Imperial power word for word

[peaccenicked]

http://www.ocf.berkeley.edu/~shadab
His masters voice.

[Moskitto]

Try http://www.capitalism.org as well to see why intellectuals hate capitalism.

[James]

thats an "intresting" site

[Imperial Power]

Yep thats where I got that article

[peaccenicked]

10. Is socialism ideal?
In order to answer one must first ask: What is an ideal and what purpose does it serve? An ideal is that which is held as a standard of measurement, or of excellence. As a standard, it is used to determine the merits of any system put forth to a specific end. A social system is a code of laws which men observe in order to live together. The measurement of social systems consists of the appraisal of, the relationships between men and the laws and institutions which govern the forms of association. In order to measure a social system, one must hold to an ideal, i.e. have a standard against which performance can be gauged. There is only one such possible standard: man's life.
A social system must be measured according to its ability to sustain each man's right to life, i.e. its recognition of man's nature and as such its defense of the requirements of a conceptual consciousness. Recognition of man's right to life means the recognition of the necessity of the freedom of man's mind, with reason as his sole means of survival, and of the freedom of man's body, by which the products of the mind are brought into reality. Therefore, an ideal social system must respect the nature of man, and provide a context in which the defining moral principle is the freedom to sustain one's own life by voluntary, uncoerced choice. Such an ideal system exists, if only in the minds of men, but it's name is not socialism.

Socialism holds that man is not an end in himself, and that he must sacrifice his own convictions for the sake of the "greater good" of the collective. Socialism requires the sacrifice of the individual mind, and hence denies the sole means of survival of man and in fact his very nature as a rational being. Such a system cannot honestly be held as an ideal.

To paraphrase IP's guru "to condemn capitalism is to misrepresent capitalism" This condemnation of socialism
is a gross misrepresentation.
Take the first paragraph
In order to answer one must first ask: What is an ideal and what purpose does it serve? An ideal is that which is held as a standard of measurement, or of excellence. As a standard, it is used to determine the merits of any system put forth to a specific end. A social system is a code of laws which men observe in order to live together. The measurement of social systems consists of the appraisal of, the relationships between men and the laws and institutions which govern the forms of association. In order to measure a social system, one must hold to an ideal, i.e. have a standard against which performance can be gauged. There is only one such possible standard: man's life.
A social system must be measured according to its ability to sustain each man's right to life, i.e. its recognition of man's nature and as such its defense of the requirements of a conceptual consciousness. Recognition of man's right to life means the recognition of the necessity of the freedom of man's mind, with reason as his sole means of survival, and of the freedom of man's body, by which the products of the mind are brought into reality. Therefore, an ideal social system must respect the nature of man, and provide a context in which the defining moral principle is the freedom to sustain one's own life by voluntary, uncoerced choice. Such an ideal system exists, if only in the minds of men, but it's name is not socialism.

This is socialism.
So how does the next paragraph go.
Socialism holds that man is not an end in himself, and that he must sacrifice his own convictions for the sake of the "greater good" of the collective. Socialism requires the sacrifice of the individual mind, and hence denies the sole means of survival of man and in fact his very nature as a rational being. Such a system cannot honestly be held as an ideal.

This is untrue. This is true of both stalinism and capitalism. We hold up sacrifice as a virtue if it is needed,
but not of convictions but of time and we have our matyrs too. Nowhere in socialist theory will you see in reference to this. It is not a desireable state of affairs to create drones the way capitalism and stalinism does.
That is why we want to get rid of both capitalism and stalinism. If so,you too capitalist drone can become a free thinker.







(Edited by peaccenicked at 5:23 pm on Feb. 8, 2002)

[El Che]

Heed our words Imperial. Think them over for your self. There is hope for u yet, there is hope for us all.