a rose flower or the unconditional love between all humans. Something like that:P

[piet11111]

psychiatrists have a certain pressure on them from their clients to produce a quick fix in the form of pills.
and with the amount of paperwork they have to deal with its to be expected that shrinks desire a quick fix in the form of pills aswell.

actually its surprising they dont hand out pills by the bucket these days.

[Jhé]

psychiatrists deal with their patients by discussing about their problems and their issues. this way the subject becomes self centred and self dillusional. its not a good way to treat people.

[Red Blue Pen]

I used to take anti-depressants and they did help...but there was also harm done.
They should only be used as a last resort. Try exercising instead. :)

[MarxSchmarx]

psychiatrists deal with their patients by discussing about their problems and their issues. this way the subject becomes self centred and self dillusional. its not a good way to treat people.

Their meaning the psychiatrists or the patients?

If either, care to elaborate?

If you're talking about the patients, I fail to see what is so wrong with a sick person describing their symptoms to a medical professional, and the same professional diagnosing and offering advice on how to deal with a disease.

Just because some mental illnesses don't require shots and surgery, doesn't diminish the needs of the patient.

[Lector Malibu]

LSD ! answer my post you turn coat !

[Lector Malibu]

Their meaning the psychiatrists or the patients?

If either, care to elaborate?

If you're talking about the patients, I fail to see what is so wrong with a sick person describing their symptoms to a medical professional, and the same professional diagnosing and offering advice on how to deal with a disease.

Just because some mental illnesses don't require shots and surgery, doesn't diminish the needs of the patient.

Good post comrade, well said!

[Led Zeppelin]

LSD ! answer my post you turn coat !

He can't answer your post because he's restricted, he can only post in the OI forum.

[STI]

I'm more of the school of thought on this issue ,that because psychiatrist are quick to push medications that one might not actually need for insurance reimbursement

The same criticism could be made on the same grounds against any kind of medical doctor, a mechanic, and anyone else whose job it is to "fix things that don't work like they should".


I'm soured to the "not feeling well, take my pill approach."


There are criteria which must be met for one to be diagnosed with clinical depression, anxiety disorder or obsessive-compulsive disorder, all of which can, in some cases, be treated with SSRIs. Specific criteria. "Not feeling well" isn't enough to get Prozac from a doctor, and I'd expect the popular notion that such is the case to be rooted more in the false notion that "mental disorders don't really exist" than the facts as they are.


What I suggest is that people educate them selfs about the medications and learn about their mental illness and not just take whatever because a psychiatrist says too.

The same could be said of any other type of medication given by any other type of doctor, and I think the focus on psychiatry setms from a stigmatisation of mental illness and the field that treats it specifically.


I am not opposed to medicine and I think it should never be a class privilege. we stand in agreement on this.

I wonder what the long-term effects of relaxing patent laws would be on the development of new medicines.


Depression i think is better treated by highlighting all the wonderful things that you experience and come with existence as a human. The sent of a rose flower or the unconditional love between all humans. Something like that:P

A heartworming notion, but damn-near useless clinically. Somebody suffering from clinical depression (forget about the plethora of other mental illnesses treated by combinations of medicine and therapy) would probably not be disposed toward enjoying the scent of a flower, nor even believe in the "unconditional love between all humans". Hell, I'm mentally healthy and I think it's a load of hooey!

We're talking about real, clinical depression here, not "the blues".


psychiatrists have a certain pressure on them from their clients to produce a quick fix in the form of pills.
and with the amount of paperwork they have to deal with its to be expected that shrinks desire a quick fix in the form of pills aswell.

actually its surprising they dont hand out pills by the bucket these days.

That post presumes that anti-depressants are grossly over-prescribed (suggesting an epidemic of malpractice among psychiatrists), then offers a post-hoc explaination of why that may be the case as proof that it happens. Try again.

[Sentinel]

There are some posts in this thread, which are just ignorant..


Depression i think is better treated by highlighting all the wonderful things that you experience and come with existence as a human. The sent of a rose flower or the unconditional love between all humans. Something like that:P Oh, really. Thinking happy thoughts can sure help an average person who is having a bad day, but not one suffering from a chronic clinical depression. The brain is a physical organ, and for some this organ isn't functioning the way it should, namely, it either doesn't produce enough of the signal substance serotonin or is unable to maintain satisfying levels of it.

And when this is the case, your life becomes a grey nightmare where no positive influences have impact. Even rational thought is useless -- you simply can't manage to care if the roses smell good, or whether or not you have caring and loving people around you. Now, what SSRI medication does is to correct the serotonin balance to an average level, one where the mind is once again able to absorb positive and negative influences in a balanced fashion.

People really should try to lose the image of the human mind as something entirely psychological, as it's dependent of very physical factors.

I think another usual mistake most of the go out and smell the flowers backpatters with normal serotonin levels do, is to not read up on the subject and instead think that SSRI are the kind drugs which get you 'high'. This is the only possible explanation to this 'drugs are not the answer' approach of their as I can see. Well, that's not how it works! The medication doesn't give you any 'special feeling' at all, it cures a malfunction in the brain and puts the patient back to the normal start position.


I'm not a fan of pills n' potions for depression. The best cure IMHO is occupational therapy. If you're busy you don't have time to be miserable.See the above. What you are talking about is a normal, overgoing depression every average person feels from time to time. A clinical depression at it's worst however -- not to mention panic attacks -- paralyses a person to a point where suicide feels like a better option than going out of the door.

I think we all deserve an equal opportunity to feel happy and enjoy life. And that is what the medication provides -- nothing more, nothing less.

[redcannon]

I've only had minor depression before, nothing serious enough to require pills. But I do suffer from a lot of anxiety (which gives me panic attacks and ungodly insomnia) and I find that smoking weed helps a lot. As I know it, a lot of times depression is closely related to anxiety, and so perhaps a bit of herb would do the trick as an alternative to pills.

However, if you've been prescribed pills, for god's sake take the pills. I don't care about how much the pharmaceutical industry is profiting. If you have problems with SSRIs then consult your doctor, but don't cut yourself off. These medications can take a long time to take effect, and so it is hard to notice a difference when you suddenly stop using them. It really isn't until months later that a noticeable difference has occurred. Talk to a professional, even if they might be a ***** of the evil HMO.

[Sentinel]

But I do suffer from a lot of anxiety (which gives me panic attacks and ungodly insomnia) and I find that smoking weed helps a lot. As I know it, a lot of times depression is closely related to anxiety, and so perhaps a bit of herb would do the trick as an alternative to pills.

I was prescribed SSRI primarily against anxiety (even though it also helped against my depression). Incidentally, I also smoke cannabis -- :D -- but it wouldn't have helped me, as my panic attacks occured mainly while working. And I don't think my employer would have appreciated if I'd been stoned there..

Perhaps you should consider SSRI, as it does relieve anxiety and remove the risks of panic attacks -- just to prevent one day arriving in the situation I was in when I started taking them? I couldn't have continued working with people, had it not been for the pills.


However, if you've been prescribed pills, for god's sake take the pills. I don't care about how much the pharmaceutical industry is profiting. If you have problems with SSRIs then consult your doctor, but don't cut yourself off. These medications can take a long time to take effect, and so it is hard to notice a difference when you suddenly stop using them. It really isn't until months later that a noticeable difference has occurred. Talk to a professional, even if they might be a ***** of the evil HMO.

As a long term SSRI 'patient', I can only confirm this. Very good advice.